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All those stats don't change the fact that they'll charge into some chaff unit from behind and still get bogged down, getting stuck in the melee and taking a bunch of casualties trying to withdraw, unless you've got the cycle charge micro nailed down to a tee.
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Feb 21, 2021 03:29
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And latest rumor mill: Zacharias the Everliving been tentatively approved for a future Vampire Counts LL, likely to be based in the Darklands. Gorthor the Beastlord and Ghorros Warhoof have been approved as future Beastmen LLs. Moonclaw is on CA's radar, but they're thinking more a legendary hero or a Green Knight style mechanic as part of a major overhaul of Beastmen that CA intends to do, but is likely to wait until after TW3's release.
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Feb 21, 2021 03:32
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Cythereal posted:And latest rumor mill: This guy still hasn't "leaked" the WH2 DLC, right? I'm curious as to whether it would match with my thinking, which is DE lord vs. either a VC or Dawi, with Neferata as the FLC.
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Feb 21, 2021 03:42
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orangelex44 posted:This guy still hasn't "leaked" the WH2 DLC, right? I'm curious as to whether it would match with my thinking, which is DE lord vs. either a VC or Dawi, with Neferata as the FLC. I dunno. This guy says that he sees and hears stuff going back and forth between CA and GW, since GW still needs to sign off on just about everything CA does. The WH2 DLC is already effectively done from that standpoint. All he's said is that he wouldn't be surprised if Bretonnia, Vampire Counts, Tomb Kings, or Beastmen are the DLC since CA's been eyeing all four for an overhaul.
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Feb 21, 2021 03:44
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No brass bull eh
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Feb 21, 2021 03:46
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albany academy posted:No brass bull eh I've mentioned it before - he says Taurox was approved a week or two ago. Supposedly, CA has Beastmen at the front of the line for a major rework but it's not clear at the moment how much is going to be part of TW3's launch with the general Chaos changes and how much will have to wait until after launch. He's said that Tomb Kings are right behind the Beastmen in line for some kind of revamp or overhaul, CA is supposedly pretty happy with the state of the faction but feels like they've been largely ignored since they were launched and want to give them some love.
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Feb 21, 2021 03:49
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Gorthor wouldn't be the first LL who should be dead by the time the game takes place in the canon proper, but I really hope that particular rumor is false regardless. I don't want another Gor LL, it should be Taurox or bust (though Mixu adds him and Warhoof already, the models leave a bit to be desired). The rest are fine, though I think everyone would prefer Neferata at Silver Pinnacle instead of yet another vampire wizard on a zombie dragon. Hell, Ushoran, Abhorash, I'll take freaking Konrad
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Feb 21, 2021 03:50
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Ah word my b
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Feb 21, 2021 03:50
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Protagorean posted:Gorthor wouldn't be the first LL who should be dead by the time the game takes place in the canon proper, but I really hope that particular rumor is false regardless. I don't want another Gor LL, it should be Taurox or bust (though Mixu adds him and Warhoof already, the models leave a bit to be desired). The rest are fine, though I think everyone would prefer Neferata at Silver Pinnacle instead of yet another vampire wizard on a zombie dragon. Hell, Ushoran, Abhorash, I'll take freaking Konrad All he's said about any of those that is that Ushoran is on CA's radar but he hasn't heard about any particular plans, and that CA and GW don't like the idea of Lahmians being an army in themselves because they feel like it's not in character - supposedly that's why Genevieve got proposed, a Lahmian who's more likely to turn up far afield with an army.
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Feb 21, 2021 03:53
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I kinda agree with (rumored) GW there, sure the Lahmians are masters of stealth and infiltration but when it comes to marshalling armies and waging campaigns their necromantic powers are basically the same as the rest of the Vampire Counts and they are pulling from largely the same pool of old world dead that the Von Carsteins do as opposed to the dead sailors and sea creatures that Vampire Coast use. They are however a good excuse to add in the last handful of Vampire Counts units like the Coven Throne though.
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Feb 21, 2021 04:17
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In slightly-related news, GW announced a new mounted Wight King today, and I think it looks cool.  For reference this is the currently-purchasable version.  Edit: Also they teased a new Be'lakor model in the next few months. Which is...conspicuous, given the many assumptions about him being the 9th LL in game 3. Anno fucked around with this message at 04:30 on Feb 21, 2021 |
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Feb 21, 2021 04:22
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AnEdgelord posted:I kinda agree with (rumored) GW there, sure the Lahmians are masters of stealth and infiltration but when it comes to marshalling armies and waging campaigns their necromantic powers are basically the same as the rest of the Vampire Counts and they are pulling from largely the same pool of old world dead that the Von Carsteins do as opposed to the dead sailors and sea creatures that Vampire Coast use. They are however a good excuse to add in the last handful of Vampire Counts units like the Coven Throne though. Please tell me somebody has modified this so the scythe skellyman is holding his scythe like a guitar so he's a Doof Warrior.
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Feb 21, 2021 05:33
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Biggest thing they could do for TKs (and undead factions in general) is boosting growth for them, or SOMETHING. That growth change made the TK early game (all skellies all the time) essentially the entirety of the game. You're either dead, or have conquered the whole map by the time one of your settlements gets to tier V and you can start building the fun stuff.
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Feb 21, 2021 05:36
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Anno posted:In slightly-related news, GW announced a new mounted Wight King today, and I think it looks cool. The new one is a tiny bit boring but definitely very sick.
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Feb 21, 2021 05:46
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:Blood Knights and Dragon Princes are also god tier but they come at the same tier as actual giant monsters so Which is why it feels so very good to start as Imrik and only need that one settlement at level 3 before being able to recruit Dragon Princes.
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Feb 21, 2021 06:28
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TK problem is that it’s easy to be broke as gently caress, since the only meaningful way to get more bucks is to kill dudes. Killing dudes pisses them off which causes them to sack your poo poo which is awful, since that’s where all your money went!
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Feb 21, 2021 08:21
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:i pulled the numbers to check you can have a unit of empire spearmen following your reiksguard around for the same cost. a unit of spearmen and reiksguard combined will absolutely trash a unit of grail knights.
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Feb 21, 2021 11:13
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ok, well that wasn't your original point at all, but sure
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Feb 21, 2021 11:18
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:ok, well that wasn't your original point at all, but sure if you don't consider cost a statistic to compare units by then there isn't really any point in trying to discuss balance at all. just make an army of 19 star dragons.
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Feb 21, 2021 11:24
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you were the one that made the claim reiksguard were as good as dude, now you're changing it up to mean actually reiksguard and a spearmen it's hardly a fair comparison
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Feb 21, 2021 11:29
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:you were the one that made the claim reiksguard were as good as dude, now you're changing it up to mean actually reiksguard and a spearmen bretonnian cavalry should be better for cost than their equivalent in a faction that isn't explicitly cavalry focused like they are. a high elf player can spend a little less (1400) to get shock cav thats essentially as good as grail knights and they can also spend it on units that bretonnia has basically no answer for like phoenix guard. an empire player gets infantry that is basically always better than their bret equivalent and also very cost effective cavalry and also really good artillery. chaos can just spam halberd warriors but also has chaos knights, who are basically as good as grail knights, can pay a little more for dragon ogres, etc etc. bretonnia is stuck with cav and their cav isnt overwhelmingly good enough to make that focus work.
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Feb 21, 2021 11:49
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oh ok
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Feb 21, 2021 11:52
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Whats the verdict on the Radious total conversion mod?
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Feb 21, 2021 12:08
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Brettonia should have the best cavalry in the game but they also need something else to make them make sense as a faction. All their other stuff is garbage. Aren't they all about knights, nobility and king arthur and stuff? They should probably get a footsoldier unit with heavy plate armor and magical swords... Sort of like Chosen. Give them a shield and a greatsword variant and already they'd be a lot more viable and fun. That's always how I've viewed the brettonians. They should have a lot of cheap chaff (peasants) in order to be able to afford super elite units (plated cavalry / soldiers). It's just that right now their cav is on par with everyone else so they're just a faction full of bad peasants and regular cavalry. Compared to the Elves or The Empire (who have good cav but also a ton of other viable strategies and cool stuff like monsters and massive ranged firepower) they are sorely lacking. Hopefully when GW brings back the Old World they'll give Brettonia a massive overhaul. Collapsing Farts fucked around with this message at 12:20 on Feb 21, 2021 |
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Feb 21, 2021 12:13
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Collapsing Farts posted:Brettonia should have the best cavalry in the game but they also need something else to make them make sense as a faction. All their other stuff is garbage. AND WALK LIKE A PEASANT!? You besmudge the Knights of Bretonnia with such slander. I jest, I do agree Bretonnia needs some more unit variety and their cav finetuning a touch. To give CA credit, I suppose they're balancing around the assumption Bret Cav will always have the Lady's Blessing so they've always got 20% Physical Resist base.
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Feb 21, 2021 12:25
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CA’s working within GW’s cartoonish Monty Python rules for bretonnian society to be fair. Honestly they’d prolly be a much better roster if they were a little more grounded like the Empire, and they wouldn’t have to lose the foofy knights. Like where is bretonnian Jean Bureau?
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Feb 21, 2021 13:48
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cathay will probably end up with a more diverse roster than bretonnia and that is funny to me
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Feb 21, 2021 14:04
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I don’t know how the vagaries of campaign buffs play into this, but if you just charge a stock unit of Grail Knights into a stock unit of Reiksguard the Grails absolutely dumpster them. If it’s a bit into a fight where the Reiksguard are tired then it’s even worse. Bretonnia being a focused roster is cool and good. Same with dwarves.
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Feb 21, 2021 14:10
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I will repeat, you can stun lock anything with a few units of hippogryph riders. You don't need much micro to do this, point and click and they will kill anything and it won't be able to fight back. I guess they are monstrous cav, so maybe they don't count, but they are still in the top 10 most powerful units easily, if not the top 5. They aren't war mammoths, sure, but nothing is. Also, mass changes hurt cav the most in order to balance infantry against heavy single unit entities and monstrous infantry/cav. That sucks and made cav worse in the campaign but gave the dwarves a nice boost (as if they needed it). The point was primarily to help balance multiplayer and then to make other strategies in the campaign more viable. I agree cav generally sucks and always has in campaign. Usable? Sure. But crappy in comparison to *almost* everything else (especially ranged). Charge bonus, which degrades quickly, does not make up for their weak stats and lack of AP where applicable. The AI is almost always going to be ready for a charge or sending something after you. Plus, useless during siege battles with the scrum at the gates or at a hole in the walls. Again, usable, and they used to send dudes flying but always lackluster. Bretonnia suffers from that as they suffer from lack of replenishment (despite being one of the most powerful factions due to Lord bonuses, hippos and no supply lines).
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Feb 21, 2021 14:21
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My issue with Bretonnia and why I haven't played them yet is that Empire is just more fun to play. They have good infantry, solid ranged, really good cavalry with Reiksguard and Demigryph Knights. They also have the best artillery in the game with the Helstorm Rocket Battery (maybe Skaven is better?). They have all the best magic (except for vampire), and they get cool toys like the Steamtank and Luminark. I used to think Empire was boring to play, but that's because I didn't know how to use them. Bretonnia needs something cool. Maybe some monsters?
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Feb 21, 2021 14:35
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Brettonian archers are and always have been great and you can Bretelf your way to victory for huge swathes of the campaign if you don't feel like microing 20 units of cav.
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Feb 21, 2021 14:55
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Question for you greenskin experts. I just started a Skarsnik Mortal empires campaign (cause I loooove Night Gobbos  ). Is there any reason not to give all night goblins the fungus flask scrap update? I mean, maybe I misunderstand its effects, but it looks way better than the alternatives.
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Feb 21, 2021 15:08
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this is just like that conversation about dwarfs last week. maybe what Bretonnia needs is three kinds of dragon, elite physical resist halberdiers, and an all-woman unit of magical ranged AP archers. Not all factions need to be Dark/High Elves, Greenskins, or Empire. Factions can have some limitations and specializations. And Bret is definitely not underpowered in campaign or MP. If you want to win sieges in campaign take 4 units of pegasus knights (great in field battles too) and realize you have some of the strongest castle attackers in the game.
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Feb 21, 2021 15:19
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They’re the only faction that can throw a 90kg stone over 300 meters tho
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Feb 21, 2021 15:21
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This whole conversation did lead me to do some testing though and Questing Knights seem to pretty handily beat Reiksguard, and for 50 gold less too! Plus I had a couple of really fun battles using two Knights Errant against the Reiksguard/spearmen combo, which is winnable just as long as you stay mobile - with a saving of 100 gold!
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Feb 21, 2021 15:37
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Tarquinn posted:Question for you greenskin experts. If I remember correctly that scrap upgrade is unique to Skarsnik faction, so yes you should give it to all night gobbos so you can poison even more your enemies.
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Feb 21, 2021 15:46
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Yeah that's his exclusive scrap upgrade. Very nasty.
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Feb 21, 2021 15:51
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AnEdgelord posted:I kinda agree with (rumored) GW there, sure the Lahmians are masters of stealth and infiltration but when it comes to marshalling armies and waging campaigns their necromantic powers are basically the same as the rest of the Vampire Counts and they are pulling from largely the same pool of old world dead that the Von Carsteins do as opposed to the dead sailors and sea creatures that Vampire Coast use. This guy has claimed in the past that there are people at CA who are really into the concept of hybrid LLs like Arkhan the Black, and that one of the ideas for Lahmians that's been floated in the past is a hybrid Counts/Empire or Counts/Bretonnia LL in similar fashion, and that there have been similar proposals for other faction hybrids, but that GW really does not like the idea and wants factions to mostly be pure in this game. He's also said that CA has voiced the opinion that Lahmians could only be done properly if there's some kind of espionage system but the prevailing opinion is that that wouldn't work mechanically due to all the restrictions that would need to be in place on who could plausibly infiltrate who and whatnot.
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Feb 21, 2021 15:58
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Lol at the guy very earnestly posting about how bad he is at Brets
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Feb 21, 2021 16:02
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Muscle Wizard posted:you can have a unit of empire spearmen following your reiksguard around for the same cost. a unit of spearmen and reiksguard combined will absolutely trash a unit of grail knights. ok but then you no longer have a cavalry unit
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Feb 21, 2021 16:04
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