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YF-23 posted:I still don't think it is the same. While AOT specifically goes out of its way to give twists on them or flip on them altogether, it positively revels in the aesthetics of militarism and dehumanisation. You do not get something that has such a surface-level appeal to fascists with most other series. How is that different from other stories about militaries? "There is no such thing as an anti-war film" and all.
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Nov 17, 2021 18:13
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I can only possibly recommend Merry Christmas, Mr Lawrence.
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Nov 17, 2021 18:16
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Pththya-lyi posted:How is that different from other stories about militaries? "There is no such thing as an anti-war film" and all.
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Nov 17, 2021 18:20
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How could I have forgotten about Come and See, the only war movie?
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Nov 17, 2021 18:29
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Try not to scrape the floor as you move those goalposts.
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Nov 17, 2021 18:33
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If we compare AoT to the green berets, AoT might even come out favorably.
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Nov 17, 2021 18:34
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No Wave posted:Readers were fist pumping and cheering when Eren started killing everyone during the marley arc. When do people fist pump and cheer watching Come and See? I was cheering when Eren started killing everyone during the Marley arc for the same reason I cheer when poo poo goes down during disaster movies. That said, plenty of people ITT were cheering because the only good fascist is a dead fascist, including the civilians that tacitly support such a regime through compliance as opposed to violent insurrection. Try psychoanalysizing those.
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Nov 17, 2021 18:37
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Conspiratiorist posted:I was cheering when Eren started killing everyone during the Marley arc for the same reason I cheer when poo poo goes down during disaster movies.
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Nov 17, 2021 18:40
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Are you?
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Nov 17, 2021 18:40
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oh no did this get shared in a discord i hate when this happens I said it before, it's impossible to argue with people who have decided AoT is fascist because if you don't think it is, they already decided for you you either misunderstood or are a fascist yourself. I just hope they're not into Star Wars, Naruto, anything Marvel or DC really, Robocop, Starship Troopers, Squid Game ah you get it it's not worth doing this again poo poo's so repetitive even the avatars of the people doing it look alike lol lets just relitigate how poo poo the ending was
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Nov 17, 2021 18:44
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YF-23 posted:I can only possibly recommend Merry Christmas, Mr Lawrence. I have to second this. Really really fantastic film.
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Nov 17, 2021 18:52
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Unless you're full juche I don't see how you could read Squid Game as fascist
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Nov 17, 2021 20:12
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Fascists love squid game because they think it’s a blistering hot take on the dangers of communism. Anything is pro fascist if you’re a complete loving idiot incapable of introspection.
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Nov 17, 2021 20:21
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When does communism come up in squid game?
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Nov 17, 2021 20:25
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It doesn't, beyond the occasional mention of North Korea. They claim stuff like food lines, soldiers shooting people, etc. means communism
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Nov 17, 2021 20:30
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No Wave posted:When does communism come up in squid game? lol it doesn’t, that’s the point. They just make poo poo up so that the media they are watching vindicates their personal views.
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Nov 17, 2021 20:36
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A major character is a North Korean refugee but that's basically it, as far as stuff actually in the show goes
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Nov 17, 2021 20:47
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lotta deranged lunatics in the thread equating a show for teenagers to a genocide endorsement
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Nov 17, 2021 21:50
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TheKingofSprings posted:lotta deranged lunatics in the thread equating a show for teenagers to a genocide endorsement  When you've seen a little of AoT: well it looks like it's all about retaking your land from hordes of inhuman zombiemonsters who are only held at bay by your giant walls, I can see why manchild fascists would love it.... When you've seen more of AoT: ah ok the walls themselves are made up of inhuman zombiemonsters, and maybe every single monster was a human at some point? and these monsters were created by soldiers injecting prisoners with something and throwing them off these giant walls? what's going on here? is man the real monster? When you've read the end of AoT: "Thank you for genociding for our sake" 
Assepoester fucked around with this message at 22:16 on Nov 17, 2021 |
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Nov 17, 2021 22:11
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there's some poetic irony in the united states lacking self-awareness while everyone else just kinda goes "oh there they go again"
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Nov 17, 2021 22:19
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The United States posted:When you've read the end of AoT: "Thank you for genociding for our sake" I long suspected without bothering to confirm that people were getting real worked up about a lovely translation but yep that appears to be the case What he says is more like "You became a murderer for our benefit...I swear I won't let your mistake be for nothing" Not an arigatou in sight
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Nov 17, 2021 22:49
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https://twitter.com/Acyn/status/1461061994019053569
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Nov 17, 2021 22:55
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Yeah everyone’s initial reaction of that exchange was based on the really dodgy translations that hit the web first. For some reason even though it was cleared up and corrected within days, “thanks for committing genocide for us” was already a solidified meme It’s like “nah I’ve already built too much of my identity on this misconception and the disappointment I felt when I believed it, I don’t care what he actually said now.”
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Nov 17, 2021 23:03
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Tenkaris posted:Yeah everyones initial reaction of that exchange was based on the really dodgy translations that hit the web first. For some reason even though it was cleared up and corrected within days, thanks for committing genocide for us was already a solidified meme there's some sort of poetic irony in the united states getting really into fake news and twitter discourse
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Nov 17, 2021 23:15
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It's such a bad translation that the only possible explanation besides "a fascist did it" is that they did not read the left panel at all and just guessed
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Nov 17, 2021 23:17
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The anime explainer has logged on https://twitter.com/scottwongDC/status/1461063478588936200 Tenkaris posted:Yeah everyone’s initial reaction of that exchange was based on the really dodgy translations that hit the web first. For some reason even though it was cleared up and corrected within days, “thanks for committing genocide for us” was already a solidified meme
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Nov 17, 2021 23:18
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I think somehow turning "I swear I will not let your mistake be for nothing" into "thank you" is the bigger issue but to each their own 
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Nov 17, 2021 23:23
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ImpAtom posted:I am sad that "Thank you for becoming a mass murderer for our sake" is too spoiler to be a title because that like made me die laughing. I found the first post mentioning it  this is the exact wording from the lovely translation
Tenkaris fucked around with this message at 23:32 on Nov 17, 2021 |
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Nov 17, 2021 23:30
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So within this page I see someone say that there's no such thing as an anti-war movie and immediately backpedal in their next post, someone accusing people who think there's a valid fascist interpretation of AoT of raiding this thread from a discord server, and someone referring to them as deranged lunatics. Is this arguing in good faith? This is loving surreal, holy poo poo. 
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Nov 17, 2021 23:30
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YF-23 posted:So within this page I see someone say that there's no such thing as an anti-war movie and immediately backpedal in their next post, someone accusing people who think there's a valid fascist interpretation of AoT of raiding this thread from a discord server, and someone referring to them as deranged lunatics. Is this arguing in good faith? This isn't D&D, but more importantly this is like the 527th time someones come stomping in with a steaming hot take after reading the polygon article and a few tweets. There's literally an example of it on this very page which is literally disproved 2 posts later but it will never, ever stop. But basically it comes down to this for most of us hatty posted:I don’t think the ending is fascist I just think it sucks and I have no energy to defend it against bad faith readings
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Nov 17, 2021 23:47
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serious gaylord posted:This isn't D&D, but more importantly this is like the 527th time someones come stomping in with a steaming hot take after reading the polygon article and a few tweets. There's literally an example of it on this very page which is literally disproved 2 posts later but it will never, ever stop. I just wanna add something very important: Gosar sounds and reads very close to the Brazilian Portuguese verb "to cum"
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Nov 17, 2021 23:50
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It’s the same posters, coming in , stomping their feet saying the work is fascist with the flimsiest of reasons. When pointed out how you have to basically ignore everything in text to reach that interpretation, they slink back into the shadows. There’s never anything productive that comes out of that discussion, because all the people claiming it are clearly arguing in bad faith and never talk about how the text in many scenes, almost hits a hammer on the readers head and says” look how bad fascism is you idiot, this is where it leads”. So why even bother at this point. Personally i’d be up for just banning the discussion happening at all. It’s happened so many times at this point and nothing useful comes of it , except pointless arguing that wears everyone out.
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Nov 18, 2021 00:02
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My point was not that there has never been an anti-war film that is effective in its messaging: that's why I put "there is no such thing as an anti-war film" in quotes. The argument I was trying to make was that there are a lot of anti-war films - not to mention superhero and disaster films - that frame death and destruction in a cool-looking way, and many people latch onto how pretty the explosions are instead of taking any deeper meaning from the work. I'm sorry for being unclear, but I don't understand why we should condemn AoT and let other stories off the hook when they do the same thing. If we have to throw out Isayama, should we throw out Coppola and Kubrick too? E: Anyway I'm not going to watch the David Bowie movie because I don't support statutory rape. Kidding. But do you see how it feels? Pththya-lyi fucked around with this message at 00:31 on Nov 18, 2021 |
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Nov 18, 2021 00:08
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A lot of those movies get rightfully critiqued for glamourising war/fascism/etc. even while containing textual condemnation of it. It is understood that said textual message comes second to overall presentation, that when those things clash the message in the text is fundamentally undercut. Because characters are fallible, because they are not mouthpieces, they can be wrong; it is not enough for a character to say "genocide is wrong" to give a story a pass for portraying the fascists glamorously. It is not enough for Gabi to have an explicit and very well-written character arc in which she gets over her internalised self-hatred and preconceptions if the rest of the story fails to back that up: she had the potential to be a foil to Eren and represent hope in breaking the cycle of violence, but ends up little more than a victim to it. I don't think AoT is fascist; I think Isayama decided to end his story with a clichéd remark about violence being an inherent part of human nature, especially considering the extra pages for the ending. But that kind of fits in a fascist worldview that would see that as "survival of the fittest", so while I don't agree with it I can very easily see a valid reading of AoT as a fascist story.
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Nov 18, 2021 01:06
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Not a surprise that the fascist who imagines themselves as a heroic member of the heroic survey corps cutting down the evil foreign invaders and democrats doesn't actually care about censure procedures and just wants to keep using anime to encourage his fascist followers to kill his political enemies https://twitter.com/RonFilipkowski/status/1461106483836465162 Wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross and the cross itself is posting anime death trolling reactionary widescreen... videos
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Nov 18, 2021 01:29
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VROOM VROOM posted:I long suspected without bothering to confirm that people were getting real worked up about a lovely translation but yep that appears to be the case That's because the arigatō happened two panels earlier:  For those wondering, Armin's first speech bubble says ...エレン ("...Eren"). His second says ありがとう ("Thank you"). Then he says the "You became a mass murderer..." yadda yadda yadda line.
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Nov 18, 2021 04:34
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they really should have brought erwin back instead lol
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Nov 18, 2021 05:08
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DamnitGannet posted:they really should have brought erwin back instead lol *KAFF*
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Nov 18, 2021 05:41
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I do love how ridiculously, wildly off base all those people were that thought Armin would have....literally any impact at all on how everything shook out in the end, when the reality is nothing anyone did mattered and Erin got everything he wanted. Which was, itself, kind of pointless. He sure did kill a lot of people though, and I guess all the folks he personally cared for lived out their lives before it went to poo poo again.
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Nov 18, 2021 05:57
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In It For The Tank posted:That's because the arigatō happened two panels earlier: Uhh AoT is a land of contrasts
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Nov 18, 2021 07:14
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