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Can't wait to die in one of those tunnels where there is no ventilation or convenient escape routes. Sure I'll just hop over a line of burning cars in front of me while choking on smoke the whole time. How the hell did this make it out of the planning stages let alone actually existing?
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Jan 6, 2022 21:44
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that feeling of claustrophobia is because the tunnels are deliberately dug more narrowly, so they can be dug more cheaply. normally tunnels that narrow are just used for utility conduits with restricted access for maintenance workers. boring company tunnels are definitely outside of AASHTO and FHA guidelines for tunnels used for vehicular traffic - you can check the guidelines here, chapter 1: https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/bridge/tunnel/pubs/nhi09010/tunnel_manual.pdf buuut, since this venture takes place entirely within the city of las vegas and doesn't draw on any federal dollars for funding, its subject only to local codes, mostly just the fire safety codes. the fire safety review doesn't have to be made public, so who knows under what rubric this tunnel is deemed safe and acceptable. my only guess is because the existing tunnel is relatively short (like 1/8 mile segments, a brisk 90 second jog) it can be argued that proper ventilation or egress aren't necessary, even if those arguments would be dodgy and exclusionary. well, nobody with disabilities or mobility problems will be using this toy subway anyway if it makes you feel like these tunnels are a deathtrap though, thats because they are, provably so according to best practice guidelines for tunnel construction Mercury_Storm posted:Can't wait to die in one of those tunnels where there is no ventilation or convenient escape routes. Sure I'll just hop over a line of burning cars in front of me while choking on smoke the whole time. How the hell did this make it out of the planning stages let alone actually existing? the system only exists under a convention center which is a city-owned corporation subject entirely to nevada and las vegas law. the only person of note who needs to sign off on the thing is the las vegas fire marshall. you know, las vegas, the city with the very good health and safety laws Mr. Fall Down Terror fucked around with this message at 21:54 on Jan 6, 2022 |
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Jan 6, 2022 21:52
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Elon Musk is going to turn LA into the next Centralia except with eternally burning Tesla batteries.
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Jan 6, 2022 22:00
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Detective No. 27 posted:Elon Musk is going to turn LA into the next Centralia except with eternally burning Tesla batteries. He's going to get the idea to have transparent tunnel through the labrea tar pits and set the whole thing on fire with some cockamamy arduino powered poo poo he dreamed up in a K-hole.
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Jan 6, 2022 22:26
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Mercury_Storm posted:Can't wait to die in one of those tunnels where there is no ventilation or convenient escape routes. Sure I'll just hop over a line of burning cars in front of me while choking on smoke the whole time. How the hell did this make it out of the planning stages let alone actually existing? Lol a burning Tesla is a lithium fire at two thousand degrees Celsius. You wouldn't be getting near one, let alone jumping over it.
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Jan 6, 2022 22:57
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Can't wait for a bunch of people to die of carbon monoxide poisoning in the helltunnels.
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Jan 6, 2022 23:05
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Every time the whole, ya know, DEATH TRAP aspect of the tunnel is brought up the Musk defenders try to defend it saying that "it's a beta test, they'll put that into the final version" or something along those lines. I'm sorry, do you really think that this is a video game? That the people traveling in this thing right now aren't at severe risk due to the terrible design of the tunnel? Do they think it's a play test and if anyone dies they'll just "roll back the server" and do it over? It's bad enough that these idiots buy into the loving "beta test" poo poo for helping Musk develop his AI on live roads. But goddamn these people need a serious wake up call and sadly even a massive loss of life from a fire in that tunnel won't even do it.
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Jan 6, 2022 23:21
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You guys just don't realize there will be thousands of tunnels layered above one another. So you'll have your own tunnel. No traffic if you just keep killing everyone in the lower tunnels. loving platform in real life Lol after 10,900 people die musk will go "we will fix it in post" Also all of you are just RACISTS against the south African genius.
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Jan 6, 2022 23:23
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Blut posted:How can the AI not manage to drive in one of those? It looks like the ideal environment for an AI - no pedestrians, intersections, animals, weather... Basically just stop and go and follow the gentle curves. The funny thing is that other organizations actually do manage that exact thing already, and better than Tesla. In my city we just had a pilot project with an autonomous bus servicing a short circular route as a practice run. It was a simple route in a fairly calm part of the city, but it was on otherwise uncontrolled public streets with cars and pedestrians both. It turned out to be a solid success, with the autonomous bus managing to navigate daily traffic without any incidents for a year. So even if you're dead set on having your public transport in tiny autonomous vehicles along predetermined routes, you still don't actually need to bother with the drat tunnels.
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Jan 6, 2022 23:26
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So the government of Kazakhstan shut down the entire country's internet yesterday over anti-Bitcoin protests, causing the world to lose nearly one-fifth of total Bitcoin processing power. https://fortune.com/2022/01/05/kazakhstan-internet-bitcoin-mining-mystery-crypto/
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Jan 6, 2022 23:35
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Perestroika posted:The funny thing is that other organizations actually do manage that exact thing already, and better than Tesla. In my city we just had a pilot project with an autonomous bus servicing a short circular route as a practice run. It was a simple route in a fairly calm part of the city, but it was on otherwise uncontrolled public streets with cars and pedestrians both. It turned out to be a solid success, with the autonomous bus managing to navigate daily traffic without any incidents for a year. you also don't really need to bother with AI either, autonomous vehicles responding to simple electromechanical controls along limited access guideways have existed for decades. there was a pilot program to summon them on demand even https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaSaWfw07Sw
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Jan 6, 2022 23:39
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fool of sound posted:Can't wait for a bunch of people to die of carbon monoxide poisoning in the helltunnels. These cars don’t output CO.
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Jan 6, 2022 23:47
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Mr. Fall Down Terror posted:you also don't really need to bother with AI either, autonomous vehicles responding to simple electromechanical controls along limited access guideways have existed for decades. there was a pilot program to summon them on demand even AI is the new hammer, and everything is a nail. You don't get massive VC money/market money if you're doing something so boring, logical and reliable. withak posted:These cars don’t output CO. * when not on fire.
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Jan 6, 2022 23:49
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withak posted:These cars don’t output CO. I'm sure the upholstery and sheer amount of plastics do.
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Jan 7, 2022 00:03
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I suspect what a lot of musk supporters do not grasp is that musk's vision of "saving the planet" only involves saving people like him, ie: very rich people. Obviously building a tunnel to act as an extra lane of traffic is a terrible idea, since an extra lane just induces more demand and traffic won't get any better. However, he isn't thinking about the effect of this extra lane on traffic in general; to him, the poor can wait in traffic, this sleek, extra-fast lane will only be used by rich people, like him. If the richest can escape to Mars, who cares if the bottom 99.99% of humans die scavenging for scraps on a dying Earth? It is a similar mindset to those who support scalping necessities during an emergency: as long as rich people can easily get whatever they want, who cares if the poor are suffering?
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Jan 7, 2022 00:15
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Nebrilos posted:I suspect what a lot of musk supporters do not grasp is that musk's vision of "saving the planet" only involves saving people like him, ie: very rich people. Obviously building a tunnel to act as an extra lane of traffic is a terrible idea, since an extra lane just induces more demand and traffic won't get any better. However, he isn't thinking about the effect of this extra lane on traffic in general; to him, the poor can wait in traffic, this sleek, extra-fast lane will only be used by rich people, like him. If the richest can escape to Mars, who cares if the bottom 99.99% of humans die scavenging for scraps on a dying Earth? It is a similar mindset to those who support scalping necessities during an emergency: as long as rich people can easily get whatever they want, who cares if the poor are suffering? They grasp all of that perfectly, what they utterly fail to grasp is the size of the gap between themselves and the handful of people who will actually benefit from this poo poo.
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Jan 7, 2022 00:26
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they think that they with have ironman rick and morty style adventures with Musk himself. also they're the protag and the rick to musk's morty.
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Jan 7, 2022 00:41
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withak posted:These cars don’t output CO. Ventilation is important for more than just vehicle emissions when you're dealing with underground tunnels.
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Jan 7, 2022 01:12
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I haven’t heard of carbon monoxide being an issue in gassy tunnels except for when there are engines running.
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Jan 7, 2022 05:07
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withak posted:I haven’t heard of carbon monoxide being an issue in gassy tunnels except for when there are engines running. Can we please make the thread title tech nightmare: gassy tunnels itt
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Jan 7, 2022 05:10
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Gassy tunnels are no joke.
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Jan 7, 2022 05:12
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withak posted:I haven’t heard of carbon monoxide being an issue in gassy tunnels except for when there are engines running. Once the batteries touch off the high temperature will set fire to the passengers. Low oxygen leads to incomplete combustion, producing CO.
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Jan 7, 2022 05:18
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Crain posted:I also buy into the theory that everything he invests in and promotes is simply so he can get his rear end to mars and be alone and as far away from another human being as possible. They made this a plot point in the Alien canon. Weyland's a nutcase obsessed with being immortal, and the company would have been run into the ground by that years ago except that the androids, hyper sleep, and atmospheric processing stuff are all offshoots derived from internal crackpot tech he was having people come up with to try to make him immortal.
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Jan 7, 2022 05:29
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Mr. Fall Down Terror posted:
the state owns the convention center, the board is a mix of local officials (county, las vegas, and the surrounding suburbs) and casino owners the actual city of las vegas had exactly 1 vote on the board and was the single no vote on the proposal
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Jan 7, 2022 05:36
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in that case i stand corrected, and also, lol
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Jan 7, 2022 07:38
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Arsenic Lupin posted:https://twitter.com/SwiftOnSecurity/status/1479165032013438977 A 32 bit unsigned integer has a max of 4294967295, so in 21 years we will probably have Y2K43, too.
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Jan 7, 2022 12:18
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Inferior Third Season posted:
There's a big one coming in 2038 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_2038_problem
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Jan 7, 2022 12:27
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withak posted:I haven’t heard of carbon monoxide being an issue in gassy tunnels except for when there are engines running. Fun thing about heavier than air gasses is that they tend to flow and pool in the lowest area they can. You're supposed to have a CO alarm in your basement even though you might not have a car down there. There's also plenty of other nasty gasses that seep and flow and pool besides CO. I wonder if anyone has done an air quality test down in the tunnel.
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Jan 7, 2022 14:43
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Crain posted:Fun thing about heavier than air gasses is that they tend to flow and pool in the lowest area they can. Carbon monoxide, having a similar mass to N2 and O2, is not heavier than air, it diffuses pretty evenly throughout regular air.
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Jan 7, 2022 15:41
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The tunnel also has ventilation, plus it’s only a mile long, some of these fears are pretty out there unreasonable
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Jan 7, 2022 15:50
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Crain posted:I wonder if anyone has done an air quality test down in the tunnel. the tunnels are short enough now as designed that they can be ventilated by just moving cars through them, and picking up fresh air at the stations which are only a few minutes stroll apart at best. there is one underground station and both other ends of the tunnel are open air if the tunnels were longer, the narrowness of their diameter would be a much larger problem in terms of ventilation, for lack of space to put in-tunnel fans and such you can see the length of the entire system here, its quite tiny https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUoZCUqbCNg Mr. Fall Down Terror fucked around with this message at 16:00 on Jan 7, 2022 |
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Jan 7, 2022 15:56
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Mr. Fall Down Terror posted:the tunnels are short enough now as designed that they can be ventilated by just moving cars through them, and picking up fresh air at the stations which are only a few minutes stroll apart at best As long as cars are moving. Thankfully a traffic jam that would lead to still air can't happe...oh wait. Safety equipment like proper ventilation is explicitly for when the "it's fine if cars keep moving through it" proper operation fails. The whole enterprise is the safety equivalent of "just in time" delivery, first thing that goes wrong and the problems will cascade. Owlofcreamcheese posted:The tunnel also has ventilation, plus it’s only a mile long, some of these fears are pretty out there unreasonable Hold your breath and go try to walk a mile, let me know how far you get.
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Jan 7, 2022 16:03
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Crain posted:Hold your breath and go try to walk a mile, let me know how far you get. What process would evacuate the air from an open ended short tunnel? You are making up nonsense to get afraid of.
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Jan 7, 2022 16:14
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Maybe the tunnels are well ventilated, but that won't help you when the Tesla bursts into flames and you cannot get out because the tunnels are not wide enough for you to open the doors and escape.
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Jan 7, 2022 16:25
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:What process would evacuate the air from an open ended short tunnel? You are making up nonsense to get afraid of. A lithium batter fire at one end of the tunnel?
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Jan 7, 2022 16:35
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CommieGIR posted:you cannot get out because the tunnels are not wide enough for you to open the doors and escape. The tunnel isn't THAT narrow.
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Jan 7, 2022 16:37
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Lead out in cuffs posted:So the government of Kazakhstan shut down the entire country's internet yesterday over anti-Bitcoin protests, causing the world to lose nearly one-fifth of total Bitcoin processing power. Thread title strikes again.
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Jan 7, 2022 16:41
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Crain posted:As long as cars are moving. Thankfully a traffic jam that would lead to still air can't happe...oh wait. there are so few vehicles in the LVCC system that you can't get a significant amount of congestion. the video which prompted this derail just demonstrates the inefficient and chaotic embarkation/debarkation process at the central station, which is indicative of how extremely halfass this entire project has become Owlofcreamcheese posted:The tunnel isn't THAT narrow. its narrow enough to prevent individuals with mobility issues from being able to pass vehicles in the tunnel. the tunnel is objectively not wide enough to accommodate federal guidelines for emergency egress. i dont know what standards are present in the state of nevada but there probably aren't any (a lot of states just piggyback off federal guidelines for things like this). this system is not safe for people who are not nimble enough to escape on their own two feet and that alone is going to doom any expansion of the project in places where health and safety standards really matter this is a structrual flaw of the entire boring company tunnel scheme. the tunnels are cheaper because they are too narrow to be safe. this is what elon musk has decided is good. we don't have to play hypotheticals about underground fires, you can compare the tunnels as dug to hard-learned lessons about tunnel regulations and see the loop tunnels do not conform e: really the saving grace here is that because the LVCC loop only exists beneath a convention center and is functionally useless, there are going to be very few individuals in wheelchairs or mobility scooters trying to use the thing anyway Mr. Fall Down Terror fucked around with this message at 16:47 on Jan 7, 2022 |
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Jan 7, 2022 16:44
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CommieGIR posted:Maybe the tunnels are well ventilated, but that won't help you when the Tesla bursts into flames and you cannot get out because the car bricked itself with an over the air update and none of the electronics (like, say doors and windows) work anymore. Fixed
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Jan 7, 2022 16:49
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:What process would evacuate the air from an open ended short tunnel? Combustion. I know this is your thing, but come on, you can't really be this dense. These are "fair weather" tunnels. Everything is fine right up until there is a failure, then things quickly cascade into a horrible mess.
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Jan 7, 2022 17:05
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