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nonathlon
Jul 9, 2004
And yet, somehow, now it's my fault ...

ultrafilter posted:

Inside the all-hands meeting that led to a third of Basecamp employees quitting

I'm not quoting any of this because you really need to read the whole thing.

Ending with

quote:

Another employee said they had been thrown by the fact that the founders, after years of telling employees that they were part of an elite chosen few who were good enough to work at Basecamp, would get rid of them so easily.

“They just want to build cool poo poo all day,” the employee said. “They don’t want to deal with people, which is something you have to do as a manager … Jason and David just threw us away.”

So much in here. Snowing the employees with how amazing they are until you have to get rid of them. Techbros just wanting to be about the technology. Not wanting to manage. Basecamp / 37Signals being one of those places that was all about breaking the rules and telling everyone else how amazing they were.

Extra layer is that DHH was one of the founding figures in Ruby on Rails, and even then there was this odd thing that he was technically mediocre, but held up as a visionary figure. Which may have played into RoR being so crazily uneven and putting so much stock in how revolutionary it was.

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Krispy Wafer
Jul 26, 2002

I shouted out "Free the exposed 67"
But they stood on my hair and told me I was fat



Grimey Drawer

I like the part where the founders have written 5 books on successfully managing employees. I mean, not their own employees.

Where do you find the time to manage when youíre busy writing books about managing.

Silly Burrito
Nov 26, 2007

Thank you, Drew.


Those who can, do.

Those who can't write many books about how you should do things their way.

Pope Corky the IX
Dec 18, 2006

What are you looking at?

Sort of like Andrew Cuomo writing a book in the middle of the pandemic about how well he handled the pandemic while he was actively hiding reports of hundreds of nursing home deaths.

Stexils
Jun 4, 2008



Silly Burrito posted:

Those who can, do.

Those who can't write many books about how you should do things their way.

the guy who wrote hollywood book "save the cat" about The Rules for screenplays only ever made two terrible films, neither of which you've ever heard of: stop! or my mom will shoot, and blank check

Bloopsy
Jun 1, 2006

you have been visited by the Tasty Garlic Bread. you will be blessed by having good Garlic Bread in your life time, but only if you comment "ty garlic bread" in the thread below

Stexils posted:

the guy who wrote hollywood book "save the cat" about The Rules for screenplays only ever made two terrible films, neither of which you've ever heard of: stop! or my mom will shoot, and blank check

Speak for yourself, pal. Not only have I seen the Estelle Getty vehicle Stop or My Mom Will Shoot as late as last summer, I actually saw Blank Check in the theatre. Masterpieces...both of them!

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007




Grimey Drawer

Bloopsy posted:

Speak for yourself, pal. Not only have I seen the Estelle Getty vehicle Stop or My Mom Will Shoot as late as last summer, I actually saw Blank Check in the theatre. Masterpieces...both of them!

I saw Stop or my mom will shoot in the theaters when I was a kid.

No regrets.

nonathlon
Jul 9, 2004
And yet, somehow, now it's my fault ...

Krispy Wafer posted:

I like the part where the founders have written 5 books on successfully managing employees. I mean, not their own employees.

Where do you find the time to manage when you’re busy writing books about managing.

Or like those CEOs who write books about their business strategy, when actually it's all down to survivorship bias

Krispy Wafer
Jul 26, 2002

I shouted out "Free the exposed 67"
But they stood on my hair and told me I was fat



Grimey Drawer

nonathlon posted:

Or like those CEOs who write books about their business strategy, when actually it's all down to survivorship bias

Most of the time the strategies arenít even that successful long term. Jack Welch was considered a business genius, but GE almost went bankrupt 6 years after he stepped down because his playbook couldnít handle a big economic shock.

FilthyImp
Sep 30, 2002

Nope



nonathlon posted:

Or like those CEOs who write books about their business strategy, when actually it's all down to survivorship bias

Raldikuk
Apr 7, 2006

I'm bad with money and I want that meatball!

Krispy Wafer posted:

Most of the time the strategies aren’t even that successful long term. Jack Welch was considered a business genius, but GE almost went bankrupt 6 years after he stepped down because his playbook couldn’t handle a big economic shock.

And yet he's still held up as a business genius in b school

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.

Stexils posted:

the guy who wrote hollywood book "save the cat" about The Rules for screenplays only ever made two terrible films, neither of which you've ever heard of: stop! or my mom will shoot, and blank check

This is an extreme dunk on 80s kids.

Silly Burrito
Nov 26, 2007

Thank you, Drew.


I worked at a video store (REMEMBER THEM), I have seen my share of lovely movies.

Groovelord Neato
Dec 6, 2014




How the hell do you write five books about management. I figure one with future editions would suffice.

divabot
Jun 17, 2015

Don't bother reading my posts. I'm an idiot shilling an e-book. I literally profit from shitposting.

ultrafilter posted:

https://twitter.com/davidgerard/status/1388554817862348800

This is honestly a pretty good summary of what happened as far as I can tell.



today was the news article where it turned out the "politics" was the alt-right C-level who spammed internal channels with Breitbart and told the black guy in the all-hands meeting NO YOU'RE THE RACIST

and the co-founder backed him

then a third of the company said "gently caress this" and left

owning those libs, it's a calling

Basecamp, formerly 1488Signals

Krispy Wafer
Jul 26, 2002

I shouted out "Free the exposed 67"
But they stood on my hair and told me I was fat



Grimey Drawer

Raldikuk posted:

And yet he's still held up as a business genius in b school

I think his main thing was getting out of any business where GE wasnít number 1 or number 2. So GE divested itself from a ton of stuff like home appliances and NBC.

It works great when your primary products are making tons of money and your secondary products are making tons of money as you sell them off. Not great when the turbine and aircraft engine businesses hit a worldwide recession.

Welchís ideas will make you a millionaire. The key is starting off as a billionaire.

Anora
Feb 15, 2014

I fuckin suck!


Possible incoming circle:

https://twitter.com/laurenthomas/status/1389946008734511108

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007




Grimey Drawer


Iíve mentioned this before but peloton was saved by COVID. They were not doing well before this poo poo started up.

OMGVBFLOL
Dec 20, 2003


MarcusSA posted:

Iíve mentioned this before but peloton was saved by COVID. They were not doing well before this poo poo started up.

yeah this really was the perfect storm for them. millions of office workers working from home

FlamingLiberal
Jan 18, 2009

Would you like to play a game?





MarcusSA posted:

Iíve mentioned this before but peloton was saved by COVID. They were not doing well before this poo poo started up.
No kidding, those things are insanely expensive and they will probably go under again once the average person feels like risking a gym trip

ddiddles
Oct 21, 2008

Roses are red, violets are blue, I'm a schizophrenic and so am I


The only thing I know about peleton is when I see their ad and the lady on their bike screen says "You crushed this Peleton!" and I cant tell if thats the name of the workout, or they call people who buy their poo poo "Pelentons".

Either way I screamed and retreated into the woods.

ReidRansom
Oct 25, 2004





I have a Bike+

I super hosed my ankle up last year in a nasty sprain that still hasn't healed fully almost a year on, so I couldn't go out jogging anymore. The bike is nice.

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007




Grimey Drawer

FlamingLiberal posted:

No kidding, those things are insanely expensive and they will probably go under again once the average person feels like risking a gym trip

Itís not even that the equipment is expensive the ďsubscription feeĒ is nearly what most people fuckin pay for a gym anyway!

5k (or whatever) for the bike and like $50 a month just to use the drat thing.

Duckman2008
Jan 6, 2010

TFW you see Flyers goaltending.

Grimey Drawer

MarcusSA posted:

Itís not even that the equipment is expensive the ďsubscription feeĒ is nearly what most people fuckin pay for a gym anyway!

5k (or whatever) for the bike and like $50 a month just to use the drat thing.

Iím a wimpy dude (hence why I post here) and I signed up for Appleís fitness thing. I actually use it, I can see home fitness having a second big thing (I assume Richard simmonds was the first wave).

That said, Apple fitness is , at most $10 a month.

Pelotonís prices are def insane for what is I guess a good work at home coach product , but yeah itís pretty expensive.

Haifisch
Nov 12, 2010

Objection! I object! That was... objectionable!



Taco Defender

Looking into it, the Peloton site really wants you to think that the membership is required to use the bike at all(and you are required to have one when you buy it, though you can (supposedly) cancel at any time), but you can use your bike just fine without it:

https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/peloton-review-what-to-know-before-you-buy/ posted:

Many people, however, are likely to be turned off by the Peloton Bikeís significant up-front cost and ongoing expense. Once you purchase the Bike itself, you need to keep paying a $39 monthly subscription fee, or youíre left with just three classes and a free-ride mode that displays only real-time data on the screen, with no leaderboard-inspired competition or any record of your efforts.
Of course, at that point you might as well buy a cheaper bike that isn't all-in on being ~connected~. Play exercise videos on your own device if you really miss that aspect. (and it'd probably pay off since you're not suspectible to stuff like, say, having to buy new screens when Peloton decides you have to)

Haifisch has a new favorite as of 01:32 on May 6, 2021

WithoutTheFezOn
Aug 28, 2005
Oh no

MarcusSA posted:

5k (or whatever) for the bike and like $50 a month just to use the drat thing.
The bikes are $1895 and thereís a lower app sub that lets you do everything but a couple things (like let a live trainer change your bike's resistance) for $13/mo. The regular sub is $40/mo, and itís a family sub.

Still pretty expensive, but youíre exaggerating just a wee bit.

Biplane
Jul 18, 2005



WithoutTheFezOn posted:

The bikes are $1895 and there’s a lower app sub that lets you do everything but a couple things (like let a live trainer change your bike's resistance) for $13/mo. The regular sub is $40/mo, and it’s a family sub.

Still pretty expensive, but you’re exaggerating just a wee bit.

thank god you're here to set the record straight

Turbinosamente
May 29, 2013

Lightning!


Home fitness must be having a wave again covid related or not, because I keep seeing ads for this kinda creepy home gym mirror that reminds me of 1984.

UCS Hellmaker
Mar 29, 2008

mega. milk.

Toilet Rascal

Krispy Wafer posted:

I think his main thing was getting out of any business where GE wasn’t number 1 or number 2. So GE divested itself from a ton of stuff like home appliances and NBC.

It works great when your primary products are making tons of money and your secondary products are making tons of money as you sell them off. Not great when the turbine and aircraft engine businesses hit a worldwide recession.

Welch’s ideas will make you a millionaire. The key is starting off as a billionaire.

Actually turbine and aircraft stuff was more one of the people in charge making billions of dollars of extra product wanting to make it appear the company was making tons of money and anticipation of new markets that didn't exist. He was in the running for ceo of ge and basically wanted power to appear to be in great shape.

There's a reason why suddenly at the tail end of 2017 ge took a massive nose dive, and the entirety of power management was laid off or fired.

Stexils
Jun 4, 2008



Turbinosamente posted:

Home fitness must be having a wave again covid related or not, because I keep seeing ads for this kinda creepy home gym mirror that reminds me of 1984.

you're imagining things.

MarcusSA
Sep 23, 2007




Grimey Drawer

WithoutTheFezOn posted:

The bikes are $1895 and thereís a lower app sub that lets you do everything but a couple things (like let a live trainer change your bike's resistance) for $13/mo. The regular sub is $40/mo, and itís a family sub.

Still pretty expensive, but youíre exaggerating just a wee bit.

Ok yeah Iíll take the hit on the bike price but! I know at least 5 people with one of of them and they all pay the $40 and I kinda doubt they even know about that $13 price.

Silly Burrito
Nov 26, 2007

Thank you, Drew.


Haifisch posted:

Looking into it, the Peloton site really wants you to think that the membership is required to use the bike at all(and you are required to have one when you buy it, though you can (supposedly) cancel at any time), but you can use your bike just fine without it:

Of course, at that point you might as well buy a cheaper bike that isn't all-in on being ~connected~. Play exercise videos on your own device if you really miss that aspect. (and it'd probably pay off since you're not suspectible to stuff like, say, having to buy new screens when Peloton decides you have to)

Exercise bike - $200
iPad - $329
Duct Tape - $5

I think I have a new idea for a product!

Phy
Jun 27, 2008





Fun Shoe

in the vein of goods-as-a-service/internet of things tomfuckery, this made it into Cycle Asylum earlier this week:



https://jalopnik.com/this-dystopian-biker-airbag-crash-vest-only-saves-your-1846823791

It's an airbag vest for motorcyclists. You can pay $12/mo or $120/year (or a $400 one-time fee) to activate it, and if you forget to, or your cell service is poo poo, or you forget to charge it, uh, oops, guess it doesn't airbag when you need it

This is on top of $400 for the equipment alone.

Or, you can buy a vest from a different company that costs $650 and just activates by a tether to your bike! It won't help so much if you go down and slide next to the bike, but if that happens there's a good chance you wouldn't have needed the airbag, and the company can't revoke a tether.

(I guess this isn't really a "companies circling the drain" event, because Klim aren't going anywhere any time soon. They make decent if expensive motorcycle gear otherwise, especially for the BMW and KTM-riding "adventure bike" set, it's just, this is bullshit)

Raldikuk
Apr 7, 2006

I'm bad with money and I want that meatball!

UCS Hellmaker posted:

Actually turbine and aircraft stuff was more one of the people in charge making billions of dollars of extra product wanting to make it appear the company was making tons of money and anticipation of new markets that didn't exist. He was in the running for ceo of ge and basically wanted power to appear to be in great shape.

There's a reason why suddenly at the tail end of 2017 ge took a massive nose dive, and the entirety of power management was laid off or fired.

The GE Capital shenanigans also doesn't help... really they've been a complete disaster and are a great example of why a lot of modern business ideas are dogshit. I don't see much admission of that in the business literature though.

Krispy Wafer
Jul 26, 2002

I shouted out "Free the exposed 67"
But they stood on my hair and told me I was fat



Grimey Drawer

Peloton has other exercise stuff like yoga also. Itís not all exercise bikes. No, I donít have one. My sister tried to get me to use her account for yoga, but if Iím going to slack off and not exercise, Iíll do it with the Fitness+ account Iím already paying for.

Franco Caution
Jul 18, 2003

Wicked. Tricksy. False.

WithoutTheFezOn posted:


Still pretty expensive, but you’re exaggerating just a wee bit.


One of the treadmills on their page that is/was capable of eating a small child shows the following:


"Starting at $4,295"

I'm sure they make a cheaper bike, but that's the exception not the rule. They mostly make extremely overpriced poo poo, and took way too long admitting that their equipment can gobble up small animals and children.

Ugly In The Morning
Jul 1, 2010

So pat yourself on the back and give yourself a handshake
'Cause everything is not yet lost




Pillbug

My boss at my last job had three peloton bikes, one for him at home, one for his wife at home, and one for wherever he was staying for work. It was possibly the most extra thing Iíve ever heard of. I donít usually describe things as ďextraĒ but itís the only thing I can think of that even comes close to describing what was going on.

Mustached Demon
Nov 12, 2016



Pretty sure you can get an exercise bike for like $50 or even free at a garage sale or something.

SimonChris
Apr 24, 2008

The Baron's daughter is missing, and you are the man to find her. No problem. With your inexhaustible arsenal of hard-boiled similes, there is nothing you can't handle.

Grimey Drawer

FlamingLiberal posted:

No kidding, those things are insanely expensive and they will probably go under again once the average person feels like risking a gym trip

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/peloton-ceo-says-sales-increased-raised-prices-2245-exercise-bike-132256225.html

The funny thing is that they tried to sell the bike cheaper, but it turns out that people assume expensive exercise equipment must be higher quality.

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Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.

Before the pandemic you could get some resistance pedals for under your desk from Amazon for like $18 (around $40 now).

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