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Lotus Aura posted:He has to have watched Meen according to this (honestly, I doubt he tracked Meen to begin with because hey that means wolo "knew" Meen lied about 2 targets since he'd only get to Hal and then also that he knew Meen lied about being blocked but neither of those pertinent details ever came up despite being extremely relevant). So then Meen got jailed, right? Well, no. Wind, Hal and Meen all confirm to the contrary. So then Wolo got jailed? Easy enough to confirm. Wind is the jailer so she'd know if she did that. The claims around wologar's results bother me too. Both halves of it: If wologar really tracked Meen N1, he would know who he targeted (Hal + Lotus). He might not have known about the one that failed (Lotus), depending on how the mods report failures to a tracker, but he should have known Meen was lying and he didn't mention any of this. But the failure last night is even weirder, like you said. Another factor here is that binus claims to have given wologar an invention last night, and it sounds like that action was successful. So either wologar wasn't jailed, or binus is lying about gifting that invention.
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Nov 14, 2022 10:10
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As a point of order ots possible wologar got the item but because he was, you know, dead he can't use it Unless wolo being jailed was specifically mentioned but that makes today weirder. I'm about 80% on binus just being a scum amnesiac.
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Nov 14, 2022 10:13
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Monathin posted:As a point of order ots possible wologar got the item but because he was, you know, dead he can't use it Yes, that's the most straightforward possibility. But then he certainly wasn't jailed (or binus couldn't have given him an invention), but binus still says wologar's action failed, which implies the existence of a second roleblocker. But I feel like we would've seen more actions failing, both D1 and D2, if that was the case. And that's on top of the setup spec aspect of it.
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Nov 14, 2022 10:20
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:D1 and D2 Maf edit: N1 and N2, obviously.
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Nov 14, 2022 10:21
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:But I feel like we would've seen more actions failing, both D1 and D2, if that was the case. Has anybody claimed having a night action fail last night at all?
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Nov 14, 2022 10:56
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My Second Re-Reg posted:Has anybody claimed having a night action fail last night at all? Binus claims wologar's action failed, nobody else has said anything as far as I can see.
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Nov 14, 2022 10:59
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Oh, I just realized shwinn hadn't checked in yet, so there is possibly that. But I think only one person said their action failed D1 (Lotus), and that was confirmed to be because of Wind's jail?
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Nov 14, 2022 11:46
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Monathin posted:Hey, Windward; who did you jail last night and why? Nobody. I can only jail on odd nights.
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Nov 14, 2022 13:18
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Monathin posted:Binus' role might be legitimate but the way he's talked about it makes me think he's scum still. What kind of scum role can talk to uninformed dead players, though? I've never seen a scum medium.
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Nov 14, 2022 13:20
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Votecount for Day 3  Lotus Aura (1): b-minus1 b-minus1 (1): Monathin, Not Voting (7): Hal Insandenza, Hyper Crab Tank, Ignatius M. Meen, Monathin, My Second Re-Reg, shwinnebego, WindwardAwayWith 9 alive, it's 5 votes to execute. The current deadline is November 15th, 2022 at 4 p.m. CST -- that's in about 1 day, 8 hours.
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Nov 14, 2022 14:54
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Oh yeah I forgot about shwinn. I still think mona is scum. But lotus is 100% percent scum. Lotus Hct Shwinn Mona In that order
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Nov 14, 2022 15:47
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:Yes, that's the most straightforward possibility. But then he certainly wasn't jailed (or binus couldn't have given him an invention), but binus still says wologar's action failed, which implies the existence of a second roleblocker. But I feel like we would've seen more actions failing, both D1 and D2, if that was the case. And that's on top of the setup spec aspect of it. I guess this could come down to an order of operations thing from the mods. Or I guess people without active actions could be getting hit by a roleblocker but I think the first is more likely.
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Nov 14, 2022 16:12
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b-minus1 posted:Oh yeah I forgot about shwinn. I still think mona is scum. But lotus is 100% percent scum. Just to be clear here, your Lotus read is not based off info you have from your role, but just your personal read? Because now that you've sort of explained things more it doesn't seem like you would know anything about Lotus's role.
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Nov 14, 2022 16:17
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b-minus1 posted:Oh yeah I forgot about shwinn. I still think mona is scum. But lotus is 100% percent scum. I don't think Lotus is scum
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Nov 14, 2022 16:21
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I can't say I'm enthused with being on binus's scum list, but I will say that Windward has a point that talking to the dead doesn't feel like a scum role. I would like answers to whatever you were doing with that "day action" stuff though. I don't know why you have shwinn on the list, there is virtually nothing to go on there in terms of content, and I'd like to hear the explanation for that as well. Right now we seem to have binus pointing at Mona and Lotus, and both of them pointing at binus. I think there has to be scum somewhere in binus, Monathin and Lotus; between the Cloaca pileup, weird posts on Illusionis, and all the other stuff we already went through yesterday (and I can't dredge up right now since I'm still at work) there's way more irregularities in this group than anywhere else, even whatever is happening between Meen and Hal. But I really don't think it can be all three of them, at most two, but I'd lean more towards one. Among them, I think Lotus has seemed the scummiest to me so far. I'm not even sure I buy the gunsmith/empowerer claim anymore. Like, both of those things are completely impossible to verify since Lotus was jailed N1, and nobody was apparently jailed N2. And if wologar was blocked, he certainly wasn't also empowered or his action wouldn't have failed.
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Nov 14, 2022 16:42
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Hal Insandenza posted:Just to be clear here, your Lotus read is not based off info you have from your role, but just your personal read? Because now that you've sort of explained things more it doesn't seem like you would know anything about Lotus's role. Personal read. I find it unlikely that two townies are trying to get me lunched. I’m not sure why lotus is still alive. I could have missed it because I skimmed a lot of posts yesterday, but has his role provided any useful information?
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Nov 14, 2022 16:42
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Eh I just remembered he was jailed n1
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Nov 14, 2022 16:43
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:posts on Illusionis Maf edit: votes. b-minus1 posted:Personal read. I find it unlikely that two townies are trying to get me lunched. I’m not sure why lotus is still alive. I could have missed it because I skimmed a lot of posts yesterday, but has his role provided any useful information? Lotus was jailed N1 and performed an unverifiable action N2. But scum can just claim whatever power if they were jailed and nobody will know any different.
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Nov 14, 2022 16:44
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At the very least, I believe Lotus's claim to an extent I'll talk more about it later but I'm busy packing my suitcases today and ill have time to kill at the airport tomorrow for longwinded posts. Gonna keep it a bit shorter today and pop in when I can instead, and do most of my thought dumping tomorrow.
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Nov 14, 2022 17:08
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WindwardAway posted:At the very least, I believe Lotus's claim to an extent I do think gunsmith and empowerer are pretty safe fakeclaims, unusual enough roles that there is a good chance you won't be counterclaimed and very hard to verify if they actually are being used. Empowerer could be real and a scum role too.
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Nov 14, 2022 17:38
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Hal Insandenza posted:I do think gunsmith and empowerer are pretty safe fakeclaims, unusual enough roles that there is a good chance you won't be counterclaimed and very hard to verify if they actually are being used. Empowerer could be real and a scum role too. You have a point, yeah It's more the thing Lotus said about the empower action being a byproduct of something. I'm pretty sure I know what it is. Unfortunately the rest of their claim isn't really verifiable, but that part is specific and I believe it's not made up.
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Nov 14, 2022 17:41
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i'm a passive doctor, anyone who visits me at night gets a big HUG and will survive a nightkill action
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Nov 14, 2022 18:02
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my song was "Here comes a special boy" by freezepop, a real banger bh
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Nov 14, 2022 18:03
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what's the case on lotus what's the case on hct yesterday i thought that if clo or hct was scum the other one was likely scum too. don't remember exactly why i thought that, but either way clo flipped town. does that make hct less likely to be scum in ya'lls view
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Nov 14, 2022 18:04
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shwinnebego posted:what's the case on lotus I don't think it tells us too much about HCT really. I guess the adage that it is unlikely two town were up would indicate HCT is more likely scum but I don't totally buy into that. I have not really read HCT as scum personally
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Nov 14, 2022 18:24
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Hal, have you claimed anything at all about your role yet?
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Nov 14, 2022 19:11
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I'm going to collect the role claims we have so far: Me: write a message in the day if desired, wander to two random people at night, one-shot dirty socks vig. That mark has been placed so I can only wander around at night or shoot my mark in the day (so long as we both shall live). Windward: updated only today to odd nights jailer. previously just claimed jailer. noting for completeness' sake, don't think this is AI for now per fair town obfuscation protocols. I'm presuming she does nothing on even nights unless clarified otherwise. monathin: BP that requires reaching some sort of vote threshold to charge. No other night activity claimed. Lotus: gunsmith odd nights, empowerer even nights originally. if their mystery partner dies, they become vanilla. claimed to have guessed their partner and lost the empowerer part, so now only an odd nights gunsmith. shwin: passive doctor, only protects those who visit him. binus: masons dead players at night. claims to have gathered solid intel on night bingo from the dead players. This leaves HCT, Hal, and MSRR as unclaimed. Thoughts so far: Lotta empty spaces! Can't say I'm a fan of that, but that's just how it is sometimes. My Second Re-Reg posted:Hal, have you claimed anything at all about your role yet? He has not and I don't like that either.
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Nov 14, 2022 19:19
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The case post(s) I've been working on are... taking their time to come together. And, tbf, anybody who's anticipating something on the level of my cases from prior games might end up slightly disappointed. But I will go ahead and share The Forbidden Knowledge that makes me believe b's "I see dead people" claim: I am a narcissist with way too much free time on their hands, who keeps Discord running p much 24/7 for both work and personal reasons. When Illusionis died, I thought it was strange it took them so long to join obs chat - you can tell who has and who hasn't ascended by looking at the user list for the server, and Illusionis just stayed in their confessional for... almost a day? Something like that. I knew that wasn't down to Maer or Shell, because they're both on the ball about this sort of thing, so I figured maybe Illusionis was just AFK for a bit and didn't know they had died, or was busy IRL with something. Either way, some time toward the end of N1/start of D2, I noticed Illusionis had finally joined obs chat. Cool. Then Bif died. And the same thing happened. For, like, waaaaaaaaaaaay longer than it should have. Bif? Not joining obs chat? For... days?? I literally almost asked the mod team in my confessional "Hey, has anyone heard from/seen Bif? Is she ok?" - Because I know drat good and well Bif ain't gonna get that salty at a Mafia game as to not at least see who the gently caress scum was, so maybe Bif had a heart attack or smth, how would I know? But, no, it couldn't be a case of Bif being offline or unable to post, I saw Bif posting in another game thread while still carrying the same purple role color on Discord. It just didn't make any sense. Then, finally, Bif ascended. All was right with the world. ...... but then the same thing happened with Cloaca. And, from what I can tell, on a much shorter time frame, wolo. Every single player that's died so far has taken their sweetass time joining obs chat, and the timing fits with b's claim about being able to chat with the dead.
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Nov 14, 2022 19:41
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binus' claimed intel... wolo would have totally called BS on me if he'd tracked me N1. I can't believe he would have sat on that at the time, he'd have seen I visited Hal for sure. That point alone removes my former hesitation to vote binus. I'd thought he was a Seeker but I'm clearly wrong (which, sure, different songs in the rotation, but Party Host showing up again made me say "maybe others showed up again too"). shwin's passive doctor claim is.... one of the worst doctor types I've ever heard of. Worse is easy, a random wandering weak doctor for instance, but this takes the cake in terms of doctor types I've seen actually deployed. I have no idea what the gently caress the hypothetical utility of this would be; if there were a lot more people stumbling around unable to control their targets, sure, but so far I'm the only one who's claimed that. Lotus by comparison... IDK. I'm still having trouble seeing what other people are seeing there, but if they were flipped it'd help fill out D1 voting patterns more. Hal, you were right and I did mark you. You should claim this game day if for no other reason than if I'm dead tomorrow you'll be a prime suspect with that reveal.
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Nov 14, 2022 19:53
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My Second Re-Reg posted:The case post(s) I've been working on are... taking their time to come together. And, tbf, anybody who's anticipating something on the level of my cases from prior games might end up slightly disappointed. This seems all well and good except the part where the night bingo claim re: wolo just doesn't make sense. b-minus1 posted:Illusionis had no night action obviously Wolo or his target being jailed makes sense if Wind is scum and lying about being an odd nights jailer today, but it does NOT fit with what the result would be N1, that I visited Hal only. I don't believe he'd have waited on that intel. There's simply no way, not with being convinced I was a liar already.
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Nov 14, 2022 20:10
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I can't claim the rest is accurate, I just believe b when it comes to the whole "can interact with the dead" bit.
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Nov 14, 2022 20:14
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I think b- is right about his role but also could ne lying about how it's being interpreted. I would buy a weird Medium+Amnesiac combo that let's binus copy a role of a dead player (since what he is claiming is basically Bif's power). If he knows night actions its only the night actions that his dead partner have been telling him and even that seems suspect given wologar. passive doctor sounds plausible but I agree w/Meen it could be one of the weakest Docs I've ever seen if so. But a lot of visiting roles have flipped.
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Nov 14, 2022 20:45
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Hal Insandenza posted:I don't think it tells us too much about HCT really. I guess the adage that it is unlikely two town were up would indicate HCT is more likely scum but I don't totally buy into that. I have not really read HCT as scum personally Looking back at it, I don't think it tells us anything negative about HCT at all, really. He was up there as a candidate, sure, but so was binus and Mona. Heck, binus was even vote leader until MSRR pushed Mona making it switch from binus/Cloacamazing!/HCT to Cloacamazing!/Mona/HCT and then HCT just dropped off entirely as we got closer to deadline. With how that push changed things up, I'm inclined to say that HCT is probably fine there. Mona as a possible scum works in theory, sure, but he did self-vote to trigger his claimed BP which ended up with him sitting at -1 right by deadline is a real risky move for scum to do so brazenly and then opening today by immediately voting binus near enough the instant the day opens doesn't gel with Mona being scum either. So, at the risk of looking like I'm tunnelling here, I'm inclined to say that if anyone looks bad from that it's binus (and presumably also MSRR by association) for the way that late push saved him specifically. HCT just dropped off from being the 3rd place candidate right near deadline so votes swiched to Cloacamazing!/Mona to try and get one through. I also can't help but find it incredibly conspicuous that binus was the only person who wasn't voting for either Cloacamazing! or Mona by the end after catching flak for voting Illu, "forgetting" to unvote/randomly vote someone else and then claiming he knew all along that Illu was town.
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Nov 14, 2022 20:46
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Thank you, Lotus. 
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Nov 14, 2022 21:01
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I would also like Hal to claim if for no other reason than Meen has confirmed Hal is the dayvig target.
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Nov 14, 2022 21:05
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I agree. Hal, whatcha been up to?
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Nov 14, 2022 21:37
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It’s scummy af that hal hasn’t claimed anything
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Nov 14, 2022 21:58
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Monathin posted:My general rule of thumb is if it's Day 3 and Hal has not made a notable impression in my mind you should vote Hal because they're scum.
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Nov 14, 2022 22:03
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I won't vote Hal today because I suspect that Meen might make that irrelevant, but I think the principle applies.
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Nov 14, 2022 22:12
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b-minus1 posted:It’s scummy af that hal hasn’t claimed anything Lol why would that be scummy? I’m an undead backup/grave robber sort of role. I can visit a dead person and absorb their power once per game, I used it last night to absorb bifs power, so I can post a song today and use that to send someone a thing tonight based on that song. Can’t do much to prove that before tomorrow but there you have it
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Nov 14, 2022 22:25
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