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kafka is cool because if you read his journals everyday is basically: woke up coughing blood, had some coffee for brunch, laughed by myself at my reading of my latest work at the coffee shop, wish goethe wasn't dead
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Oct 12, 2016 18:29
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kafka wracked by laughter spilling coffee all over himself because he's reading parts of the trial to his friends who all are very uncomfortable
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Oct 12, 2016 18:32
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fantasy zone posted:kafka wracked by laughter spilling coffee all over himself because he's reading parts of the trial to his friends who all are very uncomfortable It's all about the delivery.
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Oct 12, 2016 20:59
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Bob Dylan (of all people) awarded Nobel Prize for literature for "having created new poetic expressions within the great American song tradition": http://www.nobelprize.org/
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Oct 13, 2016 12:03
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Kopijeger posted:Bob Dylan (of all people) awarded Nobel Prize for literature for "having created new poetic expressions within the great American song tradition": Not sure what to think about that. He's a good lyricist but...literature? I don't know.... Do you think shitposting counts as literature and which SA poster would you nominate? Submissions to Nobel Committee, Stockholm, Sweden.
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Oct 13, 2016 15:21
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I'm certain ICP will be awarded the Nobel prize for physics for their revolutionary work in magnetism.
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Oct 13, 2016 17:26
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Take the plunge! Okay! posted:I'm certain ICP will be awarded the Nobel prize for physics for their revolutionary work in magnetism. Yeah, because they're so similar.  Josef K. Sourdust posted:Not sure what to think about that. He's a good lyricist but...literature? I don't know.... Define Literature.
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Oct 13, 2016 17:59
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I still say Paul Simon was the better lyricist 
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Oct 13, 2016 18:31
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But could there have been a Paul Simon without a Bob Dylan?
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Oct 13, 2016 18:32
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Franchescanado posted:But could there have been a Paul Simon without a Bob Dylan? Could there have been a Bob Dylan without a Woody Guthrie? Mel Mudkiper fucked around with this message at 18:43 on Oct 13, 2016 |
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Oct 13, 2016 18:40
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Mel Mudkiper posted:Could there have been a Bob Dylan without a Woody Guthrie? Well of course not, but at the time everyone was playing Woody Guthrie. Bob Dylan made the folk community diverge from only performing standards from songbooks and gave them new lyrics dealing with issues of the time, instead of the Dust Bowl stories and hobo train car blues. It is a tough call, Paul Simon does have lyrics that put Dylan to shame, and his modern output blows Dylan's modern output of covers songs out of the water, but he never played with the convention of identity, and I like Bob Dylan's surreal lyrics of his electric era. I'm happy for Bob.
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Oct 13, 2016 19:10
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I appreciate why he got it more than that he got it I think its tremendous to acknowledge the value of the American folk singer songwriter as a voice of cultural introspection, I just think Dylan is the most trite figure of that movement
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Oct 13, 2016 19:15
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Mel Mudkiper posted:I appreciate why he got it more than that he got it Yeah, I gotcha. But who else from the movement would be better? Dave Van Ronk? Guthrie? Bob Dylan is kinda the easy pick, with a half-century long career that has explored almost every genre and that's still going. It would have been more interesting to see Leonard Cohen, who has several novels and poetry collections, but he was after Tin Pan Alley.
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Oct 13, 2016 19:19
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Franchescanado posted:Yeah, I gotcha. But who else from the movement would be better? Dave Van Ronk? Guthrie? Bob Dylan is kinda the easy pick, with a half-century long career that has explored almost every genre and that's still going. I mean, considering the Nobel can only be awarded to living writers, outside of Simon, Dylan is the most deserving. I like Cohen, but he doesn't have nearly the output or influence of Dylan. Its more about me being a folk music fan and having hipster folk music opinions than a literary critique at this point.
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Oct 13, 2016 19:25
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Mel Mudkiper posted:I mean, considering the Nobel can only be awarded to living writers, outside of Simon, Dylan is the most deserving. I like Cohen, but he doesn't have nearly the output or influence of Dylan. Its more about me being a folk music fan and having hipster folk music opinions than a literary critique at this point. Aw man, Mel. You've already recommended me Art of Fielding and Aquarium, you gotta throw me some folk acts you like.
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Oct 13, 2016 19:37
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Franchescanado posted:Aw man, Mel. You've already recommended me Art of Fielding and Aquarium, you gotta throw me some folk acts you like. Well, my absolute hero is Townes Van Zandt. Townes Van Zandt is so good Steve Earle named his son after him and also gave the world this quote “Townes Van Zandt is the best songwriter in the whole world and I’ll stand on Bob Dylan‘s coffee table in my cowboy boots and say that.” After Townes Van Zandt I would probably say you should check out Iris Dement. Her album "My Life" is pretty much perfect. Early John Prine is also excellent. He got a little hoaky for me as he aged, but his debut album and Diamonds in the Rough are masterpieces. Kate Wolfe is probably the best female songwriter ever so check her out. Nanci Griffith is hit or miss. She is a little earnest and can over-produce her albums, but when she is on its beautiful. Two modern folk musicians I am fond of are Jenni Arnau and Joshua James Townes Van Zandt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPxz_4wIa4g Iris Dement: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7VGGmTJqZs John Prine: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLVWEYUqGew Kate Wolfe: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GO4nnNURgFI Nanci Griffith: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GK462XnRjQ Jenni Arnau: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNeRLVdk7mc Joshua James: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpWoTO-lLbE
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Oct 13, 2016 19:51
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To sorta stay on topic, I like Anthony Scaduto's biography about Dylan from 1972. It fully acknowledges that Bob Dylan's story is weird and full of contradictions, and embraces an oral retelling based on many interviews, showing different perspectives on his story only ten years into his career. I'm Not There's weird structure is also similar.
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Oct 13, 2016 19:51
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Mel Mudkiper posted:Folk Music recs, John Prine These are great! I'm already a huge John Prine fan. His first few albums are amazing, and I consider the eponymous album perfect. Sam Stone and Angel From Montgomery are fantastic heartbreakers. I'll give the rest a listen over the next few days.
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Oct 13, 2016 19:56
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Franchescanado posted:Yeah, I gotcha. But who else from the movement would be better? Dave Van Ronk? luang prabang is nobel-quality material and deserves to be recognised as such
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Oct 13, 2016 20:20
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It's not like he was given the award only for writing some  tunes that the committee members used to listen in uni while smoking weed and arguing with each other how many roads must a man walk down. Actually, to me his early songs seem quite mediocre compared to what Dylan managed to do later in his career: from grab-bag of surrealistic images to revenge songs, to collage-like narratives.Thunder on the Mountain that the Nobel twitter feed linked to is actually a good example. The lyrics of the song are poo poo if you read them without context. But listening to it within the context of American song tradition you begin finding references from all over the place, reworked for the song, and thus making the song itself become a (satirical) commentary on the main preoccupations of the American popular music: love and religion. (It's actually remarkable how it manages to speak of physical and religious love at the same time- often in the same line - and keeps doing it throughout the song.) i mean Simon and Cohen do have lines and verses, and songs that are just as good that whatever Dylan has ever written - and they've been more consistent to boot. But they've never involved themselves consciously with the history of music and its people in their lyrics/songs as deep and wide as Dylan did. To me this metalyrical (?) aspect is the one that lifts him above the rest, no matter how tired the idea of Dylan as the Great American Songwriter is by now. ok, back to shiposting now
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Oct 13, 2016 20:59
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Mel Mudkiper posted:Well, my absolute hero is Townes Van Zandt. Townes Van Zandt is so good Steve Earle named his son after him and also gave the world this quote “Townes Van Zandt is the best songwriter in the whole world and I’ll stand on Bob Dylan‘s coffee table in my cowboy boots and say that.” You have good taste. You are also probably prone to depression, but so am I. God, Tecumseh Valley, that has to be the bleakest song ever written, but I just can't get enough of it. I thought this quote would be relevant to the discussion: Wikipedia posted:According to Susanna Clark, Van Zandt turned down repeated invitations to write with Bob Dylan.[27] Dylan was reportedly a "big fan" of Townes and claimed to have all of his records; Van Zandt admired Dylan's songs, but didn't care for his celebrity.[27] The two first met during a chance encounter outside a costume shop in the South Congress district of Austin, on June 21, 1986.[27] According to Johnny Guess, Dylan later arranged another meeting with the songwriter. The Drag in Austin was shut down due to Dylan being in town; Van Zandt drove his motorhome to the cordoned-off area, after which Dylan boarded the vehicle and requested to hear him play several songs. Take the plunge! Okay! fucked around with this message at 21:25 on Oct 13, 2016 |
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Oct 13, 2016 21:14
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Shoulda been Zevon
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Oct 13, 2016 21:23
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corn in the bible posted:Shoulda been Zevon Warren Zevon, the guy who's been dead for thirteen years?
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Oct 13, 2016 21:24
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Dylan has been creatively dead for much longer
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Oct 13, 2016 21:25
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corn in the bible posted:Dylan has been creatively dead for much longer As a live performer, sure, but The Tempest was pretty good. The two cover albums have been interesting projects for a man a few years away from death. Would you care to comment on the irony that Warren Zevon's last album had him cover a Bob Dylan song?
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Oct 13, 2016 21:29
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I will say that Bob Dylan, as far as I know, doesn't have any songs about werewolves, though Zevon and Simon do.
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Oct 13, 2016 21:31
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aooooooo, werewolves of london
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Oct 13, 2016 21:39
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Take the plunge! Okay! posted:You have good taste. You are also probably prone to depression, but so am I. God, Tecumseh Valley, that has to be the bleakest song ever written, but I just can't get enough of it. Nanci Griffith's version with Arlo Guthrie is incredible https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AN4EXY91SJw Townes himself said its the best version of the song ever performed
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Oct 13, 2016 21:52
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corn in the bible posted:aooooooo, werewolves of london Quiet Gary, you're gonna start a howl
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Oct 13, 2016 21:57
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"It was early in the morning. The sun was shining, early in the morning. I was laying in bed. I was wondering if she had changed it all. I was wondering if her hair was still red." -- Ernest Hemingway, "Tangled Up In Blue"
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Oct 14, 2016 11:30
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HA this name is bad please rename the forum or at the very least the lit thread to Idiot Wyndham Lewis
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Oct 14, 2016 15:18
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CestMoi posted:HA this name is bad please rename the forum or at the very least the lit thread to Idiot Wyndham Lewis Open to suggestions but they need to be funnier than that Also the lemonades joke tagline is old now and needs replacing I toyed with the idea of just moving the whole forum to make it a subforum of NMD but that would've been complicated
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Oct 14, 2016 18:45
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I've Never Even Kipled
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Oct 14, 2016 19:20
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CestMoi posted:HA this name is bad please rename the forum or at the very least the lit thread to Idiot Wyndham Lewis
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Oct 14, 2016 19:27
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"leading whores to culture" ?
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Oct 14, 2016 19:35
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a la recherche du posts perdu
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Oct 14, 2016 19:38
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Literatorture
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Oct 14, 2016 20:18
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i vote we keep it Quit Being A loving Child and Read Some Real Literature because every now and then a genre dweeb gets mad enough about the thread title to post once about how the concept of high lit is bullshit or whatever and then never posts again
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Oct 14, 2016 20:21
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ITT We Are The Best Minds Of My Generation
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Oct 14, 2016 20:44
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corn in the bible posted:a la recherche du posts perdu The fault is not in our posts, but in ourselves It was the best of posts, it was the worst of posts All happy posts are alike; each unhappy post is unhappy in its own way Posting died today. Or maybe yesterday; I can't be sure Edit: And so we post on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into GBS Many years later, as he faced the firing squad, colonel Aurelio buendia was to remember that distant afternoon that his father took him to discover shitposts The Unbearable Lightness of Posting I could do this all day Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Oct 14, 2016 |
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Oct 14, 2016 20:45
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