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enki42 posted:I think more than any show, Discovery has proven itself as a show that doesn't tokenize their characters or include people for diversity quotas. It's hard to have a 'diversity box' when almost your entire cast could arguably be put in that box. I'm not sure if this is a defence of the show or not. I think most people in the thread would agree that a massive problem the show has that's really been highlighted this season is that they have no idea what to do with most of their cast. Given that's the case, why make the decision to add more characters that you also have no idea what do do with. Would the show be any different if Adira had only been around for the one episode on Trill where they needed to get her past knowledge, then stayed there? I don't think so. I think the only characters who have had narrative relevance this season are Michael, Saru, and the Admiral (and the Admiral only because he acts as a constraining factor on the first two). Everyone else on-screen could have been extras or guest stars, the show is absolutely using you as a token if you are just been kept around on screen to occasionally exhibit one trait that doesn't actually develop character or have anything to do with the story being told. It's like how Detmer's arc is that she has PTSD, except that has nothing to do with anything and it's apparently resolved by her having fun murdering people. The show wants token representation but doesn't want to actually deal with the issues seriously, it just wants the badge. If diversity issues were being layered onto well developed characters who actually got to participate in the issues of the show that would be great, but this is absolutely tokenism and bad storytelling.
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Dec 5, 2020 14:34
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I don't feel like that's got anything to do with diversity though - if they didn't have a diverse crew they'd still completely fail to do anything interesting with them. It just highlights it because at first glance it looks like an interesting crew where all the characters have had a bunch of thought put into them but in reality there's not much going on. It feels like they had grand plans but just never executed them.
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Dec 5, 2020 14:49
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Chalks posted:I don't feel like that's got anything to do with diversity though - if they didn't have a diverse crew they'd still completely fail to do anything interesting with them. It just highlights it because at first glance it looks like an interesting crew where all the characters have had a bunch of thought put into them but in reality there's not much going on. You can tell/guess at a glance that there was more planned because there's a lot of detail and variety put into the bridge crew alone when you look at characters like Airiam and Detmer. I think some of original-plan Detmer might've actually got out of the character bible with the PTSD episode where she goes on about being "macho" despite all evidence to the contrary across two prior seasons.
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Dec 5, 2020 15:17
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Everyone say hello to our new chief of security Keiko O’Brien! Keiko’s husband is recently unemployed so please make him feel welcome as well.
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Dec 5, 2020 16:02
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A GIANT PARSNIP posted:Everyone say hello to our new chief of security Keiko O’Brien! Keiko’s husband is recently unemployed so please make him feel welcome as well. Oh god, I know they already did the shout-out with the statue, but please just have a story where Miles shows up and is the most competent man in the room. And they keep setting up for bad things to happen to him, and then nothing happens (or happens to Boimler instead). O'Brien was Dean of Engineering at Starfleet Academy by the end of DS9, he 100% taught Rutherford. Maybe at the end he can tell Rutherford to stop overthinking it and just ask Tendi out already.
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Dec 5, 2020 16:23
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Characters like O'Brien and Bashir seem like they'd fit right in to Lower Decks. It'll never happen, and it shouldn't happen, but I'd personally find it hilarious if there was a Sisko cameo with him in full brand new "messenger of the prophets" mode. It'd be fun to listen to Avery Brooks chewing some scenery again, and I'd enjoy them lampshading some kind of MAJOR trek canon thing tying back to one of the shows (like a Sisko or Odo return) through somebody being like "Why is this happening here and not on the Enterprise or Deep Space Nine where all the cool stuff happens?! At any rate, I have to imagine "The Cerritos docks at Deep Space Nine" is an index card somewhere in the writers room, and it's hard to picture there not being a lot of fun jokes to be had there. I need to credit to the people involved with the show for not just making it a Star Trek greatest hits thing and constantly relying on established characters/settings though.
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Dec 5, 2020 17:02
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I missed a bit of security chief talk, but what if it's just Shax, but in Cardassian form? Same voice, same tone, same overall build, just as a Cardassian?
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Dec 5, 2020 17:46
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MichiganCubbie posted:I missed a bit of security chief talk, but what if it's just Shax, but in Cardassian form? Same voice, same tone, same overall build, just as a Cardassian?
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Dec 5, 2020 18:06
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Payndz posted:Gul Dushax. Shaxsilana Ghemor
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Dec 5, 2020 18:09
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New security chief Dreadnaught AI quantum torpedo
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Dec 5, 2020 18:10
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MichiganCubbie posted:I missed a bit of security chief talk, but what if it's just Shax, but in Cardassian form? Same voice, same tone, same overall build, just as a Cardassian? Every season they get a new security chief who's "Shax but a different species".
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Dec 5, 2020 18:29
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https://www.globenewswire.com/news-...wo-seasons.html interesting, could give an idea of ~3 mil per episode
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Dec 5, 2020 18:45
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am i missing something about the production of a show like this that suggests they are spending like 300,000 man hours per episode edit: even if you're counting all of the extras earning a 5 (or was it 8?) hour day for an hour or two on set it seems fantastic
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Dec 6, 2020 00:03
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Verviticus posted:am i missing something about the production of a show like this that suggests they are spending like 300,000 man hours per episode It's all CGI.
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Dec 6, 2020 00:05
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NowonSA posted:Characters like O'Brien and Bashir seem like they'd fit right in to Lower Decks. Wasn't Bashir meant to be the template for a later model EMH? That'd be a fun way to be on Lower Decks if they don't want to visit DS9 proper (although why wouldn't you?). Or the Cerritos could just as likely still somehow still have a Mark I EMH. That'd be fun to see him & T'Ana play off each other. Oh god, I just realised if they went to DS9 we could see Quark hustle Boimler. 
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Dec 6, 2020 00:46
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Yvonmukluk posted:Wasn't Bashir meant to be the template for a later model EMH? That'd be a fun way to be on Lower Decks if they don't want to visit DS9 proper (although why wouldn't you?). Or the Cerritos could just as likely still somehow still have a Mark I EMH. That'd be fun to see him & T'Ana play off each other. That was what kicked off the whole genetically modified thing.
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Dec 6, 2020 00:52
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Yvonmukluk posted:Wasn't Bashir meant to be the template for a later model EMH? That'd be a fun way to be on Lower Decks if they don't want to visit DS9 proper (although why wouldn't you?). Or the Cerritos could just as likely still somehow still have a Mark I EMH. That'd be fun to see him & T'Ana play off each other. Yeah, there was an episode of DS9 in which Commander Doctor Robert Jean-Luc-o shows up to observe and record Bashir doing Bashir stuff, and it comes out that Bashir is genetically enhanced. The doctor leaves, and the drama plays out from there. It is later revealed that they Andy-Dicked up the whole EMH thing with the new version. All of the Mark I's ended up being space janitors or something. Some hazardous, yucky, humiliating-to-their-creator job. So, I think they never went with Bashir.
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Dec 6, 2020 00:56
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NowonSA posted:I'd enjoy them lampshading some kind of MAJOR trek canon thing tying back to one of the shows (like a Sisko or Odo return) through somebody being like "Why is this happening here and not on the Enterprise or Deep Space Nine where all the cool stuff happens?! 
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Dec 6, 2020 01:15
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When they started talking about the music coming from the nebula and how everyone seemed to know the tune the first thing I thought of was All Along the Watchtower and BSG.
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Dec 6, 2020 02:16
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The music bit is a really stupid idea, and the only way to redeem it would be to go balls-out ridiculous and have the musical distress signal be coming from Ben Sisko and the Sao Paulo/Defiant II (yes I know he didn't disappear with a ship but I would allow that retcon)
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Dec 6, 2020 02:24
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Snow Cone Capone posted:The music bit is a really stupid idea, and the only way to redeem it would be to go balls-out ridiculous and have the musical distress signal be coming from Ben Sisko and the Sao Paulo/Defiant II (yes I know he didn't disappear with a ship but I would allow that retcon)
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Dec 6, 2020 03:05
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FlamingLiberal posted:Here's what I don't understand. Apparently the distortion of the nebula just happens to make it sound like that song that a bunch of different people from different places recognize. However, when they remove the distortion effects it's a Federation distress signal. So is that just a coincidence that it sounds like that? I re-read the description of that scene on Memory Alpha and it doesn't say much. Seems like it. The
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Dec 6, 2020 03:08
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“The distress signal is coming from a Federation shuttle craft from the...late 24th century. We should bring it aboard!” *Warp 10’ed Tom Paris stumbles onto the Disco shuttle bay. His tongue falls out.*
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Dec 6, 2020 03:09
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FlamingLiberal posted:Here's what I don't understand. Apparently the distortion of the nebula just happens to make it sound like that song that a bunch of different people from different places recognize. However, when they remove the distortion effects it's a Federation distress signal. So is that just a coincidence that it sounds like that? I re-read the description of that scene on Memory Alpha and it doesn't say much. Yeah, I feel like we were meant to understand that it's just the distress signal with all the distortion that has influenced the musical bit that everyone has heard. But as much as I have generally been enjoying this season I definitely have a very healthy amount of doubt that they will be able to follow through in a satisfying way.
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Dec 6, 2020 03:11
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FlamingLiberal posted:Here's what I don't understand. Apparently the distortion of the nebula just happens to make it sound like that song that a bunch of different people from different places recognize. However, when they remove the distortion effects it's a Federation distress signal. So is that just a coincidence that it sounds like that? I re-read the description of that scene on Memory Alpha and it doesn't say much. Maybe the signal has been going for 1,000 years or more due to time travel. So long that many different civilizations have heard it through the nebula and written music influenced by it. Maybe due to time travel fuckery it's just been seeded into the collective subconscious of a bunch of cultures and nobody remembers where it came from anymore. You know, a radio astronomer picks it up but can't explain it, starts humming it around. Someone overhears it and turns it into a folk melody, and so forth down the centuries. Drink-Mix Man fucked around with this message at 03:18 on Dec 6, 2020 |
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Dec 6, 2020 03:13
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Drink-Mix Man posted:Maybe the signal has been going for 1,000 years or more due to time travel. So long that many different civilizations have heard it through the nebula and written music influenced by it. Maybe due to time travel fuckery it's just been seeded into the collective subconscious of a bunch of cultures and nobody remembers where it came from anymore.
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Dec 6, 2020 03:16
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FlamingLiberal posted:I mean maybe, it's just odd to me that they set this up earlier like it was going to mean something but they kind of shot that down in this episode and I didn't even notice at first? They just breeze past that. The real answer is probably nobody gave that much of a poo poo about where that plot point was headed, they just needed to check that mystery box box for the first few scripts of the season.
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Dec 6, 2020 03:21
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So betting pool on stupidest things that could still cause the Burn(ham): 1) It's still from Michael's mom and that was the federation distress signal and the episode was a misdirect 2) It's still Michael and the distress signal is from the Discovery 3) It's Pike's Enterprise NCC-1701 with a Harry Kim quantum duplicate crew and ship because Kurtzman has a fever and the only cure is more Spock 4) The Emerald Chain is actually using the dwindling dilithium to contain an eldritch horror and is making TOUGH CHOICES that TOUGH ORIONS must make to hold back the green ending of Mass Effect 3. The "chain" refers to them being the jailors of the green ending. A random federation ship unlocked the portal to Joker's hat. 5) God did it. Saul Tigh screams about the song being in the fraking nebula. Atarask fucked around with this message at 03:26 on Dec 6, 2020 |
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Dec 6, 2020 03:23
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Atarask posted:So betting pool on stupidest things that could still cause the Burn(ham): However I don't know when they are going to resume dealing with that mystery, because it looks like from the preview for next week (which is the beginning of a two-parter) that it's mostly going to be about dealing with Georgiou's condition.
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Dec 6, 2020 03:26
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Atarask posted:So betting pool on stupidest things that could still cause the Burn(ham): Michael and Philippa go back in time, Michael is stranded in the past, sets up a distress signal so the Discovery can wake her up from cryo-sleep. May or may not have to do with "Calypso."
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Dec 6, 2020 03:29
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Or it's an old ship that caused the Burn when testing an experimental weapon. Dun dun dun, the Federation caused the Burn.
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Dec 6, 2020 03:31
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I’m 100% expecting The Burn to be Federation-caused in some way. However, like a fool, I’m gonna give the show the benefit of the doubt and say that it won’t be the Discovery herself sending out that SOS. I will give it a 20-40% chance that the ship will be the Enterprise-J or some future incarnation, though.
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Dec 6, 2020 03:35
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I fast forwarded through a bunch of it so maybe I missed it, but did we finally have an episode where Burnham doesn’t cry? Also finding I have very little interest in The Chain and its big baddies. I guess it was the natural course for a “bad guy” in a dystopian federation-free universe but boy howdy is it lacking in interest for me. Atarask posted:So betting pool on stupidest things that could still cause the Burn(ham): It’s this.
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Dec 6, 2020 03:35
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HD DAD posted:“The distress signal is coming from a Federation shuttle craft from the...late 24th century. We should bring it aboard!” It keeps growing back and then falling out over and over again, please kill me
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Dec 6, 2020 03:36
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Big Mean Jerk posted:I’m 100% expecting The Burn to be Federation-caused in some way.
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Dec 6, 2020 03:37
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Mr. Apollo posted:When they started talking about the music coming from the nebula and how everyone seemed to know the tune the first thing I thought of was All Along the Watchtower and BSG. Well it basically is; Kurtzman is a notorious hack and are you at all surprised he's ripping off BSG too?
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Dec 6, 2020 03:46
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Yeah, I wouldn't want that collaborator/gestapo officer coming back either. e; Odo, i mean.
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Dec 6, 2020 03:57
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Big Mean Jerk posted:I’m 100% expecting The Burn to be Federation-caused in some way. However, like a fool, I’m gonna give the show the benefit of the doubt and say that it won’t be the Discovery herself sending out that SOS. Hopefully it'll be a Pegasus, actually. I do think it would be neat if the distress signal got some 24th century lookin' rear end ship on screen in disco but I don't think we're getting that.
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Dec 6, 2020 04:06
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There's only one correct answer for the source of the distress signal, the Cerritos.
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Dec 6, 2020 04:43
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I think the only logical theory is to pick the worst theory and that's what the writers will do. It's those racist caricature aliens from code of honor and this time they want to kidnap burnham because they've heard she's the best at everything.
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Dec 6, 2020 04:52
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