|
I hope the Navi space ships come out of the ground and they travel to earth and blow up Washington DC (cinematically)
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2022 22:24
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 31, 2024 18:22 |
|
|
I really wish the native insurrection/resistance stuff had lasted longer, that was a neat premise and made for a cool setpiece. Some of the more effective parts of these movies are the ones that highlight the contrast between human and Na'vi aesthetics by putting them side by side; it makes the Na'vi and Pandora feel a little more alien and humanity feel more sterile in comparison. It's actually kind of a good trick by Cameron, especially in the first movie; when it's just Na'vi on screen, they're human enough in design and attitudes to be relatable, but put them next to actual humans and there's just enough weirdness to make them feel off. Also apparently I'm blind, because I didn't realize regular Na'vi and Avatars had different numbers of fingers until this movie explicitly pointed it out.
|
|
#
?
Dec 18, 2022 22:48
|
|
|
Tea Party Crasher posted:How are the humans losing when at the start of the movie the retro burn from their rockets is enough to decimate vast swaths of forest. The humans obviously don't give a gently caress about ruining the environment so why act precious and engage in boots on the ground warfare. The navi are a race of like giant super soldiers that know the ins and outs of Pandoran geography and can mount huge gently caress off dragons. And after this movie, we know they befriend other sentient megafauna who presumably can/will eventually get recruited to help them in their fight against the human colonizers -- this is assuming the tulkun move beyond their "no killing" ideology after best spirit brother Payakan tells them all what the gently caress is up with these colonizer assholes.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 00:08
|
|
|
missed opportunity not to call them the Na'vy really
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 00:09
|
|
|
Why didn't they make the motivations of the god-like planetary intelligence network more straightforward for me, the viewer. A bad movie.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 00:26
|
|
|
Turn your brain off for his one folks. I wish someone would make a movie of the badass space vampire book instead.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 00:26
|
|
|
Ratios and Tendency posted:Turn your brain off for his one folks. I wish someone would make a movie of the badass space vampire book instead. Somebody did.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 00:29
|
|
|
euphronius posted:Also the human factions are evil but I don’t think they are (yet) completely eliminationalsit (not on spellcheck idk) I think this was actually fine left unsaid. Cameron doesn't need to explain that the humans will become eliminationist settlers. We've seen this play out so many times in history it doesn't need explaining. For me the dropship incinerating the forest was a great piece of visual storytelling. It tells you everything you need to know about General Falco's plan: it's genocidal and doomed to failure. The humans are taking the one thing they need so desperately - a functioning biosphere - and in the process of taking it they'll destroy it because that's the totalizing logic of the capitalist system. The humans are dead either way. The only thing left to be decided is whether they take Pandora with them.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 00:39
|
|
|
Ratios and Tendency posted:I wish someone would make a movie of the badass space vampire book instead.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 01:26
|
|
|
Ratios and Tendency posted:Turn your brain off for his one folks. I wish someone would make a movie of the badass space vampire book instead. It's not the same book, but does the anime involving space vampires count? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQX0jclEzXg
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 01:41
|
|
|
Arglebargle III posted:The humans are dead either way. The only thing left to be decided is whether they take Pandora with them. The tulkuns won't let that happen... I hope 
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 01:44
|
|
|
teagone posted:The tulkuns won't let that happen... I hope I mean their principles seem to stop them from doing anything about the humans hunting them down so I wouldn't peg them as the ones to do something.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 01:55
|
|
|
Tea Party Crasher posted:I mean their principles seem to stop them from doing anything about the humans hunting them down so I wouldn't peg them as the ones to do something. I spoilered it in another post hoping that Payakan will be the difference maker in getting the other tulkuns to make an exception for the human colonizers 
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 02:00
|
|
|
Arglebargle III posted:I think this was actually fine left unsaid. Cameron doesn't need to explain that the humans will become eliminationist settlers. We've seen this play out so many times in history it doesn't need explaining. I like how it shows there are humans in the system who know it’s wrong and they are powerless (or deem themselves powerless) to do anything. “That’s why I drink”
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 02:53
|
|
|
I think it sent a really clear message - the man who knows what he's doing is wrong but does it anyway is still a villain. The only way to be a human hero is to grab something heavy and smash the controls.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 03:00
|
|
|
Arglebargle III posted:I think it sent a really clear message - the man who knows what he's doing is wrong but does it anyway is still a villain. The only way to be a human hero is to grab something heavy and smash the controls. I had the impression that quaritch was disgusted several times by the attitude towards the whales but choose to ignore his feelings in service of his goal.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 03:25
|
|
|
I'm putting my thoughts here because lol as if anyone I know is either going to see the movie/want to hear my thoughts on it Spoilers but why you reading this deep into the thread if you don't want spoilers 1. what the gently caress was with the insurgency just disappearing when Sully leaves and what the gently caress was I'm gonna quit if my kids are in danger, you were already sending them on raiding parties dude and presumably all those other Na'vi in the insurgency are someone's kids 2. Jim, I've seen that shark hunt sequence in the little mermaid and finding nemo already, spend some of your billion dollars on originality 3. All in all the action spectacle was a whole lot less cool than in Avatar, where's the maximalist blowing up poo poo in the second half of the film. A whaling boat and some dinghies ain't big enough. 4. Avatar vs avatar combat sucks because it's the default of the film, the original film had the right idea with the avatar vs. huge robot climax, you need better contrast for the basic as hell fight choreography you've got, oh cool an mma style choke out. that would have sucked in Terminator 2 (why couldn't that Cameron still be making movies?). 5. If the colonel kills a poo poo load of Na'vi in the next film that kid was dumb as gently caress and he should be absolutely guilt stricken for his dumb decision 6. Pretty okay spectacle movie overall that doesn't reach the heights needed to justify it's budget super skippable, feels like two movies with the first being abbreviated, but avoids most of the pitfalls of being a midquel. 7. I've seen enough of water, hate that the next movie is going to be more water poo poo, shows us snow Pandora or lava Pandora or some other environment, spectacle needs novelty
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 04:05
|
|
|
It is kind of wild that the tulkun get hunted regularly enough that they have a whole routine operation going on, but they've never mentioned it to the sea na'vi - presumably each year the migration party conversations are very awkward from the tulkun side when Bob and Jane are missing and they just pretend they migrated to a farm in the country.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 04:19
|
|
|
I want them to go to the desert biome where the local Na'vi are jacking into the giant eywa cactus
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 04:25
|
|
|
xiw posted:It is kind of wild that the tulkun get hunted regularly enough that they have a whole routine operation going on, but they've never mentioned it to the sea na'vi - presumably each year the migration party conversations are very awkward from the tulkun side when Bob and Jane are missing and they just pretend they migrated to a farm in the country. They Metkayina did know, but the whalers kept their hunting to beyond the reef and never hunted any soul bonded tulkun closer to their home. The Metkayina respected the tulkun's wishes of not interfering/killing the hunters. Everything changed when Quaritch commandeered one of the whaler boats and killed a soul bonded tulkun, worse yet, a tulkun soul bonded to the Metkayina's Tsahik/shaman/spiritual leader.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 04:31
|
|
|
xiw posted:It is kind of wild that the tulkun get hunted regularly enough that they have a whole routine operation going on, but they've never mentioned it to the sea na'vi - presumably each year the migration party conversations are very awkward from the tulkun side when Bob and Jane are missing and they just pretend they migrated to a farm in the country. Doesn't the sea chief guy mention something about how they've always done it far away from there (where presumably it would be too far to help them?) but now this is happening right on their doorstep? It seemed less like they didn't know and more that there was nothing they could do. At least I think I remember some line like that but I guess I'd have to watch it again to see.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 04:31
|
|
|
Just got out of the movie. The audience was super into it, people crying at the whale hunt scene, people quietly saying "yes" when the whalers got hosed up, etc. The lady beside me all but screamed every time there was a little jump scare of people popping into frame. I could have done without the 3D, I don't think it added much. I surprisingly loved the HFR though, I thought Cameron made good use of it. I appreciated how cheesy and earnest it was once I leaned into it. Cameron obviously loves machines, so the final act kind of read like "looked at the fuckin sick machines killing nature. I hate them so much, but they're so cool". I wish Quaritch stayed dead. As it is I think he's going to become a wild card character, a la Agent Smith. Overall I think it will work in terms of accomplishing Cameron's goal of getting more people to educate themselves of just how destructive commercial resource extraction & fishing is. And the marine biologist character shows Cameron understands a lot of people in those industries hate it, but that's capitalism. I think the message was diluted by the existence of the super valuable resource though, could have done without that entirely and just have whalers exist for the same reason they still exist today. Since goons earlier in the thread were confused: The eclipse is just sunset, not a big special event. And the scene at the end with Sully and his son was on Pandora. It had big blue alien ferns in the background. stratdax fucked around with this message at 05:19 on Dec 19, 2022 |
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 04:42
|
|
|
stratdax posted:Since goons earlier in the thread were confused: The eclipse is just sunset, not a big special event. And the scene at the end with Sully and his son was on Pandora. It had big blue alien ferns in the background. Were the ferns in a gully?
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 04:57
|
|
|
stratdax posted:And the scene at the end with Sully and his son was on Pandora. It had big blue alien ferns in the background. It was only one goon, and I'm not even sure how they ever thought Jake and his son were on earth lmao.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 04:59
|
|
|
Fernsully
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 05:04
|
|
|
The school I work at took its students to see the movie today... and the quality of 3D really did not make up for the pace and storytelling the second time around. I wound up walking out to have a coffee until the movie ended. It's just kind of tedious and the spectacle doesn't hold up on the second run. A bunch of the students also wound up trying to leave to walk around the mall, but I had to send them back in since they can't be running around unsupervised 😂. Anyway, I have no idea what the general popular perception will be, but my students seem to have found it boring. I saw the first Avatar about 10 times in theaters and loved the 3D thrill ride each time. But idk maybe it's just not as novel a decade and change later, or maybe the poor storytelling is just too heavy a weight for me this time.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 05:25
|
|
|
I liked it but the first one was so much better. - The movie introduced way too many characters. I felt so unattached to Jake's children because there were just so many of them. The character deaths in the first one (Tsu'tey, Grace, Trudey) all felt impactful but the death of one of the sons in this movie didn't bear much weight. - I wish the movie actually tried to close certain arcs (Kiri's father and Quaritch's fate) instead of leaving them ambiguous for a sequel. The first film's plot was so simple but cohesive so it felt like a complete movie, in contrast this movie is three hours long but leaves so many questions unanswered. - Spider was really annoying. - Best part of the film for me is easily the worldbuilding with the Metkayina Clan. I wish they delved more into the philosophy behind the "way of water" though.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 05:53
|
|
|
It rules that for years people will argue about avatar 2's box office without the context that there's a huge covid outbreak in China the release week.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 06:22
|
|
|
Bedshaped posted:Worst part in the entire film was when the two characters who should know for sure there is neuralconnectivity with all of Pandora's organisms say some dumb poo poo so the movie can tell us how good alternative medicine is. ….. lmao
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 06:22
|
|
|
She had a seizure not COVID-19 dude
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 06:25
|
|
|
They gave kiri the Na'vi ivermectin to cure her
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 06:31
|
|
|
The REAL Goobusters posted:She had a seizure not COVID-19 dude And they showed shamanism as a more effective cure than scientific analysis, in an era where goofy "holistic" healing is gaining traction and vaccines are viewed with skepticism. You get what he's complaining about.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 06:38
|
|
|
The Saddest Rhino posted:They gave kiri the Na'vi ivermectin to cure her The alternative was getting disinfectant and UV light into the lungs
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 06:39
|
|
|
It’s a fantasy movie clearly on an alien planet, not an active disinformation campaign promising secret science the global deep state doesn’t want you to have. People can see the difference.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 06:46
|
|
|
Maybe they can't but if so, then this movie wasn't tipping that mental balance
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 06:54
|
|
|
Witeldram posted:I liked it but the first one was so much better. Agreed. I feel like this movie centered a lot of it's drama around the kids/family which was an issue for me because I didn't care about any of them. Their relationship with Jake seemed one note, with him just non-stop lecturing them for getting themselves in danger. And then what do they do next? Get themselves in danger and get yelled at. And the cycle just repeats until one of the sons dies. And yeah, Spider had me cringing a couple of times. Also why the gently caress did he save the colonel from drowning, not only is that pointless franchise wise because he can just be brought back to life anyway, but it just doesn't seem in character what we see of Spider. He seems too ride or die for the Na'Vi to play lifeguard for a war criminal that is a clone of his dad. I did laugh at that hostage exchange tho. "We're not even the same species." 
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 06:55
|
|
|
If your faith in modern medicine can be shaken by Avatar: Way of the Water, I don't think there's enough information versus disinformation to save you from eventually buying vibrational healing crystals.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 07:00
|
|
|
After watching Avatar: Way of the Water i'm going to kiss a whale and know we'll be soulmates
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 07:12
|
|
|
Bugblatter posted:And they showed shamanism as a more effective cure than scientific analysis, in an era where goofy "holistic" healing is gaining traction and vaccines are viewed with skepticism. You get what he's complaining about. The movie was pretty careful to not imply that the shaman stuff actually did anything. The humans moved out of the room out of respect, not out of belief. Both movies aren't doing any kind of science vs magic narrative, the humans in the story have a decent grasp of the ecology of the planet, they just don't give a poo poo about it beyond it's ability to produce capital.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 07:23
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 31, 2024 18:22 |
|
|
The whole human invasion thing is pretty clearly analogous to settler-colonialism, with the first cycles being exploration and resource extraction, establishing a beachhead and trying to drive off the natives to access valuable resources. The city's construction is the next step- building long-term settlements, not just base camps, and with the intent of expansion through dispossession, genocide and environmental destruction. Also that Cameron has openly compared it to Dune makes me lol at the possibility it ends with the Sully middle child becoming a whale god-emperor
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2022 07:48
|
|
