Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Fornax Disaster
Apr 11, 2005

If you need me I'll be in Holodeck Four.

TITANKISSER69 posted:

Offhand, I do know that their new streetcars have been somewhat of a fiasco with Toronto Transit, with many being delivered very late and some having to be sent back.

The Toronto Star did a major investigation into the streetcar fiasco. They mismanaged the supply chain badly with parts arriving late or out of spec. They outsourced a lot of the welding work to a plant in Mexico so that they could keep the bid low and then failed to properly train or retain the workers there.

https://projects.thestar.com/bombardier-ttc/index.html

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Nebakenezzer
Sep 13, 2005

The Mote in God's Eye

Would you believe there's another corrupt Canadian company based in Quebec that is bad at rail?

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/snc-lavalin-technical-evaluation-1.5438697

KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010



Runner-up, TRP Sack Race 2021/22

Nebakenezzer posted:

Hi, train friends

This is a airplane/train thread MIXED MODE double post. Can anybody explain what the hell is going on with bombardier? Were they not good at making trains? Are they now bad at trains? The company has sold its entire aviation holdings (C300/A220 partnership with Airbus, CRJ sold to Mitsubishi, all legacy designs like the Dash 8/Q400 sold to a BC aviation firm), with the only exception being its bizjets. And now they appear to be dying/dead everywhere else.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-01-21/bombardier-is-said-to-explore-combining-rail-unit-with-alstom

well the CRJ and dash-8 line sales make sense. the market pretty well dried up for both and it was transitioning entirely to aftersales support. bombardier also needed cash at the time.

drunkill
Sep 25, 2007

me @ ur posting
Fallen Rib
Uh.. that looked like it was close to a huge fuckup

https://twitter.com/thomaslmajor/status/1221922465363791872?s=19

TITTIEKISSER69
Mar 19, 2005

SAVE THE BEES
PLANT MORE TREES
CLEAN THE SEAS
KISS TITTIESS




Glad nobody had to call Todd

Noosphere
Aug 31, 2008

[[[error]]] Damn not found.
Bombardier has also had tremendous trouble with the Twindexx contract for the Swiss Federal Railways (SBB). They were supposed to deliver them starting in 2013. Deliveries started instead in 2018. The few units in service have been plagued by poor reliability, insufficient access for handicapped people, software crashes (sometimes preventing the train from running at all), a tilting system that shakes passengers around, and more. They've only recently ironed out enough bugs that the trains can run without Bombardier support staff aboard to fix things. As a compensation, Bombardier has had to deliver a handful of units to the SBB free of charge.

evil_bunnY
Apr 2, 2003

Nebakenezzer posted:

Would you believe there's another corrupt Canadian company based in Quebec that is bad at rail?

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/snc-lavalin-technical-evaluation-1.5438697

"The SNC-Lavalin bid failed to include a signalling and train control system, had no plan for snow removal and, at one point, appeared to believe the trains that run on the Trillium Line were electric, not diesel."

My good bitch what are you doing

Neddy Seagoon
Oct 12, 2012

"Hi Everybody!"

evil_bunnY posted:

"The SNC-Lavalin bid failed to include a signalling and train control system, had no plan for snow removal and, at one point, appeared to believe the trains that run on the Trillium Line were electric, not diesel."

My good bitch what are you doing

Ooh, reminds me of Connex when they took over management of the Melbourne passengee trains.

Kilonum
Sep 30, 2002

You know where you are? You're in the suburbs, baby. You're gonna drive.

Nationalize all passenger rail

Kia Soul Enthusias
May 9, 2004

zoom-zoom
Toilet Rascal
Resume production of the Tatra T3!

drunkill
Sep 25, 2007

me @ ur posting
Fallen Rib
Whoops.

https://twitter.com/amnayang/status/1222420795294568448
https://twitter.com/amnayang/status/1222429230366986240

evil_bunnY
Apr 2, 2003

Kilonum posted:

Nationalize all passenger rail
It's not just the nationalizing, it needs to be independent. The tech team on that project advised against giving them even the time of day, but they went ahead because *must buy lowest bidder guysssss* and here we are.
I'm so glad our regulations specify best value instead of lowest price. It makes it trivially easy to dismiss lowball shitbag bids.

lilbeefer
Oct 4, 2004

Any of you train nerds interested in virtual trains should check out the humble bundle at the moment

https://www.humblebundle.com/games/...ator2020_bundle

$450 worth of dlc, pay what you want over a few hundred bucks. I only have a passing interest from a mechanical perspective (especially this thread), but I flipped 15 bucks because hey, it's charity

Kilonum
Sep 30, 2002

You know where you are? You're in the suburbs, baby. You're gonna drive.

this is cool

https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/eyoxfb/oc_i_have_made_60_fps_4k_version_of_1896_movie/

also, lol safety

sincx
Jul 13, 2012

furiously masturbating to anime titties
.

sincx fucked around with this message at 05:55 on Mar 23, 2021

Saukkis
May 16, 2003

Unless I'm on the inside curve pointing straight at oncoming traffic the high beams stay on and I laugh at your puny protest flashes.
I am Most Important Man. Most Important Man in the World.

I recently went through a Star Trek marathon, and when watching the video-based Deep Space 9 after film-based The Next Generation, I really wished we could just feed all the high quality photos of the actors and sets to a neural net and have it reconstruct the series.

Kilonum
Sep 30, 2002

You know where you are? You're in the suburbs, baby. You're gonna drive.

Saukkis posted:

I recently went through a Star Trek marathon, and when watching the video-based Deep Space 9 after film-based The Next Generation, I really wished we could just feed all the high quality photos of the actors and sets to a neural net and have it reconstruct the series.

iirc DS9, Voyager, and Enterprise were all shot on film but all the post production was done on tape.

Kia Soul Enthusias
May 9, 2004

zoom-zoom
Toilet Rascal

Kilonum posted:

iirc DS9, Voyager, and Enterprise were all shot on film but all the post production was done on tape.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4rDBV1MCfU

Crunchy Black
Oct 24, 2017

by Athanatos

Kilonum posted:

iirc DS9, Voyager, and Enterprise were all shot on film but all the post production was done on tape.

...so was TNG. Viacom/CBS/whoever the gently caress just won't release the negatives like they did for the TNG release.

e: that clip is from the DS9 Documentary, "What we Left Behind" which is AMAZING.

madeintaipei
Jul 13, 2012

Remember us talking about train wheels w/ axle on semi-trucks? Found one in the wild: This Swedish trucker hauls them on a regular basis. Starts at about 4:50. Still don't understand it.

TheFluff
Dec 13, 2006

FRIENDS, LISTEN TO ME
I AM A SEAGULL
OF WEALTH AND TASTE

madeintaipei posted:

Remember us talking about train wheels w/ axle on semi-trucks? Found one in the wild: This Swedish trucker hauls them on a regular basis. Starts at about 4:50. Still don't understand it.

I don't remember that, and I don't know what you're curious about, but I think I know something about this! That looks like a driving axle and wheel pair unit for a SJ Rc locomotive but without the wheel flanges. The flanges are manufactured separately and are shrunk onto the wheels; they are wear items and they need to be replaced occasionally. The wheels themselves are of course also wear items and are occasionally touched up on a lathe. Removing the wheels from the axle seems to only be done in exceptional circumstances; normally the axle, the transmission (the big bulky thing inboard of the wheel on one side) and the wheel pair seem to be treated as a unit with a single serial number.

I don't know exactly why you'd ship around the entire thing around on a truck, but I presume that it might be for certain types of maintenance that cannot be done everywhere.

All I know about SJ Rc wheels is from this report (in Swedish) from the Swedish equivalent of the NTSB, regarding a 2008 derailing caused by a wheel flange on one of the locomotive's driving wheels breaking off.

evil_bunnY
Apr 2, 2003

madeintaipei posted:

Remember us talking about train wheels w/ axle on semi-trucks? Found one in the wild: This Swedish trucker hauls them on a regular basis. Starts at about 4:50. Still don't understand it.
I don't understand how you'd think those ties would resist any kind of dynamic loading.

BalloonFish
Jun 30, 2013



Fun Shoe

TheFluff posted:

I don't know exactly why you'd ship around the entire thing around on a truck, but I presume that it might be for certain types of maintenance that cannot be done everywhere.

I quite regularly see flatbed artic trucks loaded with rail wheelsets on the motorways here in the UK.

I've always just assumed it's because there are only a few places that will lathe/re-tyre/whatever a wheel and, with the way the rail system is run, it's easier and cheaper to send it by road. In the old days of BR you'd either send the loco/wagon/carriage direct to a BR
workshop, or if the wheelsets had to be sent separately then just pop them in a Departmental wagon and hitch that to the back of the next freight train heading in the right direction as a non-revenue load.

Now, there are no Departmental wagons and essentially no regular wagonload freight trains to attach them to. The wheelsets will be owned by one company, operated by another and probably maintained by a third, with the actual job done by a fourth. The costs of sending by rail would be astronomical in comparison to sending them by road and, actually, there's a good chance that the workshop isn't even rail-connected in the first place.

It's often cheaper to move entire locomotives from one point on the rail network to another by road on a heavy-haul low-loader than pay out for a crew, a track path and all the access charges etc.

Stairmaster
Jun 8, 2012

But... The free market is the most efficient way to allocate resources?????????????????

vains
May 26, 2004

A Big Ten institution offering distance education catering to adult learners

Stairmaster posted:

But... The free market is the most efficient way to allocate resources?????????????????

i think the time that he's referring to when wheelsets would move by rail was when british railroads were private, and then they all got nationalized. now, they're back to private but in a weird arrangement where various companies own licenses or concessions to operate certain routes and another company owns all the rail and dispatching.

the present state of british railroads doesnt seem like it can get pinned on failure of the market to work properly.

vains fucked around with this message at 07:36 on Feb 12, 2020

BalloonFish
Jun 30, 2013



Fun Shoe

vains posted:

i think the time that he's referring to when wheelsets would move by rail was when british railroads were private, and then they all got nationalized. now, they're back to private but in a weird arrangement where various companies own licenses or concessions to operate certain routes and another company owns all the rail and dispatching.

the present state of british railroads doesnt seem like it can get pinned on failure of the market to work properly.

Whether pre-BR private system or the days of the nationalised BR, the rail vehicle, the wheelsets from it, the physical rail system, the workshop where the work would be carried out, the wagon that would transport the wheels to the workshop, the locomotive that would haul the wagon and the crew that would run the locomotive were all employed by the same entity. These days, all those elements could be in the hands of different companies, each demanding a fee or charge of some sort. So it makes financial sense to just cut out all the middle-men and pay one transport firm to send them by road.

And that doesn't get around the more basic fact that, up to the 1980s, there were still plenty of wagonload freight trains trundling around the national network, so tacking a wagon of wheelsets on the back was absolutely routine. Now 99% of the freight trains in the UK are fixed-formation unit trains carrying one cargo from Point A to Point B and neither of those points will be somewhere a wheelset needs to come from or go. And because all the operations are franchised (although the physical trains are operated by private companies what those operations are are rigidly controlled by the government), an operator running a fleet of passenger trains wouldn't have any freight vehicles or locos of its own anyway - their franchise is to carry people, not stuff.

In the Good Old Days (tm), when BR ran the entire network, a huge amount of small-item shipping (packages and parcels etc. - the stuff that these days is distributed in a DHL/DPD/UPS/FedEx/Yodel van) was carried around on BR passenger trains, nearly all of which had a luggage/parcels compartment. Now that can't happen because rail franchises are specifically either Passenger or Freight, not both.

Our 'privatised' railway system is a farce. But mostly because it combines the absolutely worst features of both a private and a nationalised system without getting the full advantages of either. There's no doubt that in many ways the system is in much better shape, and a much better service-provider, than it was in the last few creaking, worn-out, run-down, 'managed decline' years of BR...but then the system as a whole receives something like three times more government funding and subsidy than BR ever did. It's a mess.

Anyway - that's not the good kind of Insanity. Here are some narrow-gauge steam pics I took back in the summer and have just found on my phone:











The big blue saddle-tank is engine No.19 from the Darjeeling Himalayan Railway in India. Built in the UK in 1889, the loco was retired in 1960, went to a steam museum in the USA and then returned to the UK in 2003 for restoration. It's the only DHR locomotive to leave India.

BalloonFish fucked around with this message at 14:44 on Feb 12, 2020

vains
May 26, 2004

A Big Ten institution offering distance education catering to adult learners

BalloonFish posted:

Whether pre-BR private system or the days of the nationalised BR, the rail vehicle, the wheelsets from it, the physical rail system, the workshop where the work would be carried out, the wagon that would transport the wheels to the workshop, the locomotive that would haul the wagon and the crew that would run the locomotive were all employed by the same entity. These days, all those elements could be in the hands of different companies,

yup, thats how normal railroads work.

Disgruntled Bovine
Jul 5, 2010

England: it's not just our trains that are crap, it's how we run them too!

George Zimmer
Jun 28, 2008

vains posted:

yup, thats how normal railroads work.

Yeah, not exactly seeing anything inherently “bad” here. Here in the US, I’d say most freight rolling stock is now privately owned or controlled by TTX.

For autoracks (cars for transporting finished vehicles), the flatcar portion is often owned by one party, usually TTX, while the rack itself is owned by the railroad.

NoWake
Dec 28, 2008

College Slice
My company manufactures track components, sells to railroads/rail contractors, and we spend a fortune on shipping by truck. Increases the price anywhere between 6-30%

It's more efficient to ship by rail, but only for repeated or massive quantities delivered between the same two points, and with railcar loading/unloading facilities at both ends.

If we ever shipped by rail, we'd have to load a truck at our plant, send it to the closest rail yard, arrange for an empty car to be there (sometimes they've shown up with other poo poo in them), arrange for someone to transfer the material to the rail car, send the railcar to the closest yard to the job site (might need to pay freight if the material is bound for another RR's track), arrange for another truck to get to that yard when it arrives (could take a week), arrange for someone to unload the railcar's material onto the truck, and then arrange for another person to unload the truck at the job site.

Hell of a lot of administrative work, and you load/unload two more times than necessary. That's two more opportunities for the poo poo to get damaged. Much easier to throw it on one truck, and let one driver get it all the way there.

evil_bunnY
Apr 2, 2003

vains posted:

yup, thats how normal railroads work.
LMAO "normal"

Mortabis
Jul 8, 2010

I am stupid
I don't see anything inefficient about shipping railroad-related stuff by some method other than rail. I bet the reason BR didn't do it that way was because it could get the rail capacity for "free" due to bad cost accounting.

Pigsfeet on Rye
Oct 22, 2008

I'm meat on the hoof
Behold! (xpost from the OSHA thread)
https://i.imgur.com/rOT3QTt.mp4

mekilljoydammit
Jan 28, 2016

Me have motors that scream to 10,000rpm. Me have more cars than Pick and Pull
That's one way to do a high rail truck.

~Coxy
Dec 9, 2003

R.I.P. Inter-OS Sass - b.2000AD d.2003AD
I was so disappointed when the railset didn't roll down the incline at full gravity speed.

KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010



Runner-up, TRP Sack Race 2021/22

Mortabis posted:

I don't see anything inefficient about shipping railroad-related stuff by some method other than rail. I bet the reason BR didn't do it that way was because it could get the rail capacity for "free" due to bad cost accounting.

in my experience costing for other industries, rail is cheaper for high volume and high weight shipments but requires the following
1) you have good access to rail at each end point
2) you absolutely do not give a gently caress about the timing of the shipment

FuturePastNow
May 19, 2014


Pigsfeet on Rye posted:

Behold! (xpost from the OSHA thread)
https://i.imgur.com/rOT3QTt.mp4

it's a keirailer

Tex Avery
Feb 13, 2012
In the true spirit of Murphy's Law, the first Amtrak long distance train to use one of the new Siemens Chargers in revenue service hit a cement truck. No fatalities, but minor injuries reported.

vains
May 26, 2004

A Big Ten institution offering distance education catering to adult learners

Tex Avery posted:

In the true spirit of Murphy's Law, the first Amtrak long distance train to use one of the new Siemens Chargers in revenue service hit a cement truck. No fatalities, but minor injuries reported.

the reddit thread had the most onion autistic reporter line ever:

"Sad to see one of the new Siemens Chargers (SC44) damaged in the accident. Luckily nobody was seriously injured!"

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Log082
Nov 8, 2008


Tex Avery posted:

In the true spirit of Murphy's Law, the first Amtrak long distance train to use one of the new Siemens Chargers in revenue service hit a cement truck. No fatalities, but minor injuries reported.

Oh hey Amtrak got some of those? My local commuter railroad got some in 2018. They look pretty neat. Anyone here enough of a nerd/industry insider to know if they're a good or lovely design?

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply