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Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Drone posted:

those precious few seconds are really going to hurt my APM in a pauseable game

Seriously though, I hadn't noticed that there's no minimap before, and would like to know the reasoning behind it too. But maybe my not noticing that it was gone says something about how often I actually ever looked at it.

Multiplayer :getin:

e: in seriousness watching the WWW between Germany and Britain eventually Germany's sheer size meant the player was missing bad things happening to him in quite a few places, where the British player had fewer things to focus on. Minimaps are good.

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Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

podcat posted:

Its not needed for a few reasons:
- the reason to look at china is because you have units there most likely, in which case you just click on the army icosn on the right and camera goes there
- you can bookmark areas of interest which makes going there faster (if you dont have troops there)
- zooming out, then in rapidly is really fast and more precise than trying to hit a tiny minimap
- you get area alerts which (you guessed it) you can just quickly go to by clicking.

Generally right clickign anythign with a location (like units in the unit list) in the game will move camera there.

Usually its something new betas go "where is my minimap!" then after a while realise they dont need. we might end up adding one as optional in a patch just because, but its not needed at all.


I dont see how a traditional paradox minimap would help here. you still need to jump around and actually look at stuff. This is also one of the challenges of playing MP, because player attention can not be everywhere and paused you can do sneaky stuff.

I'm just coming from having played a lot of EU IV MP where the challenges are similar (but presumably less?) and being able to jump around with a click is what's important: I suppose we'll see how this pans out but you have certainly listed a lot of other ways to do that than a minimap so if they work well it could be fine?

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Man Musk posted:

EU4 Question:

For events like "Nobility Request Privileges" or "Bourgeoisie Request Privileges" - do these trigger additional events down the road? A lot of the time it feels like a choice between tech loss and regional autonomy is a no-brainer, so not sure if there are hidden costs...

Doesn't granting them also nullify them for the other if they currently have them?

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
How was the fan gathering?

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
Over at MapGoons, this happened:



It was great but everyone has become a burning husk of death. Good times.

If you want to join the next EUIV multiplayer clusterfuck, signups are over here. Don't be afraid if you haven't played before! You will quickly learn that we are all, in fact, terrible.

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Fister Roboto posted:

Purple is obviously Malaya, dark green is Kilwa, light green is some Nubian country? Lavender looks like Shu, white is a daimyo (Uesugi?), pink I want to say is Livonian Order but I'm probably wrong, and I have no idea what puke green or red are.

How close am I?

Quite close. Players at game end were Wu, Shu, Uesugi, Malaya, Bharat, Mewar, PLC, Kilwa. I think we started with twenty five?

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
A fun reminder that the MapGoons Multiplayer Kaiserreich game starts this Sunday. Signups:

http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3822711

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
As always Paradox games become good if you play multiplayer and just ignore the AI entirely

Exceptions for Stellaris, whose MP is exactly as stale as SP, and CKII, which would be good if it worked

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Jabor posted:

CKII multiplayer is basically "Ow my balls", if anyone is allowed to play a Greek character.

MapGoons have tried it repeatedly. It's either speed 1 or continual crashes.

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Kaza42 posted:

I've been playing a multiplayer CK2 game that's lasted about 300 years (started in 867). We've had 5-9 players and been able to stay at speed 2 nearly all the time with only one session having significant crashed (due to a local file corruption). How many players are you trying that you're stuck on speed 1?

Apparently, too many! Peaked at about fifteen, I think.

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
Yeah it's awful design. KR4 is an absolute masterclass in terrible modding decisions, Apres Moi is the KR we deserve.

One focus tree for all nations, with variants! Same effect as KR but a)far quicker to make b) far easier to balance c) not completely nuts

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Strudel Man posted:

"Everyone has basically the same focus tree" is not a selling point.

Actually it plays a lot better and is particularly good for multiplayer. Feature bloat is no good either.

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

StashAugustine posted:

I'm sure the loss of Victoria's Secret was a huge hit to their finances

Not as huge as the hit to my heart

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
The solution to good AI is

play multiplayer, because humans make the best AIs

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
Also Wiz made a mod (for the LP?) that made it substantially more fun, so if you get it on a sale or something to see what the fuss is about don't even bother playing vanilla.

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
Not to be too brutal but 'someone in another place hosed up our dependencies' is less unusual and more the most normal thing to happen in any kind of development

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

ArchangeI posted:

Depends. How hard do you want your sci-fi?

If there are no Fred Pohl references I swear I will refund

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
Release Victoria IV already

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Radio Free Kobold posted:

when will they announce victoria 3 at PDXcon

Never, there's Stellaris story DLC and for my money something they're just publishing

Good thing though because Victoria II is v bad

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Groogy posted:

I mean we don't really release games in the state of back then anymore.

Counterpoint: Stellaris

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
I too can't wait to destroy Carthage

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Drone posted:

I always get the feeling that Kaiserreich is a good concept executed by a team that couldn't gamedesign their way out of a wet paper bag. c/d?

Because every nation is done by a different person they all end up being power fantasy nonsense with no collective balancing or quality control. Sone focus trees are over in three years, some in twenty. People wander off from the mod and their work is never picked up.

Overheard at the KR stall: 'China is really exciting, we've been working on it for four years now' :psyduck:

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
It'd all be fine if we could spend MP to adjust sliders imo

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
Originally it was a joke but like everything else on the internet it succumbed to irony poisoning

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Kaza42 posted:

It's been said a hundred times before, and I'll keep saying it despite that it's almost certainly a bad idea, but:

give me a game where the interface is your throne room and council halls. Let me interact with the world through in-game maps and reports and issue orders to underlings rather than enforce my magic will upon the world. If you can make this a first/third person game where you can actually walk around and interact with the area around you so much the better but I'll settle for stills and text.

What's that, your messenger didn't make it back with his report of the battle? Guess we don't know who won!

(this is good)

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Ofaloaf posted:

My sideburns are a work of art, don't diss. :colbert:

Wear the hat

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Drone posted:

Paradox just stickied this post on all of the subreddits where they have PDX employees as mods (so for all of their main games except /r/CrusaderKings, which is apparently independent):


It's long loving overdue to be honest. Paradox likes to talk about how they don't tolerate this kind of vitriol or memes on their official forums (for good reason) and seem to think that that's enough, but all too often they're uncomfortably silent on some of the other highly questionable parts of their community (specifically, rampant pandering to fascists in HOI4).

Edit: also apparently there are rumors floating around in those threads about one of the shooters having "kebab removed" etched into his gun. What a truly fantastic community this is, all filled with very fine people.

Edit2: Meneth replied quite quickly about HOI4, which actually surprises me.



Hopefully this means the next PDXCon won't have SS cosplayers, wait who am I kidding

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Koramei posted:

Wait, did the past ones seriously?

To be fair I only saw one last year

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Drone posted:

If this happens, please take photos and forward them to Kotaku/Polygon/Waypoint/whatever.

I love PDX games to death but they are entirely too tolerant of this poo poo.

Yeah tbh I should have done this

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Beamed posted:

Unpopular Opinion Time: The player shouldn't be responsible for micromanaging the armies anyway, those should be a result of your government, your POPs, and your military doctrine. Disloyal generals thus become a huge systemic problem you need to work towards resolving, rather than something you just micro away from being a thing. Don't @ me.

You can only communicate with generals via horse messengers that have to path from your capital to their (last known) location, except there's fog of war and also sometimes your messengers don't make it through which you only realise when your general ignores his orders, except he did get them and is rebelling

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Jeoh posted:

CK3 should span 1936 - 2036

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
A procedurally generated Parliament with a number of parties with different beliefs and goals: you play one politician whose job is to make as much money as possible before the system collapses under the weight of its own corruption and you are guillotined

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

CharlestheHammer posted:

They are streaming the players who have no idea what they are doing thing again and it’s interesting to say the least.

They have no idea how peace mechanics work and there is no one there to give them any help.

This is super mean to the devs, they're not that bad

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
None of these dev videos are as painful as the HOI one where they're trying to roleplay as their nations, primarily through excruciating fake accents

E: and not one USSR player could hold a frontline

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
Victoria III was released ages ago, it's a mod for Stellaris

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Cynic Jester posted:

Prussian Swedish Marines, checks out.

Ask me about culture converting as Sweden in multiplayer in my 'stop invading me or I click this button and become Prussia with Swedish events and modifers' strat

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
Both of you have correctly ended this story, though in the end nobody could take Konigsberg

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.
What everybody loved about Victoria is the jank and the weirdness and the idea that the game is so Byzantine even its developers don't understand it (see the Dominions series, which gets the same effect in each release by just tweaking their ancient spaghetti codebase) but I can't help but feel that 'gently caress it up, but on purpose' is bad advice to give to Paradox

Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

Jeoh posted:

Can't believe they left out March of the Eagles and Victoria's Secret

Victoria's Secret exists in the same weird immortal timewarp that the Civilisation leaders do and is thus bound by no timeline

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Obliterati
Nov 13, 2012

Pain is inevitable.
Suffering is optional.
Thunderdome is forever.

DrSunshine posted:

POPULATION PYRAMIDS.



Instant buy

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