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MikeJF posted:Oh almost certainly. I'd just hope the flight sim community can embrace a good standard methodology rather than getting grognardy and insisting on a thousand manual weird ways. Can't wait for there to be two or more camps that both have advantages but neither can work with the other over the most tepid of perceived slights or infringements on their one true project.
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Aug 29, 2020 03:29
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Anime Store Adventure posted:Can't wait for there to be two or more camps that both have advantages but neither can work with the other over the most tepid of perceived slights or infringements on their one true project. Oh, I love ETS2 modding.
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Aug 29, 2020 03:42
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MikeJF posted:I'd just hope the flight sim community can embrace a good standard methodology rather than getting grognardy and insisting on a thousand manual weird ways. Friend, I have bad news for you
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Aug 29, 2020 04:19
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Here's the manual for the GPS in the Robin; Garmin 430: https://static.garmin.com/pumac/GNS430_PilotsGuide.pdf
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Aug 29, 2020 04:30
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The only way to get stuff like this done is to weaponize the grognards. You need to be sure you're ready for them to go full grognard before you pull that trigger. Unrelated: Are there any sites yet listing tourist-ey flight paths for MSFS? I feel like doing a nice multi-hop cruise (never done this before) but would like it to cover some cool stuff in the world instead of saying "yup, that's a satellite photo" and skipping to approach.
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Aug 29, 2020 04:33
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Mailer posted:The only way to get stuff like this done is to weaponize the grognards. You need to be sure you're ready for them to go full grognard before you pull that trigger. https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2020/08/18/all-341-photorealistic-cities-in-microsoft-flight-simulator-2020/ This might help, it's a list of the cities that have the most data.
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Aug 29, 2020 04:39
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Extracting Google models to fill in gaps rubs me the wrong way, but if it gets Microsoft to put more effort into their maps again I'll be happy. And after the Melbourne monolith I saw a number of comments from people who had gone in to improve their areas in OpenStreetMap with the hopes of improving their local area in the sim, and that also makes me happy. Though I also hope it doesn't lead to OSM vandals trying to sneak in new wacky structures. I do want to see how the map updates are going to work though. Take that Orb-X London pack (that was maybe actually lovely?), does that mean MS has less incentive to improve London in general, whether autogen or custom structures? As a relatively casual simmer with a whole load of frankly obsolete FSX add-ons, I'm not going to want to pay for areas or features that are already suitable for fun VFR, let alone if there's a chance they'll be improved for free anyway. If I can get into the SDK and patch up my home town, add some comms towers and seaport cranes and fix up a few notable buildings, that'd be enough.
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Aug 29, 2020 04:53
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Mailer posted:The only way to get stuff like this done is to weaponize the grognards. You need to be sure you're ready for them to go full grognard before you pull that trigger. I mean there's only 3, but the Bush trips are exactly this right now and the Nevada one has been cool as gently caress. It hits a really cool river valley/canyon to start, an Army weapons depot and a cool high desert lake, then gets up into the Reno area over Burning Man (allegedly? Inferred this from an earlier post) and the Tesla Gigafactory, then over Lake Tahoe and such. Really excited to check out the other two. I think I said it before but I had to constantly tell myself "this terrain isn't generated to look cool, it just *is* cool."
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Aug 29, 2020 04:58
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I love this thread and as usual SA is a great source of smart people discussing good things. I have a quick question. Recently, I downloaded a Livery pack from [MSFSaddons.org](https://msfsaddons.org), finally found the proper folder to load it into (I'll never understand why AppData is hidden by default, but thats more a Windows 10 issue) and got it working perfectly... for exactly 1 session. Now, having changed nothing, the liveries are gone. Anyone have any insight as to what may have happened? I love this game so far but it feels so unfriendly to newcomers. Of course all the veteran simmers have a wealth of resources and experience to draw from but i'm honestly just over here trying to figure out how to start engines, plan flight plans, and activate auto pilots. AT THE BARE MINIMUM it would be great to have some sort of "FlightSimopedia" that gives you the basics of each craft, how to perform checklists, and tells you what the dozens of acronyms stand for (FLC? NVN? ILS? WTF??) Frustrating. I don't have all the time in the world and the fact that I have to locate and watch hours of 3rd party youtube videos in order to simply get a handle of the instruments does not feel good. I'm having a great time just doing 3rd person bush flights around familiar locations and other spectacular places around the globe but apparently that's not the 'proper' way to play! Cat Potency fucked around with this message at 06:12 on Aug 29, 2020 |
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Aug 29, 2020 05:26
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Cat Potency posted:i'm honestly just over here trying to figure out how to start engines, plan flight plans, and activate auto pilots Upon reflection, my experience so far figuring this stuff out is some of the best fun I've had in ages.
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Aug 29, 2020 05:34
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plester1 posted:Upon reflection, my experience so far figuring this stuff out is some of the best fun I've had in ages. I get that. I really do. There's a soulsesque quality of being thrown something impenetrable and then realizing you're on your own. But when half the poo poo isn't working as intended, inoperable, or inexplicable, and the assists give bad/ wrong advice, it's not rewarding.
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Aug 29, 2020 05:41
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Aviation is pretty fun when you can mess around consequence free
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Aug 29, 2020 05:46
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Cat Potency posted:I'm having a great time just doing 3rd person bush flights around familiar locations and other spectacular places around the globe but apparently that's not the 'proper' way to play! I think this is its biggest strength! I don't hang out with IRL pilots or anything, I'm having a total blast getting online with family members and flying to landmarks around the world. One of my nephews wants to fly to every baseball stadium in North America. plester1 fucked around with this message at 05:56 on Aug 29, 2020 |
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Aug 29, 2020 05:48
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Anime Store Adventure posted:I mean there's only 3, but the Bush trips are exactly this right now I saw those but figured (given you can't pick the plane and people said you can't refuel some places) those were more "challenge mode" than tourist stuff. I'll try that out, though there's not going to be much time to view stuff without a computer.  Cat Potency posted:I'm having a great time just doing 3rd person bush flights around familiar locations and other spectacular places around the globe but apparently that's not the 'proper' way to play! Dig down into the fun stuff and have your ghost copilot handle the rest. There are no points to lose or systems to game where you'd need to do unfun stuff to get to the "real" game. There's no leaderboard for Realest Pilot. Chill and fly.
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Aug 29, 2020 05:50
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Cat Potency posted:I love this thread and as usual SA is a great source of smart people discussing good things. The archive for that pack came with a main folder that had bunch of subfolders inside for each individual aircraft. I found I couldn't get it to work properly unless I went one level down and unzipped all the subfolders into the Community folder, instead of just dragging the main "livery pack" directory in there.
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Aug 29, 2020 05:57
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Mailer posted:I saw those but figured (given you can't pick the plane and people said you can't refuel some places) those were more "challenge mode" than tourist stuff. I'll try that out, though there's not going to be much time to view stuff without a computer. I think you can just gently caress around however you want, there's even a button that snaps you back on course if you get lost. I think the only difference is you won't get an achievement if you use the magic button.
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Aug 29, 2020 05:58
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You're giving dearth the opposite meaning
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Aug 29, 2020 06:05
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Charles posted:You're giving dearth the opposite meaning no idea what you're on about  I'm going to extend my rant just a little bit here. Having a skill ceiling to a game is a good thing, and letting people have fun right out of the box whilst simultaneously making them very aware of that skill ceiling is good game design. Landing a Cessna 172 is fun and easy, and the built-in tutorial is a great resource for teaching first timers how to do that. Naturally, that spurs one to want to learn how to land turbo props and jetliners -- but those are completely different animals and I've still yet to successfully land the 747. I could have figured out the Cessna 172 without a tutorial, but the more complicated planes are so drat unintuitive to understand and control, and having to sift through the (frankly mind-numbing) youtube videos, each generally about 30 minutes and packed with adds, just to figure out how to plug in a value for a variable that you didnt even know was important, is maddening. A simple included text document for each plane would have gone such a long way for me. And yes, as much as I'd be happy to just fly the Savage Cub up and down the Aleutian islands for 40 hours, that's not the entirety of the game I own. There is more here and I'm eager to learn it and master it. The fact that I can't pick apart "You don't know how that works yet" from "That's a bug" or "That hasnt been implemented yet" or "That is inoperable by design" without needing to stop the flight, spend 15-30 minutes on other websites (whilst my bandwith, CPU, and RAM are basically crippled, of course) for each simple question? No thanks. Cat Potency fucked around with this message at 06:40 on Aug 29, 2020 |
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Aug 29, 2020 06:12
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Mailer posted:I saw those but figured (given you can't pick the plane and people said you can't refuel some places) those were more "challenge mode" than tourist stuff. I'll try that out, though there's not going to be much time to view stuff without a computer. It's part touristy, part "drop you in the wild and make you figure out where you're supposed to go with limited information and lovely maps." But like people have said, there's buttons to keep you on track to make it easier. The refueling is the one part I don't understand yet. It saves your fuel levels between legs, and I'm never given a chance to refuel. I ended up binding that "refuel and repair" function that someone mentioned. That works, but I'd like to know how you're intended to complete these flights without that. It definitely feels like cheating when you use that key, but there's no other way to refuel from what I've seen. edit: the "find your way" thing can be somewhat challenging from time to time but it's a very low-key, slow paced experience where you're given plenty of time to find stuff (these are 7 to 9 hour journeys when you add all the legs up, after all). My suggestion would be to just bind a key to the "refuel and repair" function and then just chill out for the duration. If you get lost, press the magic "back on track" button. The flight path they want you to take is intentionally indirect and guided through some interesting sights. I'm currently about 80% of the way through the Sierra Nevada one and it's good times.   
Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 08:03 on Aug 29, 2020 |
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Aug 29, 2020 07:13
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I'd never buy a game on release date for full price... I feel like this should be the most basic advice ever.
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Aug 29, 2020 07:47
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Seems impossible to have the Beechcraft Baron alt load not maxxed out if you have any lights on. The dome light even makes it jump. I don't even have deicing on. They need to switch to LEDs. (I think the values are messed up. Not sure if it makes any difference or if it'll break)
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Aug 29, 2020 08:38
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:It's part touristy, part "drop you in the wild and make you figure out where you're supposed to go with limited information and lovely maps." But like people have said, there's buttons to keep you on track to make it easier. I almost made it through Nevada. Their instructions are horrible and full of dumb tourist pamphlet stuff, and the textures for the river (bonus points for giant shark fins!) go strange places that got me off course quite a bit. Still, I practiced a lot of really nice flying if I do say so my drat self. Nice and steady, throttle up/down at the right time, smooth rear end turns (mostly). After a couple of missed turns I got back on track and used the visual references and headings to get me to the airport. No ATC, no ATIS, but I know I'm supposed to land into the wind so wanted to pick a runway based on that. This reminded me that you can look for the windsock, but I was a bit high up and couldn't see one. No problem, since there's no planes around and I could descend and take a trip over the midline to check for it. I'm a responsible pilot! I died over the airport because I wasn't monitoring airspeed on descent and my Savage Cub tore itself apart. 
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Aug 29, 2020 08:44
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I said come in! posted:Does anyone know where you can purchase packaged airline meals online and have them delivered to your house? My wife and I want to do a flight in Flight Sim and role play as pilot /co-pilot, or passengers. This is the dorkiest and cutest thing I have read in a while I'm thinking that you deserve better than the airline food I know. Supposedly in Japan you get really nice meals with beer even in economy class. Try to look for Indian Thali plates. These are metal dishes with compartments, so they will feel right. But they are also good quality so after you guys had a threesome with the stewardess you can still use them to have tasty Indian food.
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Aug 29, 2020 08:55
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Mailer posted:I saw those but figured (given you can't pick the plane and people said you can't refuel some places) those were more "challenge mode" than tourist stuff. The one over the Balkans is in a Cessna with a G1000, so you can always see where you are on the map and where the waypoints are if you're unsure.
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Aug 29, 2020 08:58
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Cat Potency posted:no idea what you're on about On the other hand, the airliners are recreations of stupendously complicated objects that require training and assumed experience. Even in the sim where penalties for failure are much lower and the recreations apparently aren't "study-level", I don't think you could have that simple text document. I do think the default planes in general need more checklists for people who want to do things by the book, and that kind of tutorial works well where it exists, but I think teaching real-world use and control, procedures and regulations, and understanding of their various speciality systems goes beyond the expectations of a default airliner, even before considering the time and effort to implement.
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Aug 29, 2020 09:00
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Lord Stimperor posted:This is the dorkiest and cutest thing I have read in a while JAL economy food is quite nice, and comes with beer. Their long haul premium eco is also the best value air travel product I have ever experienced. I look forward to a time when I can leave Melbourne International in any way other than using FS2020 
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Aug 29, 2020 09:37
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You know, this game's not perfect, but it's sucked me in more than any game since, uh, probably the launch of Shadowbringers. Maybe more than that. It's just fun thinking of things that you want to see and zipping around the countryside, or seeing how fast you can push an A320, or how far you can stretch yourself during an hours-long flight. One thing I haven't been able to figure out: how are you supposed to navigate by VOR on the G1000-equipped planes? I figured out the needle gauges on the Robin and the older Cessnas, but the G1000 has a big green arrow that I can't get to line up even if I'm pointed straight at a VOR beacon. Look at this picture for an example: according to the second screen and the little blue arrow on the HUD I'm lined right up with the DXG VOR, but the NAV 1 arrow doesn't really indicate anything like that.  I guess I could follow the blue arrows, but they're a bit hard to see and the autopilot won't follow them. Hell, a general guide to the G1000 would be great, it's not the most intuitive thing. I didn't even know you could look up airports and beacons on the right screen until today! Also, I'll try not to clog the thread up with a bunch of pictures, but this game is pretty enough that I have to post at least a few.    
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Aug 29, 2020 09:55
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Solo Wing Pixy posted:
You need to turn the CRS knob until the CRS block above the HSI (thing you're using to navigate) shows the radial you are intending to fly. Right now you have it set to the 000 radial, which is indicated by the open green arrow and general orientation of the CDI needle on the HSI. However you are flying south. So the HSI is gonna point backwards. It sounds like you're trying to just home in on a VOR rather than fly a specific radial. In that case, turn the CRS knob until the needle centers itself, then turn the plane until the open arrow is pointing upwards, and fly that direction.
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Aug 29, 2020 10:08
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The game could have at least launched with the checklists from start to shut down for the default planes like FSX. I don't know that that is too much to ask for new players.
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Aug 29, 2020 11:22
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First leg of Nevada done. I don't know if me having the best landing I've ever had going in manually with a taildragger for the first time is a good or a bad thing. I'll take it.
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Aug 29, 2020 12:24
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Seems a bit unrealistic to be upset about not being able to go from a 172 to a 747 without putting serious time into it. It’s a simulator, after all and you’ve been flying for..... a handful of days now? And you can literally start it on a runway and be airborne almost immediately without knowing anything about flap overspeed or egt or anything. It is unfortunate to hear that the experience is bad for new pilots. If I don’t get the engines started within about 20 seconds the “hit ctrl-e to start engines” tooltip. I am mad at the systems and performance of the jets compared to the real versions but thought that for new pilots that didn’t know or care it would be pretty approachable.
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Aug 29, 2020 14:03
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I think Asobo really dropped the ball on the tutorials, and every plane at a minimum should have "cold and dark to dark and cooling" checklists as detailed as the C172, but you just aren't going to learn how to fly a 21st century jetliner from "a simple text document." Cat Potency posted:I'm having a great time just doing 3rd person bush flights around familiar locations and other spectacular places around the globe but apparently that's not the 'proper' way to play! Given that detailed terrain for the entire world is the leading gimmick for MSFS, and the amount of effort put in to the planes that are traditionally flown VFR vs the half-assed "high-end" planes, I'd argue that not only is it the "proper," way to play, but it's also clearly the developer intended way to play. The game just isn't there yet for the people who like cruising around the flight levels on autopilot and will try to tell you that's the "proper" way to play flight sims. It's absolutely there for what you've been doing. Theris fucked around with this message at 14:24 on Aug 29, 2020 |
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Aug 29, 2020 14:20
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Wow.
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Aug 29, 2020 14:28
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I don't think anyone is asking for a magic tutorial.txt that instantly transfers all the knowledge to fly airliners. But between what's now in the game and magictutorial.txt there's a lot of room for improvement. I'm learning the G1000 and G3000 entirely from YouTube tutorials and the manufacturer manual. That's fine for the hardcore flight simulation crowd. But I don't think we can seriously make the point that this is a desirable circumstance. There should be step by step guides at least for the basic functions, and pointers for further information. Otherwise this stuff will remain accessible to and used by only the grognardiest of players and that would be an absolute shame.
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Aug 29, 2020 14:51
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Yea. It was basic as hell but if I recall on FSX there were the checklists then a basic "manual" that had some guidance on take off rates/speeds and basic approach and landing guidance. That's enough for me. I'm fine with supplementing that elsewhere but I do think a dark to dark checklist and some simple manual/guidance for each default should be minimum included ideally.
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Aug 29, 2020 14:57
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Theris posted:I think Asobo really dropped the ball on the tutorials, and every plane at a minimum should have "cold and dark to dark and cooling" checklists as detailed as the C172, but you just aren't going to learn how to fly a 21st century jetliner from "a simple text document." the problem isnt the checklists tbh, it's the systems behind everything. it isnt just about cruising around in the flight levels on autopilot, the game is fundamentally broken in weight and balance, fuel range, and the basic navigation systems. even the number of fuel tanks some of these aircraft have. the weather is broken. icing and deicing is a joke - basically did you turn on window heat? no? here's some ice on your windshields as soon as you go through a cloud hit the button and it'll go away in 20 seconds. engine anti-ice doesnt affect performance and doesnt even do anything other than be a clickable button. yes, autopilot is broken too but you don't have to be a person who leaves it on autopilot to be affected by these issues. click buttons to make engine go brrr is cool and all but make it right if you want to learn the G1000 or G3000 in any meaningful sense, that's basically hardcore flight sim crowd imo. embrace it.
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Aug 29, 2020 15:56
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i also think them putting the G1000 in as many default aircraft as they did is a crime. it makes GA needlessly complex and there's no reason why so many aircraft need it other than i guess it looks cool, but a version without it and a GNS430 or something would have been great and a good stepping stone from nothing digital to a digital system 90%+ of GA aircraft you could fly today don't have what im saying is the default baron cockpit on x-plane is perfect dont @ me
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Aug 29, 2020 16:13
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sellouts posted:i also think them putting the G1000 in as many default aircraft as they did is a crime. it makes GA needlessly complex and there's no reason why so many aircraft need it other than i guess it looks cool, but a version without it and a GNS430 or something would have been great and a good stepping stone from nothing digital to a digital system 90%+ of GA aircraft you could fly today don't have As a noobie simmer, I totally agree about the G1000. Right now, I'm more interested in solving the riddle of the trim wheel than the maze of the G1000...I wish the steam gauge 172 wasn't locked behind the deluxe version, but I'm also perfectly content learning as much as I can about the basics of GA until some nice 3rd party content comes out.
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Aug 29, 2020 17:05
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Turbo Poggs posted:As a noobie simmer, I totally agree about the G1000. Right now, I'm more interested in solving the riddle of the trim wheel than the maze of the G1000...I wish the steam gauge 172 wasn't locked behind the deluxe version, but I'm also perfectly content learning as much as I can about the basics of GA until some nice 3rd party content comes out. Yeah really wish the 172 with gauges wasn't an add on thing. It should just be a default option. Especially because it makes sense to move up from the 152 to there as you become more comfortable.
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Aug 29, 2020 17:27
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I've been really enjoying experimenting with the aircraft systems but I'm way past the basics of flying. I know a big part of the traditional sim crowd is the systems management of jets, doing proper approaches etc. I get that but I've never found it fun; that's why my combat sim of choice has always been IL2 and not DCS. I like the feeling of flight and skipping all the tedious stuff that makes flying more like an office job and MSFS2020 does that really well. To be honest I think they made the right choice; people dropping in to learn how to fly are going to need to start with the GA aircraft, which they nailed. That's also the largest segment and is who will need the sort of tutorials they provided. If you're serious about learning how to fly a 747 tbh I don't think it's unreasonable to expect you to go online to learn it. They could have at least provided a curated list but again, you're learning to fly a modern jet; a set of cold and dark to flying to cold and dark tutorials for that alone is worth $60.
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Aug 29, 2020 17:29
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