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Well that ain't goodquote:Gottlieb cited experimental evidence from Bloom Lab, and explained 501.V2 does appear to partially escape prior immunity. It means that some of the antibodies people produce when they get infected with Covid, as well as the antibody drugs, may not be quite as effective.
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Jan 6, 2021 17:07
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brugroffil posted:what will they do, let it spread unchecked instead? At least in the U.S. it has been spreading unchecked this whole time. It wouldn't surprise me if our political "leaders" just give up even the pretense of managing this crisis.
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Jan 6, 2021 17:09
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Dick Trauma posted:At least in the U.S. it has been spreading unchecked this whole time. It wouldn't surprise me if our political "leaders" just give up even the pretense of managing this crisis. Well the US is a poster child for handling this like poo poo. A lot of poorer countries have handled this much better. I'm just saying, a big portion of the world won't be able to "move on" from COVID any time soon.
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Jan 6, 2021 17:13
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Reminder that after leaving FDA, Gottlieb now works for a deregulatory industry group.
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Jan 6, 2021 17:14
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Failed Imagineer posted:They're all good
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Jan 6, 2021 17:15
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brugroffil posted:Well the US is a poster child for handling this like poo poo. A lot of poorer countries have handled this much better. I'm just saying, a big portion of the world won't be able to "move on" from COVID any time soon. I imagine that the U.S. will be on the Global Travel poo poo List until this is over, and deservedly so. Can you imagine a nation welcoming a cruise ship full of infected stupid American assholes?
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Jan 6, 2021 17:18
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brugroffil posted:Well the US is a poster child for handling this like poo poo. A lot of poorer countries have handled this much better. I'm just saying, a big portion of the world won't be able to "move on" from COVID any time soon. Are you saying that the entire world will have to stay under lockdown for a few more years? Because right now, lockdowns aren't helping poo poo in Europe, and the cases are still climbing there
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Jan 6, 2021 17:18
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Willo567 posted:Because right now, lockdowns aren't helping poo poo in Europe, and the cases are still climbing there The hard part about public health and taking measures to prevent something is that people have a hard time understanding what could have happened had there been no mitigation measures. It's exponential spread with a long incubation period and able to be spread without clinical signs - you think 200k-300k cases per day in the US or Europe is bad, try 2 million or more.
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Jan 6, 2021 17:24
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I'm saying that billions of people won't have access to a vaccine for years and they won't be able to "move on" from COVID-19 within a year.
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Jan 6, 2021 17:24
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I have a 24 year old friend who waited at a hospital until they vaccinated all 40% of the staff (all those who wanted it) and was able to get the vaccine. very cool distribution and good tier system
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Jan 6, 2021 19:46
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Vasukhani posted:I have a 24 year old friend who waited at a hospital until they vaccinated all 40% of the staff (all those who wanted it) and was able to get the vaccine. very cool distribution and good tier system hahahaha fukc this entire country
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Jan 6, 2021 19:47
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The Oldest Man posted:Well that ain't good Does the vaccine still protect against it, at least? If ‘previous antibodies’ are less effective and that’s what vaccines encourage your body to make... but I’m not educated in any of this so I’m guessing
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Jan 6, 2021 19:56
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Forgall posted:What about russian one? It's probably going to be the only one I can get, and I don't want to sound like an antivaxxer, but boy do I not trust our govenment at all. Funny story, our covid deaths for april-november are officially at 55k, but excess deaths for same period compared to 2019 are at 240k. Everybody's definitely on the level here. Oh in that case I probably wouldn't get it unless I saw some published data which had been scrutinised by a reputable health authority
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Jan 6, 2021 20:04
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Regarde Aduck posted:Does the vaccine still protect against it, at least? We don't know. I'm guessing they meant monoclonal antibody treatments (which are for rich people only), which target a single binding site on the viral surface protein, so they're relatively easy to evade. The mRNA vaccines code for the entire viral spike structure, which means your body will respond with a variety of antibodies to attack multiple binding sites. My best guess is that they'd be somewhere between 0 and 100% effective against this type of variant and the same goes for naturally-acquired immunity after an infection with the original variant hope this helps
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Jan 6, 2021 20:05
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Regarde Aduck posted:Does the vaccine still protect against it, at least? Yes. We'd need more data to know the exact specifics, so while some resistance means it's not the 90%+ that many current vaccine/vaccine candidates are looking at, even a 50% effective vaccine would be extremely beneficial and what many were expecting in the beginning. And that's a vaccine that wasn't even made specifically for that variant. I see no reason why, if that becomes the dominant strain, that it just can't be vaccinated against as well. I wonder if you could even combine two COVID variants into one vaccine vial.
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Jan 6, 2021 20:06
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It's pretty irresponsible to just say "yes" when a) we know the variant evades immunity to at least one type of antibody that was effective against the original strain and b) there's no data on vaccine efficacy specifically. The answer is that we don't know and won't know until more studies are done.
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Jan 6, 2021 20:07
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I’ve know three people who were not eligible to get a dose get one because they were around and they had leftover doses.
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Jan 6, 2021 23:32
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Vasukhani posted:I have a 24 year old friend who waited at a hospital until they vaccinated all 40% of the staff (all those who wanted it) and was able to get the vaccine. very cool distribution and good tier system Just watch out for COVID trees...
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Jan 7, 2021 01:12
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In positive news it looks like convalescent plasma therapy does indeed work after a proper trial in Argentina, though it has to be given early Did Trump get it alongside the Regeneron? Or was that just a rumor?
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Jan 7, 2021 01:54
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HelloSailorSign posted:Yes. This. Obviously, some parts of the spike protein matter more than others, but the gist is that it's very hard to create mutations in the short term that just outright evade polyclonal antibodies. Mutations will likely drop effectiveness a bit, and that's going to be most pronounced in at-risk populations who have weaker immune responses where their bodies have a difficult time reconfiguring to fight a mutant. Think of it as a pot of Chili or Jamabalaya--some ingredient changes can drastically alter the result, some won't be noticeable, and you still ultimately know what's in the pot when you taste it. Effective sequencing and vaccine distribution greatly reduce the risks of all of these issues and keep things from freelancing as much. You potentially still have some infections, but even a partially effective vaccine is still likely to help keep people out of severe illness, which should be our main concern at the moment, with perhaps even asymptomatic or neutralizing results in people with healthy/strong immune systems. Mutations are usually a dial on effectiveness, not a switch, and one reason certain elements are targeted in vaccine design is because those elements changing would drastically alter the virus's viability which helps with durability concerns too. The expectation is that once we're at scale, we'll be able to get ahold of new strains with boosters down the line, particularly with the MRNA/AAV types that can be spun up again in a matter of days to weeks so that any dominant strains that pose an issue can just be a booster, like a flu shot we can guess at more effectively and with better knowledge since it's not nearly the headache that trying to target flu shots it.
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Jan 7, 2021 03:38
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TheGreyGhost posted:The expectation is that once we're at scale, we'll be able to get ahold of new strains with boosters down the line, particularly with the MRNA/AAV types that can be spun up again in a matter of days to weeks so that any dominant strains that pose an issue can just be a booster, like a flu shot we can guess at more effectively and with better knowledge since it's not nearly the headache that trying to target flu shots it.
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Jan 7, 2021 03:45
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Regarding timing of the doses, why not go wide rollout of 1 dose, and later do it right with 2 dose followed by 3rd dose in the right time
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Jan 7, 2021 09:58
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vuk83 posted:Regarding timing of the doses, why not go wide rollout of 1 dose, and later do it right with 2 dose followed by 3rd dose in the right time That's not how vaccination works. The reaaon ypu need several shots is so that your immune system knows that it's not just a one time thing and keeps guarding against the virus. Worst case: since the vaccination is to weak, some strains of virus barely survive the first wave, and since they aren't fully eradicated get a chance to adapt to this environment, making the immune system less effective overall. Granted that can also happen with a regular infection, so such a shot wouldn't make a lot worse, but there's also the fact that this is a straight up waste. No country has the capacity, or the willingness to vaccinate everyone once. So they can't really hand out a bonus round.
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Jan 7, 2021 10:34
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New guidance from HHS says states can and should vaccinate lower priority people rather than let doses sit in freezers. https://twitter.com/NBCNewsHealth/status/1346972987388354561 quote:Secretary of Health and Human Services Alex Azar said Wednesday that he is advising states to begin vaccinating lower-priority groups against Covid-19 if the doses they have on hand would otherwise be sitting in freezers.
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Jan 7, 2021 12:38
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freebooter posted:Australia and New Zealand are still going well. Victoria proved that even when things spiral out of control you can still do a hard lockdown to bring it down to zero, and New South Wales proved that even if you have a low burn of 5-10 cases a day for months on end, kept under control with test-trace-isolate measures, you can still eventually achieve elimination without a lockdown or a mask mandate. We've had a burp of a few dozen cases in Sydney over Christmas which then spread to Victoria, which led to state borders closing again, but I still feel safe walking around the streets; Victoria (pop. 6 million) recorded about 30,000 tests yesterday and picked up 1 case. I get pretty disgusted at the remarks major news outlets makes about only Japan being complacent, considering how utterly hosed the U.S. has been. Dick Trauma posted:I don't think this can be fixed. As a nation we might outlive it, but fix it? No. Not saying they couldn't have done better (the DEFINEITLY should have been), but it's better there than the U.S., and as you said, most European countries Willo567 fucked around with this message at 13:15 on Jan 7, 2021 |
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Jan 7, 2021 13:10
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Willo567 posted:I get pretty disgusted at the remarks major news outlets makes about only Japan being complacent, considering how utterly hosed the U.S. has been. I have an acquaintance on FB who teaches in Japan and posted something about the government closing the borders with an exasperated air of "oh yeah of course it's only the filthy gaijin who could be spreading it and not possibly any issues in Japan itself," and I'm sure she knows better than me and there's some truth to that, but the idea that closing the borders could be construed as a bad idea in any way shape or form, during a PANDEMIC, is utterly alien to me. Didn't Japan have closed borders for like the first six months?
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Jan 7, 2021 14:51
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Also, something went around on Twitter about how Britain has recorded more deaths in 24 hours than Australia has all pandemic, and I got into a bunch of arguments with British people because I'm an idiot who doesn't value my time, but I just gotta say: it is fascinating how many people up there are willing to waffle on with vague ideas about weather/geographic isolation/"they count deaths differently"/whatever the latest loving conspiracy theory is. And there aren't even Tory ideologues! I don't understand why you wouldn't just be like, "yeah, our government dropped the loving ball, gently caress them." If the shoe was on the other foot and the British government had a competent response while the Australian government had shat the bed, you bet I'd be loving ropeable about it.
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Jan 7, 2021 14:55
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freebooter posted:I have an acquaintance on FB who teaches in Japan and posted something about the government closing the borders with an exasperated air of "oh yeah of course it's only the filthy gaijin who could be spreading it and not possibly any issues in Japan itself," and I'm sure she knows better than me and there's some truth to that, but the idea that closing the borders could be construed as a bad idea in any way shape or form, during a PANDEMIC, is utterly alien to me. Didn't Japan have closed borders for like the first six months?
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Jan 7, 2021 15:13
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Charles 2 of Spain posted:This was a legit problem at the beginning of the pandemic when foreign residents couldn't get back in, but the new border closures are fine and people complaining about them are dumbasses who think every Japanese person is a giant racist. Something that really miffed me in the USPol thread the other day were posters that seemingly decided to specifically point out Trump supporters in Japan, despite the dumb fucks being everywhere around the world
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Jan 7, 2021 15:16
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freebooter posted:Also, something went around on Twitter about how Britain has recorded more deaths in 24 hours than Australia has all pandemic, and I got into a bunch of arguments with British people because I'm an idiot who doesn't value my time, but I just gotta say: it is fascinating how many people up there are willing to waffle on with vague ideas about weather/geographic isolation/"they count deaths differently"/whatever the latest loving conspiracy theory is. And there aren't even Tory ideologues! I don't understand why you wouldn't just be like, "yeah, our government dropped the loving ball, gently caress them." If the shoe was on the other foot and the British government had a competent response while the Australian government had shat the bed, you bet I'd be loving ropeable about it. How dare you talk down are britane like this
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Jan 7, 2021 15:17
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Willo567 posted:Something that really miffed me in the USPol thread the other day were posters that seemingly decided to specifically point out Trump supporters in Japan, despite the dumb fucks being everywhere around the world
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Jan 7, 2021 15:22
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That was a dumb thing to argue about because it’s not like there are 0 Americans living in Japan. Expats are totally a thing, although to be fair I’ve never known an (American) expat who was a conservative rear end in a top hat since those people tend to not leave “the best country in the world.” Nonetheless, I’m willing to bet there were a nonzero amount of Americans in that Japanese parade of grump supporters.
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Jan 7, 2021 15:58
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ShadowHawk posted:What's the approval process for these slightly modified mRNA vaccines? Sure it may take only 2 days to include another spike protein variant in the mix, but how long does it take to go from there to actually getting the updated shot produced and authorized to be given to patients? It’s likely to be treated as a licensure update rather than a new vaccine, so it would have an expedited process likely on the order of weeks at submission. It’s similar to the flu vaccine process where there’s essentially a vote on updated strain coverage rather than approving a totally new vaccine every year. Production essentially is done throughout since there’s basically no risk once the decision is make to update the strain; since it’s not having to go through true trials again. It’s still a months long process overall, but we’re still taking a massive amount of lead time out of the process by having the platform built and with the knowledge we likely need this infrastructure to stay and scale over time.
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Jan 7, 2021 16:58
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Willo567 posted:I'm sorry for sounding defeatist, but I've just become depressed with everything going on with it. and in most countries that have lock downs, none of it seems to be working as well as before it's not just COVID, Willo, it's every where I see you post. Can you take up a meditation habit? Spend more time walking around outside? I, personally have several diagnosed anxiety and depressive conditions and I know for a fact that I hit periods where I just have to be offline, no matter how hard it is. Note that I am not suggesting that you have a diagnosable condition, I am saying that living with my anxiety disorders makes me sensitive to seeing other people in clearly anxious states. Even very neurotypical people with no history of problems, can become extremely irrational during protracted distress states. Worrying about everything all the time is useless. Anxiety and worry are useless past the point they change behavior. Is it safe to assume you're already doing everything in your power to take this seriously and avoid COVID? If so, then try to sit back and let science do its thing, this is not going to last forever. I am fully expecting to have my kid back in daycare in the fall here. (Of course, we probably would have done it this year if not for pregnancy, because it's weighing risks of different sorts). I'm not necessarily expecting that it's going to be okay to have random people inside my house drinking beers and poo poo until 2022, but, you know what? 2020 sucked, 2021 is looking like it will be at least a bit better in some critical ways. So, chill, smoke a joint, take a hike, whatever your happy is -- go find it, it's not in this thread
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Jan 7, 2021 17:54
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I've mentioned we have kids in daycare. I'm sure all of you saw this coming, but both of our kids had sniffles this morning, and one is coughing. I would have suggested we keep them home this week but my wife and I were loving fried after 2 weeks of looking after the 6 month and 2.5 year old over the christmas break. I could have dealt with it but my wife couldn't have. Around Dec 20th, before they closed for two weeks, they sent us a 'holiday prevention agreement' where we agreed to not see anyone for the holidays (and we didn't), and since there are only 8 families total, we're still doing daycare. We're both feeling fine for now. They both seem to 'just have colds' for now. The 2.5 year old is getting a covid test tomorrow morning. When my wife wife spoke to the nurse practitioner (video call!) about the daycare and 'holiday prevention agreement' and said "hopefully nobody else had a christmas party!", the nurse practitioner's response was basically "they probably all had a christmas party", so lol. I suppose she's seen it all. Of course, we're keeping the kids out of daycare until the test comes back. So... my friend who uses my shed for working out doesn't seem fazed at all. I'm pretty sure that we DO have a safe arrangement but when one of us has an actual suspected covid case, maybe stop with the workouts???? She has a boyfriend who has a bad immune system. The shed is very drafty and not linked to the house or even next to it, and I use a huge fan to blow air in while I'm in there, so I'm not worried about airborne stuff when we work out hours apart, and we both wipe off the elliptical after we use it. She doesn't use the weight bench and has one set of weights she uses, that I don't, I have my own weights. Anyway I haven't used it for about a week, so it's just been her in there working out a couple of days this week. I told her she shouldn't come over for a while because we're probably sick (we keep the keys in the house so I have to leave them out for her, then take them back in when she's done, otherwise it would be fine for her to work out since I won't be for a little while I suspect). She was like 'no, it's fine, I won't get it' and I suddenly realised after talking to her a bit more, she wears a mask at all times but she doesn't really think she needs to and she only does it so that other people will think she's being safe. Otherwise she literally does not give a gently caress. She has a roommate, and a boyfriend who lives separately. So my wife and I told her that she can't come and work out any more at all. I'm just amazed that I'm like "maybe I have covid?" and she's like "so can I work out today?" anyway it ended with me getting all of her stuff out of the shed and leaving it in a bag for her outside, then going back inside and washing my hands. If it is a cold I'll be loving amazed. Until Feb last year (the last time I got sick!) I would get sick on an almost monthly basis due to the oldest kid getting sick at daycare all the time. My brother (I haven't seen him for a couple of years) got covid a couple of months ago and it didn't affect him badly so hopefully it's the same for me. My wife never gets as sick as I do, she has a great immune system, so hopefully she'll be ok too. My wife goes to the library which is closed to the public, once a week. When she's there, about 4 other librarians are there in the large 2-storey building. She was going to return after the christmas break, today, but she's home now. It's weird though, she woke me up and said the kids are both sick so they have to stay home from daycare, and she was still going to work and I was like 'yep' but then I was like .... ... "wait a minute you should stay home!". Reading this story you'll probably think we're both completely stupid but it just didn't cross our minds at first. So, she called her manager saying that both kids were sick and we didn't know what with but it could be covid, and her manager told her to stay home, she works from home every other day anyway. Our fridge is running low and we've been avoiding shopping, so when I found out I was like 'oh poo poo time to stock up' and then I was like 'lol of course, I shouldn't do that' so I'm defrosting a bunch of stuff. I just checked and instacart, which used to be 'next delivery window is in 3 weeks' a few months ago, is now offering same-day deliveries so we're putting in an order. I'm going to bake some bread and order a bunch of crap for chili and freeze it.
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Jan 7, 2021 21:34
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I'm sorry this poo poo country can't do better for you and for all of us. Ganbatte.
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Jan 7, 2021 21:37
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redreader posted:If it is a cold I'll be loving amazed. Our 3.5yo in daycare had sniffles/congestion a few months back, and Mrs. HSS had a mild fever with decreased appetite for a few days about a month ago, and in both cases everyone came back negative for COVID, our quarantine/isolation ended with those negatives, and nobody else wound up getting ill in our associated groups. Obviously, there remains concerns regarding false negatives and everyone else getting asymptomatic or significantly mild cases, or not transmitting at all, but still. Colds and flu are still out there, so it's not impossible. And while the parents in the small daycare pod we've got going on could also be lying, it does seem like everyone seems to be trying to do their part to keep daycare open... i.e., not be COVidiots. Again, obviously there are those who will say they're not going to and yet still will, but I still have faith in some people.
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Jan 7, 2021 22:30
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You sent your kids to daycare sick/when they had a cough in the middle of a pandemic. What the heck.
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Jan 7, 2021 23:01
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sheri posted:You sent your kids to daycare sick/when they had a cough in the middle of a pandemic. no, you lack reading comprehension skills. what the heck. Redreader, sorry, super f'ing bummer. I might be in the same boat now if we didn't have kiddo 100% out of daycare because my wife is pregnant and due at the end of March. This has me second guessing anything unnecessary I do, even though right now that list is "skiing, first thing in the morning, at a pretty deserted place that's enforcing strong protocols, wearing an N95 in the line and never going inside". Sucks and the lack of childcare has us both considering self-trepannation. Cabbages and VHS fucked around with this message at 23:06 on Jan 7, 2021 |
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Jan 7, 2021 23:03
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sheri posted:You sent your kids to daycare sick/when they had a cough in the middle of a pandemic. Lol, gently caress off! Edit: I know these forums, I knew this was coming, so I added the BOLD PART OF MY ORIGINAL POST! I didn't have to edit it in, it was always there, since as I said I knew this was coming. Feel free to re-read!
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Jan 7, 2021 23:04
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