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I feel it'd depend on the persons ability to acknowledge what's "weird" or not. I had a friend who got into the role playing thing, not a big deal, but turned from a relatively normal hobby to becoming really, really obsessed to the exclusion of other activities. On the other hand there are plenty of people in the same kinds of communities and don't let edgy Pokémon rp become part of their identity. I'd personally be very uncomfortable introducing 9 year olds to those communities.
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Nov 26, 2016 21:08
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Lemniscate Blue posted:I would under no circumstances expose a nine year old to the slippery slope to horror and psychological damage that is the fanfic community. Considering how much pedophilia and incest and abusive relationships portrayed as normal/healthy, I'd vote for keeping young kids away from fanfics until they're much older. You really don't want pedos grooming them, or them developing bad ideas about how any kind of relationship works, romantic, platonic, sexual and otherwise. See also: that undertale Anna pedo using rp and fiction to groom and abuse minors in this very thread! Hell, this whole thread!
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Nov 26, 2016 21:09
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I'd say there's nothing wrong with teaching her that writing fan fiction is a thing to do creatively. Just don't use that exact term. Describe it slightly different, so when she's old enough, she'll be like "Oh, there's a word for that!" Instead of just kind of being exposed to the whole hot mess of it right off.
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Nov 26, 2016 21:30
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Absolutely do not introduce a nine-year old to any online communities, keep them on pbs.org or somewhere else they can be easily monitored. But as a certified armchair psychologist, I think writing could be a good outlet for solving her disruptive behavior in class. Get her a nice journal (I saw some nice leather-bound ones at a Wal-mart for just  ), and tell her that instead of having a conversation with (character), that she can write it down in the journal and show people later.Of course that doesn't solve the root problems, the only thing I can think of is trying to tie her back down to reality. Ask her who picks her up from school, who makes dinner for her, who kisses her goodnight. If she insists that fictional characters are doing it, ask to meet them when they pick her up. If she continues the in-class conversations, play along and wrest the fiction from her. "Oh, (Character), I didn't see you there! (Student) has a lot of studying to do today, so she'll see you at recess." Open the door and let them out. But absolutely let her parents/counselor know what you're doing and your concerns with her behavior. Do that before taking any of our dumb advice.
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Nov 26, 2016 22:57
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uglynoodles posted:I'd say there's nothing wrong with teaching her that writing fan fiction is a thing to do creatively. Just don't use that exact term. Describe it slightly different, so when she's old enough, she'll be like "Oh, there's a word for that!" Instead of just kind of being exposed to the whole hot mess of it right off. Eh, it's probably better to steer her away from fan fic in general. Perhaps go the route of "well hey if you like those stories and those characters why don't you invent your own?" If you like, say, Harry Potter you could write your own boy wizard and what kinds of crazy adventures he goes on.
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Nov 26, 2016 23:02
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I meet her family members every morning and most afternoons. They know what's going on. Sounds like what I had been doing is probably the way to go. Hey, who knows, maybe she burns out on fanfic before she even realizes it's a thing.
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Nov 26, 2016 23:20
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VideoTapir posted:Her independent entry is not that much of an immediate danger; her reading level isn't quite up to it. Just whether I should remind her that this thing exists, maybe pick out a few suitable stories. (Her current favorite thing is not very popular fanfic wise, and everything I've seen is fine.) Dude, you even read this thread? Alternative answer, read the saga of Andrew Blake and get back to me.
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Nov 26, 2016 23:45
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VideoTapir posted:Her independent entry is not that much of an immediate danger; her reading level isn't quite up to it. Just whether I should remind her that this thing exists, maybe pick out a few suitable stories. (Her current favorite thing is not very popular fanfic wise, and everything I've seen is fine.) Uh, you have a very high opinion of the reading level of the typical fanfic I think. Unless you're saying she has some sort of reading problem in general? Which maybe that could be part of why she feels the need to claim various characters are totally her friends.
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Nov 27, 2016 00:22
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fishmech posted:Uh, you have a very high opinion of the reading level of the typical fanfic I think. Unless you're saying she has some sort of reading problem in general? Which maybe that could be part of why she feels the need to claim various characters are totally her friends. She does, a bit. The reading level of a particular fanfic isn't the problem. It's that you need to reach a minimal level of automaticity in your reading before navigating a text-heavy website to find the things you'd be interested in stops being a chore. I expect she'll be a year or two behind most kids in getting to that level. How about I put this another way...I have been trying to encourage this kid to write instead of pestering people with her fantasy life. Is the inevitability of this leading to the fanfiction community if she persists long enough to be able to get there on her own a death sentence for someone who is already showing some crazy tendencies? Would it be better to just deny this crap outright, all the time? Would it be better to play along? What approach is most likely to help maintain a connection to reality?
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Nov 27, 2016 00:31
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I think if you say "Writing is a great way to enjoy your imagination, and if you want to make up stories about the characters you love from {thing}, that's awesome and can be really fun. And you can make up your own characters, too, and write about their stories. I'd love to read any stories you want to show me. But it's not okay to do that in class, because we're here to learn about math/science/history" you might plant some seeds. I think encouraging her to write is good, because it gives her an outlet for her imaginative fixation with these characters and situations, but agree that maybe don't tell her it's fan fiction, because holy crap, some of the people out there 
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Nov 27, 2016 02:00
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value-brand cereal posted:Considering how much pedophilia and incest and abusive relationships portrayed as normal/healthy, I'd vote for keeping young kids away from fanfics until they're much older. You really don't want pedos grooming them, or them developing bad ideas about how any kind of relationship works, romantic, platonic, sexual and otherwise. When you think about it, a lot of fantasy fiction has some really unhealthy relationship dynamics that are portrayed as acceptable, if not perfectly normal. I imagine there are loads of kids out there that take on books that might be at their reading level, but are certainly a not at their emotional level and getting some really messed up ideas. Some examples off the top of my head: Harry Potter - wtf is Hermione doing with Ron? Ron is lazy, jealous and petty and she herself admits he has the 'emotional range of a teaspoon'. Wheel of Time series - Rand has like 3 love interests and while he has some cursory angst about it he decides to keep them all and all three of them are cool with this because well, he is the Dragon Reborn! Game of Thrones - almost noone in those books has anything approximating a normal relationship with their friends, family or spouses. Wildmage series by Tamora Pierce - in the final book of the series, the main character shacks up with her mentor, who she met when she was 13 and in the final book she's like 16 or 17. I think if these weren't fantasy novels, people would be going 'ewwwwww' or 'what? What?! That makes no sense!'.
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Nov 27, 2016 03:55
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dont forget all the subtle femdom stuff in WoT especially re: spankings
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Nov 27, 2016 04:02
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Oh god, I'd forgotten about that.
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Nov 27, 2016 04:31
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froglet posted:Game of Thrones - almost noone in those books has anything approximating a normal relationship with their friends, family or spouses. I mean, if you want to get all analytical about it, there's only one we see much of (the Starks) and the Lannisters are always trying to destroy it.
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Nov 27, 2016 04:41
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froglet posted:
Well she isn't with Ron for most of the books, and ends up with him when he saves her a few times in the last books and they're constantly together because of the conditions - especially when Hermione, Ron, and Harry are on the run for like a whole year, with Harry already being established with Ginny. Ron also has a bit of character arc through the books of being something of a useless whiner into becoming a real hero who's more considerate and all that.
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Nov 27, 2016 04:49
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VideoTapir posted:She does, a bit. The reading level of a particular fanfic isn't the problem. It's that you need to reach a minimal level of automaticity in your reading before navigating a text-heavy website to find the things you'd be interested in stops being a chore. I expect she'll be a year or two behind most kids in getting to that level. You should go find your school psychologist and ask them to do an observation and give you intervention suggestions. Source: I am an elementary-level school psychologist and this happens from time to time. Could be attention motivated, they could have social skills deficits, they could have difficulty at home, we can't help determine this online the way your school support staff can. If it's attention motivated, your intervention may not show the most improvement. Also please do not ever expose any of your students to any non-educational online anything. You don't want the consequences of that if the family doesn't like any of the possible end results.
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Nov 27, 2016 06:17
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WOOFDOCTOR posted:You should go find your school psychologist and ask them to do an observation and give you intervention suggestions. Source: I am an elementary-level school psychologist and this happens from time to time. Could be attention motivated, they could have social skills deficits, they could have difficulty at home, we can't help determine this online the way your school support staff can. This this, holy loving poo poo this. What even made it seem like a good idea to introduce a nine year old to an internet community? I am not even certified yet and that sets off alarm bells you could hear in the next zip code.
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Nov 27, 2016 06:19
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I was into Sonic the Hedgehog when I was 10. I was let into fanfic communities and online role playing chatrooms full of furries and vore (I only understood the implications of these people including a child into their activities years later). This was 18 years ago. English was not even my main language. So yeah, don't underestimate what kids can get into online.
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Nov 27, 2016 13:12
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As long as she has (real) friends, I think that the problem is going to sort itself out in a couple years. Absolutely don't do anything that would single her out in the class.
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Nov 27, 2016 13:34
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froglet posted:When you think about it, a lot of fantasy fiction has some really unhealthy relationship dynamics that are portrayed as acceptable, if not perfectly normal. I imagine there are loads of kids out there that take on books that might be at their reading level, but are certainly a not at their emotional level and getting some really messed up ideas. You know there's an alternative to lovely fantasy, right? Like, lots of them. The girl's only 9, she should be reading stuff like Scott O'Dell books about Indian girls, or children's versions of "Swiss Family Robinson," children's non-fiction, or something like that. I fully agree with WOOFDOCTOR, talk to the school counselor about her issues. In the meantime, though, VideoTapir can encourage her to read stuff that's not fantasy or science fiction. I mean, shoot, I was an awkward, loudmouth dork who loved non-fiction, and historical fiction without knowing what it was, and I honestly think that helped me stay a little more grounded in reality. Even just reading realist children and YA books wouldn't hurt. (Nothing like the end of "The Great Gilly Hopkins" to make you realize that the real world is tough, even for kids, and it's okay when there isn't a "happy" ending.) I remember a book that portrayed a girl with eating issues and her dysfunctional relationship with her petty, possibly personality disordered mother, and the characters were in fifth grade. I'm not going to lie, I'm biased against fantasy and sci-fi, partly because I think the real world is more interesting than anything a single writer can invent. My younger sister is an awesome, insightful and very intelligent person, but she's the type to try to force resolutions and confrontations because--and this is purely my opinion--she thinks in terms of literature and drama, where there's usually a clear storyline and arc. We clashed a lot because I fully accept that there are no clear endings, people's motives are sometimes a mystery to themselves, and real life is not a series of novels. (My BA is in History, hers is English.) So I'm a firm believer in pushing reality on people in whatever form it takes to make it palatable to them. It's good that VT is looking out for this kid and trying to be pro-active before she ends up the star of a future iteration of this thread. He(?) should NOT steer her towards internet fan-fiction communities, and it wouldn't hurt to suggest books that she wouldn't necessarily seek out on her own. Bobbie Wickham fucked around with this message at 05:56 on Nov 29, 2016 |
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Nov 29, 2016 05:54
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So, wait. You introduced your precocious fanfic writing kid to John Podesta?
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Nov 30, 2016 09:48
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No one in this thread should be allowed near children. 
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Nov 30, 2016 11:32
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Poison Mushroom posted:No one in this thread should be allowed near children. Most of the thread is about kids and teens that posters knew as kids and teens. I don't get your point.
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Nov 30, 2016 15:23
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I mean specifically the last page or so.
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Nov 30, 2016 22:01
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Louise Erdrich's Birchbark series are what little girls should be reading about Native kids.
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Nov 30, 2016 22:10
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Seconded. The first book is cool as hell.
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Dec 1, 2016 01:06
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froglet posted:Harry Potter - wtf is Hermione doing with Ron? Ron is lazy, jealous and petty and she herself admits he has the 'emotional range of a teaspoon'.
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Dec 5, 2016 22:50
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 Suddenly even more glad I dropped GoT.
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Dec 6, 2016 02:32
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Back when I first read Game of Thrones, in the mid-2000s, it was in my local library's teen fiction section. Teenage me was fine with this, but in retrospect, I'm very glad it's been shifted to adult fiction. It's no harder for teens to find, but at least we can pretend.
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Dec 6, 2016 02:38
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I feel like this thread has run its course and should be goldmined already.
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Dec 6, 2016 03:31
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Poison Mushroom posted:
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Dec 8, 2016 11:56
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pookel posted:Yeah, but no one should be letting their 9-year-olds read Game of Thrones either. I don't care how precocious the kid is, they don't need to be reading graphic, horrifying gang rape and torture scenes. cptn_dr posted:Back when I first read Game of Thrones, in the mid-2000s, it was in my local library's teen fiction section. Might as well get my sperg on. You DO NOT READ Game of Thrones. You WATCH Game of Thrones. You READ A Song of Ice and Fire. Which is the book series the TV series Game of Thrones is based on. Also, it is a pile of poo poo because GRRM is so busy self-promoting and sucking the last bit of cash out of new fans since he ignored his old fans (Wild Cards anyone?) and pissed them off, I am pretty drat sure he will die before he gets the books done.
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Dec 8, 2016 15:03
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Samizdata posted:Might as well get my sperg on. You DO NOT READ Game of Thrones. You WATCH Game of Thrones. You READ A Song of Ice and Fire. Which is the book series the TV series Game of Thrones is based on. A Game of Thrones is a book, though.
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Dec 8, 2016 15:06
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Stultus Maximus posted:A Game of Thrones is a book, though. Yeah, the first book in A Song of Ice and Fire, and I doubt they were just reading the one book. Sorry to be all  , but as an inveterate reader, I get tired of people forgetting books exist. Had an incident with a coworker the other day. It is pretty cold right now where I live, and, so, as a generic farewell, I tend to say stuff like "Have a better one. Drive safe and stay warm!" However, with this new coworker I decided to snark a bit and said "I bet one of those bloodthirsty Game of Thrones fans would say something about winter coming." She stopped, turned around, and said "I AM one of those bloodthirsty Game of Thrones fans." We talked for a couple of minutes, and, during the conversation, I mentioned my frustration at the books not getting done, and she mentioned she didn't know it was based on books and at some point she wanted to pick my brain about the books versus the series.EDIT: Not sure why the formatting did that, but it is fixed now. Samizdata fucked around with this message at 15:19 on Dec 8, 2016 |
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Dec 8, 2016 15:15
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Please. Every true fan knows that A Song of Ice and Fire is actually the name of the author, and the book series is A Song of Ice and Fire's Monster.
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Dec 8, 2016 15:37
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Samizdata posted:Yeah, the first book in A Song of Ice and Fire, and I doubt they were just reading the one book. Chill out. What are you, astrally married to one of the unicorns in the series or something?
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Dec 8, 2016 20:12
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Dogwood Fleet posted:Chill out. What are you, astrally married to one of the unicorns in the series or something? No. Nor are any of my alters.
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Dec 8, 2016 20:14
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Samizdata posted:
Settle down, Francis.
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Dec 8, 2016 22:47
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BOOKS!!! 
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sinking belle posted:Please. Every true fan knows that A Song of Ice and Fire is actually the name of the author, and the book series is A Song of Ice and Fire's Monster. Wisdom is knowing that George RR Martin is the monster.
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Dec 8, 2016 23:39
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value-brand cereal posted:I feel like this thread has run its course and should be goldmined already. Agreeing with this Honestly at this point it's mostly just tangents and people desperate to prove they aren't like the people discussed in the thread
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Dec 9, 2016 04:22
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