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Joementum posted:A federal judge has ruled Utah's same-sex marriage ban unconstitutional. Now it's on! [gasp] ...hahahahahahaha! I just taught a lesson in my (Mormon) church this past Sunday about how we Mormons are commanded by our leaders to support the government and obey the law.  indeed.
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Dec 20, 2013 22:22
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Does this mean that marriage licenses can be issued to same-sex couples in Utah, now? Or will it take more than this?
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Dec 20, 2013 22:26
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RZApublican posted:Does this mean that marriage licenses can be issued to same-sex couples in Utah, now? Or will it take more than this? I doubt the Utah government is gonna let this stand.
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Dec 20, 2013 22:29
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RZApublican posted:Does this mean that marriage licenses can be issued to same-sex couples in Utah, now? Or will it take more than this? It will almost certainly be appealed, and a stay on the ruling will likely be granted. I really don't know what the 10th circuit is like, but I can't imagine this means gay marriages will immediately happen in Utah. Still good news though.
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Dec 20, 2013 22:30
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drat, I wish Utah was in the 9th Circuit, it's just barely outside it. I would've laughed and said, "Appeal that, Utah conservatives! California's payback for funding Prop 8!"
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Dec 20, 2013 22:36
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Joementum posted:A federal judge has ruled Utah's same-sex marriage ban unconstitutional. Now it's on!
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Dec 20, 2013 22:42
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Is it possible they still have a statutory ban on the books?
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Dec 20, 2013 22:43
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Pfirti86 posted:It will almost certainly be appealed, and a stay on the ruling will likely be granted. I really don't know what the 10th circuit is like, but I can't imagine this means gay marriages will immediately happen in Utah. Still good news though. The 10th Circuit is pretty bad and has a large amount of extreme libertarians and reactionaries (compared to some of the other districts), so just hope it comes before some of the libertarians.
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Dec 20, 2013 22:46
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Y-Hat posted:Man, the dominoes are falling even faster than I thought. The ruling in New Mexico was kind of a surprise, but it's a bastion of relative sanity in an otherwise batshit Southwest. Aren't NM and Utah in the same U.S. court district, and if they are, can they appeal together? They are both in the 10th, and no they cannot appeal together, because A) Utah was based on federal law whereas New Mexico was based on state law and B) A circuit court ruling like Utah would be appealed to the 10th district, but the only place that a state Supreme Court ruling can be appealed is to the SCOTUS, and its up in the air if NM will even try to appeal it there, whereas Utah will absolutely appeal.
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Dec 20, 2013 22:49
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The Utah ban was struck on 14th Amendment due process and equal protection grounds. It strikes all prohibitions on marriage equality in the state, and there's nothing they could pass to prohibit it again. They'd need to appeal up to the 10th circuit to have a shot, but that would depend on granting a stay of the ruling in the meantime, as otherwise marriage licenses will be issued unless and until the appeals court says otherwise.
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Dec 20, 2013 22:49
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Y-Hat posted:Man, the dominoes are falling even faster than I thought. The ruling in New Mexico was kind of a surprise, but it's a bastion of relative sanity in an otherwise batshit Southwest. Aren't NM and Utah in the same U.S. court district, and if they are, can they appeal together? I live here: I'm not too surprised by NM. New Mexico's senate repeatedly rejected bills to put the issue to a public vote. We're also the first US state to issue same-sex marriage licenses (Bernalillo, NM). There are some pockets of the kind of bible-belt conservative thinking people might expect: for example, Roosevelt county (borders Texas) just saw their county clerk and deputy clerk quit over this (BYE NOW!). But overall I feel like the densely-populated parts of the state either supported same-sex marriage or didn't think it was an important issue. Our economy is also fueled somewhat by tourism, and Santa Fe especially seems to understand there's nothing to be gained by turning away customers. For sure we're not Hawaii, but I think when merchants start seeing newly-married same-sex couples, there won't be a snowball's chance in hell of the state changing course on this. I feel like it's already a done deal but bigots with money to burn are probably going to keep pressing. E: Forgot to mention all the artists that live here. Lots of big name movie stars live here and lend a progressive air to politics. Santa Fe's the third largest art market in the world, and now we have a burgeoning film industry. Next up is to deal with all the Operation Rescue people from Kansas (I think) who are trying to stir poo poo up in Albuquerque. We defeated a city ballot thingy but according to news reports, they feel like they can use us as a testing ground to figure out how to get people all worked up over things that don't really matter much. For states nearby, I'd put my money on Colorado and Nevada next, and that'll be it for a while. Texas may surprise everybody. Arizona would sooner set itself on fire. cruft fucked around with this message at 23:05 on Dec 20, 2013 |
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Dec 20, 2013 23:00
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Utah opinion is up. It's loaded with Scalia's angry slippery slope arguments and the judge endorses them all. quote:the Honorable Antonin Scalia recognized that this result was the logical outcome of the Court’s ruling in Windsor: quote:The court therefore agrees with the portion of Justice Scalia’s dissenting opinion in Lawrence quote:And, as Justice Scalia has noted in dissent, “‘preserving the traditional institution of marriage’ is just a kinder way of describing the State’s moral disapproval of same-sex couples.” UltimoDragonQuest fucked around with this message at 23:04 on Dec 20, 2013 |
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Dec 20, 2013 23:02
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UltimoDragonQuest posted:Utah opinion is up. This might actually give Scalia a stroke. Oh my god. I don't know how Scalia didn't pause to think that his histrionic dissents would be used as support for his greatest fear by people saying "yep, he's right, there's no reason not to now."
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Dec 20, 2013 23:05
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It is Utah, but the case ended up in front of a 43 year old complex litigator that Obama put on the bench last year. In any event, this is the obvious extension of Windsor and everyone knew that when that case came down.
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Dec 20, 2013 23:08
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UltimoDragonQuest posted:Utah opinion is up. I saw people predicting this at the time of Scalia's dissent, and I could not be any happier to see those predictions coming blissfully true.
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Dec 20, 2013 23:18
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It looks like there's at least one gay couple in Utah that wants to strike while the iron's still hot. @jsethanderson is live-tweeting his attempt to get legally married right now, and from the looks of it he's succeeding:
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Dec 20, 2013 23:22
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Gay marriage is now legal everywhere Mitt Romney owns a home.
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Dec 20, 2013 23:23
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And to think the fact that TWO STATES have legalized marriage equality in one week is getting lost on the news/social media because of some random redneck who said A Thing.
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Dec 20, 2013 23:24
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AP confirms licenses have started being issued in Utah.
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Dec 20, 2013 23:28
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Lmao this is great, gay people are getting married in Utah. I can't imagine the conniption some people in Utah are having thinking it'd take some years before they ever saw a gay marriage.
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Dec 20, 2013 23:31
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According to PPP, gay marriage had 13% approval in Utah in 2011. Polygamy had 14% approval
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Dec 20, 2013 23:38
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UltimoDragonQuest posted:Utah opinion is up.
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Dec 20, 2013 23:39
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Misandrist Duck posted:AP confirms licenses have started being issued in Utah. What I'd give to be a fly on the wall in NOM's war room right now. Here's a state that I would have guessed to be last to the party, the one that everyone assumed would put the most time and money into ensuring they'd hang on to their ban for as long as possible. But nope, they're in the teens among states to issue (presumably valid?) licenses.
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Dec 21, 2013 00:08
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Captain Mog posted:And to think the fact that TWO STATES have legalized marriage equality in one week is getting lost on the news/social media because of some random redneck who said A Thing. The great thing is the redneck said the thing three days ago or so. Since then, in the last 48 hours two states have legalized marriage equality. It's funny how even bad news nowadays gets outweighed by good news, and I like to think both rulings were made to spite him.
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Dec 21, 2013 00:13
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Emanuel Collective posted:According to PPP, gay marriage had 13% approval in Utah in 2011. Polygamy had 14% approval I wonder if they used to say in Utah, "We can't legalize polygamy! It's slippery slope, and next it'll be gay marriage!"
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Dec 21, 2013 00:19
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Lycus posted:I wonder if they used to say in Utah, "We can't legalize polygamy! It's slippery slope, and next it'll be gay marriage!" I was talking to my Dad who lives in Utah and apparently some people don't even realize that the polygamy and gay marriage rulings this week are unrelated and think that the cast of Sister Wives ruined everything.
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Dec 21, 2013 00:33
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HuffPo reporter piles on.
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Dec 21, 2013 00:33
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UltimoDragonQuest posted:HuffPo reporter piles on. Obviously the important thing here is that our brothers and sisters in Utah have equal rights now. But, ya know, I really love it when it happens somewhere that'll just make the assholes go nuts.
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Dec 21, 2013 01:17
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Joementum posted:Gay marriage is now legal everywhere Mitt Romney owns a home. Now we need to make it legal in every state that he his from.
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Dec 21, 2013 01:25
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Well this is a welcome surprise... Open the blood gates! :get in:
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Dec 21, 2013 01:54
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If this gets appealed enough, could we end up with all state bans being struck down?
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Dec 21, 2013 02:45
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Chief Savage Man posted:If this gets appealed enough, could we end up with all state bans being struck down? Yes. If the Supreme Court takes this case and upholds this on the merits, that's what happens.
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Dec 21, 2013 02:56
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evilweasel posted:Yes. If the Supreme Court takes this case and upholds this on the merits, that's what happens. Oh great. That better not happen or I'll have to flee Texas before it secedes.
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Dec 21, 2013 03:08
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I'm worried the Utah thing is gonna cause blowback. That's a hell of a step for loving Utah.
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Dec 21, 2013 03:32
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Petr posted:I'm worried the Utah thing is gonna cause blowback. That's a hell of a step for loving Utah. Blowback like what, an anti-gay George Wallace? I guess I can't think of much else that might happen.
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Dec 21, 2013 03:43
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Lutha Mahtin posted:Blowback like what, an anti-gay George Wallace? I guess I can't think of much else that might happen. "I draw the line in the dust and say, traditional marriage now, traditional marriage tomorrow, and traditional marriage forever!" 
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Dec 21, 2013 03:49
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I don't think any blowback can be worse than 2004, short of most Democrats getting on board with a federal marriage amendment, and I highly doubt that's gonna happen.
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Dec 21, 2013 03:51
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Lutha Mahtin posted:Is it possible they still have a statutory ban on the books? Doubtful if the county clerk is issuing licenses
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Dec 21, 2013 03:53
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Petr posted:I'm worried the Utah thing is gonna cause blowback. That's a hell of a step for loving Utah. Every state that doesn't have it has a ban, right? This year should really put any doubts to rest. 8 states have legalized it in 2013, 9 if you count Maryland's taking effect January 1. We've gone from having one state with legal marriage equality to 18 states with legal marriage equality in the span of 9 years. Any possible turning point has been passed by now, and arguably was passed as of 2012. 2012 was the point of no return, and momentum has somehow only picked up from there. I'm not saying there's no way this gets wiped out, but it's looking very likely that the entire country has legal marriage equality before decade's end. Unless you don't expect to live much longer, you'll soon be living in an America where gay marriage is just as legal as straight marriage.
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Dec 21, 2013 04:08
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VitalSigns posted:Oh great. That better not happen or I'll have to flee Texas before it secedes. Why wait? Do it now, avoid the rush.
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Dec 21, 2013 04:12
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