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I just had the conversation with my partner because she was stressing about what to get me for our upcoming anniversary. Basically "my parents used gift giving as a substitute for emotional and psychological support. They'd buy me $500 worth of presents and then go back to ignoring me satisfied they'd purchased the right to keep calling themselves good parents for a few more months. Receiving gifts is literally meaningless to me at this point and I'd rather you do something small to show you care than blow your budget on something expensive".
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Oct 6, 2021 15:44
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Gift-giving with my mom always followed this pattern: 1. I beg her not to give me clothes, she says, "Okay, I promise." 2. She gives me clothes. 3. I don't like the clothes. 4. She is sooooooo hurrrrrt, you guys! Big, tear-filled puppy-dog eyes, whispers of, "But I thought you would like this. *trembling sigh* I guess I can take it back." Sad pouting and cold shoulder for hours. The rest of the holiday has a pall cast over it. 5. I feel like absolute poo poo for being so ungrateful and mean to my mom, who just wanted to make me happy, you know?! But also I'm secretly angry at her for not listening to me, for putting me in the position to hurt her over and over again, always leaving her the victim. (I wouldn't be conscious of that anger until I was in my 20s.) But it gets weirder than that. When I was a teenager, my mom was always on my case about dressing "provocatively" -- meanwhile, I was asexual, terrified of sex, went to an all-girls Catholic school, literally knew no boys besides my brother and cousins (all younger than me), and catcalls from men would leave me crying and feeling disgusted for days. I was also 15 pounds overweight and thought I was hideous and disgusting, so I dressed in baggy shirts, sweaters, and jeans like a boy. But still, my mom would give me *looks* and comments if I wore a shirt with an open collar a couple inches below my neck, showing no cleavage, and I would feel horrible and change. Except her birthday and Christmas presents to me were usually "provocative" clothes that I would never wear. One gift of note was a fitted burgundy velvet blouse (this was the 1990s), short waist length with a very deep v-neck collar with loose corset lacing that would have left cleavage and skin visible almost down to my belly button. It was classier than club wear, but it was maybe something an adult woman very comfortable with her body would wear to a New Year's Eve party, and there I was: a dorky teenager who felt humiliated if I showed any skin or any contour of my body. And ordinarily if my mom saw me wear this, she would have LOST her poo poo, yet she's the one who gave it to me. (I can still feel my throat tighten with anxiety when I think about this shirt 25 years later.) So the gift wasn't just, "Here's a shirt I don't like and isn't my style, but I can find a way to wear it...maybe under a sweater." It was something I couldn't possibly wear, because it would have pushed me into a sexuality I was terrified of and I would be punished for. I cried when I unwrapped that present. I still don't understand her thought process behind giving it to me. I don't understand how she could be in a clothing store, see this blouse hanging on a rack, and think, "There it is, the gift I will give my daughter (never mind that she asked me not to give her clothes, never mind that this will leave her chest and bra exposed, never mind that there is no occasion where it would be appropriate for a teenager to wear this, never mind that she doesn't even have any other clothes to make an outfit out of this, because she never wears clothes like this, because she's ashamed of her body, because I constantly shame her for being fat and for showing any skin). Yes, this is the one!" If she had only loving listened to me and chosen to give me not clothes but something I had asked for, she would have watched me unwrap it and smile and thank her with joy and enthusiasm, and she would have felt that wonderful feeling you get when you give someone a present and they love it. Instead, she chose to make both of us feel horrible. And she would do this every birthday and Christmas, until she died when I was 33.  Edit: I've got to stop reading this thread at work. Rabbit Hill fucked around with this message at 16:23 on Oct 6, 2021 |
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Oct 6, 2021 16:18
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Rabbit Hill posted:Gift-giving with my mom always followed this pattern: sounds like she did listen to you and used that information to torture you
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Oct 6, 2021 17:07
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Rutibex posted:sounds like she did listen to you and used that information to torture you Because drinking in a person's emotions as they suffer based on your actions is such a rush. They'll go chasing that tiger forever and don't you dare flinch. Not directly related except a good prism for understanding attachment, things made more sense when I read about the Harlow rhesus monkeys. Xlorp fucked around with this message at 19:20 on Oct 6, 2021 |
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Oct 6, 2021 17:21
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that's really hosed up. sorry your mom sucked. sorry so many of our parents sucked. hosed up how common "i will take the concept of giving things to others and make it a problem for all of us" seems to be. i'm glad we have this thread to hopefully get some of this stuff out in, though.
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Oct 6, 2021 17:51
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Ghostnuke posted:double posting because I just remembered another one - My parents both have this weird thing about pets, like they just don't really believe that animals have comforts or wants or desires and they don't understand that "good enough for them to survive" isn't enough. My mom always insisted on having a big dog around because she was terrified that the moment she was home alone (she almost never was - my dad worked from home and lever left without her) without a dog, all of the criminals in the world would know it and immediately break in and steal everything inside. Side note: as far as I am aware my mom has never been the victim of a crime in her entire life except for one time when the car was stolen out of the driveway. So she always insisted on having a dog around for "security" but she treated it just like that, like a security system. She never pet it, never walked it, didn't talk to it unless she was mad at it, never played with it, and she loved "pranking" a dog by doing things like making a big obvious show of eating food right in the dog's face and then not giving it anything, or doing this exact kind of thing to them on christmas. From what I can tell, she just literally did not comprehend that pets are more than an amusement/security system. My brother and I always got stuck with doing all of the 'dog chores' like walking, playing, hanging out with the dogs, being friends with the dogs etc despite not wanting to. Not because we were told to, but because if we didn't these dogs just laid around sad and moping all the time and we felt awful. Since the dog was a security system for her, she also encouraged it to bark as loudly and violently as it could any time someone was in front of the house - unless she just happened to not want it to, in which case she would scream things like "loving STOP IT OR I WILL loving KILL YOU" as loud as she possibly could, or choke it with its collar. I remember one time when my cat wasn't eating and I got very worried about him, because we spend all day together and I'm very attached. She berated me for taking him to a vet. She said "Cats just aren't worth taking to vets." and "I've never known anyone who takes their cat to the vet." I didn't know how to respond but I was very hurt and disgusted, which she noticed, and she tried to console me by saying "Next time you think about taking your cat to a vet call me, I'll look up the cheapest vet in town to make sure you don't waste your money". She would also "prank" the cat by throwing a stuffed mouse at him and then pretending it wasn't her and stuff like that. She also berated me for things like not feeding him the cheapest available food (which he refused to eat) or for having multiple litterboxes - basically anything "extra" that I did for his comfort and to make him happy was something she would tell me was a waste of time and resources. Anyway the point that I'm getting at is that she viewed animals as existing purely for their utility and her amusement, if they weren't amusing her or doing their job then she would do things like kick them as she walked by (not like, a wound-up kick, but just kind of intentionally shuffling straight into them as she walked down a hallway and then saying "Oh! I guess that's why you shouldn't lay right there!"). As far as she was concerned they did not have feelings that could be hurt, and there was no difference to them between eating a delicious meal and eating murky weird poo poo from a $0.15 can of food. Lo and behold as I reached my 30s and started to finally figure her out and recognize all of this poo poo as awful, I start to realize that almost everything she did to her children makes perfect sense if I assume that she saw us as no different from animals. She generally did the bare minimum to help us survive and to make sure outside observers wouldn't think anything was wrong, but as long as we had food in our bellies and clothes on our back she had no problem getting malicious or neglectful with us if we weren't amusing her or being useful. So that's what I see the gift/prank thing as - it's parents who don't comprehend that their children have complex internal lives and feelings and wants and desires and needs. The kid is their property and it's there for their amusement and to do the jobs it's told to do, and they just literally do not fathom that there's more to them then that. So they think "this prank will be funny to me, lol" but they completely lack the conscious that tells them "but it would be at the expense of another living thing" because in their mind they are the only entity special enough to have thoughts and desires. My dad was the same way. When we were very little he used to 'tickle' us, which to him meant jamming his fingers super-hard into our ribs and stomachs over and over. It was painful and we would scream while he did it, which he would laugh at and assume was a squeal of joy or something. It just never even occurred to him that something that was amusing to him could possibly not be amusing for the entire world. To his credit he at least stopped doing terrible poo poo to us after a neighbor called them out and after that point only served to enable my mom - he just sat in his office 24/7 on his computer after that and never interacted with any of us except around meal time. edit: Re-reading this made me realize that she disguised a lot of her intentional abuse as clumsiness or forgetfulness and then blaming others for not working around her clumsiness or forgetfulness 
deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 18:45 on Oct 6, 2021 |
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Oct 6, 2021 18:12
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deep dish peat moss posted:She never pet it, never walked it, didn't talk to it unless she was mad at it, never played with it, and she loved "pranking" a dog by doing things like making a big obvious show of eating food right in the dog's face and then not giving it anything, or doing this exact kind of thing to them on christmas. she did comprehend that the dog had an inner experience. she taunted the dog. you wouldn't taunt a security system because it would be pointless. the only reason to be cruel is if you understand the other creature is experiencing something
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Oct 6, 2021 19:04
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Something I put together a few years back. Both my father and my husband's father were champion sulkers. My father would get furious and stalk around the house looking for things to be mad at. My husband's father just radiated anger in all directions, at least as an adult. When my husband and I quarrel, we do it in low, tense tones. My husband claims that he is never angry at me. (He is sometimes angry at me.) He also is incapable of asking for things he wants, so I have developed ways to ask him three or four different ways to find out what he wants/needs. I do a lot of mind-reading. e: To be clear, he isn't abusive. He is totally repressed when it comes to expressing his own needs. I'm pretty sure we didn't pass either of those on to the next generation. We did a lot of "I know you are mad at me, it is okay to be mad at me, it is not okay to do X." And I never demanded that anybody "put a pleasant look on your face".
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Oct 6, 2021 19:12
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Arsenic Lupin posted:Something I put together a few years back. Both my father and my husband's father were champion sulkers. My father would get furious and stalk around the house looking for things to be mad at. My husband's father just radiated anger in all directions, at least as an adult. It's a relief to know this can be done even if it's hard and takes a lot of work. Sometimes I get intimidated about raising my own child and not causing the pain my and my husband's parents did but then I am relieved to hear from people who managed to break those chains. It also helps me confirm that my instincts in how to talk these things out is good, which is also a relief.
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Oct 6, 2021 19:19
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Your mind is hell. Going beyond your mind is heaven. Go beyond the mind. That is the essence of the whole teaching of all the awakened ones. Osho, Bodhidharma: The Greatest Zen Master, Ch 11 (excerpt)
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Oct 6, 2021 19:22
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hallo spacedog posted:It's a relief to know this can be done even if it's hard and takes a lot of work. Sometimes I get intimidated about raising my own child and not causing the pain my and my husband's parents did but then I am relieved to hear from people who managed to break those chains. It also helps me confirm that my instincts in how to talk these things out is good, which is also a relief.
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Oct 6, 2021 19:28
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I hadn't realised until I got with my boyfriend, just how relaxed a relationship could be. He doesn't shout at me about washing the dishes or whatever, I don't shout at him for, well, anything. If we have problems we just talk about it, and literally the only time I've ever shouted at him was when I fell of my bike while riding it for the first time. He'd briefly lost the dog and then startled me by grabbing me, and I didn't know how to stop or deal with that, and fell over sideways. I instantly burst into tears, we found the dog, talked about it, and I still feel bad about hurting him months later. Got some wicked bruises out of the fall though! I didn't think my mum was abusive, but she said she herself said that she thought she was a psychopath and incapable of deep emotional bonds. We fought a lot when I was a teenager+, I would shout and slam doors and occasionally she'd pin me against the wall and throttle me like homer in the simpsons, I think she may have slapped me a couple of times? It really wasn't a great time for either of us. If I accidently bumped into her during one of the fights she'd accuse me of doing it on purpose to hurt her and refuse to believe otherwise. She'd accuse me of lying when I pretty much never did. If she made dinner, which she couldn't do later in life, and I didn't thank her for it, she'd get all huffy about how she wasn't appreciated, and I think it annoys my boyfriend slightly how I always thank him like 3 times for making dinner. She didn't want cards or presents and didn't believe in mothers day, but also bought it up weeks later in a fight the one time I didn't get her something. When I bought cards, I'd have to spend a while looking for one that didn't say "Worlds Best Mum" on the front, because it just felt disingenuous. We never said "I love you" and I'm pretty sure I never got any hugs past the age of 8 or so, and wouldn't have accepted them if offered. I guess the big thing is I cry when I'm angry or upset. I have no control over it and it's incredibly frustrating, and she'd mock me for that, which didn't exactly help. Telling me what a cow and how weak I was to cry over nothing, and I don't even know. If I tried to remove myself from the situation, that was "sulking". Being able to cry with my partner now and not being mocked for it is strange and I love him for it so much. He doesn't even make fun of me for crying because I haven't eaten in a while and it's making me sad! All that said, she died a few years ago, and I still miss being able to talk about films with her, or see her reactions to weird links or videos or politics. She never pushed me to be girly or do anything I didn't want to do and was generally supportive in that regard. She was a "to the far left of trotsky", bisexual, feminist, nurse, camera operator and artist, and a cool and interesting person to talk to, but not a great mother. When she died it was over Christmas, and I'd bought her present with me to the hospital, a book of Victorian post-mortem photography. The irony of it would have made her laugh. It would have been her birthday on the 2nd. I love my partner, and life is better now. https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/48419/this-be-the-verse
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Oct 6, 2021 20:11
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Bringing this over from the reddit relationships thread because, Jesus. AITA for bringing sources to my disagreement with my daughters gf? quote:I think the title is confusing but I couldn't think of a better one. I made a reddit account to get judgement for this issue. Daughter's gf replied: quote:hello reddit and also my fmil, i guess. this is my side if you are interested. the tldr is that it was a joke about "tight chink pussy" and the mural was the rising sun. we are staying NC but now have an interesting story to tell at zoom parties, I guess.
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Oct 6, 2021 21:09
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HO-LEEEE poo poo I think that might be the thread winner
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Oct 6, 2021 21:12
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...and THIS is the sort of thing lurking behind those "missing details" from the stories on those estranged parents forums. 
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Oct 6, 2021 21:38
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AceOfFlames posted:...and THIS is the sort of thing lurking behind those "missing details" from the stories on those estranged parents forums. Absolutely. The "He explained that there is tension between the two cultures and propaganda has affected M to misunderstand a historical event" had to be something major, and it did not disappoint.
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Oct 6, 2021 22:08
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just happened to be one of the worst things in human history
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Oct 6, 2021 23:34
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Wow. WOW. Also I cannot fathom how making someone you allegedly love cry just so you can laugh at them could ever be considered okay. It makes my skin crawl and my heart break just thinking about it. I could NEVER do that, especially to a child on Christmas, or their birthday???? What the gently caress.
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Oct 6, 2021 23:38
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Yeah tricking your kid is a bad idea even when you're trying to give them better than they expected, because kids aren't always predictable and might want to visit a broccoli farm more than the circus. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7yMZGA2lzg a good parent can recover from that type of mistake https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hswdDZgcwHA
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Oct 6, 2021 23:43
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AceOfFlames posted:...and THIS is the sort of thing lurking behind those "missing details" from the stories on those estranged parents forums. Abso-loving-lutely. Jesus christ.  "There is tension between the two cultures and propaganda has affected M to misunderstand a historical event" oh you absolute condescending rear end. Just a "misunderstanding" when a foreign army invades your home and murders your family
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Oct 7, 2021 00:14
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The MIL in that story is lucky that her daughter is even giving her the option to remain in some kind of a relationship with her. It's far more than her racist lovely arse deserves.
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Oct 7, 2021 00:43
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Light Gun Man posted:sorry so many of our parents sucked. hosed up how common "i will take the concept of giving things to others and make it a problem for all of us" seems to be. i'm glad we have this thread to hopefully get some of this stuff out in, though.  I'm glad this thread is here. It's honestly crazy how many people have parents like this.My mom used to call me to describe lavish, multi-course (like, tasting menu level, Michelin star) restaurant meals she'd eaten recently over the phone to me while I was on food stamps, and got mad when I didn't really want to hear it. She said she was doing it to be "helpful" because I was writing a fiction book about restaurants at the time.
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Oct 7, 2021 00:59
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Rabbit Hill posted:Gift-giving with my mom always followed this pattern: This sounds very similar to my parents. It's MY fault if I don't like the present they gave me, (you use clothes in your example, so lets say a red T shirt). Even though I never said I like red T shirts, in fact have spent years loudly telling anyone who would listen how much I hate the colour red. Despite the fact that I have never worn T-Shirts of that style ever in my entire life, and have often commented on how uncomfortable I find them. Even though my closet is overflowing with other T-Shirts that I can't get around to wearing the ones I have and another T-Shirt would be a burden. Despite all of this it is MY fault, and they get to act hurt and betrayed, which makes me feel worse for hurting and betraying them when all they did was give me a gift. So I wear it once around them, (to show them I appreciate it, and that I am in fact a good and grateful son), so for the rest of my life all I ever see from them are red T shirts. And am constantly reminded of the day in September 1993 when I wore it around them as proof that I love it and it is my favourite thing in the world ever, (thus making them good parents for giving it to me.) It doesn't have to be a Red T Shirt, I am just using that as an example. You can substitute that for anything they have ever performatively given me.
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Oct 7, 2021 01:24
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Ghostnuke posted:double posting because I just remembered another one - It's just so dumb, give up an easy win as a parent (get your kid The Gift they wanted) and instead make some stupid joke to make them upset, just to exercise more power over them.
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Oct 7, 2021 01:39
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Picnic Princess posted:Also I cannot fathom how making someone you allegedly love cry just so you can laugh at them could ever be considered okay. It makes my skin crawl and my heart break just thinking about it. I could NEVER do that, especially to a child on Christmas, or their birthday???? What the gently caress. Big  People who prank their kids with "haha you thought we got you an Xbox? it's just a box full of socks and underwear haha fooled you" (extra big gently caress you if they even enforce the "c'mon you have to act like you appreciate the gift" part) and then also record their prank and then have that prank played on daytime TV...the whole thing makes my skin crawl right off my goddamn bones.StrangersInTheNight posted:Just.....stop. You're not dating your parents, they need to make their own bdays happy with their own friends and such. Guess I'm ahead of the curve. I have literally never cultivated or otherwise had the concept of giving gifts instilled in me. (I'll sometimes toss some stuff to close friends, that's about it.) Everything to do with gifts is a giant source of anxiety and guilt and stress for me, and oh look at that it's very much a Thing for those on the spectrum, bullseye. Probably also doesn't help that, at best, there's a gulf of distance between me and anyone else in the family so if you put a gun to my head and asked me to pick out a gift for my aunt I'd have no loving clue anyway.
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Oct 7, 2021 02:31
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My brother and I both cultivated a very early habit of just asking for money for our birthdays/Christmas/Hanukkah. This was because while we could make lists and our mom would buy things based on those lists, our dad has a truly incredible ability to be told "I want [insert thing] for my birthday" and respond with "Ah hah, I know what you want for your birthday! It's [insert thing that Dad wants, actually]! I am tapped in to the youth of today." Like one year for Christmas, I recall receiving an acoustic guitar and books on how to teach yourself to play guitar. It was actually a pretty pricey gift and that would have been cool and all except that I had literally never, not once, expressed any interest in learning to play guitar. My dad however is a huge country music fan and had often wished that he'd learned to play guitar in his youth. HMMMMMM. I thanked him politely and put it in my room and forgot about it. To no surprise, the guitar swiftly migrated from my room to his ("Well SOMEONE should use it if you aren't going to!"), although I will say that he never actually did learn how to play it. I don't think he had the patience for it. Fortunately my brother and I are both very into video games so it was easy to convince our parents after awhile that they didn't want to go to the hassle of finding and buying the specific games we wanted and it'd be much easier to just give us cash. Really took the frustration out of the holidays to just receive envelopes of money.
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Oct 7, 2021 03:00
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CuwiKhons posted:Fortunately my brother and I are both very into video games so it was easy to convince our parents after awhile that they didn't want to go to the hassle of finding and buying the specific games we wanted and it'd be much easier to just give us cash. Really took the frustration out of the holidays to just receive envelopes of money. Yeah this was a key tactic of mine as well. Oops, you can't go to the store and buy a Steam game, please just hand over some cash and I'll unambiguously appreciate that. And of course nonetheless my mom would get agitated because surely it isn't right to not receive SOMETHING on Christmas???
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Oct 7, 2021 05:47
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deep dish peat moss posted:I remember one time when my cat wasn't eating and I got very worried about him, because we spend all day together and I'm very attached. She berated me for taking him to a vet. She said "Cats just aren't worth taking to vets." and "I've never known anyone who takes their cat to the vet." I didn't know how to respond but I was very hurt and disgusted, which she noticed, and she tried to console me by saying "Next time you think about taking your cat to a vet call me, I'll look up the cheapest vet in town to make sure you don't waste your money". My mom is like that too. Maybe it's a boomer brain thing. Related, but my friend's cat unfortunately passed away unexpectedly and suddenly yesterday. He was obviously heart broken and inconsolable and I guess he mentioned it to his family group chat. His mom sent him this, verbatim: quote:this is what happens when you get attached. Dont let it affect you too much, life happens and you move on. Wonder if its me would u cry this much 😜😜
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Oct 8, 2021 20:43
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Even if you felt that way in your heart (e.g. "It's just a pet don't be too upset") why would you say it out loud to another person. That's what gets me. Not that they have these bizarre beliefs and feelings, but that they don't know they're unacceptable and loving say them out loud.
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Oct 8, 2021 20:52
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Not even just that, but the added "what about ME" at the end just stunning
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Oct 8, 2021 20:54
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Imagined posted:Even if you felt that way in your heart (e.g. "It's just a pet don't be too upset") why would you say it out loud to another person. That's what gets me. Not that they have these bizarre beliefs and feelings, but that they don't know they're unacceptable and loving say them out loud. Some people just do not connect with animals and cannot conceive why someone else would. I had a coworker who, upon finding out I have pet birds, decided to tell me a terrible story about his sister in law's parrot. It got out, was too spooked to be retrieved from the tree it took shelter in, and then froze to death overnight because this is not a climate for parrots. And then she was really upset about it for some reason???? But her house was way cleaner afterwards. Literally just "oh you have cockatiels? Let me tell you this funny story about a family member of mine losing her beloved pet, isn't that wild???"
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Oct 8, 2021 20:57
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When I first started reading it and got to "this is what happenes when you get attached" I was thinking maybe it was like a heartfelt thing that the mom worded poorly, sort of like "this is just part of love," but then she made it about her lmao Mom: "It's not sad when things die. Unless..??" deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 21:01 on Oct 8, 2021 |
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Oct 8, 2021 20:59
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lovely parents with dumb conditional love wonder why their kids get attached to creatures that love you unconditionally, act shocked.
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Oct 8, 2021 21:31
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Yo, I think all of these people who lack empathy for animals and the people who love them are psychopaths.
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Oct 8, 2021 21:34
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Rabbit Hill posted:Yo, I think all of these people who lack empathy for animals and the people who love them are psychopaths. Oh without a doubt, I just would've thought a psychopath might have the self-awareness to realize that other people aren't psychopaths and so they should probably disguise their psychopathiness. Like, how do you reach middle age without realizing and accepting that other people really loving love their pets, even if you don't?
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Oct 8, 2021 21:53
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If they're loving pets that means they're not loving ME. What about ME?
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Oct 8, 2021 21:58
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My mom had two dogs. One died when she got hit by a car. She had the other one put to sleep 2 weeks later because he had stopped eating, presumably because he missed his buddy. Neither were housebroken, groomed, or consistently walked more than once a week. I've done enough therapy to where that doesn't really bother me anymore. What does bother me is that she puts on a mask of a good person enough to fool others. I feel like she should be made to wear a sign or something so that other people can be fully informed before interacting with her.
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Oct 8, 2021 22:00
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Rabbit Hill posted:Yo, I think all of these people who lack empathy for animals and the people who love them are psychopaths.  I work at a prison which has a pilot program where inmates re-train problem dogs which can’t be adopted out because of behavioral problems. Each dog has three inmates assigned to it, so there’s always someone with the dog, and these inmates are devoted to their assigned dog. I see them doing their dog training at 6am when it’s cold and dark, the tatted-up, shaved headed dudes in crappy prison clothes out in the little yard working with the canines. They’re so loving proud when the dogs pass their tests and can be taken back to the shelters and adopted out.
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Oct 8, 2021 22:13
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Imagined posted:Oh without a doubt, I just would've thought a psychopath might have the self-awareness to realize that other people aren't psychopaths and so they should probably disguise their psychopathiness. Like, how do you reach middle age without realizing and accepting that other people really loving love their pets, even if you don't? They think everyone else is faking too, and that it's just a social convention to pretend like you care.
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Oct 8, 2021 22:20
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| # ? Apr 27, 2024 11:20 |
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Imagined posted:Oh without a doubt, I just would've thought a psychopath might have the self-awareness to realize that other people aren't psychopaths and so they should probably disguise their psychopathiness. Like, how do you reach middle age without realizing and accepting that other people really loving love their pets, even if you don't? quote:Just as there are physical monsters, can there not be mental or psychic monsters born? The face and body may be perfect, but if a twisted gene or malformed egg can produce physical monsters, may not the same process produce a malformed soul?
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Oct 8, 2021 22:23
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