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emfive
Aug 6, 2011

Hey emfive, this is Alec. I am glad you like the mummy eating the bowl of shitty pasta with a can of 'parm.' I made that image for you way back when. I’m glad you enjoy it.
Whiplash

Written and directed by Damien Chazelle

Preface

Everybody but me loves this movie, so go see it. Come back and read this if you feel kind-of funny afterwards.

Synopsis

Andrew Neiman is a freshman at a prestigious east-coast music school ("Shaffer Academy"). He plays the drums.

While practicing one day, or one night, in a room somewhere, a man appears ("Terence Fletcher") and startles Andrew. He stops and apologizes. He knows who the man is: an eminent instructor, we are led to believe. An awkward back-and-forth ensues, and the scene ends. The eminent instructor pulls Andrew into the school's top band, and things start getting edgy from there.

So Andrew is a competitive music student at a ritzy school. He's taken in by the premier instructor, where he faces trials in becoming a core member of the best band at the school. His life gets somewhat messed up, in part due to the extremely demanding nature of the band leader, and Andrew eventually leaves the school. But then Andrew and band leader Fletcher meet again to set the stage for a dramatic ending.

Cast

Andrew is played by Miles Teller.
Fletcher is played by J. K. Simmons.
Andrew's dad is played by Paul Reiser.
Andrew's not-quite girlfriend is played by Melissa Benoist.

Good Stuff

The movie was beautifully filmed. The camera stays close to Teller and Simmons, and also to the musical instruments involved, and the effect is quite sensitive. The audience is really forced to deal with the characters, almost as sculpture.

The movie is about musicians, and the musical interludes involving actual performance were thoroughly entertaining.

Teller and Simmons did fantastic jobs. Teller's Andrew is consistent and thoroughly believable, but it's Simmons that dominates everything; he basically is the driving force of the movie. Andrew is ostensibly the protagonist, but it's Simmons that calls the tune.

Terrible Stuff

OK, I don't like this movie at all. I just saw it 24 hours ago, and I can't stop thinking of new reasons I don't like it. I repeat, everybody else loves it, so don't pay attention to me.

NOTE: there are, I guess, spoilers below. I'll try to spoiler tag the big ones, but honestly there aren't many surprises in this movie, and the ones that are there aren't really that important to me anyway. I'll try not to ruin things for you.

Where to begin. First, we know nothing at all about Andrew other than that he seems to be a drummer. He stares blankly ahead the whole time, more or less. The only interesting thing he does (once) is go see a movie with his dad, and in that scene he stares blankly ahead, because it's a movie.

Fletcher, the premier instructor, is a maniacally abusive psychotic. The film gives him two or three human moments, but of those one turns out to be a complete (and terrible) lie. He's a violent bully, a misogynist (in a frankly silly fraction of a scene), and a monster filled with homophobic invective. His entire schtick is to psychologically torture the band members in order to reduce them to utterly cowed zombies. In the film, there's almost no communication between Andrew and any of the other musicians in the band (and there are at least a dozen other people). They say nothing, and they rarely make eye contact with anybody (or the camera).

Andrew, the student, is apparently a drummer since a young age (as we find out later in the film). He's made it into this super-great music school, and he's pumped that he's been tapped by the Big Cheese. Except the Big Cheese is mostly interested in abusing people, so he publicly humiliates and physically assaults Andrew in his first try in the big band. This of course makes Andrew just practice more and more. And more.

Early on Andrew asks a girl out. (She works the concession stand at the theater where Andrew sees movies with his dad. He decides to ask her out, and introduces the notion by saying he'd like to take her out because "I think you're pretty". She punks him by saying "Get out" and he believes her; unbeknown to the poor girl that was actually the right answer.)

At this point I need to admit that I'm a terrible person to review this film because one of my kids is a pretty talented drummer. I get to see somebody playing the drums all the time. I know from my kid some things about drumming, and in fact I went with him to this movie because one of his instructors told him (with reservations) to see it. To be fair, he liked the movie a whole lot more than me.

Anyway a lot of the movie focuses on Andrew working and working on his drumming. He works so much that his hands bleed, like a lot. This is something that, according to my son and to his accomplished and borderline-famous instructor, is simply impossible for somebody who can actually play the drums with any competence. I've never seen it happen in my house, and my kid plays for hours at a time. So this was really hard to take, but it probably was inspiring for those less familiar with the actualities of drumming. Similarly, what Andrew was working on sounded fairly awful. The main drumming challenge seemed to be the ability to play a really fast "double-time swing" beat, which my son described as a lovely grind-core break beat.

There's a weird scene where Andrew and his dad have dinner with some random people, friends or extended family or something, and Andrew gets to display again how much of a dick he is by being abrasive to these two unexplained other youths. We never see them again so the whole segment makes no sense other than to re-confirm that Andrew is unbearable.

Then (maybe it happens before the dinner; doesn't matter) Andrew invites his girlfriend to a diner and tells her that they need to sever because he's so devoted to music that he'll eventually hate her. She, acting like a normal person, asks if he's really saying that he literally believes it's impossible that they can make things work, and he says "Yep that's basically it." She wisely departs from the film at that point.

So all that happens in this fancy academy, at least as far as we the audience see, is that this super-intense "Studio" band has rehearsals. No private lessons, no conversations with other band members, no other classes, nothing. OK fine, it's an allegory. There's a drum-off between three candidate drummers (including Andrew), where they have to meet the apparently impossible standards set by the sadistic Fletcher. They go around and around, playing on command for two or three seconds each, for hours and hours as we're led to understand by shots of a school clock on the wall. Eventually, for reasons unknown, Andrew is at the end of this ordeal able to bang out this awful-sounding noise at a speed that satisfies Fletcher, so the rest of the band can continue the rehearsal.

Andrew is tortured by Fletcher by being brought into the band, then excluded, then brought back, as a sort of sick joke by Fletcher; none of it makes much sense. (Again, through all of this, there are all the other band members who exhibit no reaction at all to what's going on; they're like brainwashed POWs.) He eventually fucks up pretty seriously (literally almost getting killed in the process, which nobody seems to notice) and is dumped from the band and (I think) the school after a violent (if understandable) attack on Fletcher.

It turns out that some parents are kind-of upset that Fletcher viciously abuses their children so Andrew ends up giving a deposition of some sort that gets Fletcher kicked out of the school. But Andrew and Fletcher meet again, only to set up the bizarre ending to the film. I won't even go into that; it's supposed to be inspiring and emotionally draining according to everybody else, so bring Kleenex.

I don't like this movie because it's terrible. The only two real characters are a jerk and a violent madman. In the end, things seem to be working out so that they both may continue a productive relationship as young budding madman and older, wiser madman, both jerks. However, as I said at the beginning, everybody else loves it, so I must be stupid.

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GenderSelectScreen
Mar 7, 2010

I DON'T KNOW EITHER DON'T ASK ME
College Slice
My family loves this movie and I hate it. The main character reminds me of a professor I had in school, except he was just an insufferable rear end in a top hat who wasn't trying to make us reach our full potential behind the assholishness. I also hate how people keep comparing it to Full Metal Jacket. It's nothing like that.

Overhyped movie. 2/5

Dick Fagballzson
Sep 29, 2005
That car insurance commercial guy from The Closer gives a good performance in an otherwise mediocre movie. He reminds me a bit of R Lee Ermey in Full Metal Jacket. I'd a give a 3/5.

real_slime
Apr 21, 2015

by Lowtax
I thought Whiplash was really good.

You don't seem to acknowledge that the two lead characters aren't supposed to be totally normal guys who do things that make sense. Andrew is a silly younger guy with high ambitions but no perspective, so he keeps going too far in his efforts to impress Fletcher, who he thinks holds the keys to the gate of being a great musician. You can think his perseverance through getting blindsided in a car, and his decision to dump his girlfriend because he thinks she is a distraction (although that is far more realistic, people do this), and other elements, are ridiculous but they do fit within his characterisation and the theme of the movie. It's all about ambition and what actually matters in life, and you can make you own judgment on what you think about the decisions Andrew makes and whether Fletcher's method has any validity or if it just an excuse for him to terrorise people.

I think the bar scene is good because it gives some weight over to Fletcher's side which wasn't there before. He explains his whole thing about 'good job' being the two most destructive words you can ever hear, and for people who are laser focused, I get that. I can even see how his logic that being punishing to weed out people who aren't really committed works. It might NOT work, but I can see how he thinks it does. Of course he betrays that towards the end by showing that he asked Andrew to join his new band as a chance to get revenge on him, and then Andrew overcomes that and gives the great solo to end the film and Fletcher smiles. I guess you can read it as being Fletcher's intention in asking him to join him, or just him being happy to see his student surpass his expectations even if he did want to hurt him moments before.

The scene with the family where Andrew is rude to them isn't pointless and weird, it sets up a context where what he sees as mediocrity is praised and he is ignored despite the grueling process he is putting himself through. He feels unappreciated and lashes out. I think the other kid at the table is a football player or something? Don't remember, but it felt like a nerd v jock thing. Everyone knows how nasty nerds can be when they decide to fight back. He is a dick, but there are story reasons.

When I came out of this movie, having been totally onboard for the whole ride, I was just on a bit of a high watching two people who were fiercely committed to what they do butt heads and the energy that comes out of that kind of thing. People who care about things are interesting, and it's an interesting area to explore whether it is possible to care to much and what that can do to your life. I don't think dumping his girlfriend was even the wrong move. He didn't give a poo poo about her I guess, so whatever his reasons, he made the honest choice even if it didn't make anyone happy in that moment. She got a new boyfriend by the end and sounded happier, and he obviously was hoping to rekindle things, but he'll be happier with someone else later when he is ready to give a poo poo about someone else.

One thing that didn't fit for me was that Fletcher kept using homophobic insults. I guess it was to make it more clear that he was going over the line, but it felt kinda cheap and not necessarily fitting in with what that kind of character would have to be like. I mean he'd probably be fired in the real world pretty quick anyway for putting students in mortal danger, so it was a bit much to have to put up with the slurs and stuff besides.

Crazyweasel
Oct 29, 2006
lazy

I loving hate typing on my phone so I'll keep it short.

The editing of this movie is really really good, and for a music nobody who likes jazz, everything is believable and it looks like the main character is really trying hard.

The movie is very streamlined, repetitive, and exaggerated around the scenario of a hungry young artist being abused by an older expert in a very competitive and glory less field (unless you are in the field).

In my opinion, this movie NAILED the great crisis of Millenials to a T. Hard working, entitled, and competitive wrapped in an unhealthy layer of naivety, self doubt, and social awkwardness.

For those who can't cope, its like being a beaten puppy, lash out and bite and whimper and run away from the Baby Boomers when they don't appease them. Most eventually smarten up, learn how to survive in the real world and move on.

Whiplash shows what happens when you get a great boomer manipulator paired with the most naive millennial trying to prove himself, and the ending is perfect.

4/5 if you can relate, although I can easily see this being a whiney over dramatic mess for non Millennials who haven't been through this dilemma.

Crazyweasel fucked around with this message at 13:44 on May 1, 2015

Dr. Video Games 0112
Jan 7, 2004

serious business
I think it's cool that the movie chose not go the cliche path of focusing in on drug use or a sappy love story like most "musician" movies tend to. A very believable portrayal of how warped with obsession higher level musicians can get and how their passion for their art is about the only thing keeping them from outright murdering each other or ending their life in some other tragic way (hey Im going to murder you... but hold on finish that drum solo first that sounded good.) If you've been around musicians or even played in bands, a lot will strike close to home. Lots of new ideas but expertly executed and fitting, interesting visual metaphors. Some tension building and keeps you interested in what you're seeing. It genuinely feels like a good book in film form (but I dont think it's based on a book,) could be it felt more personal for me due to hobbyist interest in music. A definite movie everyone should see and a MUST for anyone remotely into music. Musicians are insane, the movie. Fantastic.

I guess the only downside would be is I can see how not everyone would be that interested in the subject matter, there really isn't much more in the movie beyond what it is. However, it's definitely a case where it works to a positive effect and if it focused away from the main plot it would be distracting and break the tension and focus you are supposed to feel along with the main character. It's worth seeing at least once because everything is executed so well. Great music throughout as well.

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Aces High
Mar 26, 2010

Nah! A little chocolate will do




As a musician myself I had decided to see this movie because I had heard stuff about it "being a good musician movie". I agree with this sentiment but I am not sure if they really thought it the way I would.

What most everyone has already said about the two main characters is spot-on but I will go a little deeper from a musician's perspective:

Andrew wants to be the next Buddy Holly of jazz drumming, nothing wrong at all with having a goal. We see him listening to music and we see him practicing but what we don't see is him developing any kind of camaraderie with anyone else in the band, in ANY of the bands. He is laser focused (as others have pointed out) on being THE best drummer at the school he is attending and he will be better than those other chucklefuck drummers. This is where I say that this is one of the reasons why I like this film as a musician but not strictly for the reasons people may think. Andrew is demonstrating more of a rockstar personality, he is not a team player, he will not have a lucrative music career or be the next Buddy Holly and that is because of how self-centred and self-focused he is. He will not accept his fuckups as his own fault and will try to pass that off on others and he is not interested in developing healthy relationships with his peers, people he would likely play with in other bands when he is out on his own in the real world.

I'll throw in a personal story from something that one of my music professors once told our class about ways to keep ourselves in good company and to excel as good musicians, never keep score. Do not let your egos consume you and do not compare yourself to others in your group as if you are "better" than them. That will make you a pariah and no one will ever want to work with you making your life as a professional musician a living hell.

Getting back to the film I got the feeling that Fletcher's point is to show the end result of Andrew's path as a musician, running the "top" band at an academy and winning first place at those level competitions and festivals for the rest of his life and maybe playing with one band or two on the side but nothing outside of bars and clubs. Fletcher's abuse is so over the top that I feel that in the real world he would not have a huge following except by naive people that feel that they are "the best" whereas the actual "good" musicians would stay as far away as possible and lead healthier lives and careers because of it. A good example of this is when Fletcher says that the two words "good job" or the worst words that a musician can ever hear when it is actually the opposite. 9 times out of 10 when you perform for a judged competition or you attend a masterclass the first words out of your judge's mouth will be "that was good" and then they will start critiquing you. But Andrew takes him at his word and believes that being told you did a "good job" is poison and so he buys into what Fletcher is selling. At the end when Andrew is humiliated on stage by Fletcher and he leaves he has three options, the obvious one that his father offers which is to give up on music and look for something else, the one he chooses by going back and showing up Fletcher (and solidifying in front of thousands how much of an rear end in a top hat he truly is) or he could leave, rethink why he wants to be a jazz drummer and go somewhere else.

I honestly feel that the way the film ends is perfect since it is highly representative of Andrew's future path that he has chosen for himself.

At the end of the day I feel that this is a good film because it demonstrates the wrong way to become a musician, it shows you the opposite of what you should do to become a lucrative and successful musician and person, I would say 4/5 because of that but again that is mostly because of the great performances by Teller and Simmons, without them I don't think this film would have succeeded at even what I took away from it.

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