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DELETE CASCADE posted:you really shouldn't have to apologize for learning imho No, but doing so works a lot better for getting people to take you seriously. Should it be that way? No opinion. It is that way.
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Dec 21, 2020 07:08
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CRIP EATIN BREAD posted:didnt some shoot those teenagers in that jeep, killing one and seriously injuring another? you're right, i had forgotten about this incident, thanks for the reminder. that involved trying to protect the chop, rather than happening at a protest, but the camps are there in protest so it still counts and it does undermine the details of the point i was trying to make. i think the people who perpetrated the shooting thought they were defending against an outsider who was drive-by shooting at the camp; whether that was actually what happened we will probably never know. regardless, i think it's true that the goal of the left is for less death, not more. like kimberly jones said, equality, not revenge.
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Dec 21, 2020 07:10
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endlessmonotony posted:No, but doing so works a lot better for getting people to take you seriously. perhaps, if you were to happen onto a thread named for screaming into the void re: events on quite literally the other side of the planet from where you live, you could probably chill and read the goings on for context rather than wading in with "well, i saw in the news that" you don't have to kowtow, but no one has an obligation to hold your hand either
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Dec 21, 2020 07:16
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PokeJoe posted:just play cyberpunk like everyone else i need a goddamned graphics card!!!
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Dec 21, 2020 07:20
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infernal machines posted:perhaps, if you were to happen onto a thread named for screaming into the void re: events on quite literally the other side of the planet from where you live, you could probably chill and read the goings on for context rather than wading in with "well, i saw in the news that" I don't know what poo poo you read, and believe you me, you loving up the "global pandemic" also affects us because of that "global" part. No what I was saying is that echi apologizing means it's a lot easier to take him seriously in the future. This keeps happening. The internet's global and you can never trust people on the internet to actually have a sensible take. endlessmonotony fucked around with this message at 07:30 on Dec 21, 2020 |
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Dec 21, 2020 07:28
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sure, and i was saying he probably doesn't need to apologize if he just holds on to those spicy takes from the other side of the planet. i'm also saying that there's no real reason to be particularly kind and courteous in this specific thread of this specific forum, on the subject of the north american hellworld. if you show up and start repeating word for word american right-wing talking points, folks will probably take a dim view of that, you can expect to be lightly razzed if nothing else
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Dec 21, 2020 07:34
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Where the gently caress is the narrative thread of my post. Echi speaks up about what he sees, and gets swiftly corrected, and then apologizes because he was actually told why he's wrong, not just that he's wrong. Just trying to figure this poo poo out from what people say on the internet is no different than trying to find the middle point among media outlets, unfortunately this means bad takes because seriously the media representation is capitalism at its finest in any "western" country. Learning from your own bad takes is good. That's why I have so many.
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Dec 21, 2020 07:34
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endlessmonotony posted:Learning from your own bad takes is good. That's why I have so many.
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Dec 21, 2020 08:08
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Sagebrush posted:i'm glad that you are interested in learning and considering new information. that makes you 10,000 times better than the 70 million americans who voted for trump. they have such poisoned brains that they think learning something new and changing their attitude makes them weak. well, some of those people have to be reached & converted somehow because 70 million lost cause voters means the left will never gain any power in america in our lifetimes
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Dec 21, 2020 08:23
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echinopsis posted:sometimes i say some stupid poo poo on here. and then get called out for it. I generally take it to heart and try to do better. a true poster would double down
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Dec 21, 2020 08:23
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Sagebrush posted:school is over for the semester and i'm stuck in lockdown for at least the next 3 weeks so i guess i'm gonna be posting a LOT oh it’s on!!!!!
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Dec 21, 2020 08:49
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Not to pile on echi, since I think those questions are fine to ask especially for someone that doesn't live here, and probably doesn't understand just how insane America is (has gotten? Always was?) but I live in Seattle and can talk a bit about the state of things. The city council just recently passed a budget that included a 20% cut in the departments funding, well short of the 50% many activists were demanding. Additionally, we recently voted on city charter amendments, including stripping some power from the police department and moving it to the council (deciding on how to route 911 calls, for example). Local news has been reporting that cop moral here is at an all time low since the protests, attrition is high to the point where I think next years budget can afford to hire some officers even with the 20% cut. In some neighborhoods petty crime and disturbances are getting out of hand, in Ballard the response time is basically infinite for most calls, with a lot of shops reporting that they don't even bother calling anymore where someone walks in off the street shouting or doing anything not specifically violent. Homeless encampments are all over the city, including most parks and people have been reporting spikes in property crime near those areas etc. So you could look at that and be tempted to conclude "see, they defunded the police and that's what happens", except the new budget isn't even in effect yet... Seattle police only seem to have time for serious emergencies to the point where people don't even bother calling them anymore. Meanwhile, we have 11 thousand homeless people in Seattle. Partly because of sky-high rents, and partly because all of the surrounding cities claim that "they don't have a homeless problem"... no poo poo... because you refuse to implement any services to the point where if someone loses their home in Bellevue, or Renton or anywhere, they take a bus to Seattle to get help. And really... what would the police do if they DID have the man power? A lot of the visible crime/disturbances are from people who are either clearly mentally ill, or addicted to something or both, are cops the best people to handle a situation like that? Or maybe we could avoid that situation in the first place? So I think the crux of the defund argument, at least for me, is what exactly are cops good for? What is their role in society? We have a clear need in Seattle (and in the entire region despite surrounding cities insisting "its a Seattle problem") for more housing and social services. If we could shift money away from the police, who don't even bother showing up for "petty" crimes, then that's fantastic.
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Dec 21, 2020 08:55
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Raluek posted:as far as i know, no left activists have killed someone at these protests. Michael Reinoehl killed that trump supporter in self defense after one of their portland rallies. Of course then he was literally assassinated then the president bragged about his hit squad on the news.
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Dec 21, 2020 09:00
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good morning lotta posts i won’t read what did orange man do
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Dec 21, 2020 10:19
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ADINSX posted:Michael Reinoehl killed that trump supporter in self defense after one of their portland rallies. Of course then he was literally assassinated then the president bragged about his hit squad on the news. yeah you and crip are right, i was posting off the cuff and made too strong of a claim. i think i should change my position to: people on the left aren't picking fights with the intent to murder someone. there have been a couple deaths at their hands, but when compared with the counter-protesters and cops on the right, who seem to be running on bloodlust, i don't think it's fair to invoke both-sides-ism.
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Dec 21, 2020 10:32
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ADINSX posted:Not to pile on echi, since I think those questions are fine to ask especially for someone that doesn't live here, and probably doesn't understand just how insane America is (has gotten? Always was?) but I live in Seattle and can talk a bit about the state of things. obviously the right just paints Defund The Police as "leftists want a lawless free-for-all" because of course they do
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Dec 21, 2020 11:01
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Sagebrush posted:i'm glad that you are interested in learning and considering new information. that makes you 10,000 times better than the 70 million americans who voted for trump. they have such poisoned brains that they think learning something new and changing their attitude makes them weak. ultimately, this is the only place I can really discuss this that matters, because well everyone at home just has the same experiences as me. but I'll leave it anyway. I dont want to piss anyone off or whatever. once again, appreciate your responses especially the long one, lot of content for me to grok. peace
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Dec 21, 2020 11:06
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those posts are too big nope
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Dec 21, 2020 11:20
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bump_fn posted:those posts are too big nope
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Dec 21, 2020 11:27
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CRIP EATIN BREAD posted:didnt some shoot those teenagers in that jeep, killing one and seriously injuring another? iirc that was your standard run of the mill american gang/drug violence that plagues inner cities because crippling poverty and constant criminalization for being black has made it the only avenue to make money.
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Dec 21, 2020 14:37
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fart simpson posted:well, some of those people have to be reached & converted somehow because 70 million lost cause voters means the left will never gain any power in america in our lifetimes you’re starting to get it
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Dec 21, 2020 14:40
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fart simpson posted:well, some of those people have to be reached & converted somehow because 70 million lost cause voters means the left will never gain any power in america in our lifetimes 74 million. lol. 74 million voters, 14 million more than last time around, saw the events of this year and said "gimme more of that."
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Dec 21, 2020 14:43
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Capital has succeeded in turning politics in America entirely into a Red-vs-Blue culture war, policies do not matter, and I don't think there's a way to fix things.
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Dec 21, 2020 14:44
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PIZZA.BAT posted:you’re starting to get it i do, but i still dont think its worth giving up totally because whats the alternative?
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Dec 21, 2020 14:46
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Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud posted:Capital has succeeded in turning politics in America entirely into a Red-vs-Blue culture war, policies do not matter, and I don't think there's a way to fix things.
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Dec 21, 2020 14:55
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Did Nader's run make all the party strategists sit up and say "let's make damned sure everyone that isn't voting for them is voting for us"?
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Dec 21, 2020 14:58
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jesus WEP posted:yeah i don't think anyone seriously wants the police replaced with absolutely nothing
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Dec 21, 2020 14:59
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jesus WEP posted:idk if this is actually true but i read the gop/dem red/blue thing didn’t really exist before the 2000 election It's been around in one form or another since Nixon, my dad was super into right wing talk radio in the late eighties and nineties and a lot of these conspiracy theories have been pushed since at least then, it's just that the poo poo I used to hear on niche AM radio is on mainstream media now. Conservative policies are unpopular as hell, so the Republicans position themselves as the defenders of white cultural hegemony. Without the Republicans, marauding negroes will burn your house down and impregnate your daughters. Mexicans will come take your television and your truck and your job. The communists will take all your guns away. The atheist critical race theory academics will take Jesus away from you and turn your kids gay and dye their hair pink. There are no policies besides fighting back against those forces and "making the liberals cry." Bizarrely enough, a lot of the right wing nutjobs in my dad's generation started out as Jimmy Trafficante-style anti-Reaganites who morphed into anti-government people during the Clinton years and transitioned to GOP wannabe-brownshirts post-Clinton.
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Dec 21, 2020 15:01
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During the RNC this year, Trump literally pointed at the White House and said "they call it the White House, and we're there," it was a deliberate reference to the Obama era "a black man in the White House" racist joke. “The fact is, I’m here — what’s the name of that building?” he said, pointing to the White House. “The fact is, we’re here and they’re not.” https://www.vox.com/2020/8/28/21405150/trump-rnc-speech-optics-white-house-used-as-prop-hatch-act
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Dec 21, 2020 15:02
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sorry i literally just meant the colour scheme associated with each here is nbc’s coverage of the 1992 election for example
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Dec 21, 2020 15:02
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Yeah, the colors flopped, what I'm saying is that people put no more thought into it than they do into what team they spawn as in a video game
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Dec 21, 2020 15:04
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Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud posted:Bizarrely enough, a lot of the right wing nutjobs in my dad's generation started out as Jimmy Trafficante-style anti-Reaganites who morphed into anti-government people during the Clinton years and transitioned to GOP wannabe-brownshirts post-Clinton. this is honestly pretty interesting. some kind of regression to the mean stuff.
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Dec 21, 2020 15:04
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jesus WEP posted:sorry i literally just meant the colour scheme associated with each lol.
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Dec 21, 2020 15:05
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President Beep posted:this is honestly pretty interesting. some kind of regression to the mean stuff. Yeah, when Bush Jr won my dad was all "they say the acorn doesn't fall far from the tree but I think he might be made of better stuff" lol
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Dec 21, 2020 15:06
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fart simpson posted:i do, but i still dont think its worth giving up totally because whats the alternative? not saying that. just saying don’t get your hopes up. we’ll still get the occasional rare victories whenever the crazies are bored or distracted but the machine has gotten *very* good at keeping them enraged 24/7
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Dec 21, 2020 15:12
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President Beep posted:this is honestly pretty interesting. some kind of regression to the mean stuff. i have some older coworkers that told me they refused to vote for a democrat ever again after bill signed nafta
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Dec 21, 2020 15:12
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jesus WEP posted:sorry i literally just meant the colour scheme associated with each Hilarious that the guy who spent his whole life doing some the most ghoulish work for the CIA, killed kennedy, and generally made the world a much worse place got beaten by a country yokel and is now primarily remembered as the father of bush jr.
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Dec 21, 2020 15:13
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AnimeIsTrash posted:Hilarious that the guy who spent his whole life doing some the most ghoulish work for the CIA, killed kennedy, and generally made the world a much worse place got beaten by a country yokel and is now primarily remembered as the father of bush jr.
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Dec 21, 2020 15:16
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Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud posted:74 million voters, 14 million more than last time around, saw the events of this year and said "gimme more of that." i think this in particular is going to colour my perception of the usa for a long time. way more so than bush 2 and the war on terror did
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Dec 21, 2020 15:17
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i wonder how much the world would improve if we globally removed white people’s suffrage for 25 years
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Dec 21, 2020 15:18
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