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Haha what do you think Bowsette smells like LOL This poll is closed. |
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| Lilac |
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12 | 3.96% |
| Gooseberries |
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8 | 2.64% |
| Turtle soup |
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11 | 3.63% |
| Your favourite Doritos flavor (please specify) |
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14 | 4.62% |
| Gamer girl bath water |
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54 | 17.82% |
| Stop it |
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158 | 52.15% |
| A Pizza Hut Personal Pan Pizza (Pepperoni) |
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33 | 10.89% |
| get stick bugged lol |
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12 | 3.96% |
| tomato pizza |
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1 | 0.33% |
| Total: | 303 votes | ||
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the funniest kind of joke to me is a game doing the very fresh meta thing of hey uhh this sucks lol right?? anywyay do it.
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Aug 28, 2020 19:23
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father balder in bayonetta when every time you get his health down and try to finish him off with one of your demon summons, like you would every other boss, he instead destroys them first. you have to get him like 3 or 4 times before you can finally finish him for real
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Aug 28, 2020 19:24
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Stux posted:the funniest kind of joke to me is a game doing the very fresh meta thing of hey uhh this sucks lol right?? anywyay do it. i also love paper mario
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Aug 28, 2020 19:25
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sharrrk posted:father balder in bayonetta when every time you get his health down and try to finish him off with one of your demon summons, like you would every other boss, he instead destroys them first. you have to get him like 3 or 4 times before you can finally finish him for real By shooting him in the head with a lipstick while saying "don't gently caress with a witch" Bayonetta is so great
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Aug 28, 2020 19:26
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Boremehtta
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Aug 28, 2020 19:27
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Stux posted:some posters i find are like reverse taste posters and i can tell that if they dont like something its good and if they like something its bad. just out of context thing ive noticed with no relation to anything.
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Aug 28, 2020 19:28
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That's a really rude thing to quote at haveblue
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Aug 28, 2020 19:32
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cheetah7071 posted:this is going back a few pages but like So, one of the things with WoW is that they started running into a bit of a design problem: you can't keep adding new abilities to classes forever. This came up in some design discussions in MoP, according to this blog from the class designer who overhauled the Warlock class in MoP. So if you want to give players new experiences each expansion, but you know that you can't just keep adding skills and "gameplay-changing" passive powers forever, what do you do? The answer they appear to have come to is what people tend to refer to nowadays as "borrowed power." Each expansion has a new max-level progression system. This started with Legion and its artifact weapons, where every spec had one weapon you'd use for the whole expansion, and it gave you a new active ability and a whole tree of new, often very cool and powerful passives. Then they hit the reset button on that for BFA and had Azerite armor (and eventually Azerite essences and corrupted gear). Now they're hitting the reset button again and giving us covenant abilities and conduits. I think we all know the downsides to this--it sucks to lose all your cool, flashy powers and bonuses every expansion, and it sucks even more for the specs that inevitably end up being balanced/designed around a borrowed power and now have a huge gap where that power was supposed to go--but there are advantages. One thing this system lets Blizzard do is allow player power to scale very perceptibly, and in a way you can both see (with flashy animations) and feel over the course of each expansion, without having to worry about balancing it going forward. They can give you a bunch of weird, wild abilities that you build up over the course of the expansion, allowing a very meaningful feeling of progression and growing power, but then they don't have to try to balance around those new abilities in the next expansion--they're just going to hit the reset button and try a new progression system. FFXIV, meanwhile, doesn't do this. It handles growing power more subtly. Each expansion, you maybe get some flashier versions of existing powers as you level, and get one or two new big, important buttons that change how your job plays at max level. They compensate for new powers by pruning away some powers occasionally to make room on your bars, or sometimes consolidating abilities so they can share buttons (which they did very noticeably with Red Mage in Shadowbringers). The downside is that the way your job plays the moment you hit max level is pretty much how it's going to play for the next two years, barring a mid-expansion rework of some kind. Your rotation might get smoother because you have more skill/spell speed, your numbers will get bigger, but you won't get new buttons to press or flashy passive procs that change up your gameplay halfway through the expansion. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, to be clear. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that approach, and in fact I suspect a lot of players prefer it. But WoW's approach does have an appeal as well. They're two different ways of addressing the same problem--how do you let players continue to progress and help make things feel fresh with each expansion?--and each has its upsides and downsides. I'd say that WoW's approach has more downsides than FFXIV's but frankly I think most of that is just that Blizzard frequently bites off much more than they can chew balance-wise, rather than with the core concept of the approach. Harrow fucked around with this message at 19:38 on Aug 28, 2020 |
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Aug 28, 2020 19:33
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bayonetta 3
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Aug 28, 2020 19:37
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Harrow posted:So, one of the things with WoW is that they started running into a bit of a design problem: you can't keep adding new abilities to classes forever. This came up in some design discussions in MoP, according to this blog from the class designer who overhauled the Warlock class in MoP. So if you want to give players new experiences each expansion, but you know that you can't just keep adding skills and "gameplay-changing" passive powers forever, what do you do? that does make sense, and is probably related to the way classes are handled, too. In ffxiv, if you're getting bored of a class, you can just start another one with no loss of progression or even needing to switch characters. Being locked into a class means that they need to provide more variety within it.
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Aug 28, 2020 19:38
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cheetah7071 posted:that does make sense, and is probably related to the way classes are handled, too. In ffxiv, if you're getting bored of a class, you can just start another one with no loss of progression or even needing to switch characters. Being locked into a class means that they need to provide more variety within it. Definitely. One of the reasons FFXIV's jobs don't need multiple specs is because you can just play another job on the same character without losing progression. You can't do that in WoW, so there need to be multiple specs that feel different for each class to help provide some variety (or, often, a fallback if one spec gets broken or nerfed into the ground halfway through an expansion). I do think WoW players are getting tired of borrowed power systems. Whether they're rejecting the core idea of them or whether it's more that Blizzard has tended to tie them to neverending grind treadmills and has failed to balance them is hard to know. I think Legion's artifact weapons were a cool, fun, satisfying system (though definitely too grindy) and Azerite armor/essences suck. I wish they'd just kept artifact weapons. It does seem like the new system, covenants, is going to be significantly less grindy than either artifact weapons or Azerite, which is very good, but it has its own glaring issues. You have to pick one covenant per character, it's intended to be hard to swap, it's very likely a given covenant is good for one of your specs and not the others, and covenants also have cosmetic rewards and their own storylines so it sucks having to choose between the aesthetic/story you want and the power you want or need. But it's definitely an open question whether WoW players actually care about that drastic progression over the course of the expansion. If Blizzard stopped hitting the reset button on its core systems every expansion but you only got like one new button for your spec per expansion, without getting new passives or a really big feeling of power growth over the course of the expansion, would that be a worthwhile trade-off? For FFXIV players, yeah, that's how it already works. For WoW players? I really don't know. Harrow fucked around with this message at 19:46 on Aug 28, 2020 |
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Aug 28, 2020 19:44
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it just bugs me when they remove stuff, its definitely some fomo poo poo like "you gotta check out this weirdass progression system before they take it out. my contrarian response to fomo poo poo most is just to not even bother though ff14 they've only removed content from the game like a total of 4 times, and 3 of those times were different versions of the same thing they kept iterating on. if i want to go back and work on some irrelevant progression from 6 years ago i can
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Aug 28, 2020 19:49
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WoW needs to have some sort of power grind at max level, otherwise how do you get people to stay subbed during content droughts? That's what ultimately caused me to unsub in both Legion and BfA. I realised that the main reward I was getting from logging on each day was seeing an incremental increase in my AP. Whenever I get that realisation I can't stand to look at the game, let alone play it or pay £10 a month for it. FFXIV seems pretty content for its players to unsub between major updates, but it keeps them coming back by actually putting effort into its story.
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Aug 28, 2020 19:51
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Vermain posted:A not insignificant part of the difference it is that FFXIV has largely committed to removing false choices and system mastery checks, whereas WoW has wholeheartedly embraced them and made them the pillar of character progression. The only functional difference between two different players playing the same job in FFXIV is their skill level, whereas the gulf in WoW is one made up of numerous small secondary/tertiary bonuses that can be mathematically solved to an optimal configuration. Character building is a pretty interesting challenge for games, especially MMOs, to tackle. I enjoy FFXIV quite a lot, but I still have a character building itch that the game doesn't scratch. I've been playing on the World of Warcraft: Ascension servers and there's just so much choice in character building; I wonder if opening the floodgates like that and letting the players mix and match and do whatever they want with their characters is the way to have character build choices be meaningful in the long run. There's always going to be "solved" builds for every major role available, but I imagine that having as much choice as there currently is presents opportunities for players to experiment with different talents and builds that those potential solutions could always be usurped by a better build.
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Aug 28, 2020 19:53
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homeless snail posted:it just bugs me when they remove stuff, its definitely some fomo poo poo like "you gotta check out this weirdass progression system before they take it out. my contrarian response to fomo poo poo most is just to not even bother though they should have just given up on diadem and left it as a dumbass system nobody queued for but if you somehow got a full party of masochists together you could just go fight brontosauruses together still, and then spent all those dev resources on something that wasn't a waste fortunately, ffxiv's patch ideology means that even when an entire expansion's novel content is a bust, I can fallback on the regular stuff and still enjoy myself
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Aug 28, 2020 19:54
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ffxiv was willing to devote a large chunk of side-content resources to making a miniature version of old school hell MMOs as optional content, maybe someday it'll do that for specs and builds and whatnot
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Aug 28, 2020 19:56
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homeless snail posted:it just bugs me when they remove stuff, its definitely some fomo poo poo like "you gotta check out this weirdass progression system before they take it out. my contrarian response to fomo poo poo most is just to not even bother though Interestingly, it looks like Blizzard's trying to keep Azerite around as something you can keep playing with if you want to. Azerite powers will not work in Shadowlands content, but they will continue to work in BFA and older expansion zones. So if you decide you want to go play with Azerite essences and passives from BFA, you can do so, just not in current content. I wish they'd thought of that with artifact weapons, too, because some of those were really fun and cool. stev posted:WoW needs to have some sort of power grind at max level, otherwise how do you get people to stay subbed during content droughts? We'll see in Shadowlands. Going by the beta, it looks like there's no infinite grind this time. Anima--what people initially thought would be the new AP--is just for covenant sanctum stuff, which has cosmetic and convenience rewards but isn't tied to player power. And Renown, the closest thing to AP this time, has a very easy-to-hit weekly cap and you cannot permanently fall behind. You get your weekly Renown ranks by doing two quests per week, and both are basically "are you doing some content this week? Cool, have your weekly Renown." If you fall behind the current Renown cap, like if you take a break for a few weeks or months, you just get tons of bonus Renown ranks thrown at you as random world quest and rare mob rewards and stuff until you're caught up. That may or may not continue, we'll see if Blizzard sticks to the relative lack of grind, but it's a big improvement over BFA for sure.
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Aug 28, 2020 19:56
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Man, Im playing this game and the WILDEST thing just happened. So the plot characters all said "We need to go to the city!" and ran off to the east. But, there's a shopkeeper nearby who says "Hey there's a Pokemon center off to the west if you wanna heal up." So I go to the west to heal, and there's a few NPC's nearby, a quest or two that I'm able to do immediately. Then there's this one trainer who you can battle and he says "Hey, you see all these Pokemon? Caught em all on this island to the west. All kind of Pokemon there." Up until now, I'm sitting on my starter and four normal types, so I'm thinking, all type of Pokemon? Get into battle with this guy and he's got some neat lookin ones. I'm thinking, listen, you KNOW I love Pokemon types, I'm wild about em, I need in on this. So I wander farther over to the west a few screens, and I get to a little dock with a boat, and there's another guy there. Now, I'm expecting to get told, hey, you need a ticket, or hey, come back later when you're allowed to come here like a lovely bad video game would tell you. But he never says that, he says hey, you wanna go to the island? I'm like "the one with all the Pokemon?" He says "yeah, the one with all the Pokemon." So he drops me off, and I'm there on the island. I'm wandering around now, and this dude was right, there's all types of Pokemon walking around. I see a fire scorpion, he's in the party. I see a ghost-type scarecrow, he's in the party. I see a dog dressed up like a sailor, he's in the party. So now I have a team full of cool little Pokemon and I'm thinking about all the times people have said to me, "you can't have a non-linear Pokemon game, there's no way, it just can't happen" and it really does seem just as easy as I've been saying it would be for a really really long time
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Aug 28, 2020 19:59
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RazzleDazzleHour posted:Man, Im playing this game and the WILDEST thing just happened. pokemon is like dragon quest in that they're afraid to innovate too much because the point of the game is, in large part, to be just like the thing you played as a kid You're making this knockoff sound pretty cool, maybe I will play it
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Aug 28, 2020 20:01
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Hwurmp posted:Cassius in Trails in the Sky the 3rd
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Aug 28, 2020 20:11
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Something I wonder about FFXIV: there's that common YoshiP quote about how it's fine if people unsub between updates. I wonder if he feels comfortable saying that because FFXIV has less of a player retention issue than WoW does. WoW, for the last couple expansions, has tried very hard to use FOMO and infinite grind treadmills to drive player retention. But the problem is that it's all stick, no carrot. It's very easy to burn out. It makes it hard to play alts, or even alt specs, because any time you spend not playing your main is time you're falling behind. It sucks. And I can say from personal experience that this sort of punitive-feeling system does not at all drive me to be more engaged. Meanwhile, in FFXIV, it's relatively achievable to just hit whatever goals I have for my character, and then it turns out, hey, there are other fun things to do in the game if I think they sound fun. I can level another job on the same character without worrying about "falling behind." Crafting is an actual game system and not just a menu with a skill level attached. Everything has a story attached to it. But if I don't do any of that? It's also fine! If I want to take a month off and come back, I probably haven't lost any relative "progress" at all compared to other players. It makes it much easier to just jump in for a week or two at a time when feel like it, and that also means I'm more likely to just leave my subscription rolling. After all, I'd just be resubscribing pretty regularly for short bursts anyway. Basically, I wonder if the player retention problems that I have to assume are what WoW is trying to solve with infinite treadmills are actually driven by those infinite treadmills, at least in part. If WoW made it easy to play alts and share progress across your characters, ditched the infinite grind and made it relatively achievable to get "best in slot" for whatever tier of content you care to invest your time into, would more players stay subscribed for longer? I know I sure would.
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Aug 28, 2020 20:15
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the other part of that quote that doesn't get repeated, is that the second and third months between patches, subs drop precipitously and if they didn't have a hard patch cycle of every 3 months it'd be more of a problem
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Aug 28, 2020 20:20
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Covid probably cost them a shitton of money by delaying 5.3 At least they've said they will not make any attempt to recapture the old schedule. Covid caused a delay that will not be made up by crunching to accelerate future patches Of course 2.0-3.0 was fueled by such insane crunch that yoshi gave the entire staff a month off after heavensward went gold but everything we've heard suggests that they're committed to never doing that again, at least
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Aug 28, 2020 20:25
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cheetah7071 posted:pokemon is like dragon quest in that they're afraid to innovate too much because the point of the game is, in large part, to be just like the thing you played as a kid It's actually pretty neat. There's a story to it which is way more than Pokemon tries to have. There's legendary dragon type Pokemon who are notoriously unfriendly and very powerful but don't generally attack humans, but there's these things called Tyrants that they try and battle all the time and usually humans get caught in the middle, but I'm not sure what Tyrants are yet. Gameplay-wise, battles are very fast even with animations on. Swapping mons is near-instant, and enemies will swap on you too if you have a strong type-advantage and they're low health, but usually limit this to once or twice per fight. If you've played any of the Pokemon games with shaking grass being rare encounters, that's now how all encounters work. So, don't walk on shaking grass, no fights. As such, I usually only hop in the grass to catch new ones. Trainer battles only trigger if you stand exactly in front of whatever direction they're facing and no spinners - so far every trainer fight has been optional. But, they'll refresh after like five minutes, so if you need more cash for pokeballs and way better EXP than wild encounters, you can just refight trainers. e: oh you get money for beating random encounters too RazzleDazzleHour fucked around with this message at 20:29 on Aug 28, 2020 |
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Aug 28, 2020 20:25
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i think its weird to say pokemon never innovates right this second. they def avoided it for an extremely long time but the giant open wild area with tons of pokemon available immediately, and multiplayer raids, and no random encounters all appearing at once in the latest game i would say was a giant leap for them to make. and it also apparently made people mad for a reason i cant work out.
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Aug 28, 2020 20:34
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People are very mad about the national dex and I think a tree in the wild area
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Aug 28, 2020 20:40
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cheetah7071 posted:ffxiv was willing to devote a large chunk of side-content resources to making a miniature version of old school hell MMOs as optional content, maybe someday it'll do that for specs and builds and whatnot if logos were something you had to commit to for awhile and more difficult to switch, they'd pretty much be there. kinda hope that the equivalent system in bozja isn't just rebranded logos but I would be surprised
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Aug 28, 2020 20:44
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Digimon Adventure is my favorite pokemon game because it's basically an open world tamagotchi and your first digimon will probably evolve into a literal poo poo eating turd.
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Aug 28, 2020 20:47
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Help Im Alive posted:People are very mad about the national dex and I think a tree in the wild area The national dex being thinned out was good. I played a lot of competitive and it was cool seeing a bunch of new stuff, whereas now that they've added a ton back in with the DLC you see Blissey everywhere now again just like the last ten years. The Wild Area was so half-baked that if you told me they did it bad on purpose to tell Nintendo to gently caress off and that open-world Pokemon was bad I would believe you. They did it as a weird, very small offshoot of the rest of the game that they made totally normally, but that part of the game is bad and boring too. Totally linear, no mystery or challenge to anything you're doing, people literally standing around in front of a road blocker saying "hey you can't go this way yet because I said so, go do what you're supposed to do then come back." Pokemon Red was a game kids could enjoy, X/Y S/M Sw/SH are games intended for toddlers. al-azad posted:Digimon Adventure is my favorite pokemon game because it's basically an open world tamagotchi and your first digimon will probably evolve into a literal poo poo eating turd. Is that Digimon Adventure or Digimon World? Adventure was the pretty straightforward retelling of the anime I thought e: just went to a new area in the game. The guidmaster character tells you "listen, the city is up north, and that's where the guild HQ is. Please go there. PLEASE do not waste time going farther east, that's the Badlands and there's tons of trainers and strong wild encounters there." Then she leaves and you go east and your partner says "Hey, you do remember that the guidmaster JUST told us to not go this way, right?" So you go there anyways and the Badlands are cool and there's some quests you do for some nice rewards, I'm about to check out who I can catch in this zone RazzleDazzleHour fucked around with this message at 20:54 on Aug 28, 2020 |
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Aug 28, 2020 20:50
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The national dex thing was fine in concept but fire the person who picked the ones to cut because they removed all my faves. Like, they removed every pokemon in my top ten. It was absurd how few old pokemon I like are still in
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Aug 28, 2020 20:52
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RazzleDazzleHour posted:
Oops you're right, Digimon World. Getting an angemon was better than catching any mewtwo.
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Aug 28, 2020 20:54
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They should've just had each gen throw out all of the old Pokemon to begin with and avoided all of the bloat from the start.
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Aug 28, 2020 20:54
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stev posted:They should've just had each gen throw out all of the old Pokemon to begin with and avoided all of the bloat from the start.
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Aug 28, 2020 20:55
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cheetah7071 posted:The national dex thing was fine in concept but fire the person who picked the ones to cut because they removed all my faves. Like, they removed every pokemon in my top ten. It was absurd how few old pokemon I like are still in I partially agree with this but also like that whoever it was seemed to know exactly who to cut based around competitive viability. All ubers and pseudo-legendaries gone. So dope. They kept a TON of cruft though, like there's a ton of shitmons that only serve as wild encounter fodder and no one would actually want on a team. homeless snail posted:people really didnt' like when black and white did this, shockingly B/W having only new Pokemon for the main game and then re-adding them all back for postgame was great and it made me pick out some new favorites as opposed to just falling back on the classics. Having Pokemon secure you some clutch victories are part of what make you like certain ones, and I came out of Gen5 with a huge new cast of favorite, moreso than any other gen
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Aug 28, 2020 20:57
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homeless snail posted:people really didnt' like when black and white did this, shockingly black and white were also the best games since the gb/gbc games so i think the fans of things often have bad ideas about what actually makes them good
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Aug 28, 2020 20:58
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RazzleDazzleHour posted:Pokemon Red was a game kids could enjoy, X/Y S/M Sw/SH are games intended for toddlers. Every Nintendo game since Galaxy was designed so that a toddler would beat it so idk why Pokemon gets singled out on that
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Aug 28, 2020 21:00
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goblin week posted:Every Nintendo game since Galaxy was designed so that a toddler would beat it so idk why Pokemon gets singled out on that BotW definitely is not of a similar difficulty level to Pokemon. Even Odyssey added in a super challenge mode.
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Aug 28, 2020 21:06
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Harrow posted:
yeah wow's design revolves around retention entirely at this point and it's really clear that everything is adjusted based on this, almost always to be worse. my pocket theory is that if someone was put in charge that said 'ok our target now is tired 30-something that want to get high and zone out after work sometimes' the game would blossom again. I'd sub more often if every time I go to see what I need to to do get something it wasn't a time-gated grind with one, or likely more, levels of RNG on top of it. the paragon chests and how they handle stuff like holiday mounts are extremely disgusting bits of design imo.
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Aug 28, 2020 21:07
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I really like the difficulty curve that modern mario games have where a child can beat bowser and see the credits, a younger child can do the same with the golden tanuki suit or whatever, and then in the postgame after the credits roll nintendo takes the gloves off and gives you the hard stuff for the people who have been playing this poo poo for 20 years
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Aug 28, 2020 21:09
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RazzleDazzleHour posted:The Wild Area was so half-baked that if you told me they did it bad on purpose to tell Nintendo to gently caress off and that open-world Pokemon was bad I would believe you. They did it as a weird, very small offshoot of the rest of the game that they made totally normally, but that part of the game is bad and boring too. Totally linear, no mystery or challenge to anything you're doing, people literally standing around in front of a road blocker saying "hey you can't go this way yet because I said so, go do what you're supposed to do then come back." Pokemon Red was a game kids could enjoy, X/Y S/M Sw/SH are games intended for toddlers. lol I kind of agree on the Wild area being the "see? an open world pokemon would loving suck" and I totally believe them now, it would suck, and I didn't realize it til SwSh tried it out in a tiny way. Really SwSh's whole "gently caress it dump everything into a generic field" and taking away any fun progression/discovery while also having almost nothing postgame, piecemealing stuff into DLC, a new gimmick that really doesn't do anything, and virtually no challenge made it boring. The last time good Pokemon game I remember was BW2, which had a great challenge and an amazing postgame with how much time you could spend in the PWT area. I realize these are games for children as well but I do like the general idea of it, which is why I'm glad the 2 current proto-pokemon games offer a different experience with better QoL stuff.
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Aug 28, 2020 21:09
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