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You can't right click save as the Mona Lisa, that's the difference
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Jul 21, 2022 22:47
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Rarity posted:Jpgs don't have value You're being snarky, but this is drastically reductive. Edit: Rarity posted:You can't right click save as the Mona Lisa, that's the difference So is this.
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Jul 21, 2022 22:51
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ColdPie posted:Art does. Games are not art, therefore they have no value, therefore piracy is not theft.
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Jul 21, 2022 22:52
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Doom Rooster posted:Games are not art, therefore they have no value, therefore piracy is not theft. now we're talkin
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Jul 21, 2022 23:41
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it's the same as when someone buys a star from one of those websites. it's bought in the sense that they write down "you own the thing" in their book. it only has meaning insofar as anyone cares what their book says you may notice that this has nothing to do with cryptocurrency, except that the rubes who buy into nfts are the same rubes that think cryptocurrency is a good idea. the only reason that crap is on a blockchain is because that gives you access to people with a lot of "money" and not a lot of sense (and that "money" is sorta-kinda redeemable for real money) theoretically a not-scam company could have their own digital-item-registry. and of course they do, and have. that's what inventory systems in games are. having nfts for video game stuff is just a new name for something that already exists, maybe adding in blockchain nonsense because rubes Achmed Jones fucked around with this message at 23:48 on Jul 21, 2022 |
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Jul 21, 2022 23:45
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Achmed Jones posted:theoretically a not-scam company could have their own digital-item-registry. and of course they do, and have. that's what inventory systems in games are. having nfts for video game stuff is just a new name for something that already exists, maybe adding in blockchain nonsense because rubes Yeah, tracking video game assets is already a solved problem. A distributed registry makes some sense when neither party trusts the other and the transaction has financial value. Just... not in a game. I trust that a developer has literally no reason to take away my weapon skin or jpeg url and even if a bug does, my +7 sword of blockchain is practically worthless.
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Jul 22, 2022 00:28
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mutata posted:You're being snarky, but this is drastically reductive. Elaborate please.
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Jul 22, 2022 00:46
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cmdrk posted:Elaborate please. Art takes effort to make and pretending it doesn't have any value because it's in a digital medium is being pretty lovely to those artists.
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Jul 22, 2022 01:02
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cmdrk posted:Elaborate please. The value of art and visuals does not begin and end with the tangibleness of the medium. That doesn't even hold true with the Mona Lisa. Value (artistic, cultural, monetary, etc) of an image or a piece of media is very often greater than the sum of its parts, just as the Mona Lisa has value beyond that of its canvas and pigments. Art, generally speaking, has an intrinsic value that has been proven over and over for centuries. It is calculated via all sorts of factors including perceived aesthetics, emotional impact, setting, medium, the human element, and everything else. Does uniqueness add to the value? Sure, of course. But it absolutely is NOT the sole source of that value; it's just 1 of many factors. In the context of video games or digital art, that labor has genuine value and provides a genuine service that everyone agrees is valuable to them. Some people love Marvel movies. Some people love Dark Souls games. Some people love Hallmark Christmas movies. Regardless, we all agree via our choices and decisions that there is a benefit and value to consuming these things. Capitalism has hosed with the straightforward nature of things, but insofar as we are all forced to exist in this system, and we all agree that labor is worth compensation of some kind, so too does digital media have a genuine value. If it didn't, people wouldn't want a logo for their little handmade soap business and people wouldn't buy video games and people wouldn't pay furry artists 4-figures for "a jpeg". Now NFTs on the other hand do NOT have value, which is why they didn't take off in any kind of way UNTIL hucksters started attaching art to them. Only then did people go "Oh, I'm getting this art for this price, this is worth it". The scam, of course, is that they didn't get the art, nor rights to use it.
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Jul 22, 2022 01:10
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The digital image I bought* in DC has more value than any NFT. *(also got a “free” “gift” of marijuana edibles)
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Jul 22, 2022 01:14
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When talking about the value of an NFT, it's important to clarify we are talking about commodity value, not artistic value. The 'worth' of an NFT is divorced from the piece of art they've stol...attached to it, and is instead determined by speculative markets. The NFT is not the JPG, it's the unique code string.
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Jul 22, 2022 01:48
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i've spoken to plenty of artists who really loved the idea of NFTs when they were first created, because they were struggling with making art pieces and not having the ownership stolen or various businesses not believing they're the true creators. NFTs would have solved that problem if the random gamblers hadnt taken full control of it immediately
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Jul 22, 2022 02:12
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Lady Radia posted:i've spoken to plenty of artists who really loved the idea of NFTs when they were first created, because they were struggling with making art pieces and not having the ownership stolen or various businesses not believing they're the true creators. NFTs would have solved that problem if the random gamblers hadnt taken full control of it immediately No it wouldn't have. The same exact problems with monetizing art would have existed because NFTs were always a grift and the only people interested in spending any kind of money on them were crypto bros who wanted the scam to succeed. NFTs were NEVER anything more than a scam and any illusion of value they ever had was because they were being pumped by the scammers.
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Jul 22, 2022 02:34
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Lady Radia posted:i've spoken to plenty of artists who really loved the idea of NFTs when they were first created, because they were struggling with making art pieces and not having the ownership stolen or various businesses not believing they're the true creators. NFTs would have solved that problem if the random gamblers hadnt taken full control of it immediately It doesn't even solve that problem. Anyone can mint their own NFT based on an image and list it on a marketplace site, to the point where the Bored Apes folks have been suing people for doing it. 
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Jul 22, 2022 02:38
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Correct. The scam is getting people to think that NFTs have anything at all to do with art ownership or copyright. They don't.
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Jul 22, 2022 02:40
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I just assumed it was people who couldn't tell art from merchandising, and then went through life accordingly.
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Jul 22, 2022 03:09
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Lady Radia posted:i've spoken to plenty of artists who really loved the idea of NFTs when they were first created, because they were struggling with making art pieces and not having the ownership stolen or various businesses not believing they're the true creators. NFTs would have solved that problem if the random gamblers hadnt taken full control of it immediately That is hilariously out of touch with reality, NFts have just as much, if not more, of a problem with wholesale art theft as t-shirt/merch farms On top of being built on the back of Crypto, a scam on top of a scam, there was never any 'This would have been if not for...'. It was a grift from the start Magmarashi fucked around with this message at 03:33 on Jul 22, 2022 |
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Jul 22, 2022 03:30
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You can tell which NFTs are the ones made with stolen art. They're the ones that don't look like someone projectile vomiting into your eyes.
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Jul 22, 2022 03:33
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no, lady radias right. the fact that the nft space is scam central doesn't change the fact that if a reputable system of record - say the smithsonian - would allow artists to register their works, artists could point to that ledger as an easy way to prove ownership. it'd be nice. this is what non-crypto-weirdo artists think that the nft dweebs are talking about (but they aren't, they're grifting as you say). such nfts would be good for artists. the fact that current nft implementations are full of scammers and cryptocurrency nonsense is quite beside the point
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Jul 22, 2022 03:35
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such nfts would still not be good for artists on account of the ecological devastation they cause, but i guess i see what you mean. it could be, like, just a ledger, and not be crypto or NFT in any way
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Jul 22, 2022 03:37
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if the ledger is centralized by an authority it's not a blockchain, and thus not an NFT
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Jul 22, 2022 03:38
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Achmed Jones posted:if a reputable system of record - say the smithsonian - would allow artists to register their works, artists could point to that ledger as an easy way to prove ownership. you can do this without NFTs. it's called a database. NFTs are just a database with extra steps.
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Jul 22, 2022 03:41
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Dieting Hippo posted:you can do this without NFTs. it's called a database. NFTs are just a database with extra steps. A database that requires you to burn down some trees to prove you mean it
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Jul 22, 2022 03:43
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The 7th Guest posted:it could be, like, just a ledger, and not be crypto or NFT in any way I think you're on to something here. Some kind of "base" in which to store "data." Anyone have an idea what we might call such technology?
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Jul 22, 2022 03:43
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ColdPie posted:I think you're on to something here. Some kind of "base" in which to store "data." Anyone have an idea what we might call such technology? i don't know but i've heard you can store that kind of stuff on this "blockchain" thing the news keeps talking about
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Jul 22, 2022 03:46
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No loving Thanks.
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Jul 22, 2022 03:46
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Magmarashi posted:A database that requires you to burn down some trees to prove you mean it "We cut out all the paperwork"
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Jul 22, 2022 03:47
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Achmed Jones posted:no, lady radias right. the fact that the nft space is scam central doesn't change the fact that if a reputable system of record - say the smithsonian - would allow artists to register their works, artists could point to that ledger as an easy way to prove ownership. it'd be nice. this is what non-crypto-weirdo artists think that the nft dweebs are talking about (but they aren't, they're grifting as you say). such nfts would be good for artists. the fact that current nft implementations are full of scammers and cryptocurrency nonsense is quite beside the point Though you/they are correct that having an international body that assisted artists in asserting the right to their work would be helpful. It's just fundamentally unrelated.
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Jul 22, 2022 03:55
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It's funny that all this NFT talk hasn't also mentioned that you can just avoid royalty fees. Like NFTs can't enforce royalties and it's a whole thing.
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Jul 22, 2022 03:59
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Can't believe Square Enix sold FFXIV to buy 3 NFTs
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Jul 22, 2022 04:04
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Dieting Hippo posted:you can do this without NFTs. it's called a database. NFTs are just a database with extra steps. yes i literally said that like three posts up
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Jul 22, 2022 05:22
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Terrible Opinions posted:It would also be a normal database instead of an append only ledger that everyone has to have a full copy of to verify. correct
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Jul 22, 2022 05:24
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Terrible Opinions posted:It would also be a normal database instead of an append only ledger that everyone has to have a full copy of to verify. The very nature of blockchain stuff makes fixing mistakes or in this case mistaken attribution/fraud impossible to fix without convincing the person who has stolen the work on purpose or by accident to voluntarily give it back to the rightful owner. yeah i dont think the current implementation of nfts or anything is good. but there was a kernel of a real problem->solution there at one point. kind of like how transparent contracts and poo poo on the internet is good, but ethereum is just for buying crack instead. c'est la vie Magmarashi posted:That is hilariously out of touch with reality, NFts have just as much, if not more, of a problem with wholesale art theft as t-shirt/merch farms ur wrong sorry. but i still hope u have a good evening 
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Jul 22, 2022 05:54
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Lady Radia posted:yeah i dont think the current implementation of nfts or anything is good. but there was a kernel of a real problem->solution there at one point. kind of like how transparent contracts and poo poo on the internet is good, but ethereum is just for buying crack instead. c'est la vie What non current implementation are you even thinking of or are you just equating NFT being offered as a solution to a real problem as NFT being a solution at all to anything ever? Cause it never was/is/will be. NFT is a solution in desperate search of a problem to solve.
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Jul 22, 2022 06:06
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Lady Radia posted:
Nigerian prince scams would be a great way to get cash if only they were implemented in a different way.
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Jul 22, 2022 06:13
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MadHat posted:What non current implementation are you even thinking of or are you just equating NFT being offered as a solution to a real problem as NFT being a solution at all to anything ever?
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Jul 22, 2022 06:18
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Lady Radia posted:but there's a reason artists were really hype for it at the very start Yes, the reason is their eyes were clouded.
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Jul 22, 2022 06:33
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There is a real problem but NFTs are not a solution and cannot be by design. It is not a neutral technology being misused by scammers, the technology itself is not capable of what the scammers claimed it to be. Artists who were excited for it were lied to, full stop.
Clarste fucked around with this message at 06:41 on Jul 22, 2022 |
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Jul 22, 2022 06:38
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Lady Radia posted:yeah i dont think the current implementation of nfts or anything is good. but there was a kernel of a real problem->solution there at one point. kind of like how transparent contracts and poo poo on the internet is good, but ethereum is just for buying crack instead. c'est la vie NFTs are not The Force there is no Light Side of the NFT that is good and helpful, it was all dumb bullshit just like the blockchain and bitcoin. The only way they could be good is if in violation of all laws of physics they produced the energy that they currently used for each transaction.
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Jul 22, 2022 06:51
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Achmed Jones posted:no, lady radias right. the fact that the nft space is scam central doesn't change the fact that if a reputable system of record - say the smithsonian - would allow artists to register their works, artists could point to that ledger as an easy way to prove ownership. it'd be nice. this is what non-crypto-weirdo artists think that the nft dweebs are talking about (but they aren't, they're grifting as you say). such nfts would be good for artists. the fact that current nft implementations are full of scammers and cryptocurrency nonsense is quite beside the point I mean, that's what we already do with things like Land Registry, Bank Accounts, Birth Registers or Criminal Records. Maybe there's something to that 'centralised authority' thing after all.
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Jul 22, 2022 08:14
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