az jan jananam posted:

One of President Morsi's final quotes will seriously be "it's a trap"...

Ardennes posted:

The alternatives are the military, a hodgepodge of former NDP supporter and secular liberals and Salafists. None of them will actually address the very real economic problems of Egypt, since all 4 sides embrace some form of neo-liberal capitalism.

Ham posted:

Sacrifice is not sacrificing some for others, when we declare Jihad we declare it against external enemies of the nation, not against our own people. If our legitimacy will end up costing my blood then I accept that. Don't be tricked. Don't fall into the trap. I am just making it clear for you. We have many challenges ahead of us. We can's take the bait to go against legitimacy in actions that would be considered illegal under my legitimacy, taking the country in dark uncertain directions.

Any and all change will happen within the scope of my legitimacy, and my legitimacy only.

Some people and institutions are not important when considering the future of our country, our children, our police, our army.

Know that actions are measured, and god only wants what's good for Egypt. I know this of god, and I know this of you, and of the world around us. We are the people of Egypt and we should be one body, one revolution.

Nilbop posted:

Where are people watching this? This is a man unhinged.

az jan jananam posted:

It's done, it was all over Arab media. I don't know if any English media were broadcasting it.

Amused to Death posted:

BM, or anyone else, do you have any good Egypt specific twitters to follow for news

Phlegmish posted:

The sharp distinction that is being made between 'culture' and 'religion' doesn't make much sense. A nation's culture and the worldview of its inhabitants are at least partly shaped by its traditional religious beliefs, even if it's currently a secular society - the same way Protestantism left its mark on modern Scandinavia.

No, Islam doesn't directly lead to misogyny for the simple reason that it doesn't have an independent existence as an ultimate cause or as a monolithic concept, it is something that exists only in specific societies and in specific people's heads as a collection of rituals, attitudes and beliefs. Different societies will interpret and adapt it in different ways, which is why there's such a huge difference between Albania and Afghanistan. You're right that it's a multi-dimensional phenomenon.
At the same time, the form that Islam does take in much of the muslim world definitely shows a pronounced misogynistic streak, and particularly among devout muslims. To return to your example, if Albania is relatively liberal by muslim standards, it's because it's a mostly secular society where religion isn't seen as particularly important to begin with. Taking all of this into consideration, I don't think there's anything wrong with pointing that there's a correlation between misogyny and the intensity of people's Islamic beliefs.

Xandu posted:

Egypt isn't really an oil-based economy like the Gulf.

Michael Ross posted:

The region’s oil wealth has also had an indirect influence on women in some of the oilpoor states. Even though Yemen, Egypt, and Jordan have little or no oil, they have fewer women in the labor force [figure 5] and parliament [figure 6] than we might expect. These anomalies may be partly the result of labor remittances: from the 1970s to the 1990s, these countries were the largest exporters of labor to the oil-rich countries of the Persian Gulf, and received large remittances from them in turn. Between 1974 and 1982, official remittances made up between 22 and 69 percent of Yemen’s GDP, between 10 and 31 percent of Jordan’s GDP, and between 3 and 13 percent of Egypt’s GDP; unofficial remittances were probably much larger [Choucri 1986]. Remittances tend to have the same effects as oil on the supply of female labor, by raising unearned household income; they may also have a similar effect on the demand for female labor by raising the exchange rate and making low-wage, export-oriented manufacturing uncompetitive. Yemen is farther below the trend lines for female labor and female representation than any other Mideast country; it has also received more remittances (as a fraction of GDP) than any other country.

Lawman 0 posted:

Actually come to think of it the other north african arab states seem rather progressive compared to Egypt.
Am I wrong?

quote:

Oil production helps explain much of this intra-regional variation. Figures 4, 5, and 6 are scatterplots that show the relationship between oil rents per capita (averaged over 1993-2002) and the first year of female suffrage, female (nonagricultural) labor force participation, and the fraction of parliamentary seats held by women, for each state in the region. In general, the states that are richest in oil (Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Bahrain, United Arab Emirates, and Oman) have been the most reluctant to grant female suffrage, have the fewest women in their parliaments, and have the fewest women in their nonagricultural workforce. States with little or no oil (Morocco, Tunisia, Lebanon, Syria, Djibouti) were the first to grant female suffrage and tend to have more women in parliament and the workplace.

Squalid posted:

Ham posted:

It's done. Morsi will likely be dead within the day.

The Egyptian people will kill their first elected president.

Squalid posted:

Bleh. I don't care what you say about Islam, As long as you support it with evidence! If you're going to make a claim like this you drat well better have something to back it up. If you made it without seeing the correlation first, why are you so certain of it's truth? If you're just going to sit back and patiently explain how religion and culture are interrelated and you can't separate islam from arab patriarchy, well that's fine. I'm going to call you a racist moron, though, and unlike your assertions mine will have plenty of evidence to back them up.

Really I wouldn't be surprised if I'm completely wrong and there are actual correlations between professed Islamic religiosity and conservative attitudes towards women. Just show them to me, cross check attitudes between cultures and look for confounding variables. Ask yourself where did certain beliefs of yours come from, and are they sources you still trust.






Not at all!

suboptimal posted:

A video showing the shooting of a cop, fighting on behalf of the protesters, apparently by the Brotherhood. I never thought I'd hear automatic weapon fire in the streets of motherfucking Cairo.

http://youtu.be/LAI6ORPtEQc

suboptimal posted:

A video showing the shooting of a cop, fighting on behalf of the protesters, apparently by the Brotherhood. I never thought I'd hear automatic weapon fire in the streets of motherfucking Cairo.

http://youtu.be/LAI6ORPtEQc

ABC News (Australia) posted:

Brotherhood spokeswoman Alla Mustafa is calling on patriotic Egyptians to defend their new-found democracy.

"Today all Egyptians patriotic will defend this people's will and the democracy that they were all dreaming to have from the revolution," he said.

Cirofren posted:

Also:


This seems like the brotherhood are just fanning the flames, where are they trying to take this?

Volkerball posted:

The good news is that the governments legitimacy is intact.

Zeroisanumber posted:

Crosspost from the pictures thread. What it looks like to be in the helicopter near Tahrir Square that's getting tagged by all of those laser lights.

VikingSkull posted:

I have a sinking feeling this isn't going to be as bloodless as the last go-around. I know that the original revolution was pretty violent, but camel charges are gonna be replaced by gunshots this time.

I hope I'm wrong.

az jan jananam posted:

There is truth to what Morsi is saying when he says that his government is legitimate, and that legitimacy is a key issue here. He was elected by a majority of Egyptians in the fairest elections that Egypt has had in decades; the fact that he is grossly incompetent doesn't change that. If this coup happens it sets a rather poor precedent where Islamists get the message that gaining and retaining power through democratic institutions isn't actually a viable option, and that it might be better to simply return to the guerrilla/terrorism campaign of the 80s/90s. Which is that I bet they'll do if the military/dakhiliyya embark on a Brotherhood repression campaign.

az jan jananam posted:

If it is going to be bloody the Brotherhood is going to be on the receiving end, not the protesters. Which is why they're getting armed to protect themselves where possible.

Dr. Tough posted:

The 2011 revolution wasn't really that bloodless, according to wikipedia over 800 people died.

az jan jananam posted:

If it is going to be bloody the Brotherhood is going to be on the receiving end, not the protesters. Which is why they're getting armed to protect themselves where possible.

az jan jananam posted:

There is truth to what Morsi is saying when he says that his government is legitimate, and that legitimacy is a key issue here. He was elected by a majority of Egyptians in the fairest elections that Egypt has had in decades; the fact that he is grossly incompetent doesn't change that. If this coup happens it sets a rather poor precedent where Islamists get the message that gaining and retaining power through democratic institutions isn't actually a viable option, and that it might be better to simply return to the guerrilla/terrorism campaign of the 80s/90s. Which is that I bet they'll do if the military/dakhiliyya embark on a Brotherhood repression campaign.

az jan jananam posted:

There is truth to what Morsi is saying when he says that his government is legitimate, and that legitimacy is a key issue here. He was elected by a majority of Egyptians in the fairest elections that Egypt has had in decades; the fact that he is grossly incompetent doesn't change that. If this coup happens it sets a rather poor precedent where Islamists get the message that gaining and retaining power through democratic institutions isn't actually a viable option, and that it might be better to simply return to the guerrilla/terrorism campaign of the 80s/90s. Which is that I bet they'll do if the military/dakhiliyya embark on a Brotherhood repression campaign.

TheBalor posted:

Honestly, though, if elections are held within two months, won't the Brotherhood still be in a pretty good position? They had a fairly commanding lead last time.