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Now it’s true there’s all that vague world building stuff that only teases interesting poo poo in the coffee table lore book but how much of that was even written by GRRM?
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Jul 20, 2021 04:33
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GRRM clearly gives no fucks, YiTi was completely made up by those two weird superfans and means nothing. I hate the word cope now since copium etc, but I can't think of a better one. Delusion?
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Jul 20, 2021 04:36
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Oh there's a 0% chance it was written by him or even taken from his "notes" and if you believe otherwise then you must think the Six Flags guy was an actual old man: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EbXSbP-wEFU
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Jul 20, 2021 04:38
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kaworu posted:Stephen King also had a similar issue with books 5-7 of The Dark Tower, I'd argue - that one also fell apart somewhat - though unlike GRRM, he seemed to become preoccupied with rushing to a conclusion and finishing the series for better or worse expeditiously. Other people have already commented on Rowling's various problems but King to me is the more interesting case because he was already mellowing in the 90s and then getting hit by a van pretty much shook all the remaining nihilism out of him, which made it difficult for him to really pick up the thread of the Dark Tower series even though he very clearly wanted to finish it as his "magnum opus" in case he croaked prematurely. Beyond just being very cringey and badly plotted books 5-7 were just going through the motions - all the major events were contrived such that it seemed like King didn't really believe in the endings but felt that he had to deliver something sufficiently dark to try and match the oeuvre of the first 4 books. Even Roland's true ending is much more positive than what one might expect - a punishment to be sure but one that has some promise of ending and that indicates that the problem isn't that Roland is fundamentally bad (and he is) so much as being influenced by the necessities of a flawed and dying world. On top of that all the various "Dark Tower as the hinge of the multiverse" stuff feels immensely forced and hollow by books 5-7, like King doesn't really care for the idea anymore but he's made his bed so might as well run with it. The inclusion of the Harry Potter stuff in DT book 5 is so bad that I could barely read through it the first time. King was clearly enraptured with the idea of this supposedly whimsical children's adventure story (and the widespread adoration lauded on the author) that he jams a bunch of references into his own story, never mind how discordant it is within the world that he has created. It was just so loving dumb. RoboChrist 9000 posted:To be fair, I feel like Harry Potter is deep and amazing, just, like, by accident. It really is one of the most incredible and insightful depictions of late 90s End of History nonsense and of the Liberal Centrist mindset. Like if we didn't have tweets upon tweets of Rowling being a myopic bigot and lots of interviews of her being dumb, I sincerely and honestly believe future generations - if we manage to last that long as a species which lol at this point - would probably think Harry Potter was a brilliant and scathing satire on the level of A Modest Proposal. 
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Jul 20, 2021 05:01
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mind the walrus posted:Oh there's a 0% chance it was written by him or even taken from his "notes" and if you believe otherwise then you must think the Six Flags guy was an actual old man: I mean as a kid I thought the Six Flags guy was a really spry old dude, yeah.
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Jul 20, 2021 09:27
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mind the walrus posted:Oh there's a 0% chance it was written by him or even taken from his "notes" and if you believe otherwise then you must think the Six Flags guy was an actual old man: Cut footage of pycelle
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Jul 20, 2021 09:29
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Sephyr posted:Which, make no mistake, -was- a bit of a thing. 30% of the west german judges post WW2 were former member sof the nazi party, and a lot of other figures got a pass. But I don't think that was the point she was going for. Hell, even after their Magic World War THREE she lets the nazi family just walk into the sunset, because hey, their kids are gonna study with my kids in the future! Time is an endless repetition! Don't forget the complete pass that some of those kids, who either directly murdered people or helped do so, got a free pass. Though that sounds about right for a society who teaches its first year tween-aged students how to do stuff like how to make The real fantasy is that the wizarding world has never collapsed despite repeatedly handing magical WMDs and mind control powers to actual children.
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Jul 20, 2021 16:09
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Now, now. There's nothing irresponsible in....giving mastery over Time itself to a primary-school student so she can take extra classes. Such a priceless, rare artifact is perfectly safe in a school that has been twice targeted by Arcane hitler in the last 2 years and has a known Death Eater in the faculty, plus the kids of many other Death eaters attending.
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Jul 20, 2021 17:58
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quote:Whether you think Euron is legit or not, its all but confirmed he is about to attempt a giant ritual blood sacrifice in the hope of summoning something or gaining some power. If all this is accurate on where the story is headed how does GRRM finish ANYTHING in just 2 more books again?
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Jul 20, 2021 18:45
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Is the book of ice and fire worth it? It's "only" 23 bucks in Amazon, and I understand it's a nice coffee table book.
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Jul 20, 2021 20:21
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Mr. Nemo posted:Is the book of ice and fire worth it? I mean, even though I poke a lot of fun at it there is some interesting lore and world building in there. But when you know in the back of your head that none of it is going anywhere it just kind of feels pointless. It’s not about literally every question being answered because that’s almost always bad storytelling too, it’s that we’re gonna get nothing or next to nothing.
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Jul 20, 2021 20:34
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I got it for free and I'm not sure it was worth it.
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Jul 20, 2021 20:47
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I mean it has some pretty art and layouts but so do a lot of nerdy books, and they're not tied to a dead franchise no one respects anymore
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Jul 21, 2021 00:37
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Mr. Nemo posted:Is the book of ice and fire worth it? Aren't the people who actually put it together pretty vile? The two hardcore fans that he basically relies on b/c he doesn't care about Westeros have done some troubling things.
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Jul 21, 2021 00:54
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pseudanonymous posted:Aren't the people who actually put it together pretty vile? The two hardcore fans that he basically relies on b/c he doesn't care about Westeros have done some troubling things. Yeah they’re very racist Scandinavians.
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Jul 21, 2021 01:22
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pseudanonymous posted:Aren't the people who actually put it together pretty vile? The two hardcore fans that he basically relies on b/c he doesn't care about Westeros have done some troubling things. Yeah the whole thing is fanfic from the westeros.org or whatever nazi couple
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Jul 21, 2021 01:43
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pseudanonymous posted:Aren't the people who actually put it together pretty vile? The two hardcore fans that he basically relies on b/c he doesn't care about Westeros have done some troubling things. Just wait until you find out who writes the actual books…
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Jul 21, 2021 01:56
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:ASoIaF: they’re very racist Scandinavians.
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Jul 21, 2021 02:20
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Evil Fluffy posted:Every excerpt he's posted has been something he had written by the time ADWD released. I'm running off the assumption that he had to split the book like other people have said, and I still stand by my theory. I actually feel a little bad for him in the sense that he has to try to work that into a whole new book. I don't feel bad for him due to the fact that he's one of those writers that likes to do zany stuff like compose on a Wordstar* that's as old as I am. Someone asked if he works with an editor and I have to wonder what it's like to have to deal with his writing process in 2021 with some of the largest entertainment corporations breathing down your neck. *I don't know if he still does this, but I haven't seen anything to say he doesn't.
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Jul 21, 2021 02:39
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Coquito Ergo Sum posted:I'm running off the assumption that he had to split the book like other people have said, and I still stand by my theory. I actually feel a little bad for him in the sense that he has to try to work that into a whole new book. I don't feel bad for him due to the fact that he's one of those writers that likes to do zany stuff like compose on a Wordstar* that's as old as I am. Someone asked if he works with an editor and I have to wonder what it's like to have to deal with his writing process in 2021 with some of the largest entertainment corporations breathing down your neck. Why would you feel bad for him, he's not working anything into a whole new book. He's building castles and riding choo choo trains ffs
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Jul 21, 2021 03:17
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Coquito Ergo Sum posted:I'm running off the assumption that he had to split the book like other people have said, and I still stand by my theory. I actually feel a little bad for him in the sense that he has to try to work that into a whole new book. I don't feel bad for him due to the fact that he's one of those writers that likes to do zany stuff like compose on a Wordstar* that's as old as I am. Someone asked if he works with an editor and I have to wonder what it's like to have to deal with his writing process in 2021 with some of the largest entertainment corporations breathing down your neck. Don't worry, his editor doesn't have to deal with his writing process.
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Jul 21, 2021 05:17
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So by buying that book on Amazon you give money to GRRM, Jeff Bezos and two nazi's at the same time? That's a pretty impressive trifecta.
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Jul 21, 2021 06:36
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https://twitter.com/lukeisamazing/status/1417209496682876936
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Jul 21, 2021 12:10
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Sephyr posted:I have a funny history with the Harry Potter books. I resisted reading them out of pure "bleh, not gonna feed the hype" snobbery. Then I got really sick during a trip and my girlfriend, who loved them, bought the first three to read with me since we couldn't do anything else, just stay in the hotel room while I recovered. I thought the Harry Potter books were excellent escapism, but like, part of it is that you're escaping to a simpler children's world where none of that stuff is acknowledged or understood. Like, okay, the elves are slaves and haha, they actually love being enslaved and Hermione is being silly for wanting them to be freed because being Hogwarts slaves is what's best for them AND THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ANYTHING IN REAL LIFE ITS JUST A FUNNY WHIMSICAL THING DONT THINK ABOUT IT ANY FURTHER. Like, I watched a Rambo cartoon when I was a kid where Rambo shows up in a helicopter hovering outside the general's office window, and he's like "We're going to fight the bad guys, General, wanna come along?" and the general is like "Heck yeah!" and just hops out of his window into the helicopter and takes off. And it didn't bother to explain who requisitioned the helicopter or why this desk-bound general is immediately ready for a special ops mission or why he just leaves without telling anyone, or why they'd send a general into the field in the first place, or even why Rambo doesn't need to wear a shirt or body armor or anything -- because it's for kids and kids don't think about all that stuff. I think JKR tried to get away with that sort of warm naive obliviousness but it kinda failed once the characters (and readers) aged, and because the world is a little less willing to overlook these kinds of unfortunate metaphors in a major media property, especially now vs the 90s and early 00s. I still really like those books, but I definitely acknowledge that part of the enjoyment is to escape into that simple child's world where the general can just hop into the helicopter (and if he's a general it must mean he's a really good fighter.) Phenotype fucked around with this message at 04:13 on Jul 22, 2021 |
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Jul 22, 2021 04:09
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Phenotype posted:I think JKR tried to get away with that sort of warm naive obliviousness but it kinda failed once the characters (and readers) aged, and because the world is a little less willing to overlook these kinds of unfortunate metaphors in a major media property, especially now vs the 90s and early 00s. I have never once bought this argument. Harry Potter found immediate and strong shelf life across a huge swath of demographics and was merchandisable as gently caress. The readers didn't age, the majority of them were over 12 to start. The difference is in the attention Rowling got. Books 1 and 2 were successes that garnered her major hype. Book 3 was a big release. Book 4 was insane. I say this as someone who was there. I went to Barnes and Noble on the day of release for Book 3 because I had heard great things in my Scholastic Book Fair flyer and wanted to get in early. There was no fanfare, no lines, no shortage of product. Book 4... the midnight release had a line that wrapped through nearly every aisle of the store and I was there for 6 hours. My parents took me. The line held people of every goddamn age demo. Most of them were 16+. And it's not a coincidence that the plots of Books 1-3 are fairly constrained larks, while Book 4 is suddenly "the character's world is now the eye of a giant storm of game show bullshit" and then as noted previously here-- Books 5-7 are basically her trying to square the voice of those first three books with the Star Wars bullshit she realized she was obligated to make if she wanted that money plane to keep flying. And I won't hand it to her, because she's a bigoted sack of neoliberal poo poo, but that is still more than GRRM has objectively managed to achieve in twice that time.
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Jul 22, 2021 06:30
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:If all this is accurate on where the story is headed how does GRRM finish ANYTHING in just 2 more books again? gently caress if I know. I've just fallen down the rabbit hole of Asoiaf theory videos on Youtube and there's good stuff there that actually makes plenty of sense, it's reminding me of why I loved these books and of the fact that they will never be finished.
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Jul 23, 2021 01:15
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Mermen, unicorns and the pink letter... What can it all mean??
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Jul 23, 2021 14:41
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:If all this is accurate on where the story is headed how does GRRM finish ANYTHING in just 2 more books again? Euron summons Cthulhu which attracts the attention of the ancient space empire implied by the Preston Jacobs videos.
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Jul 27, 2021 18:04
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2 books at 3000 pages a piece.
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Jul 27, 2021 18:08
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Dany dies of dysentery in the desert, meanwhile everyone else keeps on politicking until they're eaten by ice zombies. Fitting!
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Jul 27, 2021 18:46
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Atrocious Joe posted:Euron summons Cthulhu which attracts the attention of the ancient space empire implied by the Preston Jacobs videos. There should be a crossover with DUNC, wherein the Fremen Jihad lands and wipes out westeros, and then harvests the ice zombies for their water. Strong Belwas earns their respect and becomes one of the Ibad.
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Jul 28, 2021 00:49
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ↃU∩C and Egg
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Jul 28, 2021 12:45
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The Dunk & Egg stuff is actually the only thing I sincerely want to see GRRM finish and still feel invested in. Probably because its honor has remained unbesmirched by the depravity, shame, and failure of the TV show and everything related to it. I'd be thrilled if he just abandoned Winds and gave us instead another trilogy of Dunk & Egg stories. I also find it encouraging that the third and most recent of those stories, "The Mystery Knight", is arguably the best of the three (or at least on a par with the first one) and was released around the same time as ADWD. Maybe the fourth story, if and when it ever gets released, will actually be good and not a self-indulgent mess? One can hope.
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Jul 28, 2021 18:40
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kaworu posted:The Dunk & Egg stuff is actually the only thing I sincerely want to see GRRM finish and still feel invested in. Probably because its honor has remained unbesmirched by the depravity, shame, and failure of the TV show and everything related to it. I'd be thrilled if he just abandoned Winds and gave us instead another trilogy of Dunk & Egg stories. Well I have good news on at least one of your wishes.
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Jul 28, 2021 20:07
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:If all this is accurate on where the story is headed how does GRRM finish ANYTHING in just 2 more books again? 10 books seems about right to me. There is just too much material, and if you look at some of the released chapters he is still building out new crap while Ariana or w/e is exploring some new poo poo, and you have fAegon coming out of nowhere, and some plague ravashing the world, and I don't even remember what is up with the snow, but I think winter just started? It's all loving blurred together. Watching how it all ended was incredibly disappointing. There is just no way he could in a million years provide good closure on all the loving threads he's trying to weave together.
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Jul 31, 2021 13:49
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the snow is acting weird
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Jul 31, 2021 14:01
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mind the walrus posted:My parents took me. The line held people of every goddamn age demo. Most of them were 16+. Well, you don't bring the younger kids to poo poo like that. They either went to a special release party for kids ( which my little sister did ) or you waited in line for them ( which I also did ). It also makes sense to me that as the characters aged, it would push towards more "young adult" and less "childrens". I know it made sense for my little sister as she got older to have more mature things happening. It's also entirely possible that as the series grew more successful - she became more aware of an older audience. But who knows. Has she commented on the change in tone?
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Jul 31, 2021 14:02
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He who controls the edit: hey look it's 1992 and I'm sorted for spice and wizz https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bruegaltCNU TERFherder fucked around with this message at 14:10 on Jul 31, 2021 |
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Jul 31, 2021 14:06
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The first book was released 25 years ago today. That is all.
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Aug 1, 2021 18:34
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So I've been listening to the series on audiobook after hearing tons of recommendations. A lot of people over the years have told me that the reader, Ray Dotrice, does an amazing job and I don't entirely agree. It sucks to speak ill of the dead, but while Dotrice is good at narrations and voices for older men, his comedic voices and female voices are awful. Brienne, Sam, and Daenerys all sound exactly the same. I much prefer when male audiobook readers don't try to create voices for women. His "funny" voices can be really annoying and overly drawn-out and I can't believe he got away that yellow-face voice for Missandei. Hearing an old man read out Dany's sex fantasies in the voice of a shrinking leprechaun has an unintended comedy to it, though. I will commend the sheer amount of effort he put into his work and when he's reading the right entries, he kills it.
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Aug 2, 2021 04:02
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