|
Who What Now posted:Me: "I don't feel much like a man or like a woman." what does it feel like to feel like a man? same for woman? and how are they different?
|
#
?
Jan 31, 2022 22:45
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 29, 2024 05:59 |
|
|
ChunTheUnavoidable posted:wait why is the gif racist. Thats not a guy in blackface or something is it Uh the first frame shows a computer screen emblazoned with the words "KFC BANKRUPT" LOL
|
|
#
?
Jan 31, 2022 22:47
|
|
|
mkvltra posted:Uh the first frame shows a computer screen emblazoned with the words "KFC BANKRUPT" LOL lmfao holy poo poo
|
|
#
?
Jan 31, 2022 22:51
|
|
|
mkvltra posted:Uh the first frame shows a computer screen emblazoned with the words "KFC BANKRUPT" LOL Can we not have anything nice?
|
|
#
?
Jan 31, 2022 23:11
|
|
|
this is me this is what a REAL man looks like 
|
|
#
?
Jan 31, 2022 23:37
|
|
|
mkvltra posted:Uh the first frame shows a computer screen emblazoned with the words "KFC BANKRUPT" LOL oh my god lmao it wasn’t on there long enough to read, I thought it was just a computer readout
|
|
#
?
Jan 31, 2022 23:42
|
|
|
Fiddler on the Reef posted:what does it feel like to feel like a man? same for woman? and how are they different? Gender roles It's more a certain knowledge of what you aren't for a lot of folks
|
|
#
?
Jan 31, 2022 23:46
|
|
|
Fiddler on the Reef posted:what does it feel like to feel like a man? same for woman? and how are they different? Welcome to queer theory in a nutshell
|
|
#
?
Jan 31, 2022 23:47
|
|
|
Sid Vicious posted:i also consider myself nonbinary, i wear whatever i want, i wear makeup when i want to, i look drat good in a dress and boots, but i have a big beard and people have told me to my face since i have facial hair i present strictly as male and shouldnt use the nonbinary descriptor and usually i just tell em to gently caress off but i would love to hear goons opinions, because im not sure if theyre right? Just wanna say gently caress whoever said that, non-binary can look like anything. It's also infuriating when people do this bc is just reinforces the idea that enby is just women-lite, skinny white afab androgynes only need apply. I post in a few enby spaces and they go out of their way to welcome our masc enbies and highlight them to try and counteract this, stuff like AMAB Mondays StrangersInTheNight fucked around with this message at 23:53 on Jan 31, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jan 31, 2022 23:51
|
|
|
Why can't Steve just be Steve and why can't Tayne just be Tayne and why can't Mimi just be Mimi? Why does there have to be a label?
|
|
#
?
Jan 31, 2022 23:53
|
|
|
The Bloop posted:Gender roles So it's a way for people who are uncomfortable with society's proscribed gender roles to distinguish themselves? For people who don't id as nonbinary, do they universally feel comfortable with those roles as well? edit: and feminists who absolutely despise gender roles but are unabashedly female: where do they fit into all this? Fiddler on the Reef fucked around with this message at 00:28 on Feb 1, 2022 |
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 00:20
|
|
|
I mean for me, I'm AFAB and still look quite feminine, but when people call me "lady" or "woman", it feels equally as wrong as calling me a man. It's deeply uncomfortable and has been since I was a kid. When I hit puberty I went full swing into gender dysphoria, but I didn't want to be a man. I spent most of my teens in deep depression and was suicidal often. Around 17 I got into David Bowie, and I started to figure out that just because I had this body didn't mean I was limited by it or defined by it. I could define myself however I wanted regardless of my body, and it was so freeing. I started to hate my body a lot less, and I'm still not fully comfortable in it, but I can live with it. I still don't like feminine words or pronouns, but I will use them to make it simplwr for people who refuse to just let us just be. I didn't start calling myself nonbinary until maybe 5 years ago. Before then my answer to "what is your gender" was "why would anyone other than a doctor or sexual/romantic partner care? Why do you care? Can I please just not have one? I'm tired of it mattering."
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 01:26
|
|
|
Fiddler on the Reef posted:edit: and feminists who absolutely despise gender roles but are unabashedly female: where do they fit into all this? if someone "is" "unabashedly female" but "despises gender roles" then y definition they wouldn't think of themself as feminine because: they probably think "i like being this way and society says this way is for female people but i disagree with the notion that anything is specifically for either gender"
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 01:32
|
|
|
good faith answer for the fiddle crab - there are 4 relevant axes - gender expression, gender role, gender identity, biological sex. these are all mutable, traversable, and potentially non-binary. gender identity - are you a man, a woman, or something else? internally perceived. not, in my opinion experience, a ‘feeling’. i don’t ‘feel’ like this gender or that. but i do perceive myself as such. most people have an internal perception of themselves as having a particular gender category. this may or may not be static over the course of a life. gender expression - typically a spectrum of masculine to feminine style. this one isn’t really a form of gender, but it’s adjacent to and interacts with gendering. gender role - the social function of gender. are you categorized by other people/ social systems as a man, a woman, or neither? this takes place a million times in a million places over the course of a life. at each individual social interaction, you may be cast into the role of male or female by the other, and you respond in turn. gender role is a dynamic property that is constantly being navigated. biological sex - this is also mutable and potentially non-binary. if we take the big sexual dimorphisms - genitals, chromosomes, sex hormones, 2ndary sex characteristics - 3/4 of these can be medically altered in a completely binary or partial non-binary way.
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 01:36
|
|
- hi
|
Ocean Book posted:gender identity - are you a man, a woman, or something else? internally perceived. not, in my opinion experience, a ‘feeling’. i don’t ‘feel’ like this gender or that. but i do perceive myself as such. most people have an internal perception of themselves as having a particular gender category. this may or may not be static over the course of a life. This part, especially "most people have an internal perception of themselves as having a particular gender category" I don't get at all, don't experience at all, and the whole idea seems fairly regressive (insofar as it seems to reinforce gender roles). I guess I sympathize with NBs insofar as it's an attempt to escape the pink and blue boxes created by society, but it also lends credence to those boxes, and presupposes the existence of some sort of internal gender identity that is somehow separate and distinct from gender roles (seems almost religious to me). Seems to be that id'ing out of those pink and blue boxes is futile. Identify NB all you want, but if you're (born) a woman, society's gonna treat you like one with all the oppression that comes with it, regardless of if you identify nonbinary. Instead of escaping the boxes, we should be tearing them down instead... imo. Fiddler on the Reef fucked around with this message at 02:40 on Feb 1, 2022 |
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 02:03
|
|
|
Ocean Book posted:good faith answer for the fiddle crab - What about the ability to give birth?
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 02:18
|
|
|
mkvltra posted:What about the ability to give birth? What about it?
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 02:24
|
|
|
Picnic Princess posted:Yeah I've been fortunate to have met a number of seniors at various points in my 20 years of adult life who thought it was loving rad that younger people drastically defied gender norms and told their elders to gently caress off. They always wanted to do it too but felt too old to take part Am well over 35 and I feel like I'm surrounded by fetuses but I also run a community group for enby folk ect in my city and we have all sorts of olds join and even come to irl events.
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 02:26
|
|
|
Sweaty IT Nerd posted:What about it? It's not on the epic list
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 02:31
|
|
|
Sweaty IT Nerd posted:What about it? I ain't no baby maker - Even before the egg cracked I was like... If you have the baby you cant be baby. Or be a easy breezy loose unit spending money on sweet poo poo vs baby bits.
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 02:31
|
|
|
mkvltra posted:What about the ability to give birth? Some people can, some people can't.
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 02:32
|
|
|
i'm non binary and love my non binary husband
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 02:34
|
|
|
Picnic Princess posted:Some people can, some people can't. Some people are born with the ability to give birth and some people will never be able to.
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 02:37
|
|
|
A favourite thing about the ability to give birth thing is a friend of mine screamed at a coworker because she was talking about me and mentioned I was trans and the coworker was like "oh she can't have kids? Guess she isn't a woman." She screamed because she had a medical issue that required surgery that destroyed her ability to have kids, something she always wanted so very much. So telling her that having kids meant I wasn't a woman was telling her she wasn't too, and she is so very much more sensitive about it.
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 02:56
|
|
|
mkvltra posted:What about the ability to give birth? good point, gamete type/reproductive configuration should be on the list of biological sex features. so make that 3/5. Fiddler on the Reef posted:This part, especially "most people have an internal perception of themselves as having a particular gender category" I don't get at all, don't experience at all, and the whole idea seems fairly regressive (insofar as it seems to reinforce gender roles). like, if someone asked if you are a man or a woman, do you sincerely not have a sense of how you would categorize yourself? i’m not talking about anything metaphysical or intrinsic or essential. just the knowledge of your own self. i think most people can either determine what gender they are. i don’t think that’s like, regressive to acknowledge. i do agree with you that trying to enact a nb social role seems difficult. i imagine most nb people are implicitly categorized by other people as male or female. but i’ve also heard that among people who know them and what is up, often nb people do feel they can enact their nb social role. i personally don’t really know what that’s like but it’s probably nice for them i guess regarding boxes - acknowledging gender is not the same as policing gender. like, humans have genders. seems to be pretty consistent. and gender roles can even be fun when they are voluntary. it’s a lot easier imo to make the boundaries of the 4 gender axes more permeable than trying to abolish gender.
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 03:00
|
|
|
youre mistaken okay bye
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 03:03
|
|
|
drat :/
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 03:11
|
|
|
seems a bit indecisive to me
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 03:20
|
|
|
kntfkr posted:Enby's; we may or may not have the meats! lol
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 03:22
|
|
|
I really hope this thread just becomes cishets debating with each other over the philosophy of gender and sexual identity. That would be 
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 03:30
|
|
|
syntaxfunction posted:I really hope this thread just becomes cishets debating with each other over the philosophy of gender and sexual identity. That would be If you're a cis guy and you have some extra vat-grown clone dicks attached does that make you more or less cis?
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 03:31
|
|
|
syntaxfunction posted:I really hope this thread just becomes cishets debating with each other over the philosophy of gender and sexual identity. That would be good, let them do it for a while, it gets exhausting
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 03:32
|
|
|
syntaxfunction posted:I really hope this thread just becomes cishets debating with each other over the philosophy of gender and sexual identity. That would be Inshallah
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 03:41
|
|
|
mkvltra posted:What about the ability to give birth? The implication hidden in this question is that an AFAB person who unquestionably identifies and presents as female yet cannot conceive or carry a child for any number of reasons isn't a woman That's not cool
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 04:47
|
|
|
Ocean Book posted:gender identity - are you a man, a woman, or something else? internally perceived. not, in my opinion experience, a ‘feeling’. i don’t ‘feel’ like this gender or that. but i do perceive myself as such. most people have an internal perception of themselves as having a particular gender category. this may or may not be static over the course of a life. The other stuff aside, I don't really get these as this stuff never resonated with me. The idea of gender identity is incredibly vague, as (biology aside) what makes a "man" or "woman" is dependent on both the times you're living in as well as the culture you're part of, isn't it? Same with a feminine or masculine style. The closest thing I come to thinking about myself in those terms is when I'm picking clothes off a rack and I'm trying to combine what I have into something cool, irrelevant whether its in the guy/gal side of the aisle. That's what I meant earlier with that I don't think about gender in that way. After years of thinking about it, I just realized that when it comes to my self identity, gender is entirely unimportant and boring aspect of my being. I only refer to myself as a man in social situations as a way of making it easy for the other party to identify me, even if I'm 2/3s of my then-current outfit comes from the female side of the aisle.
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 10:11
|
|
|
Gender identity is not really important for people who never have to think about it. I am shocked. Shocked. "Gender is not important!" I scream as I am beaten for being androgynous lol
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 10:17
|
|
|
Gender identity is like a bone. You don't really notice it at all, unless something's not right. "I don't get what you mean by feeling, I've never felt anything about my tibia."
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 18:10
|
|
|
I didn't really feel any dysphoria growing up, which definitely made it hard for me to figure myself out. It's why I only made the connection within the last two years. Honestly the thing that helped me the most was getting to know more LGBT people and chatting with them, because in environments where we all feel safe with each other we're able to discuss our identities freely. Those kinds of free discussions often lead to people suddenly making connections about themselves. For me it was small things, little realizations about past memories or behaviors that made me go "oh, huh... yeah I suppose that makes more sense now". I'm AMAB, present mostly masculine, but eventually that might change a bit. Who knows? I'm enjoying the ride.
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 18:31
|
|
|
There's a lot of situations where I "round up" to being a trans guy for the express purpose of not having to hash out this exact conversation with cis people (and it is always, always cis people who want to have it). I don't care so much when it's happening in a thread about enby gender on these dead gay forums, but when I'm just trying to send emails or pick up a prescription or ride the drat bus it gets old fast..... Like drat, just believe I know what's going on with me lolles enfants Terrific! posted:Gender identity is like a bone. You don't really notice it at all, unless something's not right. "I don't get what you mean by feeling, I've never felt anything about my tibia."
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 18:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 29, 2024 05:59 |
|
|
Everyone's story is different, that's what makes it so difficult and confusing for people who align with how they're told to align without thinking about it or feeling like they don't align. There's enough people in the world following the status quo that it doesn't matter if some of us don't. You're going to be okay even if you don't have an answer to "why?" Because there's never going to be one definitive answer aside from "because".
|
|
#
?
Feb 1, 2022 18:46
|
|