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I'm worried about the Fascist integration of Leon, but could it also represent an opportunity? If a lot of the existing power structure really wants to be in charge they may not like being told what to do by Gallicans from across the Pyrenees? And the NGF being back is helpful, as long as they understand who helped them to exist. That and I am impressed by the efforts in Asia. I think there is a very strong chance that the RRP might grow even further.
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Mar 5, 2021 12:03
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This, uh... Vrishchika-person. You know, she looks a lot like someone...
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Mar 5, 2021 12:14
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Josef bugman posted:I'm worried about the Fascist integration of Leon, but could it also represent an opportunity? If a lot of the existing power structure really wants to be in charge they may not like being told what to do by Gallicans from across the Pyrenees? if there is one thing we can learn from history, it's that french invasions of the peninsula are likely to be hugely successful and that the leonese are certain to welcome foreign rule with open arms.
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Mar 5, 2021 15:35
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Samovar posted:This, uh... Vrishchika-person. You know, she looks a lot like someone... Look, don’t worry a8out it.
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Mar 5, 2021 16:42
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I really hope we can get indochina settled before the gauls do something real stupid. Well, stupider anyway.
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Mar 5, 2021 16:51
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NewMars posted:I really hope we can get indochina settled before the gauls do something real stupid. I mean judging by how fast it is going we might be able to. The idiot in charge seems to have all the military intelligence of a GW1 era general. QuoProQuid posted:if there is one thing we can learn from history, it's that french invasions of the peninsula are likely to be hugely successful and that the leonese are certain to welcome foreign rule with open arms. Yes. For someone so obsessed with it, you'd think that Valeria would learn at least something from history. Alongside that I had three questions. 1) How late can you play HoI up to? Like can we see what this game is like if we run it up to 1980? 2) Does anyone else have a little bit of foreboding about what is going on with the Haida? and 3) What would "annex tarraconensis" actually do? Josef bugman fucked around with this message at 17:52 on Mar 5, 2021 |
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Mar 5, 2021 17:49
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VideoWitch posted:It's also good to get to see more cool lesbians The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Games > Let's Play! > More Cool Lesbians: A Byzantium Paradox Mega-Campaign
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Mar 5, 2021 17:59
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Josef bugman posted:I mean judging by how fast it is going we might be able to. The idiot in charge seems to have all the military intelligence of a GW1 era general. 1.) HoI IV has an end screen at the end of 1948, but you can continue playing past it indefinitely. Things will very quickly stop making sense if you go much further than that— I imagine the lack of a hard end-date is just to avoid a situation where a player is cut off in the middle of a lengthy war. That means I don’t know exactly how far this segment of the LP will go, but it’s probably not “until 1980”  Which I suppose means I’ll have to think of some way to model the 250 or so years between HoI and Stellaris, I guess. 2.) no comment 3.) It continues the Gallic annexation of León by integrating an area which roughly corresponds to the old Roman province of Hispania Tarraconensis.
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Mar 5, 2021 18:22
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Empress Theonora posted:1.) HoI IV has an end screen at the end of 1948, but you can continue playing past it indefinitely. Things will very quickly stop making sense if you go much further than that— I imagine the lack of a hard end-date is just to avoid a situation where a player is cut off in the middle of a lengthy war. That means I don’t know exactly how far this segment of the LP will go, but it’s probably not “until 1980” 1) Understood! I don't suppose that the idea of playing this in Aurora appeals? Because I'd love to see more of this whole world, it feels so human in a way that a lot of alt-historical things really don't. 2)  3) Ahhhh got it. I wondered if it was them or the "feadatori". Thank you! Also thanks so much for this LP. Every time an update is posted I have to fight the urge to read the whole thing again, it is just so good.
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Mar 5, 2021 18:33
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Aurora could potentially be a good narrative fit, but also I absolutely cannot make heads or tails of it enough to actually, like, play it. This did remind me that I'm like a zillion pages behind on reading CominternLP, though.
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Mar 5, 2021 18:53
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Thank the People that war is over, hopefully with enough time for the NGF to reconsolidate and build their forces up for the Big One down the road. lol'd at Mizuno's anger about Rina when they were together
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Mar 5, 2021 19:02
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Empress Theonora posted:
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Mar 5, 2021 19:37
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Ms Adequate posted:Thank the People that war is over, hopefully with enough time for the NGF to reconsolidate and build their forces up for the Big One down the road. They will be a speed bump.
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Mar 5, 2021 20:13
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wiegieman posted:They will be a speed bump. Depends on how pointy the speed bump ends up being. Part of me wonders if France might try and do an amphibious landing into Italy? Maybe try something stupid like that? Also, as a quick thing, what plans are there to defend the single outpost at the Strait of Gibraltar.
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Mar 5, 2021 20:48
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Empress Theonora posted:Aurora could potentially be a good narrative fit, but also I absolutely cannot make heads or tails of it enough to actually, like, play it. This did remind me that I'm like a zillion pages behind on reading CominternLP, though. Id read space deluge
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Mar 5, 2021 20:55
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Josef bugman posted:Depends on how pointy the speed bump ends up being. No, it doesn't. In 10 years they still won't be more than a speed bump. It's just a quieter front with the german fascists beat, that's all.
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Mar 5, 2021 21:53
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Josef bugman posted:Depends on how pointy the speed bump ends up being. I don't know HOI4 for poo poo, as a preface. So this is pretty uninformed conjecture. Paradox AIs tend to not be aggressive about opening new war fronts in other titles, and I've often taken that as a sign of developer intent (i.e. players complain that it's a feelsbad way to fight/lose). Beyond that, how wise of a move is going to be something of a matter of relative naval strength. If France has a very, very large naval advantage, then a broad attack across the Italian peninsula with supplies and support being staged in the Mediterranean islands is a solid, aggressive strategy that would put the Byzantines on the backfoot, defending large population and industry sectors across a broad front. The big reason to not do this though is that it means having a large enough naval commitment in the Mediterranean that this isn't just suicidal, and ships that are in the Mediterranean are not defending Gaul's much, much longer Atlantic coast. And that Atlantic coast is scary, because it leads very quickly into Gaul's heartlands, and is the best invasion route for multiple members of the RRP AND non-RRP communist forces. Leaving that with minimal defense is suicidal if Ireland, Britain, Ghana, Ayiti, and/or Marathas are ready to rumble. Which is probably the biggest reason why the NGF is going to be valuable, since it means that northern attacks into Gaul aren't going to rely entirely on naval resupply into contested beaches. I guess my read is: what are the relative land/naval strengths of the fascists/communists? If the fash have the upper hand navally and the lower hand on land, then I think that's a coherent thing for them to do. If the fash have less of an advantage at sea than they do on land (which I think is the case??? very unsure), it seems pretty ill-advised for them and they'd be better off taking advantage of the relatively short border they have with BC (and relatively less risky Mediterranean shore) to focus on containment and reducing Ireland, Britain, and NGF to secure those boundaries. Course I could also be wrong about where the population/industrial centers of Gaul are, I've been assuming in and around Paris but if they're much further south it's a very different situation.
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Mar 5, 2021 21:55
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I'm so glad to see ByzLP still trucking in 2021. You folks have put amazing effort into this LP, and I greatly enjoy every update.
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Mar 5, 2021 22:45
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Empress Theonora posted:Aurora could potentially be a good narrative fit, but also I absolutely cannot make heads or tails of it enough to actually, like, play it. This did remind me that I'm like a zillion pages behind on reading CominternLP, though. If all else fails, we could try pulling out some TTRPG rules (or just make some up) that have a history generator to bridge the gap or maybe make up some rules to sort of gamify what happens in the intervening years If making up rules, ~25 10 year turns or ~10 25 year turns would be a nice round number and give time to set things up in Stellaris. Pick the movers and shakers, the ones who are geopolitically relevant, whether it's 2-3 whole alliances/spheres to a dozen states. Make up some stats like economic heath, political stability, military strength. Probably keep more on the abstract side than the granular side and then maybe some global modifiers and such (things like global tensions or global economic state or even the environment). Every turn has a new technological development or crisis introduced with a decision to be made and the geopolitcal ramifications thereof.
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Mar 5, 2021 23:26
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Empress Theonora posted:General Rina Pandey and I often... frequented the same establishments, let's say. (She's queer as a three pound note, is what I'm getting at.) A certain degree of idealism is a common vice in the Red Rose Pact, but she's an idealist's idealist. I nearly spat out my wine. This is a delight to read, as usual. HoI4 is way beyond my ability to understand, let alone play, but you're really bringing it to life for me.
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Mar 6, 2021 00:02
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Empress Theonora posted:reading CominternLP, though. I havent kept up on the LP forum lately but can I get a link to this? As a reader of ByzLP Im obviously interested :P
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Mar 6, 2021 00:10
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Communist Zombie posted:I havent kept up on the LP forum lately but can I get a link to this? As a reader of ByzLP Im obviously interested :P https://discord.gg/zr6Um6mgUc There's a link for you and anyone else that wants in!
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Mar 6, 2021 00:21
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Love this update. I'd love to read the rest of Mizuno's diary, where can I place the order?quote:
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Mar 6, 2021 00:33
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Ah it lives! And I love Mizuno's reaction to Europe's history and drama, the bafflement at Europe's focus on continuity and self-importance is hilarious. I don't know what your plans are for the future of the mega-campaign but you've made one of the most organic and realistic feeling timelines I've ever read. Also your art style is amazing, and I love seeing the portraits and art in each update.
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Mar 6, 2021 02:54
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zealouscub posted:Also your art style is amazing, and I love seeing the portraits and art in each update. Seconding that; the portraits really add a little something special even beyond how good this has been generally.
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Mar 6, 2021 03:21
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Every time I see these portraits I'm glad we didn't stick with the plan to use photographs for everything.
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Mar 6, 2021 06:00
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As it turns out, it was very hard to find black and white photos of women were military officers, or even dressed as them. Who would have guessed?
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Mar 6, 2021 19:31
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Empress Theonora posted:Look, don’t worry a8out it. God... 8less you, you magnificent person.
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Mar 6, 2021 20:21
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Kangxi posted:As it turns out, it was very hard to find black and white photos of women were military officers, or even dressed as them. Who would have guessed? Just gotta go the Kaiserredux route and Photoshop whatever clothing you need onto people to make whatever portraits you need. 
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Mar 6, 2021 21:18
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Red Rose Pact gang tag when?
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Mar 7, 2021 00:57
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Tulip posted:I don't know HOI4 for poo poo, as a preface. So this is pretty uninformed conjecture. I know HoI4 for a tiny amount of poo poo, though I also know a HoI4 more extensively now that is post-Man The Guns and as such is quite different from the one ByzLP is running on. How aggressive an AI is for opening new fronts is highly individually dependent, though I can say personally that it's very rare in my experience for a Great Power NOT to jump on a new war declaration when it becomes available. This may also be difficulty-dependent, I always play on Recruit because I'm a giant child. AIs like using their CBs and are not afraid to try and overtax an enemy, which can backfire. The worst offender for doing Naval Landing Bullshit in the base game is far and away Great Britain, with Japan as a close second. These are both extremely strong naval powers which are geographically very close to their theaters of war, and they love just flinging divisions at shorelines to try and force nations like Germany or the USSR to react. That part is also something that's always been part of their AIs, to allow/represent GB's fondness for naval adventures like Dieppe or the Italian landings, and for Japan to accurately pull off its China Bullshit where it owns all the ports. Pulling off a naval landing is contingent on a number of things, the first being able to exert 50% naval supremacy in every sea zone along the invasion route. That's a pretty tall ask when you're considering two nations of roughly equal naval grunt -- the US for all its industrial and naval might, for instance, will have a very hard time pulling this off against a Japan they haven't blown up some of their pre-existing capital ships yet, because Japan can move the entire Kido Butai and surface fleet into the central-South Pacific and force colossal naval engagements in which shore air power is a factor. That shore air power also contributes to supremacy though it can't provide it all on its own, and shore torp bombers can do alarming amounts of damage. IF you pull off oceanic control, then troops need to start thinking about supply. Divisions landed on enemy territory are considered to be cut off from supply unless they control a means for the home country to get it to them, which almost always means an actual port. Divisions cut off from supply have a short grace period before they start stacking up fatal amounts of attrition, and if a port cannot be taken in the initial landing anything left around it is not going to last very long. Even area defense command armies are quite good at squashing things like this. The WRE, I would under no circumstances expect to be a naval power equivalent to the Byzantines -- even if they WERE, they have to fight them and Great Britain, which is a massive losing proposition. So the only way I'd expect French naval assaults is if Nora either forgets to set up the fleet patrols (can happen, I've done it), Byzantium runs out of fuel to keep the boats out, or the French just surrender Atlantic control entirely to force the issue in the Med. I wouldn't call any of the three likely, especially since on second recollection I think fuel was a MtG introduction and thus not something Nora even has to think about. It'd actually be far more effective for the French to give up MED control and just try to hold the coasts with their army while attempting to smash the Republican Navy. It's probably not something they even need to do per se, given how big and unwieldy the land borders are. That would be much more effective than trying to first make naval landings succeed at all and then keep them supplied, which is a much taller order. Naval landings are a much better proposition for US to be going through with, as we have the historical experience and can almost certainly put stronger local naval pressure into place anywhere we'd want to be doing them. A successful naval landing will do terrible things to a Hearts 4 front command AI, because it'll basically force it to recalculate everything and redeploy the entire army, which can cause any existing frontlines to utterly collapse as everything moves around, weakening areas and destroying Entrenchment bonuses. And I hope to God we're building fighter planes, because one thing the Hearts 4 AI loving loves to do is build infinite, unending numbers of fighter planes and do absolutely stupid bullshit in the air war. Redeye Flight fucked around with this message at 04:51 on Mar 8, 2021 |
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Mar 8, 2021 04:48
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Just to clarify, the version of the mod Nora is using runs on Man the Guns, but not Revolutions or the Battle for the Bosporus.
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Mar 8, 2021 05:08
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Kangxi posted:Just to clarify, the version of the mod Nora is using runs on Man the Guns, but not Revolutions or the Battle for the Bosporus. The latter of which is particularly ironic, given the thread’s name.
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Mar 8, 2021 05:54
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Lynneth posted:God... 8less you, you magnificent person.
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Mar 8, 2021 06:09
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cokerpilot posted:I am clearly missing something here. It's a homestuck reference, which is like an anime reference but worse.
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Mar 8, 2021 06:17
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The discord and it's pro8lems are leaking.
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Mar 8, 2021 06:18
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Kangxi posted:Just to clarify, the version of the mod Nora is using runs on Man the Guns, but not Revolutions or the Battle for the Bosporus. Empress Theonora posted:The latter of which is particularly ironic, given the thread’s name. Ah, rad. Yeah that does change things. Prior to Man the Guns, oil was a strategic resource similar to all of the others -- you needed an amount of it to produce things that use it, and as part of their upkeep. This meant a constant supply of oil was needed and also wasn't a very good representation. Man the Guns changed that into Oil producing Fuel, which can be traded around with Lend-Lease like guns and tanks, and which you need to keep things with fuel requirements operating. This can just be "at full" for army regiments with like tanks or trucks, or "at all" for the air force and navy. You still basically need a constant supply, but since you can stockpile and trade around fuel, it becomes more flexible to use. Keeping a Navy of any size going for any length of time requires a large amount of fuel, which generally also requires a consistent supply of Oil. If your fuel reserves run out, your navy will immediately all make for the nearest port and can't be sent out until they have fuel again. You can build refineries to stretch your extremely small basic fuel supply farther, and to generally make more out of smaller amounts of oil, but you HAVE to have it somewhere, and running a large airforce or a navy basically requires an onmap source of Oil that can't be interrupted -- so not traded in from someone you'll eventually be at war with, or in an overseas territory where you can't control the seas on the way (see: Japan and the Dutch East Indies). You can also massively increase the size of your fuel reserves so that you can build up years worth of supply before you get into a war, which is smart but requires use of your limited construction bandwidth to get the storage farms built -- and those are also competing for limited ground space with factories, refineries, and dockyards. Remembering that resources in HoI4 represent not just the area having the supply but having the development and infrastructure to use it, the main Oil sources in the world are in Texas, California, Venezuela, the Middle East (especially Iran), Indonesia, Romania, and the Baku-Caucasus area, with smaller ones scattered around in places such as the Chinese highlands bordering Tibet. A TON of countries can also develop small local sources in HoI4 that they'll then need to leverage the poo poo out of with highly expensive Refineries -- representing tapping sources that would be too small or difficult to work with and thus haven't been developed so far, but are kind of the only option and thus "too difficult" isn't a thing. Italy, for instance, can develop Libya's oil through national focuses because they have access to gently caress all else. Some of these may have changed thanks to the ByzLP world developing differently, in particular having a more highly developed China and Far East, but a divergence in the 11th century doesn't exactly give enough time for major geological oil deposits to have shifted around. You can also actually see which countries have native oil in the OP, at least of the ones who get their nation cards put up on the title, because they have Oil resources listed in the middle-right above the Intelligence Information. That doesn't actually say HOW big those sources are, though, just whether one exists or not, and I'm rattling off the major ones I know. The Allies have the largest amounts of oil, by a good margin. The UPR controls Indonesia's supply, Haida owns the second largest single-state deposits in the world in California and a sizable chunk of the Mexican supply, Tianhui Catalina has part of Venezuela, and the Republic of Iran explains itself. Hindustan also has some kind of supply, though I don't remember just how large. That is a ton of oil and it's going to be both necessary for all these big naval powers, and give them an unsinkable advantage because it's in the right places to fuel the right fleets with the interest in keeping that oil moving. China's fleet can give Japan one hell of a headache in that regard, but since Japan isn't going to have to fight the UPR for that oil and will instead have the UPR's small fleet helping to keep it flowing, fuel will probably be much less of a problem for the Japanese Republic than the Japanese Empire. In general fuel is not going to be a concern for the Allied bloc, though that can change if they lose sea control because they're spread across three continents and have very little land contiguity. The Pangalist block hypothetically has the actual largest amount of oil, but it comes with some strong caveats because of where it is. The actual largest deposits in the world are in Texas and are controlled by the Lenape Federation, which is about five seconds from declaring for the WPO and also about fifteen from getting stomped by its neighbors when it does. It's also on the wrong side of Avalon's Neck. The Ming control a bunch of the smaller deposits that will add up to a certain extent, and Zhongnan owns another along with the VAST majority of the world's rubber supply. The Somali Federation controls East and some of North Africa, but their area has much less oil than you'd think, though it has some. The "People's Republic" of Asitelihan also controls part of the Baku oil fields, though the majority are in Azerbaijan, and as we remember basically exists FOR that oil supply, which is telling. There is gently caress all else in most of their territory, excepting the oil in the Caucasus and the mineral resources of the southern Urals, which are considerable. Oil crunch is actually a serious threat to the WPO, because the Lenape's oil is going to do no-one any good if it can't get past Haida and across the Pacific, and while the Ming have a number of solid sources that don't need shipping, they need absolutely every drop they can get. Fighting the Allies is likely the first thing that'll happen for the WPO because of all the inter-Asian tensions and that will not be a fun time for their merchant marine. Lenape is just so screwed. Against the Red Rose Pact they have a completely opposite problem, wherein saving their Caucasian oil supply requires fighting at the far end of a trans-Asiatic supply tether through some monumentally awful and very underdeveloped terrain, and even if they win against or crush Indochina, working together with the Somalians requires getting past Marathas, which is going to be annoying as hell. I've tried to do that trans-Siberia war as China in base HoI4, it is not fun. The state due east of Astrakhan at least probably has more than ONE infrastructure in this timeline. The Red Rose Pact's largest producer may well be the Ayiti, who secured almost perfectly the slice of Venezuela with the largest oil production, along with Curacao. It's either them or the Byzantine Commune, which controls Romania and thus the Ploesti oil field that was so crucial to Hitler, and while these aren't the largest oil fields, they're in excellent positions to be highly developed by now. Nova Scotia also has some oil, along with Great Britain and the Marathas, and minor sources scattered elsewhere such as in Nuevo Xi'an. On the whole this isn't a lot of oil, and it's going to have to supply a bunch of very large and thirsty naval powers, but between GBR and the Ayiti, keeping oceanic control to keep it flowing is much more relatively plausible. The exception is Byzantium, because the WRE controls half of the Strait of Gibraltar and will shut that poo poo down as soon as a war starts, forcing trade to go the long way around Africa, which means much more ocean to keep safe. Byzantium also has the most oil-rich minor countries near it to buy oil off of, however, so in a pinch we can just trade for oil. Great Britain's navy should have less aggressive supply worries, however, since from the start they'll have active coordination from the other side of the Atlantic to keep their shipping secured. The Western Roman Empire is in the worst position for this, as you might expect. Their overseas control is minimal to nonexistent and oil supplies in Europe are very hard to come by. There's SOME -- France, Austria, and Poland all have some kind of oil supply -- but there's not going to be a lot. They also are what I'd call alarmingly short on countries overseas that they can swerve to their side. The Imperium Gallarium isn't just using Lightning War as a model for its effectiveness, that kind of model suited Nazi Germany because every war they fought was boom or bust. If the offensive goes on too long, the blitz runs out of gas alarmingly quickly. This is not to say they're not going to be a threat at all, far from it -- they have a huge amount of territory and industry and that frontline is incredibly ugly. But historically that kind of shortage means one of the three arms of combat has to suffer, and I suspect it'll be the naval arm just as it was for the Germans, because of that lack of overseas territory to need to keep hands on. They're also probably going to be trying to smash their way to any kind of oil they can reach as fast as possible, and the closest candidate is us, in Romania. The rest of the oil is mostly scattered throughout the independents, such as Azerbaijan, Da Qin, the Seljuks, etc., and apart from developing native sources the biggest way countries make up for oil deficits is buying it from neutral nations. The Aztecs are actually a big concern here because they have the other, possibly larger half of Mexico's oil deposits. These countries could hypothetically be swayed in all kinds of directions, though most of them are also in positions where only a few of the blocs could actually protect them if they joined. The important thing to remember, though, is that an unaligned country will run to ANYONE regardless of ideology if that person is already fighting against whoever decides to attack them, at least in base HoI4. Even if there's another bloc that better fits their ideology, countries get a fairly large malus to accepting members into their bloc that would drag them into a war, so a newly attacked country will usually only be able to find friends in whoever's fighting the war already. This can lead to dumb things like half the planet joining Miedzymorze, or the French Commune revolting to side with the Axis because they split off from France that was already fighting the Axis.
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Mar 8, 2021 09:28
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cokerpilot posted:I am clearly missing something here. Be glad you do.
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Mar 8, 2021 10:21
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Redeye Flight posted:-oil words- That is really interesting, thank you! Hmmm, how long do people think it will be before the Lenape do something stupid and the Haida and Ayiti descend upon them?
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Mar 8, 2021 13:18
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Lynneth posted:God... 8less you, you magnificent person. /smacks face I can't believe I didn't get that, because now that I'm looking at her again that is as unsubtly a reference as can be.
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Mar 8, 2021 22:18
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