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pentyne posted:Many disabled people can work part/full time jobs with a support network. Tons of these cases are a result of the family coddling their special boy (it's almost always the son) never pushing for improvement or growth of any kind. Whether the support network exists is going to be a big part of the equation but quite often its a matter of the 'sensitive' child being enabled heavily by the parents. Coddling feels a bit much for what's usually doing the bare minimum and responding to any requests for help or emotional problems with blank stares. Doesn't do many favours for neurotypical kids either. All those NEETs are basically indoor feral children.
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Jul 8, 2021 05:26
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therobit posted:Wrong thread’s lore. Pnurtis transcends threads and forums
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Jul 8, 2021 06:32
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please knock Mom! posted:Does this mean you’re getting a child seat for the peloton?  Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Someone at my office quit today after working there for 9 years. Hopefully not too political, but the amount of “cut ones nose to spite your face” that has gone on through the whole pandemic is just mind blowing. Hospitals in rural Missouri are at 90-100% capacity because people there refuse to get vaccinated (vaccine rates are as low as 20%) and people are literally dying because they refuse to believe science. And of course, a side affect is it also hurts poor and minority communities that sometimes may not get the same access to either vaccines or medical care that others get. Duckman2008 fucked around with this message at 12:21 on Jul 8, 2021 |
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Jul 8, 2021 12:17
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DaveSauce posted:also Heck you can open 529's for anyone you want as long as you have their SSN. And then years later when it's full of money you can give it to them or just cash it out for yourself (and pay the associated taxes). In short, 529's are great if you want to be the best grandpa in the world and they're also great if you want to be the meanest grandpa in the world.
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Jul 8, 2021 13:13
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you can open a 529 with yourself as the beneficiary and change the beneficiary later
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please knock Mom! posted:Does this mean you’re getting a child seat for the peloton?  Well done guys.
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Jul 8, 2021 14:09
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quote:Wells Fargo tells customers it’s shuttering all personal lines of credit quote:When it was offered, the credit lines had variable interest rates ranging from 9.5% to 21%. quote:One customer said the change is prompting him to switch banks after more than a decade with Wells Fargo. Tim Tomassi, a Portland, Oregon, programmer, said he used a personal line of credit linked to his checking account to avoid expensive overdraft fees. Taking out a 21% APR loan to avoid "expensive overdraft fees" and getting so mad that you will switch banks to find a new one that will offer you a 21% APR loan instead of just getting a credit card, not overdrafting, using a bank without overdraft fees, linking a savings account to your checking, or getting notification that you are overdrafting to avoid doing it repeatedly without realizing.
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Jul 8, 2021 20:57
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I have a LoC like that on my old credit union account. It's convenient since you'll get dinged on fees if you have too many savings account overdraft transfers. But since it's an unsecured loan for thousands of dollars you generally need good credit to qualify and the kind of people who have them aren't likely to keep a balance. So it's not making Wells Fargo any money. They'd rather you keep a larger checking account balance or pay a NSF fee.
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Jul 8, 2021 21:12
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The places I have worked offered overdraft lines of credit to people with marginal credit. If you are a person who cares about the rate, you likely won’t carry much of a balance so you only pay a couple days interest and won’t be losing money on it. But a lot of people would never look at their account and max the thins out never thinking they had overdrafted because their debit card still works.
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Jul 8, 2021 21:18
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:
... Yes...? 
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Jul 8, 2021 21:35
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therobit posted:The places I have worked offered overdraft lines of credit to people with marginal credit. If you are a person who cares about the rate, you likely won’t carry much of a balance so you only pay a couple days interest and won’t be losing money on it. But a lot of people would never look at their account and max the thins out never thinking they had overdrafted because their debit card still works. None of the banks I worked at ever offered checking account LoC's, so I'm making some assumptions on the type of customers who qualify for them. Banks happily give out tens of thousands of dollars in unsecured loans to customers, but I think checking account LoC's carry more risk. Someone who maxes out their credit card will keep paying the minimum payments for years, but if you're in a spot where you max out your overdraft protection then poo poo's going sideways. So Wells Fargo's making no money off people who pay off their balances every month and losing money off customers who max out their LoC's. Also it's a poo poo bank, but that's a given.
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Jul 8, 2021 21:47
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Krispy Wafer posted:So it's not making Wells Fargo any money. They'd rather you keep a larger checking account balance or pay a NSF fee. I have a friend that used to work for a small bank and he said they make the most money from their poorest customers. Those $30 NSF fees add up. Rich/financially stable people don't overdraft much and the amount they actually keep in a checking account tops off fast. The bank can't make much off the interest anyway as the money has to stay liquid.
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Jul 8, 2021 21:59
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Krispy Wafer posted:So it's not making Wells Fargo any money. They'd rather you keep a larger checking account balance or pay a NSF fee. According to their financial documents, they were making Wells Fargo about 3% of their profit each year. They weren't key to their business, but they were getting tens of millions of dollars a year from these automatic loans.
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Jul 8, 2021 22:05
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More info/speculation on why WF is doing this:https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/08/wells-fargo-is-shutting-down-all-personal-line-of-credit-accounts-.html posted:Wells Fargo CEO Charles Scharf has been forced to make difficult decisions during the coronavirus pandemic, offloading assets and deposits and stepping back from some products because of limitations imposed by the Federal Reserve. In 2018, the Fed barred Wells Fargo from growing its balance sheet until it fixes compliance shortcomings revealed by the bank’s fake accounts scandal. Krispy Wafer posted:None of the banks I worked at ever offered checking account LoC's, so I'm making some assumptions on the type of customers who qualify for them. I never touched it, but I can imagine the bank made money off that in general - low enough amount of money that the bank doesn't have too much on the line, but enough that you could get a lot of financially illiterate college students to use it and pay interest on it. (And this bank had a branch in the student union building, so that sort of targeting wouldn't be unexpected)
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Jul 8, 2021 22:15
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Haifisch posted:
I also got a checking account LOC as a college student, it was for at least $2-3k. I drew out like $1500 or so to help buy my first motorcycle. (Limited BWM as I paid it back in 1 or 2 months) I doubt I had any credit back then.
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Jul 8, 2021 22:18
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The bigger reason to have them is that they are what is called a “sticky” product. They help keep customers around in a couple of ways. People like knowing that is they accidentally overdraft they won’t get hit with that $35 fee. They can also prevent someone leaving in a huff over said fee. But probably the most important part is that if you are strapped for cash and want to close your account, you probably don’t have 2 grand to pay to close it down. Usually a condition of the LOC is having that checking account.
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Jul 8, 2021 23:14
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:According to their financial documents, they were making Wells Fargo about 3% of their profit each year. They weren't key to their business, but they were getting tens of millions of dollars a year from these automatic loans. 3% of a bank profit isn't chump change. Maybe they determined they could make 3.1% from extra overdraft fees if they got rid of the LoC's. But the asset-cap-slap-on-the-wrist-punishment that Haifisch cited is probably the reason. Krispy Wafer fucked around with this message at 00:00 on Jul 9, 2021 |
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Jul 8, 2021 23:20
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It’s kind of funny how the asset cap is probably going to cost Wells Fargo more money than the $3 billion fine they got hit with.
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Jul 9, 2021 00:03
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Bird in a Blender posted:It’s kind of funny how the asset cap is probably going to cost Wells Fargo more money than the $3 billion fine they got hit with. A Good Start.
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Jul 9, 2021 00:08
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DaveSauce posted:Except when idiots came by. How were his medical bills not higher than an equally priced set of impact sockets as compared to chrome? Do not impact chrome sockets, not because they will break but because they will shatter and send metal shards into you.
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Jul 9, 2021 01:01
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Duckman2008 posted:…people are literally dying because they refuse to believe science. Guest2553 posted:A Good Start. Sorry (not sorry)
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Jul 9, 2021 03:56
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If you have a taxable brokerage account over mid-five figures at a bank, they will pitch a securities-backed line of credit at you capped at like half of the value of your traded assets.
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Jul 9, 2021 05:15
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crazypeltast52 posted:If you have a taxable brokerage account over mid-five figures at a bank, they will pitch a securities-backed line of credit at you capped at like half of the value of your traded assets. If you already have the securities to borrow against, couldn't you write calls on treasury notes for the same effect and probably a lower interest rate?
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Jul 9, 2021 13:06
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pentyne posted:Many disabled people can work part/full time jobs with a support network. Tons of these cases are a result of the family coddling their special boy (it's almost always the son) never pushing for improvement or growth of any kind. Whether the support network exists is going to be a big part of the equation but quite often its a matter of the 'sensitive' child being enabled heavily by the parents. This happened to three different men in my life (two childhood friends and a brother in law) where they were heavily coddled by their families and for all three of them they are currently trying to fix the shattered remains of their life when they woke up at 35 with no education beyond high school, no work history, no relationship, extremely poor social skills etc etc. They are all neurotypical and basically didn't realize they should push out of their comfort zones because it was all they knew from birth. For two of them it was because the families could no longer support them, for one he just woke up one day and realized he wasn't a kid anymore and the lifestyle of anime, video games, and mcu merch wasn't enough for him. They all are very angry and sad people now working bad retail jobs.
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Jul 9, 2021 13:22
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crazypeltast52 posted:If you have a taxable brokerage account over mid-five figures at a bank, they will pitch a securities-backed line of credit at you capped at like half of the value of your traded assets. Isn't this what the ultra-wealthy do for living expenses, since their investment income is taxed much, much lower than wage-based income? I feel like the ProPublica story on the billionaire class paying very low taxes talked about this. Of course, their LoC's are like $10M Edit: https://www.propublica.org/article/the-secret-irs-files-trove-of-never-before-seen-records-reveal-how-the-wealthiest-avoid-income-tax quote:For regular people, borrowing money is often something done out of necessity, say for a car or a home. But for the ultrawealthy, it can be a way to access billions without producing income, and thus, income tax. Omne fucked around with this message at 14:46 on Jul 9, 2021 |
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Jul 9, 2021 14:37
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A Mystery in Three Acts ACT 1: PROLOGUE quote:Huge electricity bill quote:I checked a lot with the energy company and they say I'm using 5-10 times more electricity than I was 2 bills ago and the rates haven't gone up. Usage was 400-700 kWh in the past now it's nearly 2500 on the last bill. I've been here 6 months so something is really strange. I had a unpleasant talk with the landlord and said if he doesn't send an electrician to fix it then I'm breaking the lease so he caved and is booking one now ACT 2: DENOUEMENT quote:Found it and the electrician is going to voicemail, there's a 20A break switch with CP1 on it. When off the meter stopped. I flicked all other switches on and it hardly moved. I plugged in the fridge and my macbook and the meter is hardly moving. Everything in the apartment has electricity. What could CP1 mean? It could be CPI too. Other switches are P1, P2, HOT WATER, AC, OVEN, STOVE, LIGHTS quote:Electrician called back CP1 means carport1. My housemate has the garage for his car because I haven't got a car and don't need the space. Checked the garage and in the back corner there's 4 silver boxes 2 big and 2 small making heaps of noise with power leads and hundreds of yellow and black wires between the big and small boxes. The small box is called BITMAN and the big one don't know. I left the garage breaker switch off until the housemate gets home and I'll ask him what they are ACT 3: EPILOGUE quote:Not good. FIN quote:My housemate came with his parents yesterday to collect his computer, clothes and things and his parents were so upset at what he did.
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Jul 9, 2021 15:19
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Read ACT I and immediately knew what the issue was.  buttcoin
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Jul 9, 2021 15:28
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I'm stuck in the before times and got my signals crossed with one of the house threads. I thought someone was stealing power to grow weed.
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Jul 9, 2021 15:43
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Omne posted:Isn't this what the ultra-wealthy do for living expenses, since their investment income is taxed much, much lower than wage-based income? I feel like the ProPublica story on the billionaire class paying very low taxes talked about this. Of course, their LoC's are like $10M ...but the money to pay back the loans has to come from somewhere, right? That either has to be income that will be taxed as such, or from selling securities that will be taxed at capital gains rate. I have no doubt that loans would be useful for manipulating when some taxes are paid, but I don't see how they help you avoid paying those taxes. Ellison and Musk have the bulk of their assets as long term capital gains and live a lifestyle where they spend well above the highest tax bracket every year, so the biggest effect the loans have is deferring when they need to sell their securities to support their lifestyle. That's only beneficial if their company stock keeps increasing in value more than the interest on the loans. It's nice for them, but is still a risk.
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Jul 9, 2021 15:47
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I Like Jell-O posted:...but the money to pay back the loans has to come from somewhere, right? That either has to be income that will be taxed as such, or from selling securities that will be taxed at capital gains rate. I have no doubt that loans would be useful for manipulating when some taxes are paid, but I don't see how they help you avoid paying those taxes. Ellison and Musk have the bulk of their assets as long term capital gains and live a lifestyle where they spend well above the highest tax bracket every year, so the biggest effect the loans have is deferring when they need to sell their securities to support their lifestyle. That's only beneficial if their company stock keeps increasing in value more than the interest on the loans. It's nice for them, but is still a risk. You take another loan using a different asset as collateral and pay off the first loan. Rinse and repeat as the collateral for the first loan is now freed up. My understanding is that this is a huge part of why Trump is in a lot of financial trouble right now because a lot of the assets he he collateralizing his loans look like they’re not worth what he claimed and the banks might call the loans in. Meanwhile no one wants to loan to him again so he can’t do step two up there. edit: for example, if I have stocks worth 500 million I use a chunk of that as collateral for a $100 million loan. Use that for living expenses, and then take another $100 million loan to pay that off. In the meantime I've effectively paid interest only on the first $100 million, which given that I'm some famous billionaire with better credit than most governments is really goddamned low. Maybe I pay the interest with whatever other income I have. If I really want to be spicy I can take out the next loan for $110 million to cover that interest too. Meanwhile the assets that I'm using as collateral are probably increasing in value. Oh, and if there's any kind of inflation at all my loans actually decrease in value while my assets aren't affected nearly as much Cyrano4747 fucked around with this message at 15:58 on Jul 9, 2021 |
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Jul 9, 2021 15:52
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When you die in the US there's the concept of a step-up in basis which drastically lowers how much taxes are paid on those capital gains, while you lived off the LoC (which usually in these cases gets paid by the estate when you're dead). https://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/stepupinbasis.asp quote:Example of a Step-Up in Basis People either pass their assets on using heirs or a trust but the step-up shelters them from huge amounts of tax.
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Jul 9, 2021 15:54
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I Like Jell-O posted:...but the money to pay back the loans has to come from somewhere, right? That either has to be income that will be taxed as such, or from selling securities that will be taxed at capital gains rate. I have no doubt that loans would be useful for manipulating when some taxes are paid, but I don't see how they help you avoid paying those taxes. Ellison and Musk have the bulk of their assets as long term capital gains and live a lifestyle where they spend well above the highest tax bracket every year, so the biggest effect the loans have is deferring when they need to sell their securities to support their lifestyle. That's only beneficial if their company stock keeps increasing in value more than the interest on the loans. It's nice for them, but is still a risk. From what I could understand, it gives them a way to float income for a while and when you do sell securities to pay for them it's after claiming as much loss as you can on securities that didn't do well. Overall your wealth skyrockets, but you cherry pick some losing investments.
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Jul 9, 2021 15:59
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Cacafuego posted:Read ACT I and immediately knew what the issue was. The only question in my mind was whether it was an idiot roommate trying to offload the power bill, or a lovely landlord who hid a mining rig in a crawlspace or something. The big where the roommate went full on with the all you can eat buffet and calling his mining rig a business was  though.
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Jul 9, 2021 16:00
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Heirs get stepped-up basis, not the estate. Living off of loans secured by your portfolio is explicitly a bet that the assets will grow faster than the interest rate you're paying on the loan. It lets you defer the cap gains taxes, but not avoid them - TBF iron-clad control of the recognition of income is a huge tool for managing tax bills for the wealthy that we working schlubs don't get.
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Jul 9, 2021 16:27
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I really need to stop using WF, I'm kind of paranoid about switching to a credit union or whatever, only because it seems like you have to do it very carefully as I have so many things being paid automatically to and from my checking account. It seems like the best way to do it is to very slowly move things from one to the other - for example I will be getting a state property tax refund at some point this year, and that will go to my WF account. However my two big monthly are my mortgage and credit card, so I have to time moving those to a new account to coincide with having my paychecks deposited to the new account as well.
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Jul 9, 2021 16:37
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SlapActionJackson posted:Heirs get stepped-up basis, not the estate. Living off of loans secured by your portfolio is explicitly a bet that the assets will grow faster than the interest rate you're paying on the loan. It lets you defer the cap gains taxes, but not avoid them - TBF iron-clad control of the recognition of income is a huge tool for managing tax bills for the wealthy that we working schlubs don't get.
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Jul 9, 2021 16:38
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actionjackson posted:I really need to stop using WF, I'm kind of paranoid about switching to a credit union or whatever, only because it seems like you have to do it very carefully as I have so many things being paid automatically to and from my checking account. It seems like the best way to do it is to very slowly move things from one to the other - for example I will be getting a state property tax refund at some point this year, and that will go to my WF account. However my two big monthly are my mortgage and credit card, so I have to time moving those to a new account to coincide with having my paychecks deposited to the new account as well. Open a new account and deposit to it while maintaining two months expenses in your old account. I left an old account open for about a year with a few thousand just in case, and when nothing hit the statement for 3 months I closed it.
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Jul 9, 2021 16:46
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Less Fat Luke posted:I would think they can then liquidate the amount at the new cost basis to pay the LoC. No, because the estate owes the bank for the LoC, not the heirs. Heirs only get what's left over after the estate settles outstanding debts.
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Jul 9, 2021 16:51
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StormDrain posted:Open a new account and deposit to it while maintaining two months expenses in your old account. hmm that's a good idea thanks. I would probably leave it open even longer, for example the property tax refund was submitted at the start of the year, but I usually don't get it until September!
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Jul 9, 2021 16:52
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SlapActionJackson posted:No, because the estate owes the bank for the LoC, not the heirs. Heirs only get what's left over after the estate settles outstanding debts. Ah okay that makes sense. Edit: wait.. there's an actionjackson *and* SlapActionJackson??
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Jul 9, 2021 16:52
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Cacafuego posted:Read ACT I and immediately knew what the issue was. Sign that I'm way too old to be in the internet: I expected either grow-op or them finding a neighbor's extension cord half-buried in the yard and running to an outlet. Of course it's crypto in TYOOL 2021. 
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Jul 9, 2021 18:14
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