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Bottom Liner posted:remind them that it was the media that broke the story on Watergate Remind them specifically who, and refer them to his most recent book.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:34
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Sarcastro posted:Remind them specifically who, and refer them to his most recent book. Also, that Watergate didn't start with the conclusion that Nixon was dirty and then going out to find evidence of it. The evidence trail led back to Nixon despite no one thinking it would.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:36
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Sarcastro posted:Remind them specifically who, and refer them to his most recent book. I would bet there's an increasing amount of Trumpers that are starting to, if they didn't already, think Nixon was railroaded by the media as well.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:37
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Rebel Blob posted:To make a general case: nearly all presidents come from prior political office, with Trump is an anomaly. When a politician obviously has their eyes on a higher prize than their current office, it makes it difficult to believe that they are serving their current constituents as well as they could be. Obviously treating a lower office as a stepping-stone to a higher one is a bad sign, a strong signal that the politican in question is focusing their time and energy into political advancement rather than their current job. Issue is that well-off liberals have been trained to see ambition and career advancement as virtues in themselves, and consider what is actually done in that office to be academic at best. That they're the stars of the rags-to-riches story, and they must fulfil the narrative first and foremost. Any criticism of what they actually do is obviously just the haters and antagonists trying to drag them down out of jealousy. Medullah posted:I would bet there's an increasing amount of Trumpers that are starting to, if they didn't already, think Nixon was railroaded by the media as well. They do not give a poo poo about the past. Even Reagan's probably been displaced by Trump.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:38
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https://twitter.com/srl/status/1328378153828552704
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Nov 16, 2020 18:38
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https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1328382287331856384
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Nov 16, 2020 18:38
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mobby_6kl posted:Here's what was done here (and probably most of Europe) in wave 1: closed borders, fully shut down retail, entertainment and hospitality. Mandatory masks everywhere. Massive contact tracing. This basically meant the virus was negligible by summer time (then we opened er up of course). Does a president have the ability to require and enforce any of that? Essentially impossible with the state of our body politic. The only reason the 'lockdown' ...and I use that in quotes because there's only one specific place that an actual Lockdown happened: Wykygyl NY after the outbreak there...worked here in the spring is because there was at least an implicit understanding that the Feds are saying it is dangerous to operate typical businesses in this time of crisis, therefore they would be on the hook for the negative externalities. E.g..the State (as a concept) would foot the bill for the fallout. Americans have no idea what actual lockdown is. Well, a handful of people in north New Rochelle know, but that's about it. During that march span the NY national guard was going door to door in Wykygyl and getting lists of all the household needs people had and literally setting up a logistics chain to keeping them going.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:38
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Medullah posted:I would bet there's an increasing amount of Trumpers that are starting to, if they didn't already, think Nixon was railroaded by the media as well. There are. It has come up multiple times during all this. It was very loud during the impeachment
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Nov 16, 2020 18:39
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Sarcastro posted:It's additionally loving stupid when you realize that the two Presidents they've said that about were 1) a supposedly-recovered alcoholic, and 2) a life-long teetotaler who allegedy never drank at all in the first place. Which president would people want to have beer with the most based purely on their personality? I'd say Benjamin Hayes or LBJ.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:40
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I hope he ends up with thousands less votes in GA
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Nov 16, 2020 18:40
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Sorry Nancy come back and talk to me when you've got a one thousand time match
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Nov 16, 2020 18:40
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Zwabu posted:How does the idea that "Trump realizes he lost, he's just performing a theater for his fans" square with him replacing a good chunk of the civilian Dept. of Defense and national security leadership for what would be the last couple of months of his presidency? The theory I think seems most probable is that he's either planning on ending a war (just yanking all our troops out of the mideast) or starting one (with Iran?) and wants people all down the line who will let him. Really though it's Trump it might just be that he wants to fire a bunch of people in a futile attempt to get his dick hard Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 18:45 on Nov 16, 2020 |
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Nov 16, 2020 18:43
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OK, somebody said that having a job that you worked hard for his bad when you're the president because of the bad things you do to your friends on your way there, and I am sincerely asking who they are thinking of then in Biden's case. I've definitely seen that Trump has stabbed people in the back his whole life, despite not being in politics. He's destroyed every friendship ever had, as far as I can see, except for Giuliani. But who are the people Biden did that to, and/or on trump's level or kind of at all?
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Nov 16, 2020 18:43
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The Oldest Man posted:Sorry Nancy come back and talk to me when you've got a one thousand time match believe it or not, those unsubscribe links actually work. stopping the flow of neoliberals begging me for money was one of the biggest anxiety reliefs i granted myself this year. i always like to include the note of "go beg kasich's supporters for money" if they're stupid enough to leave a freeform "why are you unsubscribing" field. e: Pick posted:OK, somebody said that having a job that you worked hard for his bad when you're the president because of the bad things you do to your friends on your way there, and I am sincerely asking who they are thinking of then in Biden's case. I've definitely seen that Trump has stabbed people in the back his whole life, despite not being in politics. He's destroyed every friendship ever had, as far as I can see, except for Giuliani. But who are the people Biden did that to, and/or on trump's level or kind of at all? Chaining working class graduates (ie the demographic he claims to have come from in his campaign ads, and where it would be thinkable he has - or had - some 'friends') to their student debt via the exceptions in the bankruptcy bill springs immediately to mind. I don't have Joe's class of whenever yearbook though, so I couldn't tell you specific names of people in his social circles his policies have directly hurt. Lib and let die fucked around with this message at 18:48 on Nov 16, 2020 |
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Nov 16, 2020 18:44
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:The theory I think seems most probable is that he's either planning on ending a war (just yanking all our troops out of the mideast) or starting one (with Iran?) and wants people all down the line who will let him. I doubt that' he's planning on starting a war , but I could totally see him stopping one or unilaterally withdrawing troops from Afghanistan or other Middle East countries. That makes a lot of sense if he is trying to secure a "legacy" to set him up for running in 2024. That way he can point back and say " I pulled troops out , Biden sent them back in!' The goal of this administration right now is to really gum up the works for Biden at all costs so that they can run on that platform in 2024. Its the same thing McConnell has been doing for decade now almost of causing the problem itself then laying the blame on the Democrats for not fixing the problem.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:49
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Madkal posted:Another thing to remember about Trumps handling of the virus is that he disbanded the agency that Obama (boo be upon his name) put in place to monitor diseases coming out of Asia, and disbanded a task force to deal with epidemics, all done out of spite. If Clinton (boo be upon her name) was presidents those agencies would still be around. This. A non-trump administration would not have defunded the Wuhan research and monitoring center or associated international agreements, meaning there's a nonzero chance the pandemic never leaves the region or is squelched in a month. 1glitch0 posted:I never got why Blagojevich went down. Was it just because it was taped? I feel like he was screwed. What he was doing was totally corrupt, but I imagine any governor in his position would/have done the exact same thing. It's weird cases like this or when a cop is actually arrested where you have to imagine the person going, "WTF, everyone else is doing this, why am I hosed??" no, that was not remotely normal.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:49
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If you choose to believe a man who thinks windmills cause cancer instead of doctors with decades of experience, I have no sympathy for you.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:50
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Hollismason posted:I doubt that' he's planning on starting a war , but I could totally see him stopping one or unilaterally withdrawing troops from Afghanistan or other Middle East countries. That makes a lot of sense if he is trying to secure a "legacy" to set him up for running in 2024. That way he can point back and say " I pulled troops out , Biden sent them back in!' The goal of this administration right now is to really gum up the works for Biden at all costs so that they can run on that platform in 2024. Its the same thing McConnell has been doing for decade now almost of causing the problem itself then laying the blame on the Democrats for not fixing the problem. He's definitely running in 2024 and its a question of if he really sees starting a war with, like, Canada as a sufficient way to "Own the Libs" or if just doing a retreat from the Middle East is enough.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:50
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Glen Greenwald using his new editor free blog to defend transphobes, specifically the author of a new book (published under an alt-right label) that makes a bunch of baseless trans panic assertions. https://twitter.com/RottenInDenmark/status/1328093607534870528 https://twitter.com/RottenInDenmark/status/1328094749165645825 Longer thread here if you really want to dive into it. https://twitter.com/kristinrawls/status/1328141240215416832
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Nov 16, 2020 18:51
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BigBallChunkyTime posted:If you choose to believe a man who thinks windmills cause cancer instead of doctors with decades of experience, I have no sympathy for you. As far as I know they’re only planning on doing triage at intake so they won’t kick out the red hats for people who need beds
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Nov 16, 2020 18:53
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Pick posted:OK, somebody said that having a job that you worked hard for his bad when you're the president because of the bad things you do to your friends on your way there, and I am sincerely asking who they are thinking of then in Biden's case. I've definitely seen that Trump has stabbed people in the back his whole life, despite not being in politics. He's destroyed every friendship ever had, as far as I can see, except for Giuliani. But who are the people Biden did that to, and/or on trump's level or kind of at all? It certainly is a detriment and red flag when the structures you must rise through for decades demand you purge yourself of an internally coherent moral core and allow the monied and powerful dictate your actions while you focus entirely on building a PR team and a personal brand that can fit neatly into the aesthetics-as-politics machine that is the Dem power structures and affiliated orgs. Biden throughout his career has mostly harmed people who dont matter at that level, like minorities and students and the poor. These structures arent exclusively and singularly bad because they turn you into a sociopath, they have other and equally sinister demands as well. And anyway I've been voting for these well credentialed idiots with the party seal of approval my whole life and what has it gotten me? All it means anymore is that this person is 100% either going to lose or suck and most likely both Epic High Five fucked around with this message at 18:56 on Nov 16, 2020 |
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Nov 16, 2020 18:54
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Of loving course Greenwald is a TERF too.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:55
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Bottom Liner posted:Of loving course Greenwald is a TERF too. It's kind-of amazing how all these "wait, are they horrible or not?" people just keep leaping onto the TERF grenade and answering the question. If Rowling had just kept her mouth shut, imagine. But they somehow just cannot. Gotta Speak Out and Let The World Know
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Nov 16, 2020 18:58
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OK, but rising in the business structure requires exactly the same thing. My experience working with the nonprofit world suggests it too experiences exactly the same dynamics. Or a law firm, or the judiciary. I'm never going to be a member of the Know-Nothing Party. I'm not going to want someone with zero experience who doesn't understand what the structures are; if that's mandatory to moral purity I'll shave the moral purity and keep the cognizance.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:58
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Mat Cauthon posted:Glen Greenwald using his new editor free blog to defend transphobes, specifically the author of a new book (published under an alt-right label) that makes a bunch of baseless trans panic assertions.  Wow, the mask really fell off with him then.
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Nov 16, 2020 18:59
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I don't think 50k student debt relief is happening. A lot of CONmen are mad about it and that's who the Democrats really listen to, ultimately.
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Nov 16, 2020 19:02
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Handsome Ralph posted:
Some would argue it was a poorly fitting mask all along.
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Nov 16, 2020 19:04
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:Some would argue it was a poorly fitting mask all along. still lolling at the people who rushed to his defense for regularly going on tucker carlson well after tucker's mask fell off
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Nov 16, 2020 19:07
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Pick posted:OK, but rising in the business structure requires exactly the same thing. My experience working with the nonprofit world suggests it too experiences exactly the same dynamics. Or a law firm, or the judiciary. I'm never going to be a member of the Know-Nothing Party. I'm not going to want someone with zero experience who doesn't understand what the structures are; if that's mandatory to moral purity I'll shave the moral purity and keep the cognizance. Those people would also make bad presidents yeah, for the same reason. What you're looking for is someone who has managed to rise to prominence while refusing to submit to the dominant economic forces controlling both parties. The best way to find these people would be to look at the people who ARE rubber stamped lizards with thousand yard stares are working to disempower and slander. People who think Dubbya was a swell guy, and Reagan and Kasich are good patriotic americans, but despise Bernie and spend all their time attacking their left. The "have a beer with" thing is entirely outdated. Neither party since 2008 has expected you to actually like the candidate they put forward, they just demand loyalty now because offering things is gauche. In fact if you say youd prefer a candidate you didnt find uninspiring or outright repulsive you're guilty of ideological purity testing lol Heck Yes! Loam! posted:Some would argue it was a poorly fitting mask all along. TERF stuff is going to be ascendant in the middle going forward. Glenn is the dumbest kind of free speech absolutist but KHive psychos are already using it as a defense of Kamalas record as a wedge to an audience that was already receptive.
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Nov 16, 2020 19:08
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How did Khive come about as a nickname for that group anyway? I just think of the lovely bar tv app thing when I hear it.
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Nov 16, 2020 19:10
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I'm just gonna have to shrug my shoulders and continue to be confused with the idea of wanting people to be president who didn't want to be president or work their way up to achievement. That's just going to come down to different peoples perspectives. I don't believe in the JRPG hero origin story or that someone who doesn't know anything is inherently more pure of heart. (I guess that was also a Pol Pot thing but that's an example of someone I think was very bad for a country.)
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Nov 16, 2020 19:11
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RBA Starblade posted:How did Khive come about as a nickname for that group anyway? I just think of the lovely bar tv app thing when I hear it. I believe its a reference to the Beyhive, Beyonce's fanbase.
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Nov 16, 2020 19:12
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Pick posted:I'm just gonna have to shrug my shoulders and continue to be confused with the idea of wanting people to be president who didn't want to be president or work their way up to achievement. That's just going to come down to different peoples perspectives. I don't believe in the JRPG hero origin story or that someone who doesn't know anything is inherently more pure of heart. (I guess that was also a Pol Pot thing but that's an example of someone I think was very bad for a country.) I'm sure you'll write this off as anecdotal evidence, but DWS's most recent primary challenger ran not because she wanted to, but because nobody loving else was, and DWS is a loving monster that's happy to sell her constituents out to Amscot. I really can't tell you how many times she looked me in the eye and said "I really don't want to be doing this, but morally, I have to."
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Nov 16, 2020 19:13
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I'm here at my parents house. They are in their 70s, and I am seeing a lot of cracks in things that weren't obvious to me a couple years ago. I'd always viewed them as pretty progressive and our main political disagreement is that they have a 1960s liberal view of nukes and never wanted to debate the merits of using newer nuke tech to replace fossil fuels. For like 15 years, that was the crux of our misalignment, and I just didn't bring it up. My father has a very different take on this election's results; he thinks that any attempt to move further left by the dems is wrong, and that the fact that M4A has majority support "doesn't matter" because of what the redistricting maps are going to look like. I think my parents will reliably vote for democrats for the rest of their lives, but they're certainly not going out of their way to vote for progressives. I still feel pretty lucky that my parents aren't trump CHUDs or whatever and we can still have a loving and civil relationship. But, the list of things that I simply fear bringing up, seems to get longer with every visit.
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Nov 16, 2020 19:15
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DarkCrawler posted:What do you refer when you speak of these worst excesses? The concentration camps, the literally Stalinist government form, the all-encompassing police state, the slavery-like military, or the famine-causing mismanagement? Ah the international bootstraps argument. If you let Koreans buy food and medicine they'll get lazy and stop mining for resources
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Nov 16, 2020 19:15
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https://newrepublic.com/article/160212/republican-party-dead-its-trump-cult-now A Good Article TL;DR: quote:The final fallacy is that Donald Trump is a Republican. He is not. DarkCrawler fucked around with this message at 19:29 on Nov 16, 2020 |
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Nov 16, 2020 19:15
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Handsome Ralph posted:
I've met several older gay dudes who think this way and it's such a mindfuck because they don't even notice they're using the same "they're forcing alternative lifestyles on our poor children!" fearmongering that homophobes were using on them in the 70s
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Nov 16, 2020 19:26
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Epic High Five posted:
It seems to be the case, which is extremely sad. VitalSigns posted:I've met several older gay dudes who think this way and it's such a mindfuck because they don't even notice they're using the same "they're forcing alternative lifestyles on our poor children!" fearmongering that homophobes were using on them in the 70s It seems to be a prevalent view in older third wave feminists. What is old is new again and the more things change the more they stay the same
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Nov 16, 2020 19:28
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VitalSigns posted:Ah the international bootstraps argument. Guess you don't know much about North Korea either. You do understand that Koreans can't buy anything from abroad? Literally everything that gets into the state is controlled by the state or by criminal networks. When there was a literal famine in North Korea the state didn't "buy food and medicine", U.S. and and others literally shipped food in there and hundreds of thousands still died. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korean_famine quote:North Korea's vulnerability to the floods and famine was exacerbated by the failure of the public distribution system.[5] The regime refused to pursue policies that would have allowed food imports and distribution without discrimination to all regions of the country.[5] During the famine, the urban working class of the cities and towns of the eastern provinces of the country was hit particularly hard.[32] The distribution of food reflected basic principles of stratification of the communist system.[33] But yeah, drop the sanctions and I am sure they'll get right on that food and medicine. Next time you want to invent an argument to snark against, take five minutes to do some basic research on the topic so you won't be trying to whitewash the freaking North Korean government.
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https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1328391504843452416?s=20 Dems are going to have an extremely fun 2022.
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