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CourValant posted:Hot Dog. THIS IS A KANGAROO COURT, YOUR HNONOR, A KANGAROO COURT.
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Sep 12, 2017 19:11
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Cannon_Fodder posted:THIS IS A KANGAROO COURT, YOUR HNONOR, A KANGAROO COURT.  So, in hindsight I suppose this was inevitable; we've been tromping around the wilderness, 'hunting' things, this was always going to turn into a Courtroom Drama.
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Sep 12, 2017 19:24
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:bandwagonemote:
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Sep 12, 2017 22:13
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Slice of Life On the States of Being Broadly speaking, the Empire legally divides all living beings into one of three categories, presented here in order of relative importance. The Citizen  A citizen is a sentient, living being afforded the rights, duties and privileges of the Empire. Every citizen must have a Birth Certificate and a Death Certificate, that the Imperial Census may keep track of their lives and deaths. In addition to taxes, a citizen is expected to follow regional and Imperial law, to participate in certain religious holidays, to pay (lip or otherwise) service to at least one deity and to celebrate the life of the first Emperor. Finally, a citizen or gathering of citizens is expected to submit to a draft should one be required of them. In return for these duties, the Citizen is afforded the privilege of life in the Empire. Here they can expect a government that works to the em-betterment of all, laws and law bringers that arbitrate disputes, an army to defend them, guilds to occupy them, walls to hide behind and semi direct access to the very God's themselves. Life in the Empire is not without it's difficulties. Indeed, with the recent troubles some say it is no the verge of collapse. But the singular fact remains: it is so much better than the alternative. - The Animal  An animal is a living being of questionable sentience. They are creatures that through various means have been subjugated to bring about prosperity or utility for the Citizen, and in return are given adequate care and protection. Provided, of course, that this does not constitute a threat to the well being of the Empire. The Animal is also tracked by the Census, though not nearly as thoroughly. A citizen filling out some form or other is all that is necessary to keep track of them. - The Monster  Monsters are everything else. They are beings of unknown sentience that in one way or another constitute a threat to the Empire by virtue of their very existence. Monsters have no rights and were originally to be killed on sight. Since that proved impossibly suicidal for most Citizens, the rule has been updated to encourage reporting the encounter to the nearest monster hunting company or guild headquarters instead. If none of those are available, the nearest church. If there are no churches to be found (for example if the monster has already destroyed it) then praying is the only sensible alternative. Monsters are primarily dealt with by the various monster hunting organizations, with Paladins being called in only for the most dangerous assignments. At times, the Imperial Army may be rallied against a particularly thorny foe or infestation, though by the time they arrive it is usually too late for those affected. Monsters are not tracked by the Census, though not for lack of trying. - There is a fourth, unofficial category. Dragons. This is because Dragons can be whatever they want to be, and frankly none of the above can do much to stop them.
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Sep 13, 2017 09:13
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Are there any cases of Citizens becoming Monsters, or otherwise changing status?
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Sep 13, 2017 11:35
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There Bias Two posted:Are there any cases of Citizens becoming Monsters, or otherwise changing status? Excellent question. The above is all that you have gathered so far; your question is one of the avenues of research you will take in the days to come.
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Sep 13, 2017 11:52
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We have documentation but since our legal age is a negative number our status as a citizen is nebulous. We have sentience so we clearly don't fall under the animal category, in fact we're smarter than a lot of citizens. We're obeying the law to the best of our ability and have a proper respect for the gods, so we're no monster. Maybe we're a dragon.
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Sep 13, 2017 12:26
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What about the difference between Monster and Animal? Where would Flopsy rate? What would our Owlbears be if trained?
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Sep 13, 2017 14:38
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Swedish Thaumocracy posted:Slice of Life Two cow carcasses crash messily into an apple cart as three hundred feet of bescaled muscle, fang and talon slam onto Brav's main street cracking flagstone and scattering livestock. Two dozen common folk start briefly and turn their backs on the scene while a guard resignedly walks up to the scaly horror. "HO THERE CITIZEN! WHAT'S THE GOOD NEWS?! CAN I INTEREST YOU IN SOME FINE COW MEAT?!" "Goddammit Gratzgortha the Mighty, Titan of the Western Spine, Last Godslayer of Scale, Blight of the Western Marsh and *sigh* Butcher of Brav, you can't be here! You're a loving dragon, you're not a citizen. gently caress off with this poo poo!" "DID YOU JUST ASSUME MY IMPERIAL STATUS?!"
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Sep 13, 2017 17:37
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Ah ha . . . so the exercise is to prove that we are still a valid Citizen. Let's see if we can get more clarity on: 1) Birth Certificates: Are they ever wrong? How can we correct an error on this document? 2) Shared Custody of a 'Body': This being a 'contract' driven society, I am sure there is a body of law (pardon the pun) governing the custody and ownership of a 'body'. What is the ruling if more than one person claims ownership? 3) Evidence and Witnesses: Can we present evidence, or call witnesses, to 'prove' our case?
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Sep 13, 2017 18:25
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We have a birth certificate, but it is obviously in error. We used to have two birth certificates, but the system has altered them into this new erroneous one. Therefore the system has failed. We should sue.
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Sep 13, 2017 20:18
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So our central problem is an impossible birth certificate. Well, clearly, some dastardly monster destroyed ours and left us with a poor forgery. There must be some provision for the reissue of destroyed certificates. Perhaps a priest or hospital from our hometown has us listed on a birth registry. That, alongside the testimony of confirmed citizens and a suitable 'processing fee' should have us set to rights.
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Sep 13, 2017 20:28
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Are outlaws considered a Monster? What happens when a citizen that becomes a threat to the state. It's entirely possible that through our willful tampering with reality we have directly corrupted right and lawful Imperial process of the Census. We are also not an Imperial Citizen yet as our certificate is not valid yet. Honestly the birth and death notices along with omnipresent gods hints that the first Emperor did something fucky with the world and seemingly trapped everyone in some sort of reality bubble where things "Just Work".
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Sep 13, 2017 20:28
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Arkanomen posted:Honestly the birth and death notices along with omnipresent gods hints that the first Emperor did something fucky with the world and seemingly trapped everyone in some sort of reality bubble where things "Just Work". I like this idea. The Wall isn't to keep the bad things out, its to keep us locked in. The rest is just a shell game to keep us as chattel. @Swedish: I just thought of something, how deep down does The Wall go? Since we know there's an Under-Dark, does it extend through the wall perimeter?
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Sep 13, 2017 20:36
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sheep-dodger posted:What about the difference between Monster and Animal? Where would Flopsy rate? What would our Owlbears be if trained? Though any sane person would classify Flopsy as a monster; the fact that the Lord of Braav has apparently tamed it coupled with the fact that no one has been sent to kill it indicates that he somehow managed to get the proper paperwork filed in order to have it considered an animal. Owlbears are technically monsters, but right now the cubs classify as 'salvage', and will continue to be classified as such until you get a trainer and begin their domestication. -- CourValant posted:1) Birth Certificates: Are they ever wrong? How can we correct an error on this document? 1: No. They are artifacts of Divine Origin. They cannot be falsified or lost. 2: That body of government, if any, would be the Census. As far as you know there are no Citizens with more than one personality per body, aside from you. 3: You can try? -- Added Space posted:There must be some provision for the reissue of destroyed certificates. Perhaps a priest or hospital from our hometown has us listed on a birth registry. That, alongside the testimony of confirmed citizens and a suitable 'processing fee' should have us set to rights. As far as you know, all the documentation surrounding your birth would exist as copies at the Census Archive in Karg. This is probably why they took you here to begin with. -- Arkanomen posted:Are outlaws considered a Monster? What happens when a citizen that becomes a threat to the state. Outlaws are considered Citizens. Recall how you killed one a few days ago and all the trouble that caused you. As far as you know, nothing can cause you to loose citizenship. Being 'Exiled' does not oust you from the Empire, merely part of it. See: how you can never go back to Tukatt Hold even though you are free to roam Daalig like any other citizen. When a Citizen becomes a problem they are either sent to work the fields in some remote region or sent to work in some really remote region. Sometimes troublesome citizen can incur the Wrath of the Gods with all that that entails, most often having a Paladin sent after them or daemons, depending on the crime. For less serious offenses, fines are common. The Corporal Punishment is not practiced as far as you know. Neither is incarceration. Prisoners are put to use, everyone is always needed. Especially now, after the appearance of The Forest Swedish Thaumocracy fucked around with this message at 22:09 on Sep 13, 2017 |
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Sep 13, 2017 22:07
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Swedish Thaumocracy posted:1: No. They are artifacts of Divine Origin. They cannot be falsified or lost. But can apparently be altered through metaphysical means. It's going to take a lot of work to get this done. I'm sure Toil will like that.
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Sep 13, 2017 22:46
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Swedish Thaumocracy posted:As far as you know there are no Citizens with more than one personality per body, aside from you.
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Sep 14, 2017 01:40
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Swedish Thaumocracy posted:Sometimes troublesome citizen can incur the Wrath of the Gods with all that that entails, most often having a Paladin sent after them or daemons, depending on the crime. Can you expand on what daemons are and their behavior? I don't think they've been mentioned in game up to now.
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Sep 14, 2017 04:05
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B
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Sep 14, 2017 05:01
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There Bias Two posted:Are there any cases of Citizens becoming Monsters, or otherwise changing status? I feel Vampires could potentially present this problem if they turn round and decide gently caress it, Castlevania life yo You know some poor scribe is gonna have to reclassify every single document a century old being has/been mentioned in
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Sep 14, 2017 05:46
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Numeron posted:Can you expand on what daemons are and their behavior? I don't think they've been mentioned in game up to now. Daemons are divine agents sent out into the world to hinder, as opposed to Angels which are divine agents sent out into the world to aid. You met one in one of your first missions. -- HBar posted:So conjoined twins either don't exist or aren't something we've heard about? If they do you have never heard of it. If such a thing were to occur, the authorities would probably look at their Birth Certificate and move on from there. Medical technology is in a very weird place in Rim, in some ways far more advanced than in our world and in many ways inferior. Fatal injuries can be cured within minutes with the right application of slime and or prayer, but if you ask someone what a fever is they will still spout the old philosophy of the imbalance of the humors.
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Sep 14, 2017 06:42
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Slice of Life Transitioning With the three legal categories of life thus established, the question soon follows: how is movement between them accomplished? The first thing that pops into your mind, and indeed that of any scholar worth xir salt, is the legend of the Goddess Porphyria.  In those not so ancient days before the Empire, when the powers that were still ruled the lands and plagued the living with their petty squabbles, one of them unleashed a terrible curse amongst the followers of her rivals. A disease that struck not at the flesh but at the mind, leaving no marks upon the sufferers but rather on the victims that they in turn rendered as unto death under the cover of night. That some of those struck would, weeks later, rise from shallow graves, robbed of will aught but that of their sires, did nothing to improve the situation.  Fearing that this curse would be their end, a conclave of godlings united as one and countered Porphyrias curse with one of their own: The Wrath of the Sun. No longer impervious, the Vampyr plague abated and those affected that still held onto some shred of sanity vanished, content to bide their time until the age of gods was over. Still, they proved quiet a bother for the fledgling empire, right up until the point were the first order of Paladins were created and given the task to end the threat once and for all. As the Paladins were armed with the knowledge and power of omnipresent deities, there was in truth nowhere for the remaining vampires to hide. The burgeoning masquerade was shattered, the uncompromising slaughtered and the rest made to bend the knee. They would devote their lives to the Empire, and when the day came that the vengeful God's decreed: they would perish. Thus did vampires go from rampant monster to cowed animal, and from thence after generations to citizen. The modern vampire is either one of the original who now follows the imperial creed, or, more likely, a childer of their whom the Empire has forced them to embrace. Think of it as a really expensive and luxurious pension plan. When the Empire finds your services indispensable, they can go to quiet some lengths to make sure you stick around to dispense them. --- Another famous example is the common household slime, once a not so dreaded predator of swamplands everywhere.  With the advent of Slimegeneering though, the once bothersome pests were domesticated and put to all kinds of uses, from medicine and alchemy to architecture and mass production. It is likely that the very boat that brought you to Karg, a river going steamboat, works of off the excess of labour produced by the controlled decontainment of separately held fire and water slimes. -- The rest, as they say, is history. Though the Empire of our day covers the entire world*, it was not always so. When Rim first traveled the lands he did so on his own, picking up followers as he went. You have already heard some of the stories, mostly those of how he subjugated various deityforms, but there are other less epic but perhaps equally important tales regarding first encounters with new people's. Though the details always differ, the pattern of the stories remain the same. A people are found and then convinced that their best interest aligns with the Empire, and thus the groups merge into a greater whole. You are of course aware of the big four and small two, the races that make up the majority of citizens in the Empire. Dwarrov, Drow, Duck, dHumans, halflings and gnomes. Of the minorities, you have thus far met but one: fair lady Skvababt of the tribe of frogs. It is likely her people faced the same deal as all others: join us or be destroyed.
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Sep 14, 2017 18:23
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Swedish Thaumocracy posted:. . . join us or be destroyed. So, Rome. Rim is the Roman Empire, and his order is the Pax Rim'ana. And now, the Barbarians are at the Gate.
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Sep 14, 2017 19:27
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Work Work Work Mini -Update You spend your days researching and your evenings, working. Karg has never seen a shortage of work, at least not in the twenty years since the appearance of the Forest. The Daalig Region, the northeastern most in all the land is seen by most as a safe haven of sorts owing in part to its proximity to the Wall and River and in part to the fact that it's on the opposite edge of the world from the incursion point. Tens of thousands of refugees, hailing from every part of the Empire made their way here in perilous caravans, limited in size and intensity only by rigorous paperwork and horrible monsters. But even their labour was not enough to sate the thirst of the land, nor repair the damage caused to Karg in battles past. Living at the edge has never been easy. The closer one gets to the wall, the darker the skies glows and the more hostile grows the land. Water not directly siphoned from the river has a tendency to evaporate and the city is constantly battered by storms. Karg is not so much a city as a series of vast, layered fortresses with every inch covered with either defenses or crops. All necessary for it's inhabitants survival. Even for you, semipaperless, work is easy to find. Pay slightly less so. Toil helps those who help themselves, it is said, and so the local temple is not in fact a building so much as a mobile, scared construction site. When you work what needs doing in one of the areas designated by the church, be it moving rubble, demolishing ruined parts of the city wall or even just delivering paperwork to the site overseer, the pangs of your hunger abate, for a time. You are sustained In this way your first days of waiting have passed.
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Sep 15, 2017 08:35
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What is the construction site scared of?
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Sep 15, 2017 12:40
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Waci posted:What is the construction site scared of? Procrastination.
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Sep 15, 2017 12:47
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There Bias Two posted:Procrastination. That and Typoes, dread kobold of the north.
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Sep 15, 2017 14:07
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Do we have enough money to last the week?
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Sep 15, 2017 14:10
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Volmarias posted:Do we have enough money to last the week? All of ITECs assets where frozen, and besides which you do not exist so you couldn't get at them even if they had not been. You work to survive, nothing more, at least until the hearing. What you possess include the following: [Inventory] You possess a Standard Issue Imperial Indentured Workers Uniform You possess a Temporary Pass, identifying you as Kvelgrim IronIronscriptscript and little else. It allows you passage throughout the city of Karg but prohibits travel outside its walls. You possess a letter from the Imperial Census, informing you of the date and time of your first hearing, as well as the location you are expected to be at when that time comes. You possess an inkwell, a quill and several pieces of parchment.
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Sep 15, 2017 14:59
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Let me rephrase; are we working for subsistence wages, or can we save any and spend time on research?
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Sep 15, 2017 15:18
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Volmarias posted:Let me rephrase; are we working for subsistence wages, or can we save any and spend time on research? We're not getting wages at all. We're working and that magically fills our belly.
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Sep 15, 2017 15:28
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There Bias Two posted:We're not getting wages at all. We're working and that magically fills our belly. This is broadly speaking correct, though the effect is Divine in origin rather than "Magic" an absurd notion and smething that obviously doesn't exist despite all the evidence to the contrary. However; whilst the blessing does sustain you, it is not perfect. You could not keep this up forever without or even for very long without some additional source of energy.
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Sep 15, 2017 16:24
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Swedish Thaumocracy posted:This is broadly speaking correct, though the effect is Divine in origin rather than "Magic" an absurd notion and smething that obviously doesn't exist despite all the evidence to the contrary. You'd think for a god who prides itself on hard work, that it wouldn't do a half-rear end job when it comes to Divinely nourishing his followers....
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Sep 15, 2017 16:28
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Maybe you should work harder then.  To be clear; you are currently spending your days in research and evenings at work, with a few hours of dreamless sleep in between each. You could easily tilt the balance one way or the other, should you desire other results. Fortunately for all of us, your hearing is coming up in just a few days so one way or another you wont be at this for too long.
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Sep 15, 2017 16:36
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I don't suppose its possible to get some higher value-add work with all of our Accountancy expertise? Would really like to not show up to 'court' looking like the starving slave that we are.
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Sep 15, 2017 19:22
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CourValant posted:I don't suppose its possible to get some higher value-add work with all of our Accountancy expertise? Perhaps it would be, but you never finished your apprenticeship, indeed it was declare null and void with the exile of your Master. Even if that hadn't been the case, you simply don't have the paperwork to prove your claims. But perhaps you could convince the Overseer to let you 'Count Good' if you put some more hours in to catch him off-guard.
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Sep 15, 2017 20:08
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Swedish Thaumocracy posted:But perhaps you could convince the Overseer to let you 'Count Good' if you put some more hours in to catch him off-guard. Trade-offs, gotcha. So, its 2-3 days before the hearing? I propose we dedicate more time to 'work' so that we can get a change of clothes and a full stomach in time for our 'Court' date.
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Sep 15, 2017 20:49
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CourValant posted:Trade-offs, gotcha. We should probably try to find a decent room to rent for the evening before the trial so we can be better rested, as well. Material things to prepare for the hearing: 1. Better/clean set of clothes 2. A full belly 3. A decent nights rest before the hearing
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Sep 15, 2017 23:10
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Some rear end in a top hat has our cupcakes. They better not eat one.
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Sep 18, 2017 20:15
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Cannon_Fodder posted:Some rear end in a top hat has our cupcakes. Maybe that should be our new business model? Forget this pain in back Monster Hunting, we are now purveyors of fine Heck, we'll also be job creators, just pay out bounties for each Ethereal Rimrose brought in, no questions asked!
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Sep 18, 2017 20:54
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