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Escobarbarian posted:Watching this show and thinking The Fireman isn’t a force of good is a hell of a take But The Fireman gets what he wants, then leaves Cooper stranded and confused in some alternate timeline. Jerusalem posted:Remind me: in the scene in Fire Walk With Me where the Arm sits with Bob demanding his share of Garmonbozia, while many other figures are present like the (a) Woodsman and even Mrs. Tremond and her grandson, the Fireman himself is not present, right? Plus we see him present alone in his "home" in episode 8 seeing the "birth"/ejection of Bob into the world, and immediately taking steps to try and bring about his capture/confinement within the Lodge. Unless I'm remembering wrong, he never shows any interest in or desire for the "pain and sorrow" the other characters seem to covet. It seems like some of the otherworldly forces, like BOB, directly feed off of human emotions. Some just manipulate humans for their own purposes. None are really benevolent. Tubgoat posted:Because there is a Black Lodge. When we actually see that world it is covered in a pattern of dark and light stripes interlocked together. Seems like its implying that the good and evil sides are all mixed together, and inextricable. We never see any reason to think there is a separate Black or White Lodge, that's just something a character says once. Lord Krangdar fucked around with this message at 07:08 on May 28, 2021 |
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May 28, 2021 07:06
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Lord Krangdar posted:But The Fireman gets what he wants, then leaves Cooper stranded and confused in some alternate timeline. We don’t exactly know their relative power. How do we know Judy isn’t more powerful than The Fireman? Do you think Laura getting stranded as Carrie Page was what he wanted?
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May 28, 2021 07:17
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Escobarbarian posted:We don’t exactly know their relative power. How do we know Judy isn’t more powerful than The Fireman? Do you think Laura getting stranded as Carrie Page was what he wanted? I think he wanted to defeat BOB, and he didn't care either way what happened to any human caught in the middle of their conflict. He must have had some plan for Laura, since he apparently sent her soul or essence to Earth. But Chester Desmond, Phillip Jeffries, and Cooper were ultimately treated as expendable and all three ended up lost between worlds.
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May 28, 2021 17:54
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Lord Krangdar posted:But The Fireman gets what he wants, then leaves Cooper stranded and confused in some alternate timeline. How do we know the Fireman got what he wanted? BOB was defeated, yes, but the Fireman seemed to me to be interested in more than just BOB. How do we know that he left Cooper stranded and confused? Cooper appeared to enter that alternate timeline/reality of his own accord, and we don't know what happens to him after the final scene. (Personally, I'm a fan of the theories that the beginning scene in the Return episode 1, where the Fireman urges Cooper to remember "Richard" and "Linda", is either the Fireman briefing Cooper on whatever plan he acts out in episodes 17/18, or is an out-of-sequence scene that takes place sometime after the final shot in episode 18.) We're all free to interpret it how we want, but I have difficulty wrapping my head around the notion that the Fireman is malevolent or indifferent. My take on it was that he is benevolent, but not omnipotent, and his influence is sometimes limited or opposed by the Black Lodge residents or Judy. Lord Krangdar posted:When we actually see that world it is covered in a pattern of dark and light stripes interlocked together. Seems like its implying that the good and evil sides are all mixed together, and inextricable. We never see any reason to think there is a separate Black or White Lodge, that's just something a character says once. It's not something a character says once. If memory serves, Windom Earle, Major Briggs, and Deputy Hawk all make some kind of reference to there being two lodges. Doesn't Briggs even claim to have visited the White Lodge? If we're going to try and read some meaning into the arrangement of floor tiles, I would argue that it suggests that the two lodges are intertwined with each other, not that we should discard the multiple textual references to there being two lodges.
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May 28, 2021 18:25
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Blotto_Otter posted:My take on it was that he is benevolent, but not omnipotent, and his influence is sometimes limited or opposed by the Black Lodge residents or Judy. Great post that makes my arguments better than I personally could, thank you
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May 28, 2021 18:33
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Blotto_Otter posted:BOB was defeated, yes, *in transparent overlaid cooper voice* YOU'RE LIVING INSIDE A DREAM
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May 28, 2021 18:42
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I don't know that anything was successfully resolved by that guy punching BOB to death, because time stopped and the universe got stuck at the end. Cooper leaves and says that some things are going to change. It seems more like he went back in time to start a new iteration of whatever series of events rather than going into another timeline or reality. I don't think that first timeline is still there with everyone standing inside the sheriff's office watching the second hand on the clock go back and forth.
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May 28, 2021 18:46
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I thought the new Lynch netflix thing was supposed to start shooting this month, but he's still boppin away at his house in LA so hmmm.
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May 28, 2021 19:46
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Blotto_Otter posted:How do we know that he left Cooper stranded and confused? Cooper appeared to enter that alternate timeline/reality of his own accord, and we don't know what happens to him after the final scene. (Personally, I'm a fan of the theories that the beginning scene in the Return episode 1, where the Fireman urges Cooper to remember "Richard" and "Linda", is either the Fireman briefing Cooper on whatever plan he acts out in episodes 17/18, or is an out-of-sequence scene that takes place sometime after the final shot in episode 18.) If you interpret it that way, then I see what you're saying. I saw that scene as coming first, meaning the Fireman led Cooper to where he ended up at the end of the series. I vaguely remember an implication that the "Richard and Linda" scene took place during the long time Cooper was trapped in the other realm, but maybe that's wrong. Maybe what he was wearing in the scene is a clue to when it happened, in the context of the rest of the story? Blotto_Otter posted:It's not something a character says once. If memory serves, Windom Earle, Major Briggs, and Deputy Hawk all make some kind of reference to there being two lodges. Doesn't Briggs even claim to have visited the White Lodge? If we're going to try and read some meaning into the arrangement of floor tiles, I would argue that it suggests that the two lodges are intertwined with each other, not that we should discard the multiple textual references to there being two lodges. Can anyone else confirm how many references there are to the White Lodge in the actual show, and when they come up? I guess my overall point is that I always see fans refer to the story of Twin Peaks as a Manichean struggle between good and evil spirits, with the town in the middle. And I just don't think the actual show supports that view. There are certainly good characters and uplifting moments, but they usually come from the human side. Maybe the Fireman wants to help, but he never actually does, so why assume he has good intentions? Seems like maybe some residents of the other realm manipulate human's negative emotions, and some manipulate human's positive emotions (like giving Briggs a moment of pure, otherworldly joy). They are still all manipulating humans for whatever their own goals are. Origami Dali posted:I thought the new Lynch netflix thing was supposed to start shooting this month, but he's still boppin away at his house in LA so hmmm. Where was it supposed to be filmed? Lord Krangdar fucked around with this message at 20:05 on May 28, 2021 |
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May 28, 2021 20:01
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It's just him giving the weather for two hours.
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May 28, 2021 20:08
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Mantis42 posted:It's just him giving the weather for two hours. Somehow by the end of it, we are still left feeling with a vague sense of dread.
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May 28, 2021 20:19
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https://twitter.com/DLEveryFriday/status/1398296183647477770
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May 28, 2021 20:23
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Thank you Mr. Lynch 
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May 28, 2021 23:49
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Jerusalem posted:Thank you Mr. Lynch we should all be saying this every day of our lives
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May 29, 2021 01:12
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We never see the White Lodge, but don't we never actually see the Black Lodge either? I've always been under the impression the red room is The Waiting Room, which is not the same thing. I don't believe the Convenience Store is either but you could probably make a better case for it. Also Mike was a man but seems to be a spirit at this point, and he "lives" in the Waiting Room and appears to be benevolent. The Evolution of the Arm also seems to be benevolent though i don't know why, The LMFAP mostly wasn't. . .?
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May 30, 2021 06:15
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Most of that has always been my interpretation. TMFAP is the arm though. Mike cut his arm off, and by shedding the evil part he became good. Not sure why he seems to be human and have a physical manifestation unlike bob.
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May 30, 2021 16:36
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Borrowed Ladder posted:The Evolution of the Arm also seems to be benevolent though i don't know why, The LMFAP mostly wasn't. . .? I think the Arm isn't so much benevolent as it is just focused on garmonbozia. It's therefore on Coop's side during the series, because Bob has been taking it all and Coop opposes Bob. Think about when Ike attacks Dougie. Once the situation is mostly in control, the Evolution of the Arm appears just to urge him to "squeeze his hand off!" That's not helpful at that point, but it would create additional pain and suffering. eSporks posted:Mike cut his arm off, and by shedding the evil part he became good. He possesses Philip Gerard in the physical world. I assumed he used Gerard's form in the red room, etc., just because that's the only form we've ever seen him in and giving him a Bob-like "real form" at that point would be too pointless a complication even for Lynch.
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May 30, 2021 16:55
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Ben Horne switching from cigars to carrots that he keeps in his suit is so good
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May 30, 2021 17:16
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Borrowed Ladder posted:We never see the White Lodge, but don't we never actually see the Black Lodge either? I've always been under the impression the red room is The Waiting Room, which is not the same thing. I don't believe the Convenience Store is either but you could probably make a better case for it. I thought the Black Lodge was that really gross decaying building used in FWWM and The Return and figured the White Lodge could have been the Black and white art deco cinema in episode 8, more confident on the former than the latter though
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Jun 1, 2021 13:40
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shoeberto posted:I think about this a lot with Mulholland Drive. Very few mindfuck movies ever make good on the little in-universe fractal of mysteries that they set up. They just do weird poo poo for the sake of it. The constant cock tease of a revelation that never comes makes them sort of worthless beyond being a stoned 18 year old. The emotions being authentic as gently caress, the storytelling on that level being so competent, helps. Like the varying scenes of grief around the discovery of Laura's body in episode 1 immediatley made Twin Peaks an anomaly. It got its hooks in deep right from the get go.
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Jun 1, 2021 14:19
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multijoe posted:I thought the Black Lodge was that really gross decaying building used in FWWM and The Return and figured the White Lodge could have been the Black and white art deco cinema in episode 8, more confident on the former than the latter though I believe that hotel is called The Dutchman's, and it's in the same "place" as the room above the convenience store. I don't see it being the Black Lodge. I would buy The Fireman's whole b&w zone being the White Lodge though.
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Jun 2, 2021 03:07
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https://twitter.com/pineyrealm/status/1401677225192157186
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Jun 7, 2021 15:36
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https://faroutmagazine.co.uk/david-lynch-bizarre-ringtones-series/ E: ugh, this is neither new nor actually available. Dumb. regulargonzalez fucked around with this message at 16:18 on Jun 10, 2021 |
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Jun 10, 2021 16:15
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https://twitter.com/kyle_maclachlan/status/1403004417842966535
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Jun 10, 2021 16:15
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"Only time will tell" (?!)
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Jun 10, 2021 16:27
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Didn't they answer the question in the tie-in book? Or is that not canonical?
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Jun 10, 2021 16:42
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Isn't he asking that question rhetorically? I.e. it's obvious and/or who cares
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Jun 10, 2021 16:50
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idk man i think kale knows something
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Jun 10, 2021 16:59
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Annie’s probably not great
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Jun 10, 2021 17:03
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Her?
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Jun 10, 2021 17:06
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thrilla in vanilla posted:Annie’s probably not great she's fine
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Jun 10, 2021 18:36
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lol goddamnit
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Jun 10, 2021 20:43
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Everyone's always saying 'how's annie?' but no one every asks 'how's audrey?'
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Jun 10, 2021 20:48
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She’s married to an overbearing rear end in a top hat and her son kills kids. Seems like she’s doing great
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Jun 10, 2021 20:59
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I mean, I hope she's under doctors' care and getting the help she needs, but the scene was kind of ambiguous.
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Jun 10, 2021 22:18
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thrilla in vanilla posted:She’s married to an overbearing rear end in a top hat and her son kills kids. Seems like she’s doing great Is she married to the sleepy guy? I mean, I guess it makes sense, I'd be very sleepy if I was married to dream-state Audry too.
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Jun 10, 2021 22:25
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I thought the short guy and everything else in those scenes was a complete fabrication?
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Jun 10, 2021 22:53
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How do we know Annie isn't Audrey?
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Jun 10, 2021 23:25
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I assumed he was her therapist, she was in some weird hallucinatory state, and irl she's committed in an institution due to the various traumas she's experienced. It's actually the plot line I wish Lynch had followed a bit more after her whole dance thing.
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Jun 10, 2021 23:47
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I always thought of the Audrey plot as a small mirror of the overarching plot of season 3. She’s trapped in a dream state at her home, finally breaks free at the Roadhouse, and wakes up somewhere else. I thought this was pretty analogous to Cooper breaking out of Twin Peaks, saving Laura, and ending up as Richard.
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Jun 11, 2021 00:15
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