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Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

Godholio posted:

No, that would be "No I am NOT loving hot mic'd!" yes he was
So many of these.

"Luger 91 flight, you are cleared for takeoff on runway 13R.
...
That guy didn't acknowledge me before taking the active. Write him up."
Other guy in the RSU:
"Dude, you're sitting on your transmit button."

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Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

VERTiG0 posted:

That's the craziest goddamn thing I've ever read.
Use this weird trick to save money on plane tickets. Airlines hate this!

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

MrChips posted:

This might just be my foreign perspective, but why does the Navy even need its own army these days? To my eye, there's so much overlap between the army and the Marines that it doesn't really make sense to have them as two separate entities. Roll the Marines into the army as an army command or a series of divisions or whatever the hell, let them keep their silly uniforms and be done with.
No one in the US Government has the stomach for the shitstorm that would happen of you tried to delete an entire 200+ year old armed service. Just closing an army base is a massive, complicated, intensely political process. Hell, we barely managed to shut down JFCOM, and no one could really explain what they actually did.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

grover posted:

Doctrine-wise, US does not like to deploy amphibious ready groups for peacetime low-intensity/flag-waving missions without at least some protective air support. I'm pretty sure it's cheaper to deploy 4 F-35Bs with each ARG than to commission the additional 13 CVNs required to escort all those ARGs.
Here's the problem with that: Four F-35s aren't poo poo. It's not enough to sustain on-call CAS, it's not enough to run a barrier CAP, it's not enough for SEAD, or to attack anti-shipping missile batteries. Of course, it'll probably three after the inevitable MX cancel. Any sort of situation that requires supersonic, stealth strike fighters is going to require a lot more than four. Also, no tanker support, and the magazine on a LHA probably can't carry enough of the different munitions you need for each of those contingencies. It makes infinitely more sense to send a destroyer with a VLS, since those can actually simultaneously attack land targets and protect the group with SAMs.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

Godholio posted:

The ride can be a bit rough in a refueling aircraft. Like "oh that dude with a thousand hours just puked in his glove" rough.
Never thought I'd say this non-sarcastically, but here we are:

H. T. F. U.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011
Yes, transport height landing gear, unimproved strips, and fighter-style underwing engine intakes. Nothing can possibly go wrong. A better idea would be to do B-1 style signature management without going balls out and trying to design a transport that can go in on the first night of the war unescorted. I'm sure AFSOC would love that, but it's a capability that is going to go unused 99% of the time.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

Madurai posted:

When's the last time the unimproved strip capacity was used?

Beaten, but the answer is: pretty much all the time. Also comes in handy then you have to land places that are technically "airports" but are mainly used by the locals as junkyards/animal pastures.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

iyaayas01 posted:

e: So you all should check out this ppt featuring pictures of the Naval Aviation heritage paint schemes. I know there's a couple that aren't depicted there (VX-9's, for starters although that one apparently wasn't an "official" heritage scheme and was just done up by the unit) but it is a pretty good round up. I think my favorite has to be the P-3 scheme that is identical to the scheme that the first P-3s were delivered in.

Those two- and three-tone Orca schemes are baller as gently caress.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

Ola posted:

I wonder which limbs the fighter pilot will lose for that one.

Koesj posted:

None. Something tells me this wasn't a contractor, and a national doing lead-in will have some pull.

Haha, yeah. Ten bucks says it turns out to be someone with the word "Prince" before his name and the Emirati aviation authority quickly finds the 777 crew fully at fault.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011
Never fails.

"Oh wow, this land right off the end of the runway is so cheap! I can't believe no one has noticed this rock-bottom price, I must be a genius at real estate. I'mma build my condo there!"

*six months later*

"The government flies planes over my house all day and night and it's too loud and I'm a taxpayer, I pay their salaries and I have rights! :bahgawd:"

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

holocaust bloopers posted:

Huh. That's cool. Didnt know that TR wasn't factored into the data. The E-3 does have a totally awesome anti-skid system. It's pretty sweet landing on an RCR 10 runway and watching the lights flicker like crazy.
KC-135 got carbon brakes years ago. Get with the times, AWACers.


evil_bunnY posted:

It'd be kind of ironic to not make your landing after en engine loss.

Uh...

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

grover posted:

How is tanker fuel metered/handled budget-wise? Can't imagine the pilot has to cut a funding document from the cockpit every time he/she wants fuel...
Domestically or for combat ops? Domestically there's an arrangement where receiver units are charged a certain rate for training sorties and offloaded fuel. Combat ops are a whole different ball of wax.


holocaust bloopers posted:

-135 crews just love to be like, "Hey AWACS..... so we lost our activity and need to mosey on home. How about you take 60k of gas so we can just get out of here?! TTTTHHHAAANNNKKKSSSS!"
Do not even start with me.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

holocaust bloopers posted:

Haha you can be honest here. It's no secret that tankers try really hard to get the gently caress out of AR track and back home in record time.
In a few decades, when the NDAs from our combat operations expire, I'm going to write a book about all the stupid poo poo receivers do when the tanker doesn't cost them anything and can't tell them to get hosed. Your ":qq: I had to carry an extra 60k" is less than nothing.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

grover posted:

Both, actually. How's it work?

Well, as I said, for training purposes, the tanker units track receiver units and bill them based on how the mission is coded. TDYs and large exercises may come out of a different fund site. I think this is actually implemented as a module of the scheduling software we use, but I'd need to ask someone in finance to find out for sure and gently caress that.

Overseas contingency operations are funded by :cripes: :bravo: authorizing a :ducksiren: :barf: season lightly :tinsley::goatsecx: (Congressmen never actually read this part) :psypop::chiefsay: is disbursed to individual units in the supported command based on :unsmigghh::pgi::krakentoot:

then

:jiggled: {black magic goes here} x :ccb:=

:retrogames::retrogames::retrogames:you dump a billion dollars in a hole in the desert, cover it with JP-8, and light it the gently caress on fire:retrogames::retrogames::retrogames:

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

Gorilla Salad posted:

I'd love to see what the full interior of something like the Tu-160 or a B1-B or B2 looked like.
I'm sure various intelligence agencies would as well.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011
Might Die

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

OptimusMatrix posted:

Have a drone survival guide. Pretty simple but pretty neat. I had no idea how many types of drones we have in service. You can pay for it on aluminum or you can download the pdf for free and print it out yourself.

http://dronesurvivalguide.org/
I like that they think putting aluminum foil on your car will somehow shield you from a Reaper.

It's almost insulting, really. "Oh, those poor ethnics in Pakistan have been living under the shadows of Obama's immoral drone war for over a decade. If only they had a Dutch technocrat to tell them about shiny materials!"

Dead Reckoning fucked around with this message at 06:39 on Dec 25, 2013

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

Delivery McGee posted:

Has anybody ever flown airliners in close formation?

Powercube posted:

Sometimes the South Africans do it


EDIT: Tables. Click for huge.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011
Cessna 172 or a Piper Cub. If you're a DIY type, a Vans RV kit can be a cheap option.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

lushka16 posted:

My grandfather was a navigator in the following aircraft:

Li-2
B-25
Tu-4
Tu-16
Il-18
tu-114
Il-62

If you guys would like to ask him any questions, I can relay them over.

What was Russian navigator training like? How did the selection, instruction, schoolhouse operate? What was their primary means of fixing? (Cell, dead reckoning, navaids, radar, visual?)
What was their interaction with the rest of the crew like?
How did they cope with navigation at extreme northern latitudes? (Did they use the same Grid nav system as the USAF?)
Did he save any of his old charts?

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011
Hey, Polymerized Cum, you don't have PMs, so: what's the process like to become a flying medic? Is it easier to get the flying or the medic part first?

Plinkey posted:

This and they also fly around Palmdale a few times a week. NASA has their own white U2 flying every once in a while.

There is also some tension about keeping U2s or Global Hawks for recon work.

Well, there was until it became increasingly clear the Global Hawk wasn't meeting its promised capability milestones.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

Bob A Feet posted:

And if he diverted that pilot would have done the right thing legally but probably would've gotten fired for pissing off such a big name client as Bieber.
Not a chance. A pop musician on the downslope isn't even remotely a "big name client" in the world of people who charter private jets. Hell, it would probably be good for the company's rep to revoke a nouveau riche brat's airplane privileges. "Yeah, Justin Bieber used to fly on this charter, but he's not allowed anymore." Rich people love feeling exclusive.

hobbesmaster posted:

(b) Except in an emergency, no pilot of a civil aircraft may allow a person who appears to be intoxicated or who demonstrates by manner or physical indications that the individual is under the influence of drugs (except a medical patient under proper care) to be carried in that aircraft.

Good point except that commercial carriers are happy to give you a fuckton of booze so...
Cabin crew do not give a gently caress what you do as long as you do it quietly and without bothering the other passengers. You could have an acid flashback in seat C18 as long as you do so without causing problems. I've flown commercial while tipsy, and carried passengers I am certain were on various parts of the drunk->hungover spectrum. Nobody is going breathalyze you at the gate. I'm sure this goes double for charter jets.

Dead Reckoning fucked around with this message at 15:29 on Feb 6, 2014

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

bolind posted:

Just finished plowing through Sled Driver. Man, what a crazy, crazy aircraft. I'm surprised most of the pictures were taken by the author, in the cockpit. I would've imagined that wouldn't be allowed.

You're not supposed to, mainly because they'd like you to focus on flying the plane rather than taking cool pictures of yourself, but as long as you make sure nothing sensitive is in the frame it's generally tolerated.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

grover posted:

The US combat tested a lot of prototype UAVs in Iraq and Afghanistan.

No, we didn't. I'd love to hear what "a lot" you're thinking of.
Using something in combat for the first time is not the same thing as using a prototype.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

grover posted:

"A lot" as in %-wise of the UAVs developed during that time period. The Global Hawk is the most public example; DARPA bought the thing and threw it right into afghanistan. IIRC, they just flew the gently caress out of all the prototypes until they failed, usually about the time the next was ready, and then flew that and kept going.
One example is not "a lot." Also, if you're going by that metric, every war since Kosovo has been fought by "prototype" aircraft, since every B-2 airframe built has been upgraded to combat capability. The idea of something that's been flying since 1998 (Global Hawk) and been through several upgrades being a "prototype" is pretty questionable, especially when you're talking about aircraft with low production numbers and spiral development. At best, it's very different from the untried technology demonstrator the word implies.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011
So here's a thing I saw recently:



Textron Scorpion. It's so adorably tiny :3:

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011
It's the 21st century now, and people need to stop thinking that a gun is a viable primary weapon system for a combat aircraft. Also, :lol: at the 6,100 lbs max takeoff weight. No, that isn't missing a zero.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011
There's a reason most of the Crusader's kills were with Sidewinders, and that the design was a dead end.

Or were you misunderstanding the meaning of "primary"?

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

hobbesmaster posted:

The vast majority of combat aircraft see these days is air to ground and cannon certainly works there.
Even if we assume "the vast majority of combat" means "things the US and NATO have been doing in Iraq/Afg/etc for the last 10 years," that statement still isn't true. The vast majority of what combat aircraft have been doing is ISR or overwatch patrols. When we go kinetic, it's almost always precision weapons, and unless your platform is named "Spooky" or "Spectre" that means some sort of laser- or GPS-guided bomb.* (Let's assume we're talking about fixed wing aircraft here, since helos have a different set of missions and design drives.) Setting that aside, the last decade isn't a good sample to draw conclusions from, since our opposing force's idea of an Integrated Air Defense is firing RPGs and AK-47s at the same time.

Cannon in a ground attack role aren't realistically useful against any but the most beaten down and dirt poor of enemies, and it is a poor decision to base our aircraft acquisitions on the idea that the enemy won't fight back. There are a few reasons for this. First, strafing has essentially zero adverse weather capability, and buying an aircraft that is only meant to use its main weapons when the weather cooperates is velcro-shoes retarded in a world where SDBs and JDAM are a thing. Now, you might be able to fly below the weather, but that gets into our second problem, the tyranny of slant range. Most aircraft rotary cannon, even the vaunted GAU-8 AVENGER, have an effective slant range of around 1-2 miles, which puts them inside the effective range of virtually every SHORAD system developed in the last 40 years. This isn't even addressing the huge advancements in tactical & strategic SAMs since the SA-2/3 combo ruled the roost. Aircraft in Allied Force had to operate above an altitude restriction to stay out of the low altitude air defense threat. An aircraft built around strafing is going to be useless, or at best severely hampered in that environment. You know, assuming you aren't willing to accept daily double digit attrition of your CAS assets.

*There are a few other extremely notable exceptions. Also worth mentioning here that even AFSOC is looking at transitioning away from cannons on their gunships towards more PGMs.

Dead Reckoning fucked around with this message at 06:15 on Jun 16, 2014

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011
I know the Wombats are still rocking a 30mm. They're also way more capable than the Harvest Hawk in a lot of ways. Last I heard the J model gunship weapons hadn't been 100% pinned down yet. The AF.mil fact sheet says they're keeping the 105mm cannon, but I know they were looking at replacing it with a mortar at one point.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

simplefish posted:

King Airs also fire Hellfire missiles

I'd be interested in seeing a source on this, I haven't heard of it before.

holocaust bloopers posted:

Serious question. Any talk of the USAF looking to pack a rail gun type weapon on an AC-130? I know that's sci-fi poo poo that Grover pounds off too at night considering the immense power requirements.

Not until we perfect batteries with a higher energy density than chemical propellants.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

simplefish posted:

Cessna Caravan with hellfires
Thanks. I was curious, because every other time I hear about armed King Airs and other Light Fixed Wing, they're always talking about munitions smaller than a Hellfire.

Snowdens Secret posted:

Also, the USAF went through a long phase of trying to co-opt Navy language. Partially this was just an attempt to co-opt the gravitas of a ship's captain, commodore, or admiral of the high seas. But especially in the '50s you had all this sci-fi that future war was, actually, going to be fought with battleship-sized rockets with crews in the hundreds, hurling atom bombs at each other from a hundred miles up, as a techy fantastic skyborne version of the Battle Of Trafalgar.

Not to mention if you try to make your stuff sound as fancy and impressive as Navy ships, it helps justify asking for Navy ship levels of capital expense for them.
Really we spent most of the decade post-WWII just straight trolling the Navy. "Oh, you've got no nukes? How ever will you contribute to the battlefield of the future?"

Cue money being dumped into Martin Seamasters, Regulus missiles, and the USS United States.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

Davin Valkri posted:

Was pilot survivability ever considered when designing stuff like the "two AIM-9s, one M61, no radar" F-16 or the "one GAU-8, nothing else" SC ARES thing? The only way I see those concepts making sense is in some sort of AI controlled massive swarm thing, where they're cheap and unmanned, and nobody cares if you lose most of them getting close enough to use their weapons.
I believe the main consideration when designing the Advanced Day Fighter (that eventually became the F-16) was, "Holy poo poo, the Russians have a lot of aircraft in Europe and even the most optimistic projections about F-X heavy interceptor buys and missile Pk still have leakers getting through." It's not actually true that there was to be no radar; the spec simply didn't emphasize it, (in fact, you'd need a radar for gun ranging), especially in comparison to the F-15, which was built around emerging radar and missile technology.

The threat environment of the time was much different as well. The SA-10, MiG-29 and AA-11 didn't start showing up until the 80's, and the SA-14 and SA-6 were just starting to come on line. Early Warsaw Pact tactical SAMs had a poor record against aircraft with countermeasures, (which were in the F-16 from the start,) and scary, mobile strategic SAMs that could reach out and slap planes out of DCA orbits hadn't been fielded yet. Warsaw Pact tactical fighters of the era were the MiG-23, MiG-21 & Su-15. The F-16 could compete against the MiG-23, especially in a DCA role, but the big feature was that it completely outclassed the MiG-21 generation of fighters, and could be bought in sufficient numbers to effectively neutralize them. Even if the F-16 had to be pushed on the offensive, we would do what we did in Vietnam and protect the package with dedicated SEAD and ECM aircraft. No one ever really thought about it in a disposable "lol zergling rush" way. Or at least, no more disposable than literally every other air asset in the NATO European forces.

The SC ARES is still retarded though.

Dead Reckoning fucked around with this message at 17:55 on Jun 17, 2014

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

iyaayas01 posted:

You're right that the original ADF/LWF/ACF program spec always called for a very small ranging radar, but that doesn't mean the fighter mafia was happy about it. The LWF was supposed to be their chance to "get it right" with that daytime only 2xAIM-9 and a Vulcan armed fighter after the USAF had (in their words) "hosed it up" by turning the F-X into a gold plated overweight not maneuverable enough piece of crap (that has just managed to rack up a 105-0 kill ratio and was the most dominant air superiority fighter in the world for a quarter century).
I get that was their stated platonic ideal, but I think all but the most hardcore members of the Mafia understood that when the rubber met the road and contracts were being drawn for hundreds of purchases, the LWF was going to have capabilities at least equal to the aircraft it was competing with, to say nothing of the ones it was replacing. The people holding the purse strings certainly did. I can't imagine the Mafia was terribly disappointed either, since none of the additions (two missiles? really?) compromised the "cheap, agile, light-weight" aspects of the design.

quote:

Friendly reminder that the USAF's own loss rate predictions in a major theater war in Western Europe had at least 50 A-10s getting shot down a day, with the entire fleet gone within two weeks.
Yeah. It was a different time.


Davin Valkri posted:

How well would a countermeasure launcher have worked with no radar warning receiver or similar to track incoming missiles? Would the pilot just have to hope he saw the launch trail before using them manually? Because right now this thing sounds like it would have been a "sci-fi bad guy henchman vehicle" level of deathtrap.
Nothing in the spec said "no RWR." Onboard ECM was probably out though. It's not that horrible an idea really. The F-5 is basically that setup, and has a respectable combat record. As long as the pilot understands its capabilities and limitations (like not taking it into SA-2/3 rings) it'll do fine against bombers and contemporary fighters. There's a reason we went for the F-16 over the F-20 though: there aren't a lot of reasons not to go for added capability when you're making a big buy.

Dead Reckoning fucked around with this message at 04:48 on Jun 18, 2014

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

Flikken posted:

I liked the part when Charlotte ATC tried to get him to shoot down SF choppers after 9/11.
They should have asked an F-15 pilot instead.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

Geoj posted:

I would expect the majority of the airgoing public to have a visceral bad reaction to the pilots not having a window to look out of, not really understanding that they fly by instrument for the majority of the flight anyways. That will probably kill this concept faster than any regulatory agency's refusal to sign off on it.
I expect the majority of aircrew will also have a visceral bad reaction to not having a window to look out of. I know I would. Yes, 90% of flight time is on instruments, but during critical phases of flight having someone with eyes outside is a big deal.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

holocaust bloopers posted:

When I worked in flight safety I would get to hear about all of those ludicrous complaints. My favorite one was some elderly lady out in the sticks of Fairbanks, AK who repeatedly complained that an AWACS pilot (she would read the names on the side of the jet and since we only flew two jets she kept catching the same one) was attempting to kill her dogs by flying low over her place.

Beyond that the most regular ones were fighter guys buzzing people or flying very low. I believe those for sure considering how empty Alaska is and, you know, fighter pilots are douche bags.
My favorite of these stories was told to me by a Brit who used to answer calls for one of the Tornado GR4 units. They train at fairly low level, but it's generally away from populated areas, and most of the calls they took were either unsubstantiated or complaints about airliners flying into airports that had nothing whatsoever to do with the RAF. One day they take a call from an old lady:

:britain:: "Yes, hello, I'm sorry to have to call. I support our forces, and every thing you do. I'm used to the planes coming over my house, but they came over especially low today, and it was so loud it made my dog wee!"
RAF: "Well, ma'am there are a lot of planes flying today. Are you sure it was one of ours?"
:britain:: "Well, it was grey, it had two engines, it was definitely a fighter... and it had a [roman numeral redacted] on the tail."
RAF: :stare: "Ok ma'am, definitely one of ours, we'll have a word with the pilot."

For reference, this is how big the Squadron markings are on RAF Tornadoes:



Think about how close you'd have to be to read that.

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

All I can hear is a long horn followed by a monotone voice saying, "BANK ANGLE, BANK ANGLE... MONITOR VERTICAL SPEED"

Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

buttcrackmenace posted:

Going to work this into the next trivia contest. "What was the last American military aircraft built without on-board radar?"

hobbesmaster posted:

Probably actually the T-52. Apparently the U-28 actually has a weather radar which was my other guess.

Depends if you go from first flight or IOC. It might be one of the trainers, but a lot of those are designed and flying with civilians or other nations well before we buy them. If not those, it's probably the MQ-9 or some sort of helo, I can't remember if we've bought any new ones lately.

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Dead Reckoning
Sep 13, 2011

hobbesmaster posted:

I always wondered why there wasn't an anti AWACS ARM missile
It's been tried: the Navy tried the Brazo program to take out high, fast interceptors, and some random joes on the internet claim Russia offers a passive, home-on-emitter version of the AA-10. I'd check on that second one, but I don't have a 2004 copy of Jane's Rockets and Missiles.

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