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You can get a fully loaded macbook pro for way less than that and it's significantly more powerful. Or an air, or any other apple product. I don't even know what the target market is for that thing, other than people who really only want desktop, have far too much money, and don't want any space taken up under the desk or whatever.
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Mar 19, 2015 17:23
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The last Mac Pro release was Dec 2013, at which time it was sorta impressive but still slightly overpriced. Now they have other machines out with better performance.
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Mar 19, 2015 17:29
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evol262 posted:AFAIK, the examination doesn't check your command history at all, just whether or not the system is configured correctly, and ifconfig still handles almost everything iproute2 can do (network namespaces aside), and service transparently does "systemctl enable ...", so it should be fine.
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Mar 19, 2015 17:38
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KillHour posted:I like Ubuntu better, TBH. Actually, I like WIndows 8 better, too. Windows 8 is incredibly jarring and I was really disappointed the whole "metro" theme failed. Windows 10 is better but I still prefer OS X. I don't mind Ubuntu but I'm still stuck with Microsoft because computer games  JHVH-1 posted:The last Mac Pro release was Dec 2013, at which time it was sorta impressive but still slightly overpriced. Now they have other machines out with better performance. I'm shocked with how long Apple goes on selling older hardware for such a premium when pc's already have the next chip.
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Mar 19, 2015 17:40
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Tab8715 posted:I'm shocked with how long Apple goes on selling older hardware for such a premium when pc's already have the next chip.
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Mar 19, 2015 17:45
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KillHour posted:I know that people have a thing about Macs, but it's going to be obsolete in 3 years, just like any other workstation, anyways. I just don't see it. Xeon E5 12 core 2.7 with 64 gigs of RAM. User was demanding MORE POWERRRRR so I specced out an HP desktop that supported dual CPUs. I was going to get him something like 24 cores for barely more money and he decided it would be too loud so he went for the Mac. His stats work is critical so the CEO had already gotten involved to say "Get him whatever he wants" and he wasn't kidding. Paid for the Mac Pro and dual displays on his own credit card. Having recently revived three of the old Mac Pros that weigh a goddamn ton it was a pleasure dealing with this new one.
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Mar 19, 2015 17:58
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They're still a pretty neat piece of kit but overpriced as all hell. I never want to hear a Mac office say "we can't afford that".
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Mar 19, 2015 18:07
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I think it would be interesting if Apple had put the ports on the bottom of the case, so that you could drill a hole in the desk and have it really be seamless. EDIT: You could also countersink the case and oh man that would be pretty. Inspector_666 fucked around with this message at 18:19 on Mar 19, 2015 |
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Mar 19, 2015 18:17
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Inspector_666 posted:I think it would be interesting if Apple had put the ports on the bottom of the case, so that you could drill a hole in the desk and have it really be seamless. You may as well just strap the bare motherboard to the bottom of the desk, at that point.
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Mar 19, 2015 18:33
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Just make a desk that is a desktop. The iDesk.
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Mar 19, 2015 18:37
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Bhodi posted:I don't even know what the target market is for that thing, other than people who really only want desktop, have far too much money, and don't want any space taken up under the desk or whatever. Early adopters?  IIRC when I was shopping for PC cases they had a pyramid-shaped ones. Is it supposed to be more space efficient? I kinda understand the basic cube mini-cases but not so much the other one. My friend bought his GF's macbook and I asked him if noticed any significant improvements. He did say they had a nice touchpad. Later on he confessed it cost too much for him to develop iOS apps and now it's a glorified 2nd screen. idek. Apple is already a Lifestyle brand nowadays no need to be competitive.
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Mar 19, 2015 18:40
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I'm pretty shocked nobody's done a custom skin of *nix and created their own boutique brand, yet. Seems like something Lenovo or ASUS would do.
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Mar 19, 2015 18:54
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Inspector_666 posted:I think it would be interesting if Apple had put the ports on the bottom of the case, so that you could drill a hole in the desk and have it really be seamless. Can't counter sink it too deep, the usb/power/peripherals are all located near the bottom of the case.
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Mar 19, 2015 18:55
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KillHour posted:I'm pretty shocked nobody's done a custom skin of *nix and created their own boutique brand, yet. Asus tried back around the eeePc days and it was as clunky and horrible as you might imagine
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Mar 19, 2015 19:15
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mewse posted:Asus tried back around the eeePc days and it was as clunky and horrible as you might imagine Yes, but they tried to actually put it on the eeePC, which was the biggest (okay, littlest, whatever) piece of poo poo. Edit: I just realized I was describing a Chromebook.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:23
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KillHour posted:I'm pretty shocked nobody's done a custom skin of *nix and created their own boutique brand, yet. They called it "Mac OS 10"
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Mar 19, 2015 19:25
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evol262 posted:They called it "Mac OS 10" poo poo, I was going to make this joke.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:25
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evol262 posted:They called it "Mac OS 10" I meant nobody else.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:25
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KillHour posted:I meant nobody else. It's a lot of work. There are lost of complaints you can make about walled gardens, but Apple's is really goddamn nice inside. ASUS makes good money now without having to worry about all of the software headaches that they get to shove off onto MS.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:27
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Inspector_666 posted:It's a lot of work. There are lost of complaints you can make about walled gardens, but Apple's is really goddamn nice inside. ASUS makes good money now without having to worry about all of the software headaches that they get to shove off onto MS. I never claimed it was a great idea. I'm just surprised nobody's tried it. I guess Microsoft kind of is now, with their self-branded hardware. And Google, with their Chromebooks. And Amazon.... Alright, fine.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:30
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KillHour posted:I meant nobody else. NeXTStep had a couple of enormous advantages as a base. They controlled the kernel, most of their frameworks had/have no equivalent on other operating systems (NS*), the language was obscure, and it already had some uptake from vendors (mostly Adobe at that point). When combined with the extremely simple structure of Carbon and Mac OS Classic applications (which also didn't run anywhere else), Apple could write a pretty small compatibility layer and bring everything from their old ecosystem in. And nobody else could. When you talk about skinning *nix (I'm assuming you mean Linux here, since nobody would want to skin AIX, and BSD isn't actually "UNIX" at this point anyway, but we can lump it in anyway because that's just not paying money), there's almost no API or framework you can use which locks users into your particular boutique. And it's licensed in such a way that you'd have an extremely hard time doing that even if you wanted to. In theory, you could base off FreeBSD and make noncompatible changes to BSD libc (or some other core component) that link into your compiled, obfuscated library, but this isn't a thing on Linux. So users could just copy your files off and run them on any non-boutique distro they wanted. It's a losing proposition, and none of the (Windows) applications you want to use run anyway.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:39
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evol262 posted:NeXTStep had a couple of enormous advantages as a base. They controlled the kernel, most of their frameworks had/have no equivalent on other operating systems (NS*), the language was obscure, and it already had some uptake from vendors (mostly Adobe at that point). I don't mean carbon copy the walled garden approach from Apple. I mean skin a Linux distro to be as idiot-proof as possible (*cough* Ubuntu *cough*) and leverage the existing ecosystem from that with a nice application storefront. There's no reason to lock people into your kernel if you just want to sell the hardware for beaucoup bucks to people that are too cool for Windows, or whatever. Google did it with the Pixel.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:50
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Fiendish Dr. Wu posted:Just make a desk that is a desktop. The iDesk. I was going to make fun of this, but then I thought why isn't this actually a thing? (Sans Apple) A purpose built desk with self contained modular components rather than a metal box kicking around, interface and power ports ingrained above and below the desk material. It would be pretty bitchin' compared to stuffing boxes and cables all over the place.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:53
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Super Slash posted:I was going to make fun of this, but then I thought why isn't this actually a thing? (Sans Apple) FYI this is already a thing
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Mar 19, 2015 19:55
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Bhodi posted:You can get a fully loaded macbook pro for way less than that and it's significantly more powerful. Or an air, or any other apple product. The target market for the Mac Pro USED TO BE people who needed an expandable Mac. Which it was, since it used to be a regular large case with normal slots and poo poo to put your expansion cards in. This latest model on the other hand? Your expansion opportunities are pretty much "choose some custom graphics cards and ram configuration at purchase, and everything else has to be expanded using thunderbolt peripherals".
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Mar 19, 2015 20:00
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KillHour posted:I don't mean carbon copy the walled garden approach from Apple. I mean skin a Linux distro to be as idiot-proof as possible (*cough* Ubuntu *cough*) and leverage the existing ecosystem from that with a nice application storefront. There's no reason to lock people into your kernel if you just want to sell the hardware for beaucoup bucks to people that are too cool for Windows, or whatever. Google did not do it with the Pixel, or any other Chromebook. Google took a distro (which distro doesn't matter, but it's currently kind-of Gentoo, though it wasn't always) and wrote their own non-X11-compliant compositor which breaks every fundamental tenet of X and runs Chrome directly on top of it with hardware compositing. Every single application you can use is rendered with Chrome, because they're all webpages. They are not "leveraging the existing ecosystem" in any way, and virtually nothing from the Linux ecosystem (nothing that relies on X, anyway) will work on ChromeOS even if you enable developer mode, unless you install something like crouton which puts a compliant X-server on and runs it outside of ChromeOS's compositor, which is way too jarring for users. This is great for Google, because they want a platform which only needs to run Chrome. This is a terrible strategy that doesn't work for any company which isn't also an application vendor.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:01
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evol262 posted:Google did not do it with the Pixel, or any other Chromebook. Google took a distro (which distro doesn't matter, but it's currently kind-of Gentoo, though it wasn't always) and wrote their own non-X11-compliant compositor which breaks every fundamental tenet of X and runs Chrome directly on top of it with hardware compositing. Every single application you can use is rendered with Chrome, because they're all webpages. They are not "leveraging the existing ecosystem" in any way, and virtually nothing from the Linux ecosystem (nothing that relies on X, anyway) will work on ChromeOS even if you enable developer mode, unless you install something like crouton which puts a compliant X-server on and runs it outside of ChromeOS's compositor, which is way too jarring for users. I didn't mean they did exactly that, I mean they took Linux and customized it to their needs for a high-spec flagship piece of hardware. My point is just that I'm surprised there isn't more competition in the "High end PC that doesn't run Windows" market.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:10
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KillHour posted:I meant nobody else. BeOS didn't fair to well, but it could have been big man.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:14
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KillHour posted:I didn't mean they did exactly that, I mean they took Linux and customized it to their needs for a high-spec flagship piece of hardware. My point is just that I'm surprised there isn't more competition in the "High end PC that doesn't run Windows" market. I'm just trying to make the point here that "taking Linux and customizing it to their needs for a high-spec flagship piece of hardware" is done all the time, especially in embedded stuff you never see (even if it's "high end" kit in the datacenter), but also Rokus, every Android phone, and a bunch of other stuff. But that's using the kernel and glibc. But putting a "skin" on top of Linux, where Linux implies something like a distro that users may actually use and the associated applications (Spotify, gaming, CAD, etc) to make it usable is something that nobody has done. SteamOS is exactly that, but I'm not sure if I consider a beta project with no shipping hardware and which will only be used to play games anyway derivative or not, since it's not really "putting a skin on and making their own boutique brand" if (like ChromeOS) it's just an appliance which only runs one application.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:21
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KillHour posted:I didn't mean they did exactly that, I mean they took Linux and customized it to their needs for a high-spec flagship piece of hardware. My point is just that I'm surprised there isn't more competition in the "High end PC that doesn't run Windows" market. Because Windows owns? And any self respecting very high end Linux user just builds poo poo themselves or is customizing heavily from a major OEM.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:23
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evol262 posted:AFAIK, the examination doesn't check your command history at all, just whether or not the system is configured correctly, and ifconfig still handles almost everything iproute2 can do (network namespaces aside), and service transparently does "systemctl enable ...", so it should be fine. The instructor runs a script which SSHes into your VM and does some checks, creates an encrypted report which goes to RH for grading. I mention that who know what they look for because if you need to add an ip to a linux system, you can do it a few different ways, and the results may look a little different each time. For example maybe the ifconfig script is formatted slightly different, if you use ip add, ifconfig, or right it manually. The script may run "ip addr con if xXXX" then awk and grep it to find a pattern, or it could just look at the ifcfg file. Services are seamless, but there's a lot of specific things they want you to do. There's a section that allow you to comment on questions, and I commented on each one with how the question left enough vagaries to be open to interpretation. I'm 100% certain I did everything on the the test correctly, but I still missed a few points. I'd like to see why, because I'm sure that it's just looking for something different to grade, although the actual lab was done correctly. Oh well.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:24
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There also isn't a market for "High end PCs that don't run Windows" that isn't Apple, period. Unless you mean the server market, in which case the OEMs don't give a gently caress what OS you put on their poo poo anyway, and the people using it definitely don't care about an app store. If you need a high end gaming rig, your choice is Windows and that's it. If you want something fancy or need to run Quark or whatever, you buy an Apple. There's no use case for anything else on a workstation level.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:29
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Inspector_666 posted:There also isn't a market for "High end PCs that don't run Windows" that isn't Apple, period. Unless you mean the server market, in which case the OEMs don't give a gently caress what OS you put on their poo poo anyway, and the people using it definitely don't care about an app store. You realize you're making the argument that I'm trying to make, right? Apple has a monopoly on "Fancy PCs that hipsters use because it's not Windows." Why is nobody competing for that market? evol262 posted:I'm just trying to make the point here that "taking Linux and customizing it to their needs for a high-spec flagship piece of hardware" is done all the time, especially in embedded stuff you never see (even if it's "high end" kit in the datacenter), but also Rokus, every Android phone, and a bunch of other stuff. But that's using the kernel and glibc. I get your point. evol262 posted:But putting a "skin" on top of Linux, where Linux implies something like a distro that users may actually use and the associated applications (Spotify, gaming, CAD, etc) to make it usable is something that nobody has done. THIS is my point. Why has nobody done this?
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Mar 19, 2015 20:30
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Docjowles posted:FYI this is already a thing Imagine rolling up to the lan party with that bitch
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Mar 19, 2015 20:42
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Fiendish Dr. Wu posted:Imagine rolling up to the lan party with that bitch I've taken my Fractal Define XL to a LAN party. The case alone is 40lbs. 
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Mar 19, 2015 20:48
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KillHour posted:You realize you're making the argument that I'm trying to make, right? Apple has a monopoly on "Fancy PCs that hipsters use because it's not Windows." Why is nobody competing for that market? Google is. Chromebooks.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:52
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KillHour posted:THIS is my point. Why has nobody done this? Because what's your sales pitch? "Pay as much as an Apple for this computer that runs an OS you've never heard of and doesn't run any of the programs you want to use!"
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Mar 19, 2015 20:54
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So I interviewed for a "Junior Network Engineer" position and I was told I'm getting a job offer mailed to me, is using snail mail to extend offers pretty commonplace? I'm in my first IT job now and I was offered it over the phone so I don't have much to compare this second offer to
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Mar 19, 2015 21:00
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Inspector_666 posted:Because what's your sales pitch? "Pay as much as an Apple for this computer that runs an OS you've never heard of and doesn't run any of the programs you want to use!" That's not how you pitch a luxury purchase. That's what it is - nobody needs a Macbook Pro. It doesn't have to be more capable than its competition, it just has to make people smug about owning it.
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Mar 19, 2015 21:01
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crunk dork posted:So I interviewed for a "Junior Network Engineer" position and I was told I'm getting a job offer mailed to me, is using snail mail to extend offers pretty commonplace? I'm in my first IT job now and I was offered it over the phone so I don't have much to compare this second offer to Was it an in-person interview? KillHour posted:That's not how you pitch a luxury purchase. Since that's what it is - nobody needs a Macbook Pro. It doesn't have to be more capable than its competition, it just has to make people smug about owning it. Then give me the pitch. You're not talking about supercars here. Vertu was the company you're talking about, but in the phone space, and they're in free fall because people would rather have a "plebian" phone that actually does stuff instead of a 10k statement that just makes phone calls. And does anybody really even care about the software when it comes to luxury purchases. Why would Asus spend the money on making/maintaining some kind of franken-OS when they can just make a really thin laptop out of aluminum and achieve the desired luxury effect? EDIT: I think the closest thing to what you're talking about is in the SmartTV arena now. "Buy this 70" curved OLED TV with our special OS that lets you control Netflix with your hips!" Inspector_666 fucked around with this message at 21:07 on Mar 19, 2015 |
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