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I miss Miller. But this was an OK season. With everything going on, they did the best that could be expected. I wish Holden had more to do, but the scenes he was in were fine. I liked the bit at the end with Naomi, Amos, and Holden in the airlock acknowledging the four of them as a family and the salvage plaque. What could have been if not for Anvar's actions? The first three seasons were some of the best TV ever.
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Feb 3, 2021 19:49
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I'll take a moment to stop making GBS threads on this season to discuss people throwing high speed unguided ballistics into the Ringspace. That's probably a really bad idea. In fact, it's probably a really bad idea to do anything that remotely threatens the Rings or the Ringspace station. That thing might have turned off the slowzone, but there's no indication that its not still observing everything happening around it and is fully capable of wiping out all human life if it thinks the Rings are in danger.
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Feb 3, 2021 19:52
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Sonderval posted:Naomi - “I called him a brave idiot” Oof.
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Feb 3, 2021 19:53
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Grand Fromage posted:Mars has all kinds of stealth weapons in use. They didn't attack Earth with them because they didn't want to start a giant war that would kill billions. Just because you develop a weapon doesn't mean you want to use it. Yeah it's like asking why didn't the US bring a bunch of tactical nukes out to play with in Vietnam or the Gulf War or something. Like yeah sure it's in the arsenal but it's a major escalation to actually start deploying your superweapons, especially when the MCRN can kick the UNN's rear end just fine without having to escalate to stealthed battleships firing stealthed torpedoes.
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Feb 3, 2021 19:55
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Lol that the weird defenders of this season just decided to punish show watchers by dropping random spoilers. I’m a little unsure of what to expect from next season overall. If the Marcos faction controls ring space and Earth and Mars are both collapsing, the show will have to decide between handling the latter or the former, and completely ignoring the other, otherwise we’ll have another unfocused feeling season.
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Feb 3, 2021 19:55
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There's no way Marco can "control" anything really. He's got a few nice ships but earth and mars have fleets 1000x bigger. Earth's ecology is hosed but that doesn't hurt their short term ability to use their fleet to do what ever's needed to control the ring gate or do what ever they want. Now that marco doesn't even have the blue goop to threaten the system or his martian allies I have no idea what his plan is. He wracked up a great genocide high-score but he's totally irrelevant now, it's these ultra-fascists with some sort of proto-planet and station that are the new threat. Also as hosed as earth is, the belt is so much worse off now. Their most actual talented leaders with actual management skills (the skills that people people fed and sheltered) are dead, their food supply was already hosed with Ganymede which made them have to rely on earth even more, and now earth's ecology is hosed. Marco's rambling about how he has the best experts on his side that promise the belt will be a bread basket within a few years is total BS and the fact that his "salvage" crews were ordered to focus on securing ever scrap of food shows he knows it. Baronjutter fucked around with this message at 20:05 on Feb 3, 2021 |
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Feb 3, 2021 20:02
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I'm not sure if Earth and Mars fleets are much bigger. They don't really say much about sizes, but Earth and Mars both lost a lot of ships in the Ganymede conflict, and a lot of Mars's ships went to Marco and Duarte. And of course Bobbie was helping tear warships down for scrap last season. They could have way bigger fleets but I don't think it's something we could say for certainty, especially because of the home turf Earth and Mars need part of their fleets to defend.
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Feb 3, 2021 20:21
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I'm kinda amazed they did something that clunky with Alex, it feels like they could have done more subtle things - like just have him not be in next season and have the characters talk about how he decided he really needed to spend time with his family at last. So about the protomolecule tech at the end - is it a ship? A shipyard? A station? Nobody knows but it looks cool so they want it?
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Feb 3, 2021 20:34
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Chalks posted:I'm kinda amazed they did something that clunky with Alex, it feels like they could have done more subtle things - like just have him not be in next season and have the characters talk about how he decided he really needed to spend time with his family at last. It seems like they know what they're doing, or at least think they do. The guy on the ground showed a pretty nice earth-like planet too. I assume they're going to start some galt's gulch for fascists there and enjoy some sort of super-weapon or cache of super-technology that will jumpstart their development.
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Feb 3, 2021 20:39
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Chalks posted:So about the protomolecule tech at the end - is it a ship? A shipyard? A station? Nobody knows but it looks cool so they want it? I am going to tell you that you will get answers to this in time and ask my fellow book reading degenerates to not post details please.
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Feb 3, 2021 20:40
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Beamed posted:Lol that the weird defenders of this season just decided to punish show watchers by dropping random spoilers. Enjoying this season and stating why makes someone a weirdo in your eyes?
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Feb 3, 2021 20:43
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during Naomi's final moments on the Chetzemoka: when she makes the jump, she comes this close to getting splattered by a support beam (?).  Look at the drat shadow that's terrifyingly close. While the ship is spinning :o it's a blink and you'll miss it moment, but if you notice it it's terrifying. double nine fucked around with this message at 21:13 on Feb 3, 2021 |
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Feb 3, 2021 20:44
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Grand Fromage posted:I am going to tell you that you will get answers to this in time and ask my fellow book reading degenerates to not post details please. Yeah, sorry, to be clear I wasn't asking for book spoilers but rather whether it was obvious in a way that I'd missed that the martians know what it is based on what they'd said or previous things we'd seen. Chalks fucked around with this message at 20:46 on Feb 3, 2021 |
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Feb 3, 2021 20:44
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Chalks posted:Yeah, sorry, to be clear I wasn't asking for book spoilers but rather whether it was obvious some how that they know what it is currently based on what they'd said or previous things we'd seen. I was just trying to head off spoilerposting. You are not wrong to not know what it is yet, speculate away!
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Feb 3, 2021 20:46
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Baronjutter posted:There's no way Marco can "control" anything really. He's got a few nice ships but earth and mars have fleets 1000x bigger. Earth's ecology is hosed but that doesn't hurt their short term ability to use their fleet to do what ever's needed to control the ring gate or do what ever they want. Now that marco doesn't even have the blue goop to threaten the system or his martian allies I have no idea what his plan is. He wracked up a great genocide high-score but he's totally irrelevant now, it's these ultra-fascists with some sort of proto-planet and station that are the new threat. We the audience may know that Marco doesn't have the protomolecule, but Earth/Mars don't. And it's even possible that not all of the sample got passed along, maybe Marco kept some? Earth and Mars fleets may be bigger, but: 1) Earth and Mars have lost a ton of ships in the recent conflicts, especially in the Jupiter system (season 2). 2) Isolated Earth/Mars forces have been attacked and destroyed by Free Navy ships. This came up in an episode this season. 3) They don't trust each other. Earth knows that Inaros worked with some part of the MCRN to acquire stealth tech. Earth just watched MCRN ships help blow up a few of their bigger battleships left. Can Earth really trust that whatever faction dealt with Inaros is truly gone? And Mars never trusts Earth. 4) Some portion, probably a large one, of the Earth and Mars forces are needed to stay around their home systems. Both for defense against the Free Navy, but also they don't trust each other not to take advantage. 5) Marco doesn't need to necessarily defend the whole belt. He probably wants Earth to do more indiscriminate attacks to force more people into his camp. Given all that... yes, Marco is an egomaniac who is likely grasping for control he won't be able to hold on to. His plans for a self-sustaining belt are probably pipe dreams at best. He does control the Ring station, so he may be able to extort some of the colonies past the rings for food (not clear how many colonies are out there right now). But yes, he is probably screwed in the long run unless Earth/Mars start fighting each other.
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Feb 3, 2021 20:49
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In the books Earth's fleet is tied up because they don't have that anti-meteor defense technology, therefore the fleet is pulled back to Earth to defend, and Marco keeps sending rocks to occupy them
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Feb 3, 2021 20:59
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i enjoyed watching each episode of this season but they should have condensed the content of episodes 1 - 9 then used the content of #10 for two or three episodes. this season did feel slow paced until the last episode and then it felt rushed
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Feb 3, 2021 21:13
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I like how they show that Marco can think outside the box, that his military thinking is outside if what earth and mars would expect. But while Marco can win battles now, what about in the future? Can he replicate those successes? Inners will quickly realize how to counter his tactics and mars will probably have a purge of disloyal officers. Also how is winning fights getting belters food, air and water? He only sees a military victory, There seems to be no plan on logistics outside of it. He has millions of belters he needs to keep on his side. If they start starving, they'll turn on him.
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Feb 3, 2021 21:15
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Phi230 posted:In the books Earth's fleet is tied up because they don't have that anti-meteor defense technology, therefore the fleet is pulled back to Earth to defend, and Marco keeps sending rocks to occupy them I'm pretty sure they say that in the show at least a couple times.
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Feb 3, 2021 21:18
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Also unless your new belter state has the advanced factories and support infrastructure to maintain and supply those ships he's not going to get a lot out of them. He wanted to loving destroy Tyco via the Roci. Dude doesn't actually want to build anything up, only destroy.
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Feb 3, 2021 21:18
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Chalks posted:I'm kinda amazed they did something that clunky with Alex, it feels like they could have done more subtle things - like just have him not be in next season and have the characters talk about how he decided he really needed to spend time with his family at last. They are building a giant mech body for Marcos to transfer his conscious into
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Feb 3, 2021 21:26
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Those of you getting mad at the micrometeor strikes against the 'sitting duck' ships: that's why they used micrometeors. Grab a bunch of gravel, accelerate it to some arbitrarily high number, slingshot that poo poo at the general area of the ring gate and chances are you're going to hit something as the rocks spread out. Might be hard if the ships are doing loop-de-loops in a 1000km area, but still.
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Feb 3, 2021 21:26
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Kaedric posted:Those of you getting mad at the micrometeor strikes against the 'sitting duck' ships: that's why they used micrometeors. Grab a bunch of gravel, accelerate it to some arbitrarily high number, slingshot that poo poo at the general area of the ring gate and chances are you're going to hit something as the rocks spread out. Might be hard if the ships are doing loop-de-loops in a 1000km area, but still. It's like doing a driveby on a bouncer. How many bouncers you ever see jumping around wildly just in case some banger rolls by for a spray and pray. The ring guard ships are gloried doormen. They're just there to scan poo poo coming in and out, there's no reason they'd waste fuel zipping around on the off chance that some terrorists decided to throw space gravel at them.
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Feb 3, 2021 21:40
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So that season final did a lot to up my overall score of the season. I'm going from a C to a B-. I am always leery of stuff regarding firing actors, but this is a clear case where I'm very happy they did because it was obvious. (I would say it's less obvious with someone like Gina, because while I think her views are very lovely I would say the first step would be for an executive to tell her to knock that poo poo off online if she wants to keep her job, but obviously that's deferent because this tool legit hurt people in real life). People arguing that you're an idiot for not liking the show or you just want to watch fast and the furious or stop looking at your phone. Look, plenty of people in this thread like the show a whole hell of a lot. I watch this show with the phone down. Other shows (Sabrina the teenage which) less so. That's a great scroll twitter show. Also, as someone else pointed out, this season did not have the GOT the last two seasons problem. It was a super character study, where GOT was clearly the creators taking a solid outline and rushing to the end because they were sick of it. I would also argue last two seasons of GOT will long term be remembered more fondly, because they are not actually bad, they are simply rushed. I'd say even two or three more episodes of character depth (just like that one the night before the big battle episode in season 8, I think episode 3) would have gone a long ways to make everyone appreciate the show more. But just like Lost, long term GOT will be remembered fondly, just like this show, as long as they end on a stronger output than this season. It's funny really, this show and WandaV have the same problem. They do a poo poo ton of character study, to the point of self indulgence. Considering timelines, I wouldn't be surprised if this was in fact an overreaction to them seeing the fanbase of something like GOT last two season. AS for this show, this season felt surprisingly like B5 season 5. A lot of solid ideas but some huge execution issues. (This show is the spiritual successor to B5 far more that Battlestar, the most overrated of the loved sci fi shows.).
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Feb 3, 2021 21:46
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Kaedric posted:Those of you getting mad at the micrometeor strikes against the 'sitting duck' ships: that's why they used micrometeors. Grab a bunch of gravel, accelerate it to some arbitrarily high number, slingshot that poo poo at the general area of the ring gate and chances are you're going to hit something as the rocks spread out. Might be hard if the ships are doing loop-de-loops in a 1000km area, but still. The rings themselves are 1000 kilometers in diameter. Also if you have a cloud of micrometeors that's spread out to cover that sort of region, it's going to be visible as hell simply by the way it occludes stuff. "Stealth coating" or not. And again, the bigger problem is that it was narratively unnecessary.
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Feb 3, 2021 21:48
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Will I get probated or banned if I call Belters "skinnies" in this thread?
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Feb 3, 2021 21:49
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AndyElusive posted:Will I get probated or banned if I call Belters "skinnies" in this thread? You should be, because that's an actual slur that was used against Somalians.
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Feb 3, 2021 21:55
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I'm not going to sit down and try to do the math on it but I think you would need a truly absurd amount of rocks to be detectable That, and they even throw in the stealth coating as a hand wave I'm coming around to a B on the season overall, agree that it does feel a bit crowded but I did really enjoy the time they spent on Naomi, Amos, and Peaches. dyzzy fucked around with this message at 21:58 on Feb 3, 2021 |
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Feb 3, 2021 21:56
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dyzzy posted:I'm not going to sit down and try to do the math on it but I think you would need a truly absurd amount of rocks to be detectable Likewise you'd need a truly absurd amount of rocks to spread out over the "general area of the ring gate" and still be dense enough to seriously gently caress up a battleship. And again the part that makes it really bad is that it was narratively unnecessary.
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Feb 3, 2021 22:06
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Baronjutter posted:Also unless your new belter state has the advanced factories and support infrastructure to maintain and supply those ships he's not going to get a lot out of them. Exactly. He's a warlord not a nation builder. The reason we don't see him being upset that Palla station was blown up is because he doesn't cars.
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Feb 3, 2021 22:08
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There really should have been a scene with cara gee going "man, gently caress earth for killing all those people"
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Feb 3, 2021 22:12
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The issue with the micrometeorites is not that it wouldn't be an effective weapon, but that in order to be an effective weapon you have to launch it from a very long way away, which means a very long time ago, which means that you planned the precise moment that you'd be approaching the gate long in advance, and also had to bank on none of the ships defending the gate to move because space is huge and fractions of an angle on launch are going to translate into you missing entirely at target. e: it's a bit like Ramsey Bolton and his ten good men wrecking Stannis's camp in GOT. There's a point at which your villain's successes stop being because they've credibly outsmarted their opponents and start being because their opponents suddenly become extremely incompetent. Alchenar fucked around with this message at 22:22 on Feb 3, 2021 |
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Feb 3, 2021 22:18
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"The Pallas attack was added to fill time they cut from Alex's story" isn't the worst hypothesis tbh, because yeah it is loving weird that nobody even mentioned it. Marco is the kind of rear end in a top hat who wouldn't care but Filip probably would, and Drummer's crew would definitely have some poo poo to say. If they inserted it after most of Drummer etc.'s scenes were wrapped that makes more sense.
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Feb 3, 2021 22:29
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I had no idea what was going on in these two space battles apart from a very vague sense of how it was going based on people's reactions. I might have some kind of sci fi space battle blindness Also, I had a genuine laugh when they poochied Alex. I can't believe how bad that whole part was. He seems to have stroked out at 0g, which doesn't even make any sense
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Feb 3, 2021 22:37
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The whole stroke thing is weak because there's no real forshadowing. It's plausible that a long high-G thrust would strain cause it, and there is some dialogue where "we're already doing a high burn and juiced up to the gills" but it's said in a calm voice. If there was a feeling of speed, of exhaustion, of physical exertion or strain then it'd be less shocking. Such a shame for the character though. You only needed to not be a pest, actor dumbass.
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Feb 3, 2021 22:42
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I thought the Alex thing was handled about as well as it could have been, honestly. I don't think there was anything they could have done that wouldn't have had a poochie vibe about it, especially if they waited until the next season to kill him off screen or say he went back home to his family or something.
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Feb 3, 2021 22:44
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Phanatic posted:Likewise you'd need a truly absurd amount of rocks to spread out over the "general area of the ring gate" and still be dense enough to seriously gently caress up a battleship. Eh it was whatever. What I didn't really feel was conveyed is how the odds were stacked without them or the rogue MCRN ships. Like, I think you're supposed to see this as Marco pulling an ace from his sleeve against what looks like a hopeless fight, but they never really go into how the UNN ships stack up against the Free Navy
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Feb 3, 2021 22:53
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When David Lynch was filming Twin Peaks a set designer accidentally worked his way into the shot. Instead of discarding the footage, as an artist Lynch harnessed serendipity and turned a happy accident into one of the most memorable characters from television to date. The folks who are saying that, "Alex's death was handled in the best possible way" are killing me. The show-runners just spent millions of dollars to bring an old Simpsons gag back to life.
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Feb 3, 2021 22:57
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GABA ghoul posted:I had no idea what was going on in these two space battles apart from a very vague sense of how it was going based on people's reactions. I might have some kind of sci fi space battle blindness And I guess the idea is that the high G of matching velocity with Naomi's ship had some kind of...delayed effect where it took until Bobbie went out in her suit for the blood vessels in his brain to pop??? Would also be fascinated by a breakdown of that one!
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Feb 3, 2021 23:00
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Crazycryodude posted:"The Pallas attack was added to fill time they cut from Alex's story" isn't the worst hypothesis tbh, because yeah it is loving weird that nobody even mentioned it. I think you're right. This should have had huge implications for Drummers crew, and Belters in general, which plays right into Marcos rhetoric. Especially in this last episode, where we saw half of Drummers family crew and the Belters at the gate turncoating to support Marcos. Not addressing it at all is strange, especially for this show. Where's the 'Remember the cant!' type of outrage? Though I suppose the counter narrative of a couple of thousand innocent Belter lives versus billions of innocent Earther lives would sour those somewhat.
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Feb 3, 2021 23:02
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