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I don't get the hate for original Molly either. People spend too much time hating things.
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Sep 26, 2020 20:36
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redbrouw posted:I don't get the hate for original Molly either. People spend too much time hating things. 
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Sep 26, 2020 21:42
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I know I'm coming in like a week late with Starbucks but honestly I think people overestimate Trent's emotional... depth, I guess? He very much reads to me like someone who has inflicting pain on and flaunting control over other people as his primary motivation for most of the relevant things we've seen him doing. Everything else is a justification to make that more socially acceptable and soften the consequences for what he's doing. He's definitely not the master of cold rationality he puts on airs of being. I mean, in the space of one breath he goes from saying Caleb is his groomed and perfected heir to saying he doesn't intend to step down or die. But if you look at his motivations through the lens of sadism, the whole thing with Caleb is just another way to inflict pain of a different kind and set himself up as the puppetmaster who is in control. Not just to hurt Caleb, but to hurt Astrid and Eadwulf, who also killed their parents out of loyalty to the Empire and are now being told to their faces they're too limited in talent to have used that pain to 'properly grow'. He doesn't strike me as that different in inclination than a nurse that kills dozens of people under her care after abusing them in subtle ways because she can, and because people will praise her dedication to her job anyway. Unfortunately for everyone under his power, he also happens to be an extremely talented and intelligent wizard with a huge position of societal power, one who is clever enough to make his personal sadism project something useful for those who need a justification to keep him around. There's a reason he unsettles and disgusts even Ludamis Da'leth, and I think deep-seated loyalty to the Empire would just provoke amused contempt from Ludamis, not disgust. PetraCore fucked around with this message at 00:34 on Sep 27, 2020 |
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Sep 27, 2020 00:32
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Yeah Beau compared Trent to her dad and that wasn't a comparison she made lightly. They both looked at the people they raised and said "Well you turned out ok so I don't see what the problem is" The only real difference is Trent is undoubtedly much more educated than Mr Lionett so he said it more eloquently Similarly when he says he wants Caleb to be a bad enough dude to kill him what he's really saying is "I will always live rent free in your head no matter what you do after this dinner"
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Sep 27, 2020 04:15
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Yeah, there's a recurring theme of manipulative and abusive relationships this campaign, Beau and her dad, Jester and the Traveller, Caleb and Trent, Yasha and Obann, Fjord and, I forget his name... His mentor. I'm sure I'm forgetting some. Even to a lesser extent, Vett clearly loves her husband but she does have a tendency to walk all over him when it comes to setting an example to Luc and he's stuck with the consequences while she's away doing her thing.
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Sep 27, 2020 12:25
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Hulk Smash! posted:Fjord and, I forget his name... His mentor. Vandran? I don't even remember Fjord detailing their relationship in any depth beyond the fact he respected Vandran and wanted to emulate him. I'd have thought his relationship with Sabian, his old deckmate under Vandran was the more contentious and abusive one; though Fjord hasn't gone in to much detail on that relationship either that I recall, beyond that they grew up together and Sabian was always kind of a dick. Also, Veth was heavily influenced in her formative years by the abuse of the other kids, going of Sam's description of her backstory. She was bullied by them for being different, for not being pretty and liking normal things but instead wanting to collect oddities or what have you. The twisting of her form and torture by both the Goblins and the Hag could be classed as abuse too, I suppose, though there isn't any relationship there as such. We never got far enough in to Molly's background to establish any abuse on his end, but I suspect there was some there too and really, it's just Cadeceus that isn't informed by it to some degree. Which I imagine was a conscious decision on his part, to go along with a personality that brings people together as a calming influence and healer. tsob fucked around with this message at 15:27 on Sep 27, 2020 |
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Sep 27, 2020 15:17
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tsob posted:Vandran? I don't even remember Fjord detailing their relationship in any depth beyond the fact he respected Vandran and wanted to emulate him. I'd have thought his relationship with Sabian, his old deckmate under Vandran was the more contentious and abusive one; though Fjord hasn't gone in to much detail on that relationship either that I recall, beyond that they grew up together and Sabian was always kind of a dick. Also, Veth was heavily influenced in her formative years by the abuse of the other kids, going of Sam's description of her backstory. She was bullied by them for being different, for not being pretty and liking normal things but instead wanting to collect oddities or what have you. The twisting of her form and torture by both the Goblins and the Hag could be classed as abuse too, I suppose, though there isn't any relationship there as such. We never got far enough in to Molly's background to establish any abuse on his end, but I suspect there was some there too and really, it's just Cadeceus that isn't informed by it to some degree. Which I imagine was a conscious decision on his part, to go along with a personality that brings people together as a calming influence and healer. That's it. Sabian is the one I was thinking about.
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Sep 27, 2020 15:45
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Dawgstar posted:Every now and then I look in on the wider CR fandom and it's always about what I expect.
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Sep 27, 2020 20:16
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Crazy Ted posted:A certain segment of Critical Role viewers has been making GBS threads all over Marisha Ray since the beginning stages of Campaign One. TBF, I love Marisha and Beau but Keyleth was...A one note joke even for a C1 cast member. "OH young sheltered prodigy meets the harsh real world." was fun for a bit but she's most just kind of their.
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Sep 27, 2020 21:07
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I'm pretty sure that most of the hate directed at Marisha was only camouflaged by that and was, in fact, closer to "women in my hobby!?" and being angry that the DM let his girlfriend play.
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Sep 27, 2020 22:03
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Hulk Smash! posted:I'm pretty sure that most of the hate directed at Marisha was only camouflaged by that and was, in fact, closer to "women in my hobby!?" and being angry that the DM let his girlfriend play. I mean for sure yeah. I just don't like Keyleth.
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Sep 27, 2020 22:04
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Hulk Smash! posted:I'm pretty sure that most of the hate directed at Marisha was only camouflaged by that and was, in fact, closer to "women in my hobby!?" and being angry that the DM let his girlfriend play. Added to that I think was Keyleth got to do some stuff because Matt handwaved it, zeroing in on her because DM's girlfriend/wife and also woman and ignoring that Matt did that and does that for like everybody.
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Sep 27, 2020 22:49
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:I mean for sure yeah. Dawgstar posted:Added to that I think was Keyleth got to do some stuff because Matt handwaved it, zeroing in on her because DM's girlfriend/wife and also woman and ignoring that Matt did that and does that for like everybody.
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Sep 27, 2020 22:56
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tsob posted:Vandran? I don't even remember Fjord detailing their relationship in any depth beyond the fact he respected Vandran and wanted to emulate him. I'd have thought his relationship with Sabian, his old deckmate under Vandran was the more contentious and abusive one; though Fjord hasn't gone in to much detail on that relationship either that I recall, beyond that they grew up together and Sabian was always kind of a dick. Also, Veth was heavily influenced in her formative years by the abuse of the other kids, going of Sam's description of her backstory. She was bullied by them for being different, for not being pretty and liking normal things but instead wanting to collect oddities or what have you. The twisting of her form and torture by both the Goblins and the Hag could be classed as abuse too, I suppose, though there isn't any relationship there as such. We never got far enough in to Molly's background to establish any abuse on his end, but I suspect there was some there too and really, it's just Cadeceus that isn't informed by it to some degree. Which I imagine was a conscious decision on his part, to go along with a personality that brings people together as a calming influence and healer. EDIT: I mean, also the way him being bullied and emotionally neglected shaped him as a person. PetraCore fucked around with this message at 02:49 on Sep 28, 2020 |
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Sep 28, 2020 02:43
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Dawgstar posted:Added to that I think was Keyleth got to do some stuff because Matt handwaved it, zeroing in on her because DM's girlfriend/wife and also woman and ignoring that Matt did that and does that for like everybody. When asked to comment on "That Pat Rothfuss Bullshit," the senator had to return to an urgent meeting.
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Sep 28, 2020 05:45
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Great but incomplete theory: the missing link here are the Beacons. Objects that we know are connected with multiple lives, not unlike what Molly seems to have now, and perhaps the stolen Beacons interacted with or blocked Lucien's return and led to Molly incarnating with no sense of who he was. The Beacons date back to the existence of the city which might now be alive, and to the creation of weapons designed to kill the gods. What if they were originally crafted as a specific part of that conflict, in Aeor? My only uncertainty at present is whether they were constructed as regenerators, so that casualties wouldn't stay dead, or if that function is incidental to their original purpose, which was to catch and trap the divine energies released when a deity is slain to prevent any sort of reincarnation. Bonus points if it turns out there are 9 Beacons. We know the Cerberus Assembly is experimenting with their new Beacon. When was it recovered, I wonder, as compared with the time-frame of Lucien coming back? And is there a risk of something going wrong and the Beacon summoning the Living City from the Astral Sea to wreak havoc? And how old is Ludinus Da'leth? Old enough to have been part of the original Cerberus Assembly? I do see a second thread with the Beacons related to Caleb's "change the past" background goal, which may no longer be his goal now. What if a powerful wizard decided to try and undo the Divergence?
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Sep 29, 2020 15:50
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Don't the beacons just make it so anyone who dies within range will be "reborn" the next time an actual child is born? It's not a full raising of your same body like what seems to be happening with Admin/User1/User2
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Sep 29, 2020 15:57
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I believe that's right. IIRC the M9 even asked those questions re: coming back as an adult and taking over a body and got confirmation that it always points to a newborn that is born within the beacon's radius of influence. Souls begin to "remember" their past self at around adolescence.
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Sep 29, 2020 16:05
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Correct the beacons wouldn't have brought Lucien/Molly/Admin back into the same body, it has been described as instead being reincarnation. Starting over from the beginning as a child and growing up. Not resurrection. Now that does not mean that the beacons cannot have originated with Aeor, just that "Molly" coming back is not likely tied to his distance to a beacon based on the currently know lore of them. It would be quite the coincidence for there to be 9 of them!
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Sep 29, 2020 19:17
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if your gonna murder all the gods you need an afterlife replacement
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Sep 29, 2020 19:31
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xarph posted:When asked to comment on "That Pat Rothfuss Bullshit," the senator had to return to an urgent meeting. I kinda trailed off of C1, what’s this about?
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Sep 29, 2020 20:44
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Beef Jerky Robot posted:I kinda trailed off of C1, what’s this about? That Pat Rothfuss Bullshit refers to Rothfuss' ability to argue and narratively bullshit his way into the GM letting him do something which technically according to the rules he shouldn't be able to but would be really sick if he could Weirdly enough I don't think he attempted this during either of his CR C1 appearances
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Sep 29, 2020 20:48
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Sounds like that could also be the "NADDPOD bullshit" but I guess it fits better there since that table is open to so many more shenanigans than even the CR folks get up to.
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Sep 29, 2020 21:25
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There is a helpful video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGqejf_e7Jk
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Sep 29, 2020 21:34
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My thinking is not that Molly was brought back by a beacon. My thought is that whatever self-resurrection was available to his Nine-eyes persona got interfered with by his being in range of a Beacon, and that blocked whatever the City had done to him, leaving something of a blank slate behind, or perhaps leaving whoever he was before he stumbled into the City and got reprogrammed to be one of its agents. But I suppose it could have been something else. I wondered about Nott’s second life and the Beacons and we got a different explanation for that reincarnation.
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Sep 29, 2020 23:19
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So after ten thousand years, I have finally caught up to the end of Critical Role C2, and can watch a live episode. On a week they're not running a show.
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Sep 30, 2020 03:52
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I just hope the group thinks to at least try a sending to Molly to see if he's remotely the same guy they remember, and if so maybe they can figure out what his deal is (though of course it won't be that same person/personality, but I still think you gotta try it). Molly popping back up was the obvious way to take the plot someday, but it's still quite satisfying to see it happen.
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Sep 30, 2020 04:09
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Haha Liam forgot about Vokodo’s spell reflection.
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Sep 30, 2020 04:15
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NowonSA posted:I just hope the group thinks to at least try a sending to Molly to see if he's remotely the same guy they remember, and if so maybe they can figure out what his deal is (though of course it won't be that same person/personality, but I still think you gotta try it). I'm going to bet that sending to Molly fails because it's no longer "Molly" in there.
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Sep 30, 2020 04:31
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Caleb confirmed into hotboi. 
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Sep 30, 2020 04:31
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Is there any reason it cant just be - "the tomb takers have a cleric"?
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Sep 30, 2020 11:32
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Yeah, the beacons and the Astral Sea have very little to do with each other in Matt's story style. I'm very interested in Ruidis though. You don't mess up ruinous as a word for no reason. I don't know if the point is to pull the moon down Majora style, or if it will even happen this campaign, but that moon is clearly evil.
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Sep 30, 2020 11:47
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Just to mess with Tal, Molly should now have a perfect Irish accent 
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Sep 30, 2020 12:48
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The Talks vod got a content strike so the first 3 minutes of them talking is muted, does anyone remember roughly what they talked about at the start?
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Sep 30, 2020 14:14
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Keru posted:The Talks vod got a content strike so the first 3 minutes of them talking is muted, does anyone remember roughly what they talked about at the start? I'm in the same boat as you, but for the beginning it at least appears to be the general "Are we on the internet", "OMG It's Henry" banter that opens the show, along with talks of quarantine. I'm hoping they fix it for the youtube vod tomorrow.
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Sep 30, 2020 14:35
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Orcs and Ostriches posted:So after ten thousand years, I have finally caught up to the end of Critical Role C2, and can watch a live episode. I caught up right after they hit 100 episodes and thought I'd finally get to see a live episode. Then I remembered time zones are a thing and I'm not getting out of bed at 3am to watch a show on the Internet.
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Sep 30, 2020 19:10
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Government Handjob posted:I caught up right after they hit 100 episodes and thought I'd finally get to see a live episode. Then I remembered time zones are a thing and I'm not getting out of bed at 3am to watch a show on the Internet. I was in the same boat then too. I caught up with 100 right before they made the announcement to shut everything down. I kinda lost track at that point and just caught up again with the next 11 episodes this past couple of weeks. I'm at least in North America so it'll be easy to catch the next episode live.
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Sep 30, 2020 19:19
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I watched my first live episode in a while ( I kind of fell off with the endless 5 footers that Rumblecusp felt like, really getting back in as they finally fought Vokodo and then was pretty quick to catch back up ) and last week was the last episode I was watching live. Then I get the "Hey, no episode next week!" So hooray, I finally caught up completely and for a lovely birthday present, I can't even watch the whole episode live since I took off Thursday/Friday. Sad, but I mean, whatever. Just sucks to be caught up with that announcement.
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Sep 30, 2020 20:53
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Yeah it was kind of a strange announcement too, I wonder why they spliced it in like that. Aren't they usually filmed in advance now? Maybe they had a hangup in editing.
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Oct 1, 2020 05:56
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They usually film two weeks ahead so my guess is that the second week they ran into an issue when filming
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Oct 1, 2020 06:06
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