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Bumfluff
Jun 19, 2008

Bumfluff!
It's me, Mabel!
I'm looking at you through the av!
Right here!
This is my voice!
I'm talking to you from inside!



What is this game?

DmC: Devil May Cry is an action-adventure hack and slash video game developed by Ninja Theory and published by Capcom. It is the fifth game in the Devil May Cry series and serves as a reboot. Set in an alternative reality of the Devil May Cry series, it focuses on Dante, a young man with supernatural powers who finds himself under attack by demons.

Initial reaction was mostly negative due to Dante's and many other character's redesigns and simplified gameplay. Fans of the original games stated that the gameplay is much staler in comparison.

Sounds like it wasn't very goo-

Nope, that's wrong, it's great. And I'm certainly not the only person who thinks so. But I'm not here to convince you this via text.

A word on spoilers
While I'm not too bothered about story spoilers myself, please keep them in tags, especially boss battles.

Videos
Episode 1
Episode 2
Episode 3
Episode 4
Episode 5
Episode 6
Episode 7
Episode 8
Episode 9
Episode 10
Episode 11
Episode 12
Episode 13
Episode 14
Episode 15
Episode 16
Episode 17
Episode 18
Episode 19
Episode DLC


Characters

Dante is the protagonist of this game. He is a demon-angel hybrid know as a Nephilim, who lives as a demon hunting vigilante.



Dante's Brother. Wants to take down the demons.


Kat. Just saved Dante from limbo.


Mundus. Wants Dante dead.


Lillith. Carrying Mundus' heir.


Bob Barbas. Bob Barbas is a reporter and owner of media corporation Raptor News Network. Just doing Gods work.


Phineas. A good demon dude.

Weapons

Rebellion is Dante's main melee weapon. It was given to Dante as a memento of his father, Sparda, so that he could protect himself from the demonic hordes that he battles.


Ebony & Ivory are Dante's trademark pistols. While they lack strength, Dante's ability to pull the triggers with inhuman speed as well as his enhanced dexterity make them versatile weapons for any range and orientation.


Arbiter is Dante's first demonic weapon. With great heft, it crushes almost anything.


Osiris is Dante's first angelic weapon. While not as damaging as other weapons, it can hit a large number of enemies and specializes in aerial attacks.


Ophion is Dante's demonic/angelic grappling hook which is used for traversal and can be a useful tool in combat too.


Eryx. A pair of magical gauntlets (hulk fists). Dante awakens the Eryx after he kills Poison.


Aquila. A set of shuriken like blades that emit energy waves. Dante awakens them after killing Bob Barbas.


Revenant. Is a sweet shotgun. Lacks the speed of Ebony & Ivory, but offers much more power.


Kablooey. Fires explosive charges that stick to its targets. In the human world, it looks like a simple tazer.

Bumfluff fucked around with this message at 08:57 on Jun 27, 2014

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Tiriganiaq
Feb 20, 2012


Oh, man. This game. Even as a fan of the old games I thought that this was alright. It had a ton of problems and the story was a weird mix of pretentious and stupid but I still had fun playing it. If this was an original thing I don't think that it would have gotten half the poo poo that it did get, not to say that the criticism of this game is all wrong, just that the argument took over the whole internet and everyone was simply yelling at each others and the argument went nowhere. I enjoyed the first video and I liked your XCOM lp so I'm looking forward to this.

Justin_Brett
Oct 23, 2012

GAMERDOME put down LOSER

What should really go down about this game is how stupid and immature both gamers and developers can be. Some reviewers, too.

Pureauthor
Jul 8, 2010

ASK ME ABOUT KISSING A GHOST

This was a game that shouldn't have had the DmC name because it just invites all sorts of comparisons that make this game look worse.

Oh well. It's a decent game on its own merits.

The story is hot rear end though

Chickenfrogman
Sep 16, 2011

by exmarx


I can't even begin to express how much I hate this game. The story is completely asinine and awful even compared to the previous games, the music is dubstep at its most obnoxious, and the combat took a leap off a flight of stairs backwards from DMC3 and 4. All sense of fun the series had just got sucked out of it. The awful, awful PR didn't do it any favors either. Gonna follow this out of bile fascination though. I'm at least curious to see the game from the perspective of somebody that did like it.

Chickenfrogman fucked around with this message at 16:04 on Nov 26, 2013

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


I posted all the news I could find about it in the DMC thread, for nearly two years. Two years of bitterness. It was almost compulsion - I wanted to see how far down the rabbit hole it went.

Looking at it now with all the bile gone away, I find it to be mediocre as an action game (though deeper than most of its contemporaries), but pretty bad as something calling itself Devil May Cry. Better than Devil May Cry 2 though. Miles better than DMC2.

The story is pretty wretched though - drat is it bad.

I'll be following this for the same reason as Chickenfrogman; I'm interested of looking at it through the perspective of someone who likes the game.

Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at 16:27 on Nov 26, 2013

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?




I kinda loved this game. Sure it wasnt as good as DMC 3, but what is these days? Best game of the genre we've had in a while.

George
Nov 27, 2004

No love for your made-up things.


I managed to not get mad about it because we got Bayonetta anyway, but it was a shame to see a series that didn't need it get rebooted so childishly. One more game that has the word "nephilim", great!

insanityv2
May 15, 2011

I'm gay


Haha oh wow. Yeah I really liked this game, and never really understood the complaints about its story. Mostly because I thought the rest of the DMC series' story was pretty poo poo too. Also I am bad at action games but with this game I felt able to do the combos and stuff rather than just button mash.


That being said, this might just be another instance in a long trend of my liking things that make nerds angry. vOv.

David D. Davidson
Nov 17, 2012

Orca lady?

Pesky Splinter posted:

I posted all the news I could find about it in the DMC thread, for nearly two years. Two years of bitterness. It was almost compulsion - I wanted to see how far down the rabbit hole it went.

You really don't know how far that rabbit hole goes down. Let me give you a small example:

When the series was first created Hideki Kamiyama originally came up with Dante, one of the things he wanted to do was to create a character who was a badass and didn't smoke. A bit of an odd thing to focus on but there you have it. So anyways, what was the first thing the hip, new Dante was shown doing? Smoking a cigarette of course because that's what all the cool kid do.
That's not the only example of them getting everything wrong but it's a good place to start. There's so much of it that I don't think other people who hate this game really know all of it.
Hell I'd like to be something of a counterpoint to anyone who likes this game. With BumFluff permission of course.

Monkey Fracas
Sep 11, 2010

...but then you get to the end and a gorilla starts throwing barrels at you!


Grimey Drawer

Welp, my opinion on this game is that it's essentially a more polished Heavenly Sword. It's not bad, not even mediocre; it's a decent game. A nice brawler. It's also a very pretty game with some neat level design.

But it is also certainly not at the level of previous DMC games in terms of gameplay/mechanics.

...

Also New Dante is dumb

That Fucking Sned
Oct 28, 2010



It's easily Ninja Theory's best game to date, and has much better combat than most other Western action games. However, it doesn't do anything better than the previous Devil May Cry games (DMC2 excluded), and has an unfortunate focus on platforming and its terrible story.

If you play it on PC, then you can play it at 60 fps, so it feels closer to the original games. You are also given the ability to have white hair from the beginning, but unlike what reviewers and developers would like to believe, that was never the issue.

I have one major problem with Dante in this game, and that is he never showers at the beginning of the game. DMC3 Dante may be a lackadasical slob, but coming out of the shower is the first thing we see him do after the intro. Just imagine how bad he smells considering he's just spent the last night at a bar. Everyone in this game seems to have that trademark Unreal Engine 3 glisten, but it's totally appropriate for Dante.

The whole game feels like some 90's film adaptation of a video game.

Samovar
Jun 4, 2011

I'm not a hero...





Not too much to say here that hasn't already been said about the plot, music and characters, i.e. dumb, overtly-serious, unlikeable. I will say that the aesthetics of Limbo are actually REALLY interesting and unique; and a hell of a lot more engaging than other locales from the DmC games.

Oh yeah, the voice-acting is bad, too. Although somebody changed the V.A.'s to Spanish and the music to a more... latino theme. And the game becomes AMAZING. (linked videos contain spoilers... though you aren't really missing much, I guess)

Kaboom Dragoon
May 7, 2010

The greatest of feasts



Chickenfrogman posted:

the music is dubstep at its most obnoxious

Not to get all on you, but Combichrist is more industrial metal than dubstep. I actually like some of their stuff though (while loathing dubstep), so take that how you will.

It's not a bad game on its own merits, but gently caress Dawn Tay. There's one bit that pisses me off more than it probably should, but it just solidifies in my mind why he's such an unlikable prick.

Artix
Apr 26, 2010

He's finally back,
to kick some tail!
And this time,
he's goin' to jail!


Pesky Splinter posted:

Looking at it now with all the bile gone away, I find it to be mediocre as an action game (though deeper than most of its contemporaries), but pretty bad as something calling itself Devil May Cry. Better than Devil May Cry 2 though. Miles better than DMC2.

I was prepared to really hate the game, but I got it a couple months after launch for like $20, and I came out feeling about the same way. It doesn't hold a candle to DMC3 or 4, but the combat is as least serviceable and it'll get you through the game without things getting too stale. The biggest problem is...well, everything else. New Dante is trying way too hard to be cool, the plot is an absolute trainwreck, it has tonal issues out the rear end, and almost none of the characters are even remotely likable.

Samovar posted:

Oh yeah, the voice-acting is bad, too. Although somebody changed the V.A.'s to Spanish and the music to a more... latino theme. And the game becomes AMAZING. (linked videos contain spoilers... though you aren't really missing much, I guess)

Does this exist as an official mod yet? Because I've seen this before and it's positively magical.

E: God I forgot how many "classic" lines there are in this game.

"The world is your bitch. As am I."
"I will control the world through debt."

Oh, Ninja Theory.

Artix fucked around with this message at 20:23 on Nov 26, 2013

Lizard Wizard
Dec 25, 2004

mep, mep


Artix posted:

Does this exist as an official mod yet? Because I've seen this before and it's positively magical.

I'm downloading all the Spanish guitar music in the world as I speak, I'll get back to you on that.

Lizard Wizard fucked around with this message at 19:10 on Nov 26, 2013

Monkey Fracas
Sep 11, 2010

...but then you get to the end and a gorilla starts throwing barrels at you!


Grimey Drawer

Artix posted:

Does this exist as an official mod yet? Because I've seen this before and it's positively magical.

My god, it makes it like 3x better. Spanish VA Dante is also a bit less obnoxious for whatever reason.

Lizard Wizard
Dec 25, 2004

mep, mep


Monkey Fracas posted:

My god, it makes it like 3x better. Spanish VA Dante is also a bit less obnoxious for whatever reason.

Wait, does the mod have music already?!

WaltherFeng
May 15, 2013

50 thousand people used to live here. Now, it's the Mushroom Kingdom.

This game. This goddamn game. It's no wonder Ninja Theory is moving to mobile game business. Luckily you don't have to like a game to enjoy a LP.

TCat
Oct 10, 2012

I'll save you the time and call myself a loser

Wait, people hated this game because of the gameplay?
I was under the impression people hated it for literally everything else.

WaltherFeng
May 15, 2013

50 thousand people used to live here. Now, it's the Mushroom Kingdom.

TCat posted:

Wait, people hated this game because of the gameplay?
I was under the impression people hated it for literally everything else.


Ninja Theory made a lot mistakes when designing the gameplay. First, they completely messed up the physics of Jump Canceling, which has been considered the defining gameplay feature of the series since DMC3. Second, color coded enemies, which are completely invulnerable to specific weapons. The bosses are atrocious, both in design and mechanics. The weapons aren't really balanced and since the game lacks inherent challenge, higher difficulties just resort to annoying enemy combinations.

Monkey Fracas
Sep 11, 2010

...but then you get to the end and a gorilla starts throwing barrels at you!


Grimey Drawer

Lizard Wizard posted:

Wait, does the mod have music already?!

Nah, I just meant the videos. Is this actually a mod?

David D. Davidson
Nov 17, 2012

Orca lady?

Okay now then since people are talking about it let's start tearing apart this game with the first thing people complained about New Dante:

First off let's compare his character design to Old Dante:


One thing that I always liked about back in the day was that they really were able to get character design down to an art. Not so much these days as you can see. For a start you can see that Old Dante is rather fashionably dressed, That actually fits in rather well with the old games reoccuring theme of Style is Substance. He's wearing and drat fine Red longcoat. Now you see Longcoats have been a sign of badassery since the Dusters of the Old West so that has been communicated. Also the Color red is used in Japanese culture to denote that someone has heroic characteristics so it also communicates that. He also always was shown with an smug little smirk on his face taht was basically saying "Yeah, I'm going to kick your rear end, and I'm going to look good doing it too." Now also DMC 3 and 4 did some other things with his design that were kind of neat. In 3 he didn't have a shirt on. You may think that was just for fanservices sake but it also made him look younger. communicated that this was a younger and less experienced Dante who was just starting out. In 4 as you can faintly see they did the Opposite, they gave him facial hair making him look older and more experienced and contrasting him with young inexperienced Nero.



New Dante just looks like a mangy crackhead. In fact I'm just going to call him Mangy Crackhead from now on. Anyways That's about all I can say about him really. On the whole it's a rather lame and boring design and you really can't say anything else about it. Yeah he has the Longcoat. But that's now more black red so it's less striking. He's also trying to give his best Kubrick Stare and it just doesn't work with the lighting, It instead make him look uglier. That's about all I can say about him.



Anyways how he was introduced is also important. Dante was introduced in rather badass ways in the old games usually kicking the poo poo out of some minions in amusing ways. Riding a hapless minion like a skateboad while eating a slice of pizza, Impaling a mook on a sword and using him as a cudgel to smash the poo poo out of some other hapless minion.

So what does Mangy Crackhead do to establish his badass cred? He goes to a bar, drinks booze straight out of the bottle and has sex with two strippers. I would think that's cool, if I was twelve and didn't come from a long proud line of boozehounds who know how to drink properly. In fact that sums up this game rather well I think. It's trying to be cool but ultimately gets it's idea of what cool is from a twelve year old so to anyone who knows what a hangover feels like, Mangy Crackhead is just that and Mangy Crackhead that you avoid like the plague because who know what diseases he's carrying. This game is designed to appeal to twelve year olds. Hence the Screamo/Dubstep music that is prevalent in the game and the OMG SO DEEP social commentary with the main villan being a banker. I'll get to that in time though.

Bumfluff
Jun 19, 2008

Bumfluff!
It's me, Mabel!
I'm looking at you through the av!
Right here!
This is my voice!
I'm talking to you from inside!


David D. Davidson posted:

Hell I'd like to be something of a counterpoint to anyone who likes this game. With BumFluff permission of course.

Go ahead. Like I said in the video I've never actually played a Devil May Cry game before this one so I'm pretty ignorant of what came before and whether they are good or bad. It would be nice to get all four combinations of people who have/haven't played the originals and liked/disliked this game.

I was pretty much sold on this game after watching the GB QL cause I thought the dumb dialogue was goddamn hilarious and it looked pretty fun to play too.

judgementbringer
Oct 9, 2012


For all it's flaws, I do like the actual gameplay, it's not as good as the previous games but it's still a lot of fun.
It's also a game that would lend itself to a lot of bonus video type stuff. Perhaps someone could show off just how incredibly broken this game is.

Samovar posted:

Oh yeah, the voice-acting is bad, too. Although somebody changed the V.A.'s to Spanish and the music to a more... latino theme. And the game becomes AMAZING. (linked videos contain spoilers... though you aren't really missing much, I guess)

Oh my god, that is incredible. Makes the game so much better.

JamieTheD
Nov 4, 2011

LPer, Reviewer, Mad Welshman

(Yes, that's a self portrait)

Not played this before, but have seen bits of it played, and I honestly think the main clumsy part with this is the way they present Limbo. Oh look, how subtle, it's saying "Spend and Consume (Arcade)", and the energy drink is called Virility, and... This is why I haven't bought the game, because it has all the subtlety of a brick to the face, tied to an RPG. I'm still looking forward to seeing the vids, because you guys have good chemistry, but the game world already turns me off, compared to the older DMCs.

Lizard Wizard
Dec 25, 2004

mep, mep


After digging around in the directories a bit, it looks like all the content is in UPK archives. Anyone know how I'd go about crackin' em open?

Kaboom Dragoon
May 7, 2010

The greatest of feasts



David D. Davidson posted:

Okay now then since people are talking about it let's start tearing apart this game with the first thing people complained about New Dante:

Original Dante was a cocky jerk, but he could get away with it because he was still ridiculously charming. Even when you were rolling your eyes at him, it was with a wry smile on your face. Case in point: the following cutscene from DMC4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MZdrJZo_ig

New Dante, on the other hand, has none of the charm or personality. When he insults an enemy, it's usually followed up with calling them an ugly poo poo-eating fuckbrain. That's not cool, it doesn't make me think 'drat, I wanna be this guy', it makes me think of the kids you see hanging out on a Friday night getting blasted on cheap booze and starting fights with walls. He's not a fun character to be, he's ten pounds of cliche in a five pound haircut.

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


Bumfluff posted:

Go ahead. Like I said in the video I've never actually played a Devil May Cry game before this one so I'm pretty ignorant of what came before and whether they are good or bad.

If that's the case, the general opinion of the original four games is that DMC1 and DMC3 are held in high regard - DMC1 for basically starting the genre and setting the trend thereafter, DMC3 for revamping the combat to a high standard, and for its gameplay innovations (the style system - which vastly expands your moveset and playstyle).

DMC2 is regarded as the worst of the lot, and I'm not speaking hyperbolically either. It's an utter clusterfuck of bad game design; bosses that are immune to melee, requiring the player to slowly chip away at their massive health bars, having three melee weapons that all act the same with only minor (unnoticable) stat changes, enemies that have poorly designed AI, no tells, or whatever. Forums user, AccountingNightmare has the best video on the good, the bad and the ugly of DMC2.

DMC4...now that's a tricky one. The combat (and the innovations brought to that) are highly regarded. The rest of it seems up for debate. Very pretty looking, but artistically bland settings, the backtracking the game makes the player do, the recycled bosses, etc. DMC4 seems to be hit and miss for people.

And then, there's DmC...

Seraphic Neoman
Jul 19, 2011




David D. Davidson posted:

You really don't know how far that rabbit hole goes down.

Oh trust me, Splinter does. The man was always the first to break the news of the latest DmC developments. From initial character designs to game reviews (including the one with the splash banner "what is Vergil had his own game?" )



Another interesting thing to note about this picture is how practical these clothes are. Someone pointed out that in addition to being silly cool, leather makes for practical armor; granting protection and easy movement. His gloves have the thumb and index fingers removed for easy trigger-pulling. His harnesses are used to hold equipment and so on.
And look how friendly he looks DMC4 Dante was my favourite Dante, cool but never pretentious. Even when he was at his silliest, he always managed to look good. He was so chill and fun in that game.


Anyway, looking forward to this LP. I'm also curious to hear from people who like this game.
One correction: unlike DMC 1-4 the style meter in this game is dependent less on weapon variation and more on damage. Which is why angel weapons barely make the meter budge, while demon weapons instantly makes it leap to full. There is diminishing returns from constant weapon use, but it's easy to rest (just shoot your guns or do a sword combo). It was mostly put in after complaints came in about a certain gif.

darealkooky
Sep 15, 2011

You sayin' I like dubs?!?


As someone who's beaten dmc3 aprox 10000000 times, I should've probably been one of the first people threatening Jihad against ninja theory and capcom.

However, my opinion of this game has always been that if you've never played any of the good original DMC games (like the OP) then DmC is a pretty loving awesome action game, given that DmC is at it's core (and because of a lot of work by people at capcom) just a not as good version of those games (IE it goes from being an A+ to like a B-/C+). However, if you've ever actually played those games before (or bought the recent HD collection) then there is literally zero point in playing this game over those. It'd be like watching transmorphers over transformers or something.

I mean it's way better then DMC2 or basically every other hack and slash game put out by a western studio (even though, again, the gameplay was largely tuned by capcom at the last minute and nearly everything NT original is boring as gently caress to play, but I digress) but "isn't as bad as this game that almost killed the series" isn't really saying anything.

darealkooky fucked around with this message at 20:34 on Nov 26, 2013

funky not a junkie
Aug 5, 2011


Artix posted:

New Dante is trying way too hard to be cool, the plot is an absolute trainwreck, it has tonal issues out the rear end, and almost none of the characters are even remotely likable.

How is any of this different from the other dmc games

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009

I may not be as cute as the other girls, but I'm the best at arm wrestling!


funky not a junkie posted:

How is any of this different from the other dmc games
The older DMC games were just immature and dumb, but DmC sometimes comes across downright ugly and hateful. It's the comparison between finding a twelve year old's fanfic where he saves the world and makes out with all the hot girls and finding a twelve year old's fanfic where he kills and tortures everybody.

Aumanor
Nov 9, 2012


funky not a junkie posted:

How is any of this different from the other dmc games

The general message from the creators I'm seeing in this game seems to be "this is so cool and edgy, you should think it's cool", while in 3 and 4 that was more along the lines of "we really hope you're laughing as hard as we are".

Pesky Splinter
Feb 16, 2011

A worried pug.


funky not a junkie posted:

How is any of this different from the other dmc games

It's the difference between people who are making gameplay first, and then piling on a load of B-movie quality story telling, to people who were hired primarily for their storytelling who say things in complete sincerity like;

"You should be seeing a story of Dante that breaks the myth that all videogame stories are trite and will never stand up to the best that theatre and film have to offer" and wanting to have "a videogame story, which hopefully for once, treats us like sophisticated adults."

And failing miserably at it. To the point that the B-movie shlock where the main character rides a missile has more subtlety and nuance to it.

DmC feels like a bunch of middle-aged men sat round and asked "what's cool to the youth of today? We're gonna tell them that they're gonna feel cool playing a cool guy. He's hip and he's edgy.", whereas the other games feel like, "I want to allow the player to feel cool playing as Dante".

---

May as well talk about the video:

The Hunter Demon boss. When he throws his knife, it's possible to reflect it back at him, knocking him out. I know he's a tutorial boss, but that fact that 90% of his attacks will never connect if you jump and slash is disappointing, as is the fact that he has two very lengthy periods to damage him without him retaliating.

The 'They Live' vibe in this game is very strong. Very strong. On that thin wedge between borderline plagiarism, and homage, strong.

Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at 22:43 on Nov 26, 2013

theblastizard
Nov 5, 2009


DmC is the kind of game that would have been much better if it wasn't trying to be Devil May Cry. It would have been like making a Super Mario RPG where Mario was Cloud.

David D. Davidson
Nov 17, 2012

Orca lady?

funky not a junkie posted:

How is any of this different from the other dmc games

Well we'll see later, just remember that one of the things that Alex Garland shot down when they were making enslaved was during the opening level they were going to have the main character just randomly kick someone else off the falling ship to show that he was a bit of a badass. I'll explain more when we get there.

McKilligan
May 13, 2007

Acey Deezy

Samovar posted:

Not too much to say here that hasn't already been said about the plot, music and characters, i.e. dumb, overtly-serious, unlikeable. I will say that the aesthetics of Limbo are actually REALLY interesting and unique; and a hell of a lot more engaging than other locales from the DmC games.

Oh yeah, the voice-acting is bad, too. Although somebody changed the V.A.'s to Spanish and the music to a more... latino theme. And the game becomes AMAZING. (linked videos contain spoilers... though you aren't really missing much, I guess)

I keep noticing more stupid details and it keeps cracking me up. Vergil's absurd moustache is the best thing, and the only shame is that it isn't actually modelled.

Josuke Higashikata
Mar 7, 2013




Pesky Splinter posted:

The 'They Live' vibe in this game is very strong. Very strong. On that thin wedge between borderline plagiarism, and homage, strong.

My favourite part of this is the fact they released an iPhone app pre-release that allowed you to fight the man.

I should hope the irony is not lost on anyone here.

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Nihilarian
Oct 2, 2013




Old Dante was a smug, smarmy, cocky bastard who was always ready with a cheesy one-liner. Sometimes that's exactly what you want to see. It's like a b-movie in game form. If he was any less over the top no one would have liked him. Since the game had good gameplay on top of that, it became a hit.

DmC's a fine game from a gameplay perspective but it lost the smug charm of (most of) the old games and replaced it with edgy-cool.

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