Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Schubalts posted:

Wow, there are actually people complaining that you can trade mods and keys for other players' Platinum. There's even a thread with some guy trying (poorly) to drum up a boycott of trading. :psyduck:

What I'm amazed at is the people who are offering like, 2000 platinum (that's ~$100 USD) for Primed Chamber.

Seriously you guys? Just buy another goddamn game. Or an internet spaceship or something. How the hell are people so bad at cost-benefit?

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009



So guys do you think love can bloom on the battlefield?

(Sorry this was just way too funny to pass up)

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Kanos posted:

Even for frames with 150 or 200 base armor, Steel Fiber is a poo poo mod that basically adds no survivability anyway. It's one of the reasons why Valkyr can't tank at all outside Hysteria despite having 200 armor. (because armor is a joke of a stat and any viable tanking is done through abilities or shield stacking) :ssh:

Honestly I'm not sure if DE even understands their game sometimes.

Valkyr's health-tanking ways would make total sense if it was like, say, Space Marine and you recovered health via melee executions (at which point Valkyr could very effectively tank) but as it stands it's just "Man What".

I think they kind of hosed the armor curve for Warframes as well, because they reduced the amount of mitigation armor gave overall but completely failed to increase the armor values of Warframes to account for that.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/lv?key=0AlWVt6vp3-YWdFh0dS1YNUxjRXRENnBJa1dqQ1pXVXc&usp=sharing

Basically, Rhino should be running something like 400 armor in Damage 2.0, and Excalibur should be around 150. This would imply that Valkyr should be running 600+ Armor. Even the light Warframes like Nyx and whatnot should be running 30 armor.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Male Man posted:

edit: Oh, God. I had no idea they nerfed armor to 35% effectiveness. Why didn't they just reduce enemy armor values instead of slapping a multiplier on the formula?

I have no idea.

Anyways, I made a thread which needs upvoting about it:

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/137700-guys-can-we-get-an-armor-fix-yet/#entry1641287

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Ciaphas posted:

Finally got around to buying the Braton and uh holy poo poo the M-1 Braton really is loving terrible :stare:

Anyway, I like shotguns in my shooting-things games, generally. What's a good babby's first shotgun to pick up?

I think your only early choice is the Strun, which is okay. The Sobek, if you get Nightmare mods, is probably the best in class right now, since it combines adequate damage and a reasonable critical chance with high accuracy and a gigantic magazine, plus full-auto capability. Hek is still very good at killing things, but not quite as good as the Sobek IME.

Disclaimer: If you don't have the reload speed mod there is a chance you will die of old age before it finishes reloading.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Denzine posted:

Super Jump is pretty much the laziest power in the world yeah.

I said ages ago that they should just add the ability to charge up jumps and give Excalbur an actually legitimate skill instead of Super Jump, which is amazingly fun but utterly pointless.

I mean seriously, wouldn't it be really cool to be able to jump 10 meters into the air with every Warframe?

"But then you wouldn't need parkour!"

Well you basically don't need it now, either! It gives you some shortcuts but hell, maybe someone will figure out some way to combine charged-jumps, parkour, and Zorencoptering to do some really crazy stunts.

And honestly, the emergent craziness is half of what makes Warframe fun.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

WeaponBoy posted:

This post was linked in that thread and is also a pretty good read: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/137875-a-complete-rework-of-the-foundation-of-warframe/

It gets a little bit wishlist-y at points, but I really like some of the points like 'get rid of serration-type "required" mods' and 'all warframe powers should be baseline'. If you ever have a player going into a level without all of the class powers you have failed as a designer.

He falls into the amateur power hour trap of basically deciding because there are serious problems in the gameplay you need to burn half of it and start over again, when really there's a bunch of relatively easy fixes for that which require much less work (give abilities their own dedicated slots like Auras, possibly with no energy costs, give weapons innate damage boosts for leveling up).

It's basically 10/10 on recognizing issues, 2/10 on figuring out how to fix them. Which ironically is kind of like Damage 2.0. :p

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Denzine posted:

The base damage changing so massively, and everything else building off of it, is the problem. Nothing else is as meaningful as base damage. Baking damage into weapon level does nothing.

It does something very important, actually. It divorces the majority of the DPS of the weapon from RNG luck and mods.

I mean, flattening damage curves significantly like Male Man says (and possibly even Warframe toughness) would also work. ME3's system, where a maxed out weapon has maybe 30% more raw damage than a lv1 one and a maxed out character maxes out at maybe 100% more durability could also work, although I like noticeable increases in damage.

That's personal preference though.

Kessel posted:

Honestly, why are there even mods that straight up increase the raw damage of a weapon?

It made some sense before Update 7, when a damage mod gave you maybe 25% damage for a really really good one, while things like say, +Magazine Size could be +100%. At that point a damage mod was great to have but not overpowering.

Then post Update 7, they decided to burn every passive benefit and bake them into mods because (???) I'm serious, I normally can at least see why DE did something boneheaded that they did, but I literally cannot comprehend what they were thinking there. And when people like me brought up that no passive improvements were bullshit, DE reneged on Warframes but completely forgot about weapons and I don't know why.

MJ12 fucked around with this message at 18:15 on Dec 4, 2013

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Gestalt Intellect posted:

This isn't the point. when I used to kill people with the hammer they would go flying all over the place, bouncing nonsensically off of walls and ceilings before coming to a sudden and mysterious halt floating motionless in midair. Now the hammer just sort of clips through them and they may or may not slowly fall over.

Report it in the bug reports section of the forum.

Basically, because ragdolling was originally keyed to damage types but not anymore, a lot of weapons which normally would ragdoll no longer do in Damage 2.0.

They fixed this by making some weapons force ragdoll and others force ragdolling on death, but they may have forgotten about the hammer.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

bald and fail II posted:

Is the flux rifle garbage now, seeing as it mainly does slash damage? I did stick corrosive on it but didnt get a chance to try it out against grineer yet.

Also where the hell do I get orikin cells now? I need like 9000 to build mag prime and a few other things.

Infested were accidentally/not so accidentally/:de: given greatly-improved resistances to slash damage, so it's not really good anymore.

Do Saturn Survivals for Orokin cells, or just farm Ruk. Lephantis drops them as well.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Denzine posted:

They can't remove Serration or HCal without people whining about it for months, possibly forever, on their forums. It would be a massively unpopular move, even if it is the right one for the long-term health of the game.

When I suggested burning pure +damage mods to the ground, I suggested just refunding everyone the credits/cores needed to get themselves the mods to that rank. It would be fairly reasonable.

But DE really is incapable of not caving in to their userbase, which can be nice sometimes (when they make boneheaded decisions on their own, like the previous stamina change that was rolled back) and is completely awful in other situations (like now).

The thing about pure +damage mods is that they can be balanced alongside other mods, it's just that utility mods have to be just as useful and this requires them to be a lot weaker, relatively speaking. If a maxed serration on a Lv30 weapon was say, +25% damage or whatever, you might instead consider +60% fire rate or +100% reload speed or who the hell knows. When a maxed serration is doubling your damage considering any other mods is much, much harder.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

I AM THE MOON posted:

just make the lanka faster, I dont care what reasoning it takes. It would be really fun if its projectile speed was 2-3x better.

I'd prefer it if the non-charged shot was a projectile and the charged shot was the hitscan railgun death beam that the Railgun Moas fired.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Gestalt Intellect posted:

I haven't tried the Seer but a lot of people say it's really disappointing. I would put those cells to something better like Magnus.

There's a list of everything orokin cells make here that you can use to decide.

The Seer's main problem is:

1. Not Hitscan

2. Reload time measured in eons (base reload is like, 3.0 seconds).

It needs both reload mods (the Nightmare one and the regular one) maxed to be of any real use, but once you get those two it's actually pretty good.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

The Jumpoff posted:

I'm going to break it down by faction:

Grineer: Corrosive (Poison and Electricity, slotted before any other two elemental mods) is going to chew through their armor and make it seem like tissue paper, due to its proc of Reduced Armor. To this end, the only other elemental combo you can slot is Blast (Fire and Cold, slotted next to each other, or with no other elemental mods in the way) is going to give you a knockdown AoE whenever it procs (which will be a lot with a well-built Magnus)

Corpus: The Magnus loving rocks against the Corpus, due to it's high Impact Damage. As for elemental combos, slot Magnetic (Cold and Electricity together), which on a proc reduces their max shields, so if you can't kill them immediately and their shields DO regen, it'll be easier to take them out. The only other combo you can slot is Gas (Heat and Poison together), BUT it deals -25% versus Flesh. However, the proc is a Toxin damage AoE, which causes their health to tick down. It's up to you on that one, but I usually slot it for shits and giggles.

Infested: Gas. Gas is going to chew through Infested like crazy. The Magnus only has 12 slash damage base, which is by no means bad, but it's not as high as some weapons (Vasto).

Hope this helped!

Note that Toxic damage ignores shields, making just regular ol' Toxic damage quite good against Corpus, because they often only have 1/3rd of their total HP or less as health, which means a high toxic damage percentage means you just ignore their giant pile o' shielding and cause them to dissolve.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Mistikman posted:

The confusion comes with the fact that armor never drops, so how is damage calculated when you are effectively hitting, for example, clones flesh and alloy at the same time? If I do exclusively slash damage, then I am getting a 25% bonus vs cloned flesh, but a 50% penalty vs alloy. How does that work, exactly?

I suspect how it works is this: The damage is increased by 25% (due to cloned flesh) but the effective armor rating of the Grineer is increased by 50% (due to alloy armor). This is how it worked when armored enemies had only one type, wherein a bonus would reduce their armor rating by that much (so 50% bonus would halve their effective armor rating) and added that much damage.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Finally scored 600 Oxium.

Finally.

Watch DE halve the cost of Zephyr Oxium-wise this Friday.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

AndroidHub posted:

Super jump and mind control are fine, their frames just don't see a whole lot of use these days due to power creep. Mind control is great because you can pick out a Bombard/Napalm/Tech/etc and they will do quite a number on the rest of your enemies. I think mind control would be a lot better if it wasn't a duration, and instead was just permanent, there isn't really any given enemy that you can mind control that would be super unbalanced to have until it dies (but now that I think of it the new champion mobs come to mind). Super jump is just a fun skill, especially with lots of extra power strength, and as said before it's really cheap to cast.

Silence and contagion are just bad skills, it's a matter of people slotting other things instead of them (which is a whole other discussion on it's own). Silence would need a better minimap system with visible enemy facing and such to allow you to turn it into some kind of weird MGS simulator that would only work solo anyways (plus Loki and Ash would do it better with a lot less effort). Contagion is bad because melee is bad, it doesn't help that it costs 75 energy base to cast though.

It's sort of interesting, because with power creep being such a problem, Saryn and Banshee are both in need of some real help. Saryn doesn't really have a niche at all anymore since venom was nerfed unfortunately, and her ult is just outclassed. Banshee is only useful for sonar if you really want to kill certain bosses very quickly (which is also questionable now, but she still does damage amp best).

Silence and Contagion should just be passives or toggleables honestly. Especially Silence. I'm not sure a 'passive' ability would be really great in the design of power use, but I think it might work. Say, Contagion adds to your melee damage passively but also reduces the power efficiency of all powers by 15% or so while active, and Silence just has no costs whatsoever. It'd still be gimmicky but it'd at least be something for a gimmick ninja run.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Serious Frolicking posted:

Channeling is great, stances are dumb, explosive glaive is mostly just a comedy option.

I've had pretty good luck exploding the explosive glaive in people's faces. What I'm mostly annoyed with is that the Glaive charge-up now takes so long. Fury helps a little bit, but you really can't chain it very well.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Thranguy posted:

This is a company that apparently doesn't employ a single person who knows what a half-life is, so I don't know what I wouldn't expect from them...

Argon Crystals actually do have a half-life of one day, BTW.

I had 12 yesterday, now I have 6.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Thranguy posted:

Really? From the beginning, or did they recently fix them to work that way? (Because I got the impression that they originally just all vanished at the end of the day. And that they were doing even stranger things, like doubling instead of decaying, during some of the hotfix intervals.)

It may or may not have been bugged before, but it worked for me as intended.

It's still an awful idea, but an actual half-life instead of *poof* after 24 hours is much better.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Denzine posted:

Yesterday I made 500 plat off pubbies by selling Tranquil Cleave at silly prices.

It feels good to not pay for plat.

I sold a Life Strike to a guy for 200 plat.

On the other hand, some idiot got it from transmutation a day before the Dark Sectors came out, and thus nobody knew how you'd get them-and he sold it for 20 plat. His rationale? "It sucks, because if you always play Rhino and Rhino skin all the time and play no other Warframes ever and also always use melee channeling for your damage it's wasteful".

It's become a running joke in the clan, wherein everyone who has a Life Strike occasionally says they'll trade "a useless mod called Life Strike" for things like "3 Slash Dashes".

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Coldbird posted:

Tribes Ascend also had passive reload like that, but the reload times generally weren't too bad.

I get the idea, but the problem with increasing reload times hugely like that is that it reduces options, not increases them. Now you're basically required to find two relatively similar weapons range- and pattern-wise, both 30, if you don't want to be forced to reposition all the time (whether or not it makes any sense) because you're fielding, say, a Soma and a Brakk.

Just putting in Passive Reload would work, because then the long-reload time guns like the Supra and Gorgon and Vulkar wouldn't automatically be useless forever. They'd get a massive indirect buff.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Sprecherscrow posted:

Wait, duration effects the range of MPrime and not...range? Da fuq?

Yes, some powers have a constant 'speed' of spreading which means that the area they cover is affected by range.

I suggested a while back that every power should get benefits from every type of +Power Mod. I suggested that the benefits should be sensible and intuitive, such as Rhino Skin giving a brief (~0.5s/level?) period of invulnerability after being broken that you can buff, or Volt Speed being even more GoFast per point of +Power Strength and so on.

Because this would be sensible, it was ignored. :(

Anyways, after playing way too much Titanfall I really think Warframe needs:

1. Better Parkour. Really, double jumps, removing Stamina, and air mobility would make up significantly for the current system. Stamina is entirely pointless outside of meaning that you can't Go Fast after getting into melee combat (which is retarded because melee is already somewhat weaker than guns), and removing it wouldn't cost much. Having an ability to maneuver in midair (whether a double jump, an air dash, or something similar) would let you do things like bouncing between walls to get up, increase the ability of tile designers to add verticality and/or secrets, and let everyone have fun. You might have to redesign Zephyr's 1/2 powers and Excalibur's Super Jump, but honestly the latter power is kinda poo poo and Zephyr probably could do with outright being able to fly instead of her current setup because flying is fun.

2. More melee attacks. Melee needs at least some basic anti-air moves for weapons and some ability to wreck things like Arc Traps and the stupid energy drain sensor bars. Give us hold-melee attacks again so we can have these (so tap E for an air attack, hold E for the ground pound). Fix Channeling to actually be worthwhile, possibly by reducing its energy cost per attack for faster weapons, such that you have a relatively fixed level of energy cost per second of attacks for Channeling. Make most of the lovely Channeling mods not actually make Channeling more expensive because holy gently caress why would you use any of them at this point?

Those are probably the core 'janky' things, versus core mechanics that aren't ever going to be fixed (ref: +Damage mods) because we're silly. Halving the Damage mods' effectiveness and then giving that half to natural level-ups wouldn't fix the core problem but it'd at least make it easier to deal with the "Just Starting Out And I Have No Friends" thing.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Kyte posted:

So anybody taking bets on how long will these changes stick?

Probably 2 days, either that or they fix the LOS calc and reduce the Syndicate rep grind.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

wid posted:

It was originally a bow specific mod so you could pretend you're John Rambo in Rambo II. They should have changed the mod back to its original but remove it from Attica. Then make a new mod for Attica, maybe call it Thunderstorm, with the stats of current Thunderbolt. Or keep the current Tbolt stat and make it bow only but make the explosion always occuring. Then you're truly Space Ninja Rambo. Bundle that up with a serrated knife and a red bandana for your helmet.

Thunderbolt should have been 100% chance to explode with the damage and radius being increased as you level it up-and possibly make it proportional to the bow's base damage. That'd make it better for bows and make it more reliable on the Attica while being a sort of nerf.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

AggroJagg posted:

I'm probably making a huge bad decision but I'm gonna try playing this game! I'm on ps4 and just waiting for all the patches to finish.

Figured I'd try mag to start with.

Is the goon ps4 group still pretty healthy (cheetos and pizza aside)?

I like shotguns in games, are shotguns good in this game? Should i take the starter shot gun I guess is my question.

Shotguns are kinda bad but really as a starting player you won't notice the goodness or badness of weapons (outside of non-Opticor sniper rifles) very much because it's largely a question of scaling. They have a pretty significant damage falloff at ~10-15m, though, and melee weapons are pretty powerful, so I'd argue that because you have space-swords you shouldn't use them.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Xun posted:

Anyone have example Mag/Valkyr builds? It'd be nice to know what I should be throwing my cores at

For Valkyr you really don't need much more than some Duration mods, Vitality, Steel Fiber, and Rage (Rage is super important), and you might as well run Rush because you'll be doing a lot of running around.

Basically, take hits to recharge energy, Hysteria when your health looks to be low or when your energy is full, repeat. Ideally I think you want Overextended because the smaller your Hysteria radius the less likely you are to take damage when it ends, and sure your Warcry will affect fewer people but you're probably generally using it as a self-buff anyhow.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Neo_Crimson posted:

I'm the opposite, I think Archwing is really fun but there's not much point in playing it besides grinding for the handful of weapons that mostly suck any way.

I know I described the game as a whole, but it's more obvious with Archwing because there's less content.

Archwing right now seems to be where the game was in Update 4, when I started. A really basic framework which is probably undergoing massive changes as we speak.

I suspect we'll probably get a lot more interesting stuff we can do in Archwing missions as time goes on, but the framework itself is pretty cool.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

DoombatINC posted:

I'm at the point where I choose whether or not to be invisible by whether or not the circumstances require an extra body to draw aggro. When you can legitimately call invisibility a choice, that's when your Loki has made it.

It's like I'm Jason Voorhees, but it's the future, but it's not the Jason X future, also invisible no machete etc

Permanently Invisible Loki Best Loki.

Invisibility giving you such a ludicrous melee damage boost is the greatest part of Warframe, because it lets you do some pretty stylish bullshit. Sadly enemies don't panic when they start getting carved up by invisible ninjas.

(That reminds me I need to farm up my Prime frames. I don't have any of them past Ember :( )

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Neo_Crimson posted:

Well poo poo, due to work I'm stuck with crappy hotel wifi until March that makes Warframe nigh-unplayable. :smack:

I really hope there aren't any big events with exclusive stuff happening in the mean time.

You can still play solo mode with a crappy connection, because most of the stuff is done clientside. As long as it isn't one of those events where you Have To Team Up Or It's Impossible you can probably do just fine logging in for the daily rewards and soloing an alert or two when they have swag.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Kyte posted:

New update.

Choice changes:

You kind of forgot the most important thing in the new update.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Kyte posted:

Ever tried stacking all the fire rate and multishot on the Twin Vipers?
Sure, it barely lasts a second, but the sound it makes is amazing.

Doesn't that basically turn the Viper or Twin Viper into a really ammo-inefficient super shotgun? It already burns through its magazine in less than 1 second.

Adding Anemic Agility, Lethal Torrent, and Gunslinger onto a Viper for a total of +(90 + 60 + 72 = 222) fire rate means its 14.4 fire rate becomes 46.4, which means you can burn a mag in 0.3 seconds. With max multishot, that's 39.2 bullets ejected in the same time.

It's absurd and also kind of a great idea. Going to try this sometime.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Neo_Crimson posted:

It looks like a playable Ancient and i'm okay with that.

It looks like a beefy version of the Chromas from DarkSector.

Sadly I don't think it gets to turn invisible :(

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

SSNeoman posted:

why

No really, what does this solve?


Ouch.

It's probably trying to clear up the drop lists for Prime parts because of mass user complaints about finding it hard to farm Prime Parts. A very :de: solution for that issue.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Flipswitch posted:

I think DE need to make some sort of huge blog post with like a timeline style plan of where they want the game to end up. The end game content in this game blows chunks and they need to kind of tell players where they want to take the game. Even if it just ends up MH style where you get to the end to show off your gaudy amounts of bling to other players which only drops from like high level raids. Gives you something cosmetic to work towards and to look at at the end, as opposed to just grinding out credz and fusion cores to smash more mods together.

That would be hard, because that would require DE to actually know where they want the game to end up. :v:

The nerfing of the Synoid wouldn't be a problem if it actually seemed like there was something resembling a plan behind it-weapons need to be bounded by X parameters or the like because they believe the effective cap of equipment effectiveness should be Y and are working to make the enemies at that cap fun. It seems that sometimes DE doesn't know why people play their space ninja simulator.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Kyte posted:

What baffles me the most is that supposedly they did pick a bunch of players to playtest raids. Why didn't they catch the part where raids suck?

They probably picked a pile of gigantic spergs who love the unfun parts of Warframe because of the 'challenge.'

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Kyte posted:

Which then begs the question: Is it really DE's fault? I mean poo poo if the spergs are loud enough to be picked to playtest, then perhaps saying things in the forums might actually matter and maybe, just maybe, those who actually like fun might have to make an effort in getting themselves heard there instead of grumbling in closed off communities that need :10bux: to post and hoping things change on their own.

But I honestly don't know, since Reddit does seem to have people who like fun in there and they don't seem to be getting headway either. At least they try, though.

They're probably deliberately picking the guys who clamored the loudest for things like the raid to test it, which is a problem because the people who clamor the loudest for 'endgame' 'challenge' tend to not have a coherent vision besides 'lots of beefy enemies with big numbers so you need big numbers to win.' Which is, to be fair, not all their fault, but I can blame them for not considering "hey this might be unfun for everyone but the 1% of super-spergs."

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Naturally Selected posted:

:goatdrugs:

Reminder, this is the same person that labelled the Supra as top tier.

Also, ember is like the most obviously female warframe, why do you keep referring to it as HE.

I've been playing with the Supra and it's okay with some quality of life mods (the 4s reload time is just aggravating) but "top tier" is literally laughable.

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

Any devstream summary yet? I want to know what new and terrible things DE plans.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

MJ12
Apr 8, 2009

hagie posted:

Does that marelok have an exp special like the synoid grammacor?

All Syndicate weapons and mods have a radial damage effect that restores one stat, deals like 1000 damage to everything around you in a huge radius, and temporarily gives a buff.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply