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ChubbyChecker posted:Nice! When was that written? 1dt ed is 1971 3st ed is 1985 (what i have)
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Sep 12, 2021 16:24
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Tulip posted:Holy poo poo   NSFW! NSFW! 
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Sep 12, 2021 16:46
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An Account of Guerilla Operations Since the Manchurian Incident when the Japanese forces attacked our key cities and lines of communications in Machuria, our patriots organized volunteer corps to conduct guerilla operations against them. People rallied to our cause. In few months, guerillas spread wide in the vast territories of Manchuria greatly harassing the enemy. As Governor Ma Chan-shan of Hei-lung-chiang Province controlled the province politically and militarily, civil-military coordination was greatly facilitated. Governor Ma's forces were built around several infantry and cavalry brigades which distinguished themselves in combat. The forces under Gen. Su Ping-wen, Gen. Ting Chao, Gen. Li Tu, Gen. Feng Chan-hai and Gen. Tang Chu-wu fought gallantly. However, lack of a tight organization and unity of command and poor coordination led to their defeat in detail by the Japanese. During the Battle of Jehol in 1933, our Generalissimo's Headquarters in Peiping directed former Governor Liu Yi-fei of Chahar Province to exercise unified command over the remaining forces of the Manchurian Volunteer Corps and participate in the operations in northern Jehol. As his forces were hastily organized, it was difficult to exercise control. Lacking a guerrilla base, bit was not possible to continue operations behind the enemy lines. When the situation grew worse, the bulk of his forces withdrew to Chahar. A portion acted on its own to withdraw to central Hopei and became undisciplined. Eventually, it disintegrated. Gen. Feng Chan-hai's unit was the only one which was reorganized into the 91st Division in advance. With the outbreak of full-scale war in 1937, our country adopted the strategy of attrition which employed guerilla operations to supplement regular operations as an important means to tie down and wear out the enemy and control the occupied area so as to prevent it from being exploited by the enemy and the puppet regime. Accordingly guerilla warfare manuals were published and guerilla cadres trained. Elements of regular force and local militia were dispatched to conduct guerilla operations. Officials in the battlefield were directed to lead the local forces against the enemy and in self-defense and not to leave their stations at will. Guided by this correct policy, the various war areas were able to control the vast areas behind the enemy lines, lead the people, and tie down and wear out the enemy so to achieve glorious combat results. Had the Chinese Communists not taken advantage of this opportunity to swallow local forces and attack guerilla forces, the effectiveness of our guerilla warfare would have been much greater and victory expedited. An account of guerilla operations in the various war areas during the first phase of the War of Resistance is stated as follows
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Sep 12, 2021 16:57
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Kinda funny that they're doing the "plane's" as plural of plane thing in that first pic, somehow I thought that that was a recent invention
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Sep 12, 2021 17:01
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Jobbo_Fett posted:An Account of Guerilla Operations a. 1st War Area Between September and October, 1937, when the 1st War Area was subjected to a pincers attack by the enemy's 1st and 2nd Corps, its main force was shifted to Shansi and a portion withdrew to the Chang River line. Col. Lu Cheng-tsao's regiment (less one battalion) which was the rear guard of the 53rd Corps was cut off by the enemy's 2nd Corps by the Hu-tuo River and remained in central Hopei to conduct guerilla operations. The 1st War Area appointed Col. Lu commander of the 1st Separate Guerilla Column and Col. Sun Kuei-yuan Western Hopei guerilla commander. Gen. Chan Yin-wu was appointed commander-in-chief of Hopei militia by the National Military Council. Meanwhile, 2 peace preservation brigades in Hopei were organized into the 181st Division by Gen. Sung Che-yuan for employment in southern Hopei, leaving a vacuum in central Hopei. So people rose in self-defense, thought they were not properly organized nor subordinated. Hence, the forces under Lu Cheng-tsao and Sun Kuei-yuan rapidly developed. Gen. Chang Yin-wu's forces were temporarily stationed in Lin-chuan with cadres undergoing training. As Gen. Chang was highly regarded in Hopei, many people rallied around him. In early November, the 1st War Area began the counterattack against the enemy along the Peiping-Hankow Railway in response to the operations of the 2nd War Area. Repeatedly, the 52nd Corps and Sun Kuei-yuan's forces conducted guerilla operations in Han-tan and Tse Hsien. At one time, they entered the enemy airfield and destroyed many enemy aircraft. In the spring of 1938, Gen. Chang Yin-wu's forces went depp into Central Hopei and defeated one enemy regiment in An-kuo and Po-yeh steadily gaining fame. On September 2, 1937, the Chinese Communists issued a declaration to meet national crisis disguising themselves as willing to take part in the War of Resistance so as to gain legal status and space for freedom of action. They dispatched party members and fellow travellers to infiltrate the ranks of our troop units, organizations, schools, and various levels of the society. Chu Jui was named the Chinese Communist liaison chief in the 1st War Area, to set up radio stations and collection intelligence information, seeking to win over Lu Cheng-tsao and attacking Gen. Chang Yin-wu. By 1938, Lu Cheng-tsao's forces turned Red when Lu was appointed Chinese Communist commander in the Central Hopei Military District. Forces under Chinese Communist Ho Lung and Liu P-cheng which had been subordinated to the 2nd War Area moved into Hopei in conjunction with Lu Cheng-tsao's forces, forcing Gen. Chang Yin-wu's forces to move south. Thus, the Chinese Communists gained superiority in Central Hopei, commandeered people's weapons, swallowed local forces and escaped the mopping up of the opponent's forces. As they conducted no real fighting, they had no achievements to speak of. The fact that they forced landlords, rich farmers and dissident elements to escape to the cities and seek asylum in the enemy occupied areas was most damaging. Between February and March, 1938, when the enemy's 14th Division attacked Tao-ching Railway, our 1st War Area ordered the 53rd Corps moving to Ling-chang and Lin Hsien, to conduct guerilla operations in conjunction with the 4th Cavalry Division, and forces under Gen. Chang Yin-wu, Gen. Sun Kuei-yuan and Gen. Li Fu-ho to defend the key localities southeast of Tai-hsing Shan in the Shansi-Hopei-Honan border area. Later, the 95th Division was ordered north to cross the Yellow River and conduct guerilla operation against the enemy along the Tao-ching Railway. Efforts were made to go beyond the road to cover the movement of supplies into the Taihang Shan area. For more than 5 years, our forces persisted in guerilla operations contributing greatly to guarding against and tying down the enemy.
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Sep 12, 2021 17:10
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Sep 12, 2021 17:13
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b. 2nd War Area Between September and October, 1937, the enemy's 5th Division and the Chahar Expeditionary Force of the Kwangtung Army attacked the Great Wall from Ping-hsing-kuan to Ju-yueh-kou in the 2nd War Area. Generalissimo Chiang ordered the 18th Army Group under Chu Teh to be subordinated to the 2nd War Area so as to facilitate the operations of the main forces in the war in maneuvering in and out of Ping-hsing-kuan and disrupting enemy's line of contact in the rear area. However, the main force of the 18th Army Group was scattered in the vast areas of the Shansi-Hopei-Chahar borders busily establishing bases and seizing areas of influence without executing its assigned missions. Thus, the enemy was able to mass forces and openly attack our primary positions. As enemy forces succeeded in breaking through Ju-yueh-kou, the war situation was affected. The 18th Army Group fabricated guerilla combat results and indulged in propaganda to deceive people at home and abroad. During the Battle of Taiyuan in October and November, our forces under Gen. Wei Li-huang and Gen. Sun Lien-chung fought for more than 20 days against the enemy in Hsinkou and Ladies' Pass, yet the main force of the 18th Army Group sat idle along the Tungpu Railway and Chengtai Railway. The 18th Army Group actively expanded its bases and made false reports on its combat results. Between February and March 1938, the main force (3 divisions) of the enemy's 1st Corps moved south from Taiyuan along the Tung-pu Railway. Another force (2 division) moved west along the Peiping-Hankow Railway via Tung-yang-kuan and Po-ai forming a converging attack on our 2nd War Area. The main force of our 2nd War Area was divided into several columns and counterattacked from Han-hou-ling, Shih-kou Chen, Wen-shui and Chiao-cheng. The heavy fighting lasted for more than 10 days, and our forces scored local victories. However, the Chinese Communist 129th Division under Liu Po-chen opened Tung-yang-kuan and made it possible for the enemy's 108th division to reach Lin-fen - a vital locality in our rear area. Thus, the situation deteriorated rapidly. The 129th Division claimed that it destroyed several hundred enemy quartermaster trucks on the road to Tung-yang-kuan.
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Sep 12, 2021 17:22
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For the people playing the home game with this book, keep in mind that every proper noun is transliterated in a really old and weird way that no one ever uses outside of a small group in Taiwan. It's like trying to read a map of the US but all the place names were phonetically transcribed by a really weird French dude who made up his own little system for it. Basically if the map looks hard to read to you, that's why.
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Sep 12, 2021 17:22
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c. 5th War Area In the latter part of December, 1937, the enemy's 2nd Corps moved south to cross the Yellow River, took Tsi-nan and Tsing-tao continued its advance to the south. Mayor Shen Hung-lieh of Tsingtao was ordered to take the marines and local militia to Chu-cheng and Yi-shui where they would wage guerilla warfare. Later, the joined force with Gen. Pang Pin-hsun's 3rd Corps to recover Meng-yin and defend the cities in southeastern Shantung. In January, 1938, the main force of the enemy's 5th Division moved south along the Chiaochow-Tsinan Railway. Our guerilla commander Liu Chen-tung who led his forces in defense of Yi-shui was killed in action. During the enemy invasion of Lin-yi when enemy forces fought bitterly against the forces of Gen. Chang Tze-chung and Gen. Pang Pin-hsun, our guerillas raided the enemy rear areas, tied down enemy forces and harassed the enemy supply lines contributing greatly to our victories in the initial operations at Lin-yi. As the enemy was forced to abandon teh Wei-tai Highway supply line and switched to Chufu-Szeshui Road the vast areas in southeastern Shantung, particularly Yi-meng Shan region and the mountainous region northwest of Jih-chao became excellent guerilla bases and were maintained for 6 years. Between April and May, 1938 and during the Battle of Hsu-chow, Gen. Han Teh-chin's 24th Army Group of the 5th War Area defended northern Kiangsu and eastern Anhwei against the nortward advance of the enemy along the Grand Canal and Tung-hai Highway and repeatedly conducted guerilla operations against the enemy in the southern sector of the Tientsin-Pukow Railway to tie down the enemy and relieve the threat to the flanks of the main force in the 5th War Area, contributing greatly to our victory in the Battle of Tai-erh-chuang. During our withdrawal from Hsuchow, they assisted the 51st Corps to cross the Huai River via Wuho and fall back to western Anhwei. In the latter part of April, Generalissimo Chiang ordered the 69th Corps to advance to Lin-yi from the east of Tan-cheng to attack the enemy. Upon termination of the Battle of Hsuchow, these forces were left in southern Shantung to continue the guerilla operations. Later, the 57th Corps of the 24th Army Group was moved from northern Kiangsu to southern Shantung in order to reinforce the guerilla forces there. When Shen Hung-lieh was appointed governor of Shantung, he directed the administrative commissioners in the various districts to lead the local militia in defense against the enemy. Thus, guerilla operations spread throughout the province. In particular, Administrative Commissioner Fan Chu-hsien was most outstanding in defending the neighboring hsiens of Tung-chang (Liao-cheng) against the enemy. Although Commissioner Fan was later killed in action, his outfit killed more enemy troops.
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Sep 12, 2021 17:36
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d. 3rd War Area In December, 1937 after invading the Nanking-Shanghai-Hangchow triangular area, the enemy's Central China Front Army assumed the defensive. It began to construct defense works of the first line along Hangchow, Fu-yang, Yu-hang, Wu-hsing, Chang-hsing, Hsuan-cheng and Wu-hu. Another force operated in the vicinity of Chu Hsien and Chiang-tu. Two divisions and a column were redeployed to North China. In conjunction with the 5th War Area, our 3rd War Area conducted guerilla operations in the enemy's rear areas by raiding small enemy units and lines of communications, impeding their transportation and supply, and harassing them. In the latter part of January, 1938, the enemy's 13th Division attacked Pang-pu from Chu Hsien. Our 3rd War Area ordered the 10th Army Group to conduct guerilla operations between Hangchow and Tail Lake, the 19th Army Group between Hsuan-cheng and Nanking, and the 23rd Army Group between Wu-hu and Kuei-chih. Between February and March, many battles were fought resulting in heavy losses and destruction of the enemy. For a time, Fu-yang, Hai-ning, Hai-yen, An-chi, Li-yang, Yi-hsing, Tang-tu and Hsuan-cheng were recovered and Hangchow was entered. In mid-March, the enemy began to mass his forces from the vicinity of Chin-tan, Wu-hsi, Chang-hsing, Hangchow and Ning-kuo for a 5-pronged attack on Kiangsu-Chekian-Anhwei border areas. Highly mobile, our forces avoided the enemy's main strength and tangled with the enemy. By mid-April, the enemy was greatly exhausted and halted the attack. Holding the enemy's main strength, and making it not possible for the enemy to pull forces for commitment in the Battle of Hsuchow was the key factor which contributed to our victory in the Battle of Tai-erh-chuang and subsequent breakout of our fores. In the spring of 1938, our Government reorganized 5,000 Chinese Communist remnants in Kiangsi, Fukien and the border area of Hupei and Anhwei into the New 4th Corps which commanded 4 columns. Subordinated to the 3rd War Area, it was stationed in Tung-ling, Fan-chang, Nan-ling and Ching Hsien in southern Anhwei. IT was directed to conduct guerilla operations in Kiangsu and Anhwei south of the Yangtze River. In order to facilitate its operations, the Government designated the area between Tung-ling and Fan-chang for it to garrison. Yet it made use of the slogan of "national united front against Japan" by deceiving youts, expanding its organizations, threatening the able-bodied males and developing rebellious forces. It scored no achievement insofar as operations against the Japanese were concerned. Between June and October, 1938, the Battle of Wuhan took place. Our 3rd War Area organized pack howitzers and anti-tank guns accompanied by necessary infantry and engineers into several mobile artillery detachments. These detachments advanced ot the bank of the Yangtze River in southern Anhwei and sank or damaged many enemy ships and craft. Furthermore, they tied down the enemy's 116th Division along the Yangtze River and impeded enemy shipping contributing immensely to the Battle of Wuhan. When the Battle of Wuhan was in progress, the enemy General Headquarters was aware that their forces were being bogged down in the interior of China. Despite the employment of the main strength of their field forces totalling 30 divisions (excluding the Kwantung Army), they were only able to occupy major cities and a 10km narrow corridor along their lines of communications, while our guerilla forces possessed the vast areas surrounding and harassing them. Besides, the bulk of our forces which was intact could not be conquered by force. Meanwhile, the international situation turned more and more unfavorable to the enemy. After the Battle of Wuhan, the enemy halted the offensive and switched to sustained operations. Already the enemy lost confidence in victory through strategy of annihilation. Fin
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Sep 12, 2021 17:52
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Considering watching Valley of Tears (the newish HBO series), am I walking into a huge rear end propaganda spiel? It looks neat, but I can't shake the feeling that it's going to present some very skewed stories of the YK war.
Tias fucked around with this message at 18:11 on Sep 12, 2021 |
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Sep 12, 2021 18:01
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Yeah the trailer for that put me off entirely
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Sep 12, 2021 19:00
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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Tias posted:Considering watching Valley of Tears (the newish HBO series), am I walking into a huge rear end propaganda spiel? It looks neat, but I can't shake the feeling that it's going to present some very skewed stories of the YK war. I watched it in Hebrew with english subtitles. I would not describe it as a propaganda spiel, it’s a pretty gut wrenching war story where it shows a lot of suffering and israeli incompetence, often saved only by larger incompetence in the hostile end. It’s main characters are also ethnic minorities who are victimized by the israeli state and it shows it. I liked it. Got Pacific vibes. Vahakyla fucked around with this message at 19:04 on Sep 12, 2021 |
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Sep 12, 2021 19:02
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Satunnaista sotilashistoriaa did a video on Finnish navy submarine Vesikko, originally intended to be Kriegsmarine's CV-707 but when France and UK found out that Germany was skirting Versailles limitations, Finland bought it for itself. This was only a 250t displacement ship, compare that to Type VII's 769 tons or Gato's 1549 tons and you'll realize that it was a small, cramped, claustrophoby inducing dealio and this video really shows it. That being said, it still was one of the most advanced submarines of its time in 1933, using all the knowledge of submarine design that Germans had at the time and ultimately led to the Type II class. If you ever go to Helsinki you should experience it yourself. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2MISpCg2SI Nenonen fucked around with this message at 19:20 on Sep 12, 2021 |
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Sep 12, 2021 19:16
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Vahakyla posted:I watched it in Hebrew with english subtitles. 1 episode in now. I get that Marco and Alush are supposed to be the oppressed minorities, but I fear that we're getting kind of a unity edit where their shared bloodshed in defense of Israel makes them feel like patriots - and while that may make for a good story, IRL these veterans would go right back to being even more oppressed in the years to follow the war than the ones before.
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Sep 12, 2021 20:37
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Jobbo_Fett posted:1dt ed is 1971 
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Sep 12, 2021 21:28
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Wow, thanks! This was a hell of a lot of good stuff to read.Jobbo_Fett posted:In the spring of 1938, our Government reorganized 5,000 Chinese Communist remnants in Kiangsi, Fukien and the border area of Hupei and Anhwei into the New 4th Corps which commanded 4 columns. Subordinated to the 3rd War Area, it was stationed in Tung-ling, Fan-chang, Nan-ling and Ching Hsien in southern Anhwei. IT was directed to conduct guerilla operations in Kiangsu and Anhwei south of the Yangtze River. In order to facilitate its operations, the Government designated the area between Tung-ling and Fan-chang for it to garrison. Yet it made use of the slogan of "national united front against Japan" by deceiving youts, expanding its organizations, threatening the able-bodied males and developing rebellious forces. It scored no achievement insofar as operations against the Japanese were concerned. Now there's a citation if you want to start a goddamn fight.
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Sep 12, 2021 23:01
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Nebakenezzer posted:Mr. Trin: do you know of any good books on the WW1 Zeppelin flight to Africa? I'm also looking for good books about LTA flight in WW1 generally, but focusing on ze Germans, don't know if you know of any. Yup. IIRC, It's more of a memoir than a grand history - decent writing compared to most WW2 memoirs though (british WW2 memoirs were somewhat overrepresented in the Australian library system in the 70s for some reason that was not-at-all colonialist I'm sure). I suspect the supression was more of the UK immediate post-ww2 paranoria than anything meaningful because I don't recall learning anything startling from it.
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Sep 13, 2021 02:36
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Tias posted:1 episode in now. I get that Marco and Alush are supposed to be the oppressed minorities, but I fear that we're getting kind of a unity edit where their shared bloodshed in defense of Israel makes them feel like patriots - and while that may make for a good story, IRL these veterans would go right back to being even more oppressed in the years to follow the war than the ones before. There’s no unity, no victory, and there’s no resolution to anything. The area they fight in the show is well documented in Wikipedia and the show stays fairly historical. With that You can spoiler yourself. The valley has a name after all. Israeli cinema is also different from US style war stories. Vahakyla fucked around with this message at 03:39 on Sep 13, 2021 |
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Sep 13, 2021 03:36
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Vahakyla posted:There’s no unity, no victory, and there’s no resolution to anything. The area they fight in the show is well documented in Wikipedia and the show stays fairly historical. With that You can spoiler yourself. The valley has a name after all. i remember liking this film: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebanon_(2009_film) how does it stand up to the thread's tankers?
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Sep 13, 2021 09:56
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https://www.tankarchives.ca/2021/09/armoured-confusion-mid-war.html Also, one of my English language articles: Sherman tanks at Kursk Big articles queue: IS-2 post-war modifications, Myths of Soviet tank building: end of the Great Patriotic War, Medium Tank T6, RPG-1, Lahti L-39, American tank building plans post-war, German tanks for 1946, HMC M7 Priest, GMC M12, GMC M40/M43, ISU-152, AMR 35 ZT, Soviet post-war tank building plans, T-100Y and SU-14-1, Object 430, Pz.Kpfw.35(t), T-60 tanks in combat, SU-76M modernizations, Panhard 178, 15 cm sFH 13/1 (Sf), 43M Zrínyi, Medium Tank M46, Modernization of the M48 to the M60 standard, German tank building trends at the end of WW2, Pz.Kpfw.III/IV, E-50 and E-75 development, Pre-war and early war British tank building, BT-7M/A-8 trials, Jagdtiger suspension, Light Tank T37, Light Tank T41, T-26-6 (SU-26), Voroshilovets tractor trials, Israeli armour 1948–1982, T-64's composite armour, Evolution of German tank observation devices, Oerlikon and Solothurn anti-tank rifles Available for request (others' articles):  Shashmurin's career T-55 underwater driving equipment T-34 tanks with M-17 engines ISU-152 Wartime and post-war anti-tank hand grenades  King Tigers in Hungary NEW German King Tiger losses in December of 1944 in Hungary Small articles queue: Soviet tank camouflage, AA machine guns on tanks, IS-3 pike nose Small articles available: linked because the list is too long New small articles: Pz.Kpfw.IV Ausf.G from Patriot Park Brief history of Soviet tank forces LT vz. 38 Applique armour for BT-7 tanks Pz.Kpfw.IV Ausf.B Ensign Expendable fucked around with this message at 14:40 on Sep 13, 2021 |
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Sep 13, 2021 14:18
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Tias posted:Considering watching Valley of Tears (the newish HBO series), am I walking into a huge rear end propaganda spiel? It looks neat, but I can't shake the feeling that it's going to present some very skewed stories of the YK war. It's - decent? The first episode is pretty good. One of the main characters is with the Black Panthers and in trouble with the police, which is a bit unexpected. There are also some tank combat scenes which look like they were written and directed by someone who has actually seen a tank outside of video games, which is a refreshing change. After that things go downhill. The main characters Forrest Gump their way through the war and things become increasingly implausible. There are a few good moments along the way, but by the end you just want it to be over. Edit: And the tank battle at the end is just BAD. Watch the first episode. If you really liked it, stick with it - otherwise, that's enough. Cessna fucked around with this message at 15:34 on Sep 13, 2021 |
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Sep 13, 2021 15:11
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How bad is the tank battle? Because the wikipedia summary implies there were several moments where the tank combatants were practically knife fighting, which I can see looking ridiculous on screen. e\/ it was night and they didn't have night vision. Apparently some engagements were at >100m/ Alchenar fucked around with this message at 16:31 on Sep 13, 2021 |
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Sep 13, 2021 16:23
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What’s the distance for a metaphorical knife fight between tanks? From total ignorance I’d guess it’s still dozens of yards, but that’s a total shot in the dark attempt at what it’s even measured in. Although the image of two tanks slapping each other with their guns like giraffes is very funny.
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Sep 13, 2021 16:27
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Alchenar posted:How bad is the tank battle? Because the wikipedia summary implies there were several moments where the tank combatants were practically knife fighting, which I can see looking ridiculous on screen. It heavily plays up the "Arab tanks fight buttoned up and blunder into battle blindly while Israeli TCs stick their heads out and maintain situational awareness" aspect. This is, VERY broadly speaking, true - this was a "lesson learned" from the war that was widely reported, but it was very clumsily done in the show. ("Heroic Israeli main character comes up with One Simple Trick to Fight T-55s!)(Egyptians hate this!) It all seemed very hokey and staged to me. The show also omits the equally glaring tactical errors the Israelis made; it doesn't show Israeli M-60A1s trying to charge Sagger/ATGM batteries. It also doesn't show the very well planned and executed initial Egyptian attack across the Suez. This is in part due to what the show covers; because the focus is on the northern front against Syria the battles around the Suez and Sinai are only indirectly mentioned. But because of this you don't see a lot of Israel's mistakes. This isn't to say that the show is completely biased and shows the Israelis as flawless heroes; they most assuredly aren't, and a lot of their mistakes and hubris are candidly shown. It's just - well, don't expect full coverage of the war.
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Sep 13, 2021 16:52
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Just read a story about a irl Nazi tank commander who did that and got shot
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Sep 13, 2021 17:12
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aphid_licker posted:Just read a story about a irl Nazi tank commander who did that and got shot Them's the breaks. Your overall chances of survival are drastically improved if you keep your head out, but it does result in dead TCs.
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Sep 13, 2021 17:15
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It's pretty dangerous, but at the same time improves your visibility (and the chances of survival of the whole tank) a lot. Soviet manuals told you to button down if you're getting shot at, look out and look around if you lost your bearings. If you're an absolute mad lad, you can also stand on your engine deck to correct fire, you're guaranteed a Hero of the Soviet Union gold star posthumously. The British also write about this a lot, specifically requesting hatch flaps that don't obscure your vision when open.
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Sep 13, 2021 17:22
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Ensign Expendable posted:It's pretty dangerous, but at the same time improves your visibility (and the chances of survival of the whole tank) a lot. Soviet manuals told you to button down if you're getting shot at, look out and look around if you lost your bearings. If you're an absolute mad lad, you can also stand on your engine deck to correct fire, you're guaranteed a Hero of the Soviet Union gold star posthumously. Did anyone ever design an extra-heavy helmet for tank commanders? Seems like you could add more protection if you're not going to be running around with it, especially if you could take it off when you weren't sticking your head out.
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Sep 13, 2021 18:43
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thekeeshman posted:Did anyone ever design an extra-heavy helmet for tank commanders? Seems like you could add more protection if you're not going to be running around with it, especially if you could take it off when you weren't sticking your head out.
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Sep 13, 2021 18:50
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Xiahou Dun posted:What’s the distance for a metaphorical knife fight between tanks? WWII had at least 50 cases of tank ramming , usually leaving both tanks inoperable. Tanks were effective at crushing light vehicles and airplanes. One guy got Hero of the Soviet Union for derailing an armoured train by ramming it in a T-34.
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Sep 13, 2021 18:55
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Reminds me of a passage from a Russian Tank Commander where he had his head poked out, scanning around for targets in a town/city(?) when suddenly he was hit in the head and passed out. When he finally came too he was told that a grenade hit him square in the face, and was deflected away to explode harmlessly outside.
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Sep 13, 2021 18:59
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Gosh that sounds so easy to fix just give the commander a protective cover from all sides so they can look out without having to leave the bank
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Sep 13, 2021 19:01
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Most TCs were/are killed by: - heavier rounds which the thickest helmet won't stop. - random stray rounds or fragmentation, which would require such heavy personal armor as to be impractical. (A helmet won't do much if you're hit in the neck.) TCs in my day would wear a flak jacket and a comm helmet. The comm helmet was/is useless for protection, so you might swap in a regular infantry helmet if you're feeling exposed and talk through a hand-held mike. And if you're taking small arms fire or fragmentation you button up once things start flying around. I'd also be pretty leery of wearing very heavy or bulky armor inside an AFV; that might keep you from bailing out quickly if there's a fire.
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Sep 13, 2021 19:01
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Argas posted:Gosh that sounds so easy to fix just give the commander a protective cover from all sides so they can look out without having to leave the bank Done:  But it's not as good as sticking your head out.
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Sep 13, 2021 19:03
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Tank commanders wearing weird armored diving bell things. Tanks with little bullet-proof cubbies on top like the Pope-mobile.
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Sep 13, 2021 19:13
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I'm no expert, but it seems like wearing a heavy helmet on your head in a vehicle that is not renowned for a smooth ride would be a shortcut to a broken neck.
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Sep 13, 2021 19:13
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thekeeshman posted:Did anyone ever design an extra-heavy helmet for tank commanders? Seems like you could add more protection if you're not going to be running around with it, especially if you could take it off when you weren't sticking your head out. There were sniper shields developed in the field that go on top of your cupola, kind of like a box with one face open that can rotate to look around. The problem with that is now you have a fairly small opening to escape from if your tank catches fire.
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Sep 13, 2021 19:27
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didn't soviet tankers wear basically soft bump cap looking things because the main mode of head injury was bashing your head against something inside the turret?
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Sep 13, 2021 19:27
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| # ? May 30, 2024 02:42 |
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:didn't soviet tankers wear basically soft bump cap looking things because the main mode of head injury was bashing your head against something inside the turret? Everyone had those.
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Sep 13, 2021 19:32
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