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Guys we all love time-travel and multiverse movies, but they almost all some glaring problems because hey, you can't actually do this stuff. Kind of like how people spend time figuring out how Superman can lift the huge stuff he lifts and fly around with it when his carried items are usually too huge and being manipulated over too small of an area, and should (by the laws of physics) fall apart or structurally fail in spectacular ways. But it's Superman physics. Clearly Loki exists in MCU time, which is inconsistent with previous stuff we've seen. I only say this because I saw Tenet, thought about it too much and too hard, and sorta mental'd myself out of truly enjoying the movie when I realized it didn't make as much sense as I initially thought. Wish I hadn't done that.
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Jul 2, 2021 17:04
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Guys we all love time-travel and multiverse movies, but they almost all some glaring problems because hey, you can't actually do this stuff. Kind of like how people spend time figuring out how Superman can lift the huge stuff he lifts and fly around with it when his carried items are usually too huge and being manipulated over too small of an area, and should (by the laws of physics) fall apart or structurally fail in spectacular ways. But it's Superman physics. Clearly Loki exists in MCU time, which is inconsistent with previous stuff we've seen. 
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Jul 2, 2021 17:06
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Guy A. Person posted:Maybe I'm looking back in the wrong spot but in the cartoon Loki watches it's visualized as a rope of lines is when the Timekeepers are merging it* into a "single timeline, the Sacred Timeline". From there were see an image of all living things each with their own line, then we are told that wandering off your specific timeline even by something as minor as "being late to work" can cause a cascade of changes, so the TVA corrects the variance. I somehow doubt a timeline where Loki was born a woman and told she was adopted much earlier was within the acceptable limits, until she started being "too happy" (I guess unless the idea is that she was told she was adopted that day and feeling that sort of trust was the lynchpin moment). But Megaman's right in that it's better to just roll with the emotional stakes. Timeless Appeal fucked around with this message at 18:04 on Jul 2, 2021 |
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Jul 2, 2021 17:15
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I can't even remember the last time I got a goonsay. Hell yes! edit: btw I'm not making some kind of argument that time travel movies shouldn't try to make sense or whatever, it's that they usually have nits you can pick. Loki doesn't just have nits, it has has huge loops of fabric that are going to get caught on a door handle and tear. Megaman's Jockstrap fucked around with this message at 17:19 on Jul 2, 2021 |
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Jul 2, 2021 17:17
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Remember when we were sure that Mephisto was gonna play into WandaVision? Sometimes it's just fun to theorycraft and throw observations together. Like I didn't know the TVA Director was an existing character with ties to Kang until one of my buddies mentioned it.
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Jul 2, 2021 17:34
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Time travel media should just not bother to explain the details. Every movie/show that starts to get into the weeds of how time travel works without creating a paradox inevitably goes off the rails (Terminator, Back to the Future, Doctor Who, Tenet, Lucy, etc.) trying to explain itself. Just go with the Looper method of "Who knows? This is how it is works."
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Jul 2, 2021 17:37
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Time travel media should just not bother to explain the details. That’s not true. In Back To The Future, for example, Doc’s time machine simply destroys the universe and replaces it with a new universe. The only “paradox” is that Marty B somehow has his mind overwritten with that of Marty A in the process. In Looper, “the future” is a virtual space that exists simultaneous to and overlaps with the present-day reality. The logic is that, if you stab yourself, a scar simultaneously appears on your avatar as if thirty years have passed. But they haven’t.
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Jul 2, 2021 21:26
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:That’s not true. In Back To The Future, for example, Doc’s time machine simply destroys the universe and replaces it with a new universe. The only “paradox” is that Marty B somehow has his mind overwritten with that of Marty A in the process. I'm not sure about that, because Doc Brown's initial test makes Einstein re-appear back in "their" universe after a minute. Great Scott! This is why I don't like talking about this stuff. Back to the Future rules and it doesn't matter if it doesn't make any drat sense!
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Jul 2, 2021 22:38
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:I'm not sure about that, because Doc Brown's initial test makes Einstein re-appear back in "their" universe after a minute. That’s forwards travel without any return. We can speculate all day about what happens there, but there’s not much to go off of. However, backwards travel is definitely shown to destroy the universe. Things get incredibly convoluted in the sequel, which introduces new rules, but I believe even that can be made sense of.
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Jul 2, 2021 23:02
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Guy A. Person posted:Yeah this is the impression I am getting from the currently spelled out "rules" but again since we know the TVA is lying about a bunch of poo poo, the "Sacred Timeline" could be bunk entirely, and maybe there already is a multi-verse and the TVA are just using their propaganda as an excuse to pillage poo poo from other realities Maybe, it doesn't seem like they're "pillaging poo poo from other realities." The only things we see Minutemen take are Variants (and whatever they're wearing/carrying at the time). Most of those beings (Lokis aside) apparently end up working in the TVA. Minutemen usually leave behind a Reset charge that destroys/deletes/removes anything they deem not part of the Sacred Timeline - like Sylvie's Valkyrie toys. Maybe you're right and the TVA was started by some version of the Collector so he could score (among other things) some (slightly used) vintage Valkyrie toys, but it seems unlikely given what we've seen and been told - especially since we've seen Infinity Stones dropped into a junk drawer. That said, there's still two more episodes left, so I guess we'll see.
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Jul 3, 2021 00:21
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vD-yj9o664
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Jul 3, 2021 02:10
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This just confirms that the MCU is part of the Nasuverse, and the TVA is merely trying to stop their timeline from being subject to the pruning theoretical phenomenon and/or becoming a Lostbelt. If you don't understand these words, that's okay. Just know that it's very anime.
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Jul 3, 2021 02:11
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MonsieurChoc posted:This just confirms that the MCU is part of the Nasuverse, and the TVA is merely trying to stop their timeline from being subject to the pruning theoretical phenomenon and/or becoming a Lostbelt. I don't understand those words in terms of their specific meaning but I don't have to because it's also a very Marvel thing. Like putting the word "Quantum" in front of other words as though that's a real explanation for what's happening.
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Jul 3, 2021 02:54
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I can't believe there's no YouTube video of everytime the word NeoGenic is uttered in Spider-Man
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Jul 3, 2021 03:02
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Everyone posted:I don't understand those words in terms of their specific meaning but I don't have to because it's also a very Marvel thing. Like putting the word "Quantum" in front of other words as though that's a real explanation for what's happening. I'm gonna explain it more anyway, cause I feel like it. So, the Nasuverse is just a bunch of interlinked animes/videogames based on the work of a japanese nerd named Kinoko nasu and his friends who add stuff to it. In that multiverse, there AREN'T infinite timelines: when a timeline diverges too much so that humanity becomes stagnant or dies off, the timeline is pruned. Why or if it affects other worlds hasn't been explained yet afaik. The current storyline of the phone game is that an Alien God has wiped the Earth clean and brought back some of those Doomed Timelines (called Lostbelts cause anime) to fight it out until one remains to become the new main timeline. The hero fights them by summoning heroes of the past to fight them.
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Jul 3, 2021 03:27
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So Loki meets Mortal Kombat?
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Jul 3, 2021 03:52
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FilthyImp posted:Remember when we were sure that Mephisto was gonna play into WandaVision? Was certainly more interesting than how the show ended up ending. Though literally any of the theories would have been.
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Jul 3, 2021 07:35
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Guys we all love time-travel and multiverse movies, but they almost all some glaring problems because hey, you can't actually do this stuff. Kind of like how people spend time figuring out how Superman can lift the huge stuff he lifts and fly around with it when his carried items are usually too huge and being manipulated over too small of an area, and should (by the laws of physics) fall apart or structurally fail in spectacular ways. But it's Superman physics. I'm afraid the dweebs have out-thunk you.
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Jul 3, 2021 12:00
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can't believe this guy has the audacity to call his theory unified when he doesn't even address the logo he throws off his chest in Superman II
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Jul 3, 2021 16:16
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That has nothing to do with Superman's powers, any person can do that with any S. Try it sometime.
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Jul 3, 2021 17:08
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The 90s take on Superboy iirc actually went full into the fanboy theories with 'tactile telekinesis' and such. Random note: one of Superman's Silver Age love interests, serious enough that they had a 'what if they got married and had kids' issue, was a freakin mermaid. I wanna see them bring that back.
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Jul 3, 2021 18:41
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FilthyImp posted:I can't believe there's no YouTube video of everytime the word NeoGenic is uttered in Spider-Man that would be a nightmare
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Jul 3, 2021 19:52
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Dr. Strange: “I have seen 14 million alternate timelines where we lose…except 1.” TVA: “Uh boss, these Avengers survived…do…do we prune?”
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Jul 3, 2021 22:09
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Gatts posted:Dr. Strange: “I have seen 14 million alternate timelines where we lose…except 1.” *TVA opens a portal, throws a prune grenade in and comically kneels, eyes shut, fingers in their ears*
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Jul 3, 2021 22:15
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Grendels Dad posted:*TVA opens a portal, throws a prune grenade in and comically kneels, eyes shut, fingers in their ears* *...as the surviving Avengers die of explosive diarrhea caused by the prune grenade.*
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Jul 4, 2021 01:03
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Finished watching X-Men: Dark Phoenix. Checked it out from the library, never saw it in theaters. It was... not good. I don't know who has a hard on for doing Phoenix movies, but most people in this movie were two-dimensional at best, many less than that, including the villain. One good action sequence, most of the rest was just people looking constipated at each other while stretching their arms out surrounded by particle effects.
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Jul 4, 2021 03:16
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Cythereal posted:I don't know who has a hard on for doing Phoenix movies Probably Simon Kinberg. He cowrote X-Men 3 and wrote & directed Dark Phoenix
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Jul 4, 2021 03:46
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Cythereal posted:Finished watching X-Men: Dark Phoenix. Checked it out from the library, never saw it in theaters. It was... not good. I don't know who has a hard on for doing Phoenix movies, but most people in this movie were two-dimensional at best, many less than that, including the villain. One good action sequence, most of the rest was just people looking constipated at each other while stretching their arms out surrounded by particle effects.
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Jul 4, 2021 04:02
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Robot Style posted:Probably Simon Kinberg. He cowrote X-Men 3 and wrote & directed Dark Phoenix "MAN, X3 really killed the franchise's momentum huh?" 'Well we have a new cast and continuity... let's give OUR Phoenix saga to, uh, the guy who did X3! Surely with his experience..."
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Jul 4, 2021 04:34
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I could see how it ended up there. Phoenix was clearly being set up in X2, and Kinberg really wanted to do that storyline when he was hired for the third movie. The studio wanted to focus on the cure story instead, so the Phoenix stuff was scaled back, and there were a bunch of other decisions that were studio mandated like killing Cyclops because James Marsden was busy, or restricting which characters could be included to avoid conflicting with the in-development Wolverine movie. It also didn't help that X3 had three directors in as many years. Singer left in 2004 to do Superman Returns, being replaced by Matthew Vaughn until 2005, who left and was replaced by Brett Ratner because Fox refused to push the release date back. So when they rebooted the franchise, Kinberg was brought back to write Days of Future Past, which was pretty well regarded, and he was kept on for Apocalypse and Dark Phoenix. Then all of Bryan Singer's misdeeds became too public for the studio to ignore, and Kinberg took over as the director of the movie as well (it's rumored he also filled in for Josh Trank on Fant4stic, so would already be a pinch-hitter for Fox). The movie itself took a few hits during production as well. Originally the villains of the movie were Skrulls that had infiltrated the UN, with Phoenix sacrificing herself to destroy a Skrull ship in space. This was changed in reshoots, and one of the rumors is that it was changed because it was too similar to Captain Marvel, which was also in production at the time.
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Jul 4, 2021 05:36
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I seem to remember First Class and Days of Future Past whipping a fair amount of rear end, which seemed like a recovery for the series after X3 and Origins. Then it kind just fell back into mediocrity after that, it sounds like. I never bothered with Apocolypse or Dark Phoenix.
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Jul 4, 2021 19:36
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I know for a fact I've seen Dark Phoenix but I have zero memory of it, despite having a very good memory for movies in general. Researched DOFP with the Rogue cut recently and I still hold that it's one of the best X-Men movies.
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Jul 4, 2021 19:48
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man nurse posted:I seem to remember First Class and Days of Future Past whipping a fair amount of rear end DoFP was a fever dream of nerdyness by bringing together the two X-casts and having Jackman serve as the point. Bonus for some of the future sentinel deaths being just bonkers brutal. And then Apocalypse started throwing it to poo poo. 30-some years since FC and everyone looks the same, lovely overstuffed cast with poor writing, wasted lead villain, too much focus on Jen Lawrence who was done with the franchise, and absolutely ZERO loving consequences for a worldwide catastrophe. DP was so bad that I had to wonder why they made the lead villain look like Emma Frost. That that's my main takeaway from the film.
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Jul 4, 2021 19:56
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FilthyImp posted:DP was so bad that I had to wonder why they made the lead villain look like Emma Frost. That that's my main takeaway from the film. I'm not convinced she wasn't supposed to be Emma Frost when they conceived of the character but they had to swerve when they remembered that they'd already introduced that character twice in prior movies.
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Jul 4, 2021 20:27
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Actually makes sense that the future Sentinels are so brutal when you consider what some mutants can survive.
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Jul 4, 2021 20:46
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Inzombiac posted:Researched DOFP with the Rogue cut recently and I still hold that it's one of the best X-Men movies. Definitely agree. I liked the regular DOFP but I think the Rogue Cut really does go above. I never saw the "X-Men 1.5" DVD cut that came out just before X2 - is that worth checking out? What exactly does it change from the original?
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Jul 4, 2021 22:25
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Chairman Capone posted:Definitely agree. I liked the regular DOFP but I think the Rogue Cut really does go above. The only thing I remember was a small scene with Jubilee (in the same class when Bobby makes the ice rose.)
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Jul 4, 2021 23:56
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The thing I remember most about X-Men 1.5 is listening to the DVD commentary and during the credits an ambulance is heard from outside and they actually have to talk over it. I guess they weren't in a recording booth. Though I will say to be serious that they talk a lot about how they didn't have much of a budget for the film and had to make do with what they could. They weren't gifted a summer action blockbuster budget (especially with what superhero films were starting to cost) and speak about how Magneto ripping apart the train car presented challenges.
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Jul 5, 2021 00:36
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man nurse posted:I seem to remember First Class and Days of Future Past whipping a fair amount of rear end, which seemed like a recovery for the series after X3 and Origins. Then it kind just fell back into mediocrity after that, it sounds like. I never bothered with Apocolypse or Dark Phoenix. First Class benefitted a lot from being mostly "Magneto: Nazi Hunter" and having a fairly stacked cast. DOFP smushed two separate movies together and actually worked better than I think anyone expected it to. Neither one was high art but definitely above average. Apocalypse and Dark Phoenix seemed to suffer from a lot of studio meddling, Jen Lawrence being a pain, and the Fox sale to Disney increasing the incentive to just get the movies out the door as cheaply as possible in order to maximize short term upside.
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Jul 5, 2021 01:51
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Weren’t they also tossing around a Origins: Magneto movie before that point? Am I right in assuming that kinda just got rolled into what became first class?
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Jul 5, 2021 04:40
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