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Another dawn is breaking in Kyiv, and it's still Ukrainian.   
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Jul 25, 2022 03:15
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Chalks posted:A few pages back we were talking about how frequently Russia would need to repair their artillery barrels to avoid losing too much accuracy. Now we know what that Russian soldier was talking about "curved" artillery: their artillery barrels are getting so worn they're weakening enough to banana peel or begin curving to gravity.
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Jul 25, 2022 03:19
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Young Freud posted:Now we know what that Russian soldier was talking about "curved" artillery: their artillery barrels are getting so worn they're weakening enough to banana peel or begin curving to gravity. Dumb artillery shells are easy-ish to produce, but what about their ability to repair/replace the guns themselves? I’m sure that can’t be easy now either (via production issues or supply depots getting new rockets delivered a little faster than they’d like).
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Jul 25, 2022 03:22
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Icon Of Sin posted:Dumb artillery shells are easy-ish to produce, but what about their ability to repair/replace the guns themselves? I’m sure that can’t be easy now either (via production issues or supply depots getting new rockets delivered a little faster than they’d like). IIRC Russia no longer has a steel industry thanks to Dutch Disease and the oligarchy and the hard steel alloys they'd use in armaments come from Germany, Czech Republic and Poland, which is all under sanctions.
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Jul 25, 2022 03:38
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Young Freud posted:IIRC Russia no longer has a steel industry thanks to Dutch Disease and the oligarchy and the hard steel alloys they'd use in armaments come from Germany, Czech Republic and Poland, which is all under sanctions. They looted a whole bunch of rolled steel from Azovstal after they flattened Mariupol, there were pictures of the ship, but I'm sure machining it is a different problem.
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Jul 25, 2022 03:52
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Icon Of Sin posted:Dumb artillery shells are easy-ish to produce, but what about their ability to repair/replace the guns themselves? I’m sure that can’t be easy now either (via production issues or supply depots getting new rockets delivered a little faster than they’d like). There's usually two supply depots. One is forward, with the usual poo poo a battery needs for maintenance, and a larger, somewhat fixed depot, that has everything. And the battery maintenance crew, yeah, a separate crew, has their own supply of parts. Figure to do artillery maintenance right, you spend like 16 weeks in training. So for logistics, you've got the battery, the local mobile depot, and the "fixed" depot. All talking to each other. None of that poo poo really works good on paper during actual war, but there's an effort because of training and drills. I guess my point is, that wartime maintenance, especially on mobile stuff, is a huge separate world of specialists (and a separate world of guys who just do inventory). Maybe the Russians have so much artillery they can just throw them away and get another one from the infinite Russian artillery warehouse, like a cheap Vostok watch (with a little tank on it).
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Jul 25, 2022 03:54
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E: nvm, saw updated thread rules
HonorableTB fucked around with this message at 03:58 on Jul 25, 2022 |
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Jul 25, 2022 03:54
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NTRabbit posted:They looted a whole bunch of rolled steel from Azovstal after they flattened Mariupol, there were pictures of the ship, but I'm sure machining it is a different problem. The issue likely won't be the steel it'll be the tooling. Tooling wears out, especially when machining harder steels. Tooling is also made out of its own special kinds of steel to attempt to slow wear. I'm not sure how much domestic precision tooling manufacturing capability Russia has.
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Jul 25, 2022 03:55
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Ukraine war: Russian investigator says 92 Ukrainians charged https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62287502 The sheer unmitigated gall of it, good lord. Bolivia, Iran and loving Syria as neutral countries, the gently caress.
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Jul 25, 2022 04:19
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KitConstantine posted:The issue likely won't be the steel it'll be the tooling. Tooling wears out, especially when machining harder steels. Tooling is also made out of its own special kinds of steel to attempt to slow wear. I'm not sure how much domestic precision tooling manufacturing capability Russia has. Seeing as how they are sending poo poo like this out with the bore off center 1.5mm, my guess would be not a whole lot.  https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/comments/w76f9a/have_a_look_at_this_barrel_from_a_russian_bmp/
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Jul 25, 2022 04:24
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NTRabbit posted:They looted a whole bunch of rolled steel from Azovstal after they flattened Mariupol, there were pictures of the ship, but I'm sure machining it is a different problem. Those would be coils mostly. Not making barrels out of that.
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Jul 25, 2022 05:02
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KitConstantine posted:The issue likely won't be the steel it'll be the tooling. Tooling wears out, especially when machining harder steels. Tooling is also made out of its own special kinds of steel to attempt to slow wear. I'm not sure how much domestic precision tooling manufacturing capability Russia has. Hardened Tool Steel is pretty simple - I've made my own inserts/tools from blanks and oil quenched them to the proper hardness before. It's stuff like tungsten bits that I wonder about...
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Jul 25, 2022 06:41
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Young Freud posted:IIRC Russia no longer has a steel industry thanks to Dutch Disease and the oligarchy and the hard steel alloys they'd use in armaments come from Germany, Czech Republic and Poland, which is all under sanctions. Won't they just be able to switch to Chinese steel instead?
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Jul 25, 2022 07:35
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Trump has started ranting about Ukraine: - saying Russia would never have happened during his admin - saying Europe should pay for it since it affects them more - saying we can't afford the aid given - anti-NATO as well https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFu01gLe4os&t=9357s ShadowHawk fucked around with this message at 07:42 on Jul 25, 2022 |
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Jul 25, 2022 07:39
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acidx posted:Seeing as how they are sending poo poo like this out with the bore off center 1.5mm, my guess would be not a whole lot. I was wondering how much of an effect such thing has. Assuming the designed barrel side thickness is 8mm will additional weight and size screw up mountings? My guess for why it happened was: "-we're late for delivery, what's the holdup? - some idiot has set up the CNC machine wrong, 20 barrels are rifled off center - will they pass the inspection? - I know a guy - screw it, we'll replace them later."
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Jul 25, 2022 07:56
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a pipe smoking dog posted:Won't they just be able to switch to Chinese steel instead? Chinese steel is made with Australian and Brazilian iron ore, violating the sanctions risks long term interruptions to the critical supply chain, even if they are apparently overloaded with steel because the market crashed.
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Jul 25, 2022 08:02
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I'm honestly surprised that the rifling is even present if they can't center the bore properly. Given that the BMP-1 gun is 73 mm and smoothbore, which obviously don't match the picture, I guess that's the 30 mm autocannon that can be found on the -2 or -3. Is shoddy craftsmanship "safer" for smaller weapons?
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Jul 25, 2022 09:01
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BattleMaster posted:I'm honestly surprised that the rifling is even present if they can't center the bore properly. If I'm not mistaken the 20-30mm cannons that Russia uses on their APCs are way higher velocity than the 73mm BMP-1 gun so it's probably more dangerous to have a barrel horribly off center. One side of the barrel is thinner than the other, that can't be safe at all.
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Jul 25, 2022 09:13
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NTRabbit posted:Chinese steel is made with Australian and Brazilian iron ore, violating the sanctions risks long term interruptions to the critical supply chain, even if they are apparently overloaded with steel because the market crashed. I have full confidence that the Multinationals and Billionaire Oligarchs that own Australian iron ore will quite happy to sell it to "China". Can't let war crimes get in the way of increasing share holder value now, can we.
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Jul 25, 2022 09:19
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alex314 posted:I was wondering how much of an effect such thing has. Assuming the designed barrel side thickness is 8mm will additional weight and size screw up mountings? I assume the overall profile of the barrel is correct, the off centre bore doesn't change the desired total mass and dimensions for mounting purposes but creates unequal stresses during firing and cooling so the barrel will deform and degrade faster than expected.
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Jul 25, 2022 09:37
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ShadowHawk posted:Trump has started ranting about Ukraine: I do have to wonder how much of Putin's long-term strategy is contingent on Trump retaking the WH come 2024
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Jul 25, 2022 10:09
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BattleMaster posted:I'm honestly surprised that the rifling is even present if they can't center the bore properly. BMP-3 has a rifled 100mm gun.
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Jul 25, 2022 10:52
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The 8mm side will stress and fracture a lot sooner than if the bore was dead center, basically the life of that barrel has been reduced to a fraction of what it should be. Pressure and heat will wear away specifically at weak spots so quickly there are entire university doctorates on this sort of thing.
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Jul 25, 2022 10:52
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Xerxes17 posted:BMP-3 has a rifled 100mm gun. There are several variants that have a 30 mm autocannon but I don't know how widespread those are
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Jul 25, 2022 11:07
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Comstar posted:I have full confidence that the Multinationals and Billionaire Oligarchs that own Australian iron ore will quite happy to sell it to "China". Yeah Australia doesn't have the best history of compliance with international sanctions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AWB_oil-for-wheat_scandal
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Jul 25, 2022 11:40
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spacetoaster posted:Speaking to my family in, and around, Kiev on a regular basis now. No jobs, no pay, food is getting scarce. They haven't paid rent in 5 months, and the bank is allowing people to go into debt too. My wife's bff has family in Cherkasy area. We've sent some books, kids birthday toys, and a biggest item a laptop via USPS that all made it alright.
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Jul 25, 2022 12:34
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Polish PT-91s already in Ukraine. While concrete amount is a secret, Resnikov was quoted as saying Russians will be the first to find out how many exactly. https://wiadomosci.gazeta.pl/wiadomosci/7,114881,28722372,polskie-czolgi-pt-91-twardy-juz-w-ukrainie-ich-liczbe-utajniono.html#s=BoxOpMT
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Jul 25, 2022 12:35
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Some more info about Polish Army shopping spree: according to ppłk Krzysztof Płatek, PR person for MoD we're getting 180 off the shelf K2, with plans to upgrade to K2PL later on. K2PL was supposed to have one extra set of roadwheels, I guess it got dropped along the way. Delivery planned for 2022-26. And the remaining 820 will be built in the new factory that should start delivering from 2026 onward. Full tech transfer is involved, with some components being manufactured in S. Korea. So for those keeping track: in about 5 years Polish Army will have 250 Leo 2 in 3 or 4 variants (A4, A4PL, A5 and possibly A5PL), 250 Abrams M1A2 SEP v3, 116 M1A1, 180 K2 and first K2PL. And that assumes all Soviet derived stuff gets handed over to Ukraine. At least they will all use the same ammo and fuel. Also Ukrainian Gov just confirmed first PT-91 being delivered to Ukraine. https://nitter.it/nexta_tv/status/1551490434051997696#m
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Jul 25, 2022 12:35
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BattleMaster posted:There are several variants that have a 30 mm autocannon but I don't know how widespread those are The barrel in that picture has sixteen grooves for rifling which matches the 30mm gun for the BMP3: https://weaponsystems.net/system/534-30mm+2A72
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Jul 25, 2022 12:36
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alex314 posted:Some more info about Polish Army shopping spree: according to ppłk Krzysztof Płatek, PR person for MoD we're getting 180 off the shelf K2, with plans to upgrade to K2PL later on. K2PL was supposed to have one extra set of roadwheels, I guess it got dropped along the way. Delivery planned for 2022-26. They also have standing orders for 500 HIMARS systems and bunch of other poo poo. I cannot help but wonder what manner of budgetary crimes did make it all possible.
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Jul 25, 2022 12:37
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BattleMaster posted:There are several variants that have a 30 mm autocannon but I don't know how widespread those are The BMP-3 has both a 30mm autocannon and the 100mm gun. The ammunition for all of these is why they go up in flames so readily.
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Jul 25, 2022 12:43
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cinci zoo sniper posted:They also have standing orders for 500 HIMARS systems and bunch of other poo poo. I cannot help but wonder what manner of budgetary crimes did make it all possible. Budget? In PiS government?  It's all emergency decrees. At least after kicking out loving Macierewicz they planned back in 2019-20 modernization for the next 15 years, so in theory they should get a decent per unit cost. I really hope there's some deal to have locally produced ammo for those 500 HIMARS systems, or those poor soldiers won't get to shot one more often that once every couple years.
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Jul 25, 2022 12:47
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Russian intelligence services got tired of the world laughing at their poison adventures so they decided to make up a stupid one about their enemies, including investigators https://twitter.com/christogrozev/status/1551535542180929536?t=NvRXMzu1fJ9v-awCmC9ILw&s=19
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Jul 25, 2022 13:07
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cinci zoo sniper posted:They also have standing orders for 500 HIMARS systems and bunch of other poo poo. I cannot help but wonder what manner of budgetary crimes did make it all possible. The innate Polish desire to harm the Russian Empire played a role I am sure. (note I am of Polish Descent) More reality based is those 500 were probably over a space of 10-20 years
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Jul 25, 2022 13:23
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fatherboxx posted:Russian intelligence services got tired of the world laughing at their poison adventures so they decided to make up a stupid one about their enemies, including investigators Ah yeah, that secret plot they publicly announced 3 or 4 months ago. This is an admission that there was a real danger of some pilots taking up the offer?
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Jul 25, 2022 13:29
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cinci zoo sniper posted:They also have standing orders for 500 HIMARS systems and bunch of other poo poo. I cannot help but wonder what manner of budgetary crimes did make it all possible. We all wonder that, I have no idea where will we get the money to pay for that. Even spite has it's limits. Maybe this will be presented as the NATO-required budget increase on defense.
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Jul 25, 2022 13:30
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Proposed budget for military is at 3% GDP, and Kaczyński offhand mentioned it might end up at 5%. That 3% value that's already agreed is $20 Billion at 2021 values, more than Turkey or Spain, getting close to Israel.
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Jul 25, 2022 13:47
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fatherboxx posted:Russian intelligence services got tired of the world laughing at their poison adventures so they decided to make up a stupid one about their enemies, including investigators This is a wild ride. Excited to see the documentary when it comes out.
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Jul 25, 2022 14:06
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It's nice the FSB and Russian media decided to provide us with so much fresh content for the documentary, it'll probably make it easier to sell to broadcasters and streamers too.
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Jul 25, 2022 14:16
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KitConstantine posted:This is a wild ride. Excited to see the documentary when it comes out. random questions about what sedatives might be best for use on a co-pilot has to be one of the worst counter-intel slipups possible
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Jul 25, 2022 14:19
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