Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
shs
Feb 14, 2012
I'm sure a few people were upset because everything wasn't perfect on the first try, but that's why I'm doing a test build not going straight to release, so we can fix things :)

I uploaded Build b33. Changes include

Card draw animations can be skipped.
The very start of the game has been changed. You no longer open a booster pack. Instead there's some more help and some cards are casually inserted into your inventory. Hopefully it's better and not worse.

If you've already started and want to restart, you can delete your save by going to "Save data manager" in the upper right corner of the title screen.

DivineCoffeeBinge posted:

No idea what is going on here. Make a chain of cards between the foundation and the hero - okay, cool, but how do the cards' walls of text that haven't been explained to me affect the hero's stats, none of hich have been explained to me? Are these card upgrades even doing anything? If I draw some cards that have arrows that go off to the side so I can fit in more cards is that even having an effect? Anything? Beuller?

All card stats are added together and passed down the chain to your hero card, who uses them to fight.

Card upgrades make the card stats a little stronger.

If you're talking about Support and Monster cards, just plopping them down won't do anything. You need to make sure they're connected to your chain. That usually means removing an old card. For item cards (3 directional arrow), they're placed beside your chain, and their arrows need to point to a Support or Monster card that has their same stat.

Every stat and every mechanic is explained in the Help -> Gameplay Advice & Stat Overview menu. If you don't like reading, you're probably not going to like me or anything I make.


habituallyred posted:

The initial spread takes too long. The dropdown thing at the top of the page prevents me from seeing the entire playing area. Only drew a single left facing card, could not make anything but a straight line. I'll try again in a week, seems interesting but a little bit too complex. Have you considered having a front of card high level summary, with the back of the card having all the nitty gritty?

I'm not sure which down thing you're talking about. If you mean the Battle Status window or the small stat summary window, those can be dragged around.

The first set of cards having only up arrows is intended. I figured making the first stat chain as easy as possible to complete would make the game easier to handle. It's something that can be changed, however. Of course, the first 4 cards you draw after your initial set are guaranteed to have left and right arrows.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

shs
Feb 14, 2012
I was in such a rush to update the game last night that I didn't properly test the new game help boxes. If you play the current build b35, the game shouldn't get stuck anywhere. If it does, feel free to complain at me.

If you have issues updating or loading the page, you'll need to clear your cache.

same link as before

If anyone feels brave enough to restart, I added some a lot more guidance at the beginning. Some other little things were changed as well.

pixaal posted:

I'm going to open and say I really enjoy the core gameplay so far. There's a ton of tutorial issues and some UI stuff that's going to hold you back, but that's why you asked for play testing. Honestly you have the right info it's just being shown at the wrong time or too much at once. It's long, but that's because I like to explain why and suggest improvements.

You wrote a lot of words, and I appreciate that.

When you say the game advice is way too big, do you mean that large page with all the images? I can attempt to cut it into multi parts if it's an issue.

I've already changed the item card arrows to blue. Hopefully that will make it clear that they work slightly differently than the other cards.

If you go to Grid View then Stat Chain Arrow (Toggle), you can view all the chain arrows or all the chain stats (or arrows and stats together). Having the arrows on by default isn't something I thought about before, but I'll probably make that change.

I'll probably add something like what Rimworld has, where there's some little snippets of help in the upper right corner (or some other corner) of the screen.

For the resolution / window issues, the host I'm using (Wix) is being colossal poo poo and not letting me put the game's cloudfront url directly into an iframe (the game files are hosted on Amazon), so I had to do some weird gimmicky things to make it work. Ideally I'll find a way to fix that.

The card game from Final Fantasy 9 wasn't my main influence, but I did borrow some ideas from it.

KazigluBey posted:

The problem is that everything else feels like I'm deep-diving into a mobile card/gatcha game that has been active for a year or more.

I built the core of the game in 4 weeks, then spent another 4 weeks balancing it. If it feels like it's been active for more than a year, I consider that an accomplishment.

I might not respond, but I read everything that everyone writes. I plan to make some more updates before the game is released. Your suffering will not be in vain.

shs
Feb 14, 2012

pixaal posted:

Wix is a terrible platform. They use a ton of scripts to make the page even render. They don't like it when you use something that isn't from their site builder tools. I'd seriously avoid them, why not host on Armor or Kong, which wont charge you a hosting fee and get you more players? Most people are going to find the game searching a game site not google or finding it from reddit or this thread. Look at how much larger NGU Realm Grinder and Trimps are than say Cookie Clicker which has it's own site.

Falcon2001 posted:

Alternately aren't a lot of folks hosting on github.io? Not sure if it works for the more graphical ones or not because I'm not a dev.

I plan to put the game on Kongregate once the start of the game has been smoothed out, and some other little things have been fixed. People on that website tend to expect a game to be release ready or close to it (even if it's in beta) and don't take kindly to imperfections. If you get a poor rating then you're basically stuffed into a dark hole in the ground and left to die and there's zero way to recover.

The game will also be on Steam 2 or 3 months after the web release. I actually have the Steam api 100% integrated and do all of my testing with that version, but expectations are even higher over there. I also need to make a trailer for a primarily menu based game which I'm not looking forward to.

People also get burned out easily by rough versions of games, so for now I'm trying to limit how many people are exposed to it.


pixaal posted:

So if a card has Link Boost and the card after it has the same stat in the top section the link boost is added to it (I think) you should show a +x in red link boost color on the card if it got one. (Is link boost added to other link boosts if you chain the same link boost?) If you hit the NULL boost it should put a strike through that entire line. This is something that can be pushed until a later test but it really should be in before launch. It would make the game so much less confusing if the card showed the stats it's actually contributing to the chain when you click it. The final link should have a summary of every stat that reached the end so you have an easy comparison. If this is burred in a menu someplace it should be front and center as well. The "Grid view" seems to be able to do this but that is never given to the player and it's only 1 stat at a time. I don't think I'd ever focus solely on a single stat, it's way too many clicks to go through all of them. It seems more like a debug feature than an actual in game feature that you are going to use all the time.

If a card has a 20% attack link boost, and the next card in the chain has 10 attack, then you'll end up gaining 12 attack. If you have a link null attack instead, then that 10 attack will be ignored. You can see the stat values with Grid View then Attack Chain (replace attack with the stat in question).

Adding a visual is a good idea. I'll probably put a green arrow (boost), a gray arrow (nothing) or a red arrow (null) in between the cards.

The experience menu can probably be improved. Something like, "You'll gain 125 rank experience (56%)"

Increasing a card's rank gives it a big stat boost, and it also means that all newly drawn cards can appear at that rank. I usually wait until I have a full grid, then fuse everything into my Hero or Foundation card until I get a rank increase.

shs
Feb 14, 2012
New build b36 is available (as of ~10 hours ago). Some changes:

The great text leviathan has been slain, its carcass divided into multiple menus
Battle grid arrows are on by default and are color coded to signify a neutral/boosted/null/item card link. If you're color blind... well, sorry.
An advice window will sometimes appear along the bottom of the screen. Most of the advice comes from the help section. A few have links that open the help section.
Popups at the start of the game are less intrusive.

the link




Toshimo posted:

SHS: This is sort of a core example problem I've had with this games (and your other games) that really separates it from what I consider to be a "complete" game.

I changed the faction menu layout.

I don't really how the Region Select menu is setup. If you want to help fix that one as well, I can probably find a way to make it worth your time later :wink:


pixaal posted:

EF Beta

I'm really starting to get how things interact and how addictive combining cards is going to be. It's really hard to find menus though, any chance you could make it so you can click the token counts in the top and get a drop down of every menu that you spend them in? Some are going to require a card and probably not be possible to directly link to.

There is a lot going on. Some way to easily estimate DPS would be lovely in one of the stat panels (maybe I missed it). There is a lot to unpack with how stats work to make an optimal strategy I'm going to dig into that more. The depth is a very good thing.

Drawing lots of cards is really slow, when you open a pack it should reveal all 9 cards and you can hover over them like the card inventory screen. I woke up to a pile of draw coins and a massively reduced cost and it took a long time to open them all. You are going to live and die by how good your filters are and how easy it is to quickly find good cards and process "bad cards" out.

When placing cards early on I really want a filter for "main unit" (Human / monster) and "buff" (everything else) since I normally just need something that goes left, or something that will buff left maybe filtering for a specific stat. I think each buff has it's own stat groups which is good, but it's a bit of a guess.

I think an optimal strategy might be Human > Monster > Human > Monster ... since Monsters get double stats according to some screen, I kind of wantt to get a bunch of monsters with crit and attack and humans with crit / attack boost and chain that for massive damage. Of course the buff cards add to wanting a block of 3 cards that all benefit from the buff. Optimal layout will

I can add something like: if you click on one of the currencies at the top of the screen, the new advice box will appear and list how to earn that currency and where it's spent. And/or a red exclamation mark is temporary added to the specific menus.

A dps estimate might happen but that's pretty difficult. The best you can do right now is to open the small stat summary panel and move it to the side of the screen.

A Support&Monster filter is something I've been meaning to add. Expect that to appear soon.

Strategy wise, I usually try to have setups like this:

1. A support card with some link boost, let's say attack
2. A monster card with attack, ideally boosted by an item card with attack
3. A support card that isn't effected by the monster card's null
4. A monster that benefits from card 3's link boost, also receives an item boost if possible
Repeat

Of course that requires a lot of very specific cards.

shs
Feb 14, 2012

pixaal posted:

EF Beta
When switching regions save the set to "last used" or some other meta card save then load it if you switch back to that region. I did a test and loading card set 1 in Region 2 tells me I don't have a saved set, switching back to Region 1 gives me a blank grid. Pressing load Set 1 gives me what I had saved there. I did save region 2 to slot 2.
Do you get 4 slots per region, or 4 slots to divide between 1 and 4 regions in?

The grid getting larger in the second region was not expected, it's interesting and you can do a ton with that such as holiday events or whatever with a unique layout.

The rank points are once per region ever right? If they have unique layouts unless it loops into +1 when it gets to the end I'm worried that it's possible to really gently caress them up and a reset button might be useful. You don't want people paralyzed over spending a limited currency so they just hold on to it. It's something to keep in mind it's fine in the short term and since beta isn't going to carry over not a rush.

Cards seem like a major limiting factor of progress, it basically boils down to buy the packs once a day, then build up tokens for tomorrow. I feel very little progress doing 1h runs outside of farming combat tokens (yellow), which are very powerful, the upgrades are region locked which balances that out.
Fixing that
Card Parts: When you start a new run have some threshold that gives "card parts" they might just be an arrow, or a faction. The idea is to let you customize cards more easily. Runs are already limited to at least 1h, and there should be a reward for selecting 8 1h runs over a single 8h run that also gets buffs. Bless is nice but it's hard to accumulate at first and doesn't feel rewarding to spend.

It really boils down to the currency feels like spending XP in many idle games, not the fun part. There's a dozen currencies that each increase power in their own way. The only thing that really requires the player to do something is placing cards, which is going to be once a day due to how pack cost scales.

I'm not sure about your first issue. The saved card configurations are unique to each region, so slot 1 in the first region will have zero bearing on slot 1 in the second region. Is something else happening?

I put a note in the new region confirmation box that reminds you to save and clarifies some things.

I actually built an option to reset rank points, but hid it so I could fit more upgrades into the menu. You get so many points (especially after starting a new region) that a reset didn't feel necessary. Points actually start to feel trivial after awhile, plus there's not really any "trap" stats. But I can enable the reset option again if that's something people want.

The progress thing is going to be a difficult issue. I strongly prefer games that are really idle and only need to be checked every few hours (notice how strong the idle mode bonuses are), so that's what I built. I'm expecting people who want constant action to be let down.


Dr. Arbitrary posted:

To build on this, when the card stat window pops up, I want to be able to click anywhere on the window to dismiss it and go to the next card, not just on the tiny x.

You can press escape to close the card window (and nearly every other window). It's not as convenient as the right click to close from that other game, but it's okay.

The most recent version is build b38. A lot of little changes, including the shift animation skip being a toggle, are included.

shs
Feb 14, 2012

pixaal posted:

My comments on progress was the first few days not overall. There is a limited market for an idle game that is very active long term but you need a hook early on. The current feel of update cards once a day and check in 3 times a day feels really good for the long term. Something active that becomes obsolete after a week or so and is ignorable. It just has to feel like it does
When I start a new idle game I usually do so because I have time, and I want to spend a solid 4+ hours playing it. You currently have that but only due to learning curve. If you say read a quick start guide it could be reduced to an hour, when you are done with the first run.

Some things I've been considering adding are

1. When you change regions, you receive a number of free card draws. It might be a flat value, or perhaps something like your selected idle mode multiplied by bosses killed, or the number of hours active in the last region.
2. When you change regions, the card draw counter (the value that causes the cost of draws to increase) gets reduced by some amount. Either a flat value or calculated using your idle mode / bosses killed / hours active / some other value.

So the daily reset will still be your biggest source of cards, but there'd be some small bumps throughout the day.

shs
Feb 14, 2012

something posted:

I have no idea what's gonna happen with Steam (I'm trying to expect the worst but prepare for the best), but it does have me excited!

The big thing with steam is, once you have your store page setup, you can make it visible to the world. While it's visible, people can add the game to their wishlists. How many wishlists you have has a major impact on how much visibility you're given at release. Making your store page visible requires only some capsule images, a few screenshots, a trailer, and some basic information. No game build is needed. Unless you're planning to replace/revamp your art, you should setup your store page as quickly as you reasonably can, then tell your army of followers to add the game to their wishlists.

shs
Feb 14, 2012

something posted:

That is some really useful advice, thanks!

Open Question: Do you think a trailer with audio is really necessary for an idle game? I feel like any choice of music in a trailer for an idle game is just gonna come of as really cheesy.

You could probably get by without sound effects, but I wouldn't skip music. Lots of people flip through their Steam queue and look at something for all of 5 to 10 seconds before moving on. Music gives you another way to grab their attention, and no music might leave a bad impression. If your trailer is standard trailer length (30 to 60 seconds), you can get some really decent quality custom made music for $250 to $500.

shs
Feb 14, 2012

something posted:

Eh, in that case I should just stop being so cheap and just get someone half decent to do up a whole trailer altogether. Wouldn't happen to know what kind of cost that would be?

I've never actually paid someone to make a trailer for me. The few times I made one I recorded and edited the video myself then added some music onto it, which is a thing you can do, but it's not ideal. If you wanted someone who's competent at trailer making but not a celebrity, my rough guess would be $1000 to $3000.

shs
Feb 14, 2012

pixaal posted:

Recently a goon posted EFUniverse Beta (save wont carry to live) which uses cards in a grid that buff each other. It plays very much like Reactor / Factory.

On that note, either tomorrow or Monday I'm going to ask the people at Kongregate if I can put the game in their beta program. They're generally agreeable, so there shouldn't be any issues. Unless there's some critical flaw I overlooked or my artist falls behind, I probably won't leave it in beta for more than a week or so. So the official web release should happen in about two weeks.

shs
Feb 14, 2012

The filters should already work like you describe. By default cards are sorted by rank. If you select attack, cards are instead sorted by their attack value. The sorting uses their base stat value (the one in gray, which is the value without any upgrades or tile boosts). Same for compound stats. Using them both together works but the results might not be ideal, since sorting with multiple variables is not a clear cut task.

A separate "sort by specific value" option (which would include link boosts and upgrade/experience scale) is something that can easily be added. Same for a mass card sacrifice and a favorite option. The only real issue is finding space on the menu.

Every region unlock is simply "get to a higher rank in the most recently unlocked region". I'll probably put a note in the help section. I believe the third region requires clearing rank efu- in the second region.

Date found is not that difficult to add, but save data size is a nontrivial issue and date found uses a sizable amount of data while having no impact on your stats. It's something to consider.

"Junk card" seems like it's largely in the eye of the beholder and I don't know how I can legislate that, other than improving the filters.

Card overwrite works that way because your source card get destroyed, and if you can use cards from your chain, someone will eventually destroy their ability to complete a chain. I could put a warning up that says "pressing this button will destroy your ability to play the game, solve this 25 step math equation to continue" and someone will solve the equation, press the button, destroy their game and then yell at me afterwards. That's something I never want to put up with, even if it means overwrite is kind of tedious to use. There is some leeway for stats and factions, but the direction arrow overwrite has to stay how it is.

I don't think I'm moving fast. All of this stuff I've listed takes 2 to 4 hours to add. A planning mode is the only difficult thing. I don't know if that will happen. If it's any consolation, all of your buffs and enhancement timers are paused when you don't have a complete chain.

With regards to the dreaded m word money, things get weird when that subject comes up so prefer to avoid it. But there are some items in the game already. Some are one time purchases that give you a permanent boost, while others are 24 hour temporary boosts. I'm very not a fan of locking convenience/qol features behind money.

shs
Feb 14, 2012

Len posted:

Finally getting around to trying that game shs has been posting. I'm apparently too stupid to figure out how to rank up cards so I have a bunch of level 1 stuff with no idea how to make them better.

Also I've had the tab open for almost 24 hours and it is not a smooth experience anymore everything has noticeable lag

The best cards to rank up are your foundation and hero cards. You can either

Click the card on your battle grid -> Adv. Card Stats -> Card Fusion - > select all the cards to fuse

or

Cards -> card inventory -> click on the card you want to rank up -> Card Fusion -> select cards

It takes around 40 cards to go from rank 1 to 2, but once you get there, all cards drawn have the potential to be rank 2. There's a stat enhancement you can use that temporarily increases how much experience you earn from fusions.

Performance issues are difficult. If your browser has a hardware acceleration option, that should be enabled. This is also one of those games that requires you to leave it focused or drag it into it's own window. If you're leaving it in an unfocused tab, that might cause issues. Other than that... I'm not sure. The best you can probably do is save and reload the game every once in awhile.

shs
Feb 14, 2012
new efurtw build b42

Some changes:

You can tag cards as "Favorite" or "Scrap". The option appears when you draw a new card and in the card inventory.
If a card is used anywhere in a set, there will be an indicator.
(The icons are the very tiny star shapes in the upper left corner of the card, directly below the rank text/icon. The yellow star means favorite, the red star means scrap, the gray star means the card is used in a set (this is listed in the help section is miscellaneous))
New sorting method in the inventory
Card overwrite is less restrictive
In the card sacrifice menu, there's an option to sacrifice all cards that are inactive and tagged as scrap.

All the features you wanted and some you didn't know you wanted.

shs
Feb 14, 2012

cyrn posted:

EF: shs I really love the mechanics and ideas behind your games but actually playing them is extremely painful due to awful UI design. This whole combo boxes opening modal popups UI design pattern is just cancer.


If you have a specific thing that you think can be done better, you're free to mention it. I'm sure you've noticed that I tend to update things rapidly, sometimes the same day someone brings it up. There's a few things in your post I can work with, but the "I hate everything, everything is cancer, my life is terrible" stuff is really unneeded and makes me not want to read anything you type.


Len posted:

Why are those options blacked out and unclickable?

It's been said already, but some options like sacrifice, fusion, and card overwrite are disabled if you don't have an active chain, and sacrifice can only be used on inactive cards. If I let them be used freely someone is going to play the game while drunk / high / dumb, destroy all of their cards, then blame me for not stopping them, and that's not something I'm ever going to put up with.


Toshimo posted:

Did we get confirmation on this?

Also, make a discord.

The wording on your question confused me at first. Upgrade and Experience scales don't ever change. Link Boost can be made stronger with imbues/ranking up, but the internal base value will never change. So if you're trying to create the ultimate card, you'll probably want focus on drawing a card with good scales and a good boost, then pull the stats from some other card.

Discord is something I've thought of, but having a direct connection to the ids of dozens or hundreds of random internet goers is really straining, even if they're trying to help.


I'm thinking of changing the left menu slightly. It might look something like this:



Of course the whole thing won't be unlocked at first. You'll start with a few options then work for the rest.

shs
Feb 14, 2012
For the card overwriting stats, I'll most likely increase the magic token cost and let you pick the stat that's overwritten. I don't use that feature as much as other seem to people so I never really put much thought into it.

Toshimo posted:

EF:

Also, items have Experience and upgrade scales, but (a) they don't seem to be upgradable, and (b) Eeven though they gain combat levels, that doesn't seem to actually do anything.

Item cards don't benefit from combat levels, but their combat levels are converted into combat tokens when you start a new region, so there's that. Upgrade scale on item cards is a relic from the past that doesn't do anything now and it'll be hidden in the future.

pixaal posted:

edit: I just got my first rank 2 card. Holy poo poo they are way better when drawn, like 17 attack to 50 attack, and it's for every loving stat. So I guess I now have 10 Rank 2 cards. That is not made clear at ALL in game. Sacrifice seems like a much better route to power. For the love of god leave sacrifice locked until you get a rank 2 card.

Card rank serves as a stat multiplier (between 10% and 100% depending on the stat, and that's per rank), and sacrifice bonuses are a stat multiplier as well (also between 10% and 100%, per level), and the multipliers from each one multiply into each other :eng101:

Don't forget

quote:

Always be drawing cards. You always need more cards. It's impossible to have enough cards. Draw more cards.

shs
Feb 14, 2012

something posted:

Hey shs, I just wanna chime and say that, at least from my experience, when goons are being really critical of your work in the way these guys have, it's cause they like it and just want to help identify roadblocks to making your game really shine. I personally really struggle with taking that kind of criticism to heart, but know that ultimately folks here only want to help, and aren't just trying poo poo on a person's work. It's worth sitting back and examining the content of their criticisms one at a time as just a design challenge to overcome, and not get overwhelmed by negativity.

Wishing you all the success on your Kong release buddy :unsmith:

Sorry, it's just that I've been working in creative fields my entire life, and I have no patient for people who can't tell the difference between criticism and complaining. Criticism requires identifying issues and finding solutions. Posts from people like pixaal are really good and useful and I wish there was more of those. But posts like those require a lot of effort. Conversely, complaining is easy. While complaining can help identify an issue, it does nothing to solve it, which why I get irritated by "it's cancer I hate it" posts.


cyrn posted:

I'm not just making GBS threads on your game for fun, NGU's UI was in a far less polished but far more usable state when something originally posted it here and he spent a lot of his effort in his months of beta working on UI stuff we complained about, and pixaal and I both complained a lot.

Your other post contained a lot complaining and wasn't really useful at all. This posts points out a lot of specific issues and suggests ways to fix them and is much more helpful. I'm sure you can tell the difference between "What does a World menu even mean?" and "I want the currency spending screens to remain in sync with the currency I've earned while the screen is open". The first is mostly noise, while the second is something I can implement into the game (it'll actually be in the next build).

If you ever any solutions to any issues you might've encountered in the game, feel free to hit me with them, but if your response to "what would you do differently?" is to shrug then you shouldn't be surprised when nothing improves. Those Kongregate comments contain a lot of people saying "I hate it", but not too many people saying "I don't like this specific element, maybe you should try this idea I had/try this thing that this other game did/look at this mspaint example I drew."

Toshimo posted:

more slots

That probably can't happen, unfortunately, or if it does it won't be more than another 16 slots. All the card data requires a lot of space to store and if I go over a certain size then saving (both locally and online) will break.


Unrelated to all of that, I know a lot of people want a planning mode, but that's really difficult to implement, and I'm not actually sure how I can do it without creating a second instance of the battle grid that runs alongside the first. As a stopgap, I can put in something similar to offline progress. So when your chain becomes you complete, you'll see a message like "while your characters were idle, they found <some amount of resources>".

shs
Feb 14, 2012
Sometimes when you point out an issue, the developer/author/director/whoever can come up with ways to fix it on their own. Other times, they're not able to find a solution on their own and they need input from others to solve the problem (or others are able to come up with better solutions since they're looking at things from a different perspective and have different backgrounds). When it comes to UI layout, I'm usually in the second category.

Eldercain posted:

I have to echo that it's really overwhelming to start.

I'm actually reworking the start of the game right now. In the future (probably tomorrow afternoon), some of the currencies as well as scales/compound stat/faction information will be hidden at the start, the left menu buttons will have a different format, and features will unlock 1 or 2 at a time.

Toshimo posted:

What's the design motivation behind having only negative squares on the board?

I'm not sure what you mean by negative squares. Do you mean the plain tiles (as opposed tiles that require a specific card type)? The first three regions are mostly plains tiles, because I wanted them to be easy to setup. Later regions will have more tiles with specific requirements.

shs
Feb 14, 2012
If I make ngu dollars, hiring professionals is something consider. Until then, I have to get by with the scraps I've been given.

I'm sure all of my posts sound like whining and complaining, but the issue is that it's almost completely impossible for me to visualize anything in my head (aphantasia hype?). You can spend the rest of your life telling me how terrible the UI (or any other visual aspect in the game) is, but unless you name a specific element, I won't have any idea what you're talking about. And even if you do specify an element, I still probably won't know what you're talking about or what you expect me to do. You're basically telling someone who's blind to open their eyes and start seeing things. I can visualize functionality, but not much else.


Toshimo posted:

Oh, also, I ran into an issue where I tried to overwrite a stat to upgrade a card, but the card I was pulling the stat from was rank 2 and the card I was putting it on was rank 1, so although the stat was higher on the card I was taking it from, it wound up being lower after it transferred.

I thought having tiles that forced you to use a specific card type might be an interesting challenge. If people find it tedious or cumbersome, I can remove it or cut back.

Card ranks act as multipliers. If you take an attack +10 stat from a rank 1 card and move it to a rank 2, it'll become +20 attack. That's probably something I should clarify.

edit because I'm not interesting in making another post

New build b43. Among other things, the left menu is different. Start of the game is different; new things unlock when killing a champion monster. If you use an old save, expect a lot of alerts. That'll only happen once. There's an option to reset in the upper right corner of the title screen. I'd like to think nothing is broken, but I did rush a bit.

shs fucked around with this message at 14:08 on Jan 19, 2019

shs
Feb 14, 2012

Toshimo posted:

@shs: Are the EFU+ rank bosses supposed to be unbeatable walls? After 1-shotting my way through all the ranks, I hit these guys and after I push my def/hp enough to not get 1-shot, I was dismayed to find I only hit them for 0-1% damage and now I'm locked in farm mode for the next 7+ hours.

Edit: It's not quite as bad as I thought. I'm able to do almost 10% damage to it now before it kills me, it was just a weird step up.

Also edit: Grid view is missing "Magic Tokens" and I opened a hero card in a pack and it offered me the option to pay tokens to increase its "Upgrade Scale" which heros don't appear to have.

The efu+ bosses all mark huge steps up in difficulty, but you'll eventually grind them down then get a bunch of easy rank points.

I just uploaded a new version (b46) that fixes the magic token and scale issues and has some other little adjustments.

shs
Feb 14, 2012
You can use the green arrows icon to drag the window to a different position. Same for the battle status window and the (new) combat log.

shs
Feb 14, 2012

The Ninth Layer posted:

I don't have a button for boss token upgrades on the advanced card screen, maybe I haven't unlocked it yet though (I only just recently unlocked the tokens at the top of the screen, and since then I started an 8 hour run in the first zone so I can't go back to check if it's a later unlock for a while). I'm guessing it'll show up under card fusion and sacrifice when it does unlock, I just figured it was a feature that came with the token unlocks but couldn't find it.

There's a typo that's stopping the boss token option in advanced stats from appearing. I'll upload a new fixed version soon.

For your other other post, stats are already sort of sorted. It goes by regular stat -> compound stat that benefits it (if one exists). And there is a loose order to the stats (basic combat, tokens, experience, complex combat, factions). I'm not sure what other order they can be put in.

I could put some icons on the cards the signifies certain stats. They'd probably be under the rank icon or under the card type icon. My concern is that the icons will clutter things up, or be too small to see, or give people even more things to remember.

Rank is the biggest indicator of a card's quality. Higher is just about always stronger. You can also go to the card inventory, select Core Stat Mode from the Alt Sorting filter, then look at the tier values for each card's stats (or select a specific stat to sort them by). Tier 10 is the highest. Of course when you do this you'll realize that happiness is impossible to obtain.

New feature unlock order is still subject to change. People like to clamor over sacrifice, but rank gives you a similar stat increase, and reaching a new high rank means every card you draw can appear at that new high rank.

Toshimo posted:

@shs:
  • Please cut out the excess whitespace on the "Battle Status" box so we can fit that and the new stat window on-screen without overlaps.
  • I see references to "Region level" and "Region XP" a lot of places, but I don't see the actual region level anywhere.
  • Time Rewards don't appear to be functional. I've had the game running almost 24/7 for a week and still don't have the "1 day played" award.
  • Any hint for Imperium of cards would be nice. I'm about to hit the EFU+ wall on the 3rd region and I still don't know what this is.
  • I don't understand the requirements for "Enhancer" rewards. I do stat enhancement frequently, but I only have the first 3 rewards.
  • Previously, certain items boosted Heroes/Foundations (or at least the arrows said they did). That doesn't appear to be the case anymore. Is that intended?
  • My Hero/Foundation stats keep reordering themselves every time I do an overwrite.
  • Diamonds don't seem to have a use (or are tracked)?
  • I can't login to Cloud save?

The window is something I plan to adjust.
Region levels are in the region select menu. It's the pink text.
Having you been gaining offline progress? The time rewards are checked alongside your offline progress (and only when you first login), which requires a stable internet connection.
Imperium requires you to get a card to rank 4
The stat enhancements can all be leveled up. When they reach a new level, that's when you get the enhancer rewards.
Item cards never worked on foundation or hero cards, the arrows going to them was a display issue.
Emerald information is hidden for now.
There's something weird happening with the login password field. I'll upload a small update soon that should fix it.

shs
Feb 14, 2012
Region levels give you a 5% boost to attack and some tokens / experience. Also some hp and energy. The full list is under help in region select.

If you've been running the game nonstop then you won't get offline progress. Offline progress is for when you're... offline. Regardless, in the update build b47 I changed how the time played rewards are rewarded so you should be able to get them while the game is running and not just when you startup. There's also some other little fixes and clarifications. Some features also unlock later now (if you see repeat text, it's best to ignore it).

shs
Feb 14, 2012
I made some changes to the save format. Existing portraits had to be sacrificed, but on the bright side, you can hold up to 192 cards now.

shs
Feb 14, 2012
There's only 3 regions right now. There will be more in the future, and artwork for their backgrounds. Until the official "release", I'm attempting to focus on fixing up the features that exist instead of adding new stuff.

One of the first big things I plan to add is a way to create boss monster cards, and also card gifting, and also more regions, and also :kingsley:

Edit2 (fixed an issue for b54):
If you really want to speed build a chain, then when you have the inventory open and you're looking for a card to place, go to the Alt. Sorting filter and select "Link Boost (Chain Card Boost)". This will:

1. Enable chain card mode (normally enabled/disabled by pressing Tab). This will cause the most recent card in your chain to appear in your inventory with the purple text "Chain Card" over it.
2. If the most recent card in your chain is a support card, then your inventory will be sorted according to that card's link boost value. So if that card has an attack boost, cards will be sorted by their attack stat.



pixaal posted:

I need to get back into this, had a crazy busy week, more cards should be a good thing.

Having had a busy week and no time to manage cards means I had no gains. I had enough time for a quick 5 minute drop into the game though but didn't see the point, any chance you can allow the player to purchase card packs but not open them? So say I want to just buy packs I slam the buy packs button clean up inventory then press open pack, get my 9 cards and keep opening packs I already purchased.

I don't know about a banking feature, but I could add a "shove everything instantly into your inventory with zero fanfare" option.

shs fucked around with this message at 13:04 on Jan 27, 2019

shs
Feb 14, 2012
Unlocking region 3 should happen when you clear rank efu- in the second region.

Pretty much every region unlock will be "reach a high rank in the hardest region available".

shs
Feb 14, 2012
Answering questions in no particular order.

I can't image what you're doing that takes 4 to 5 hours per day. I don't even spend that much time developing the game. My most complex chains (which usually involve overwriting dozens of stats) have taken less than an hour to build.

If you need help comparing cards/stats then I suggest turning on :siren:core stat mode:siren: It's an option under the Alt Sorting filter, or you can press C in various menus (it's usually listed). A card with a tier 9 or tier 10 stat is good. Tier 7 to 8 might be worth hanging onto. A card with high tier stats and a high rank can go into your battle grid. A card with high tier stats and a low rank can have its stats moved to another card with overwrite. A card with low tier stats (~6 and below) is most likely sacrifice or fusion fodder, although if it's high rank, it might be worth keeping around as a placeholder.

If you have core stat mode enabled and you go into the inventory and select a stat from the stat filter (let's say attack) all cards will be sorted by the tier value of their attack stat. I'll probably add an option to sort by the sum of all tier stats which will make it really clear which cards have the best stats.

You can already tag cards as scrap -> mass sacrifice, or tag as scrap -> sort by scrap tag -> multi-fuse, or tag a scrap while drawing cards then fuse/sacrifice them later. With those you can clear out a full inventory of cards in a minute or two.
Primary stats are the stats in green text, listed after combat level. I apologize if you're color blind.

Ascended card is a stat multiplier. Adding 25% now is exactly as good as adding 25% a week from now.

It's not explained very well in game, but if you see a gray star icon underneath the "Rank X" text on a card, that means it's used in a set somewhere.

I don't know what a tableau is, but I can add a confirmation prompt when you're saving a card set.

I agree that opening a lot of booster packs is tedious. That's why I've been adding more bonus chances and rare draws. If you see a crown icon next to the purchase button, that's a rare draw. It means the card will appear at your max card rank and have much better than average stats, but is more expensive to draw. I'll likely expand these in the future.

To summarize, turn on core start mode, and stop saving that rank 1 card with tier 1 stats. You're never going to use it.

Edit: I could probably add a feature that let's you refresh the sacrifice levels of a card's stats to the current highest level. That might be interesting.

shs fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Jan 29, 2019

shs
Feb 14, 2012

Ineptitude posted:

Why does it take so long to get an already developed title up on Steam? Can't you just upload it? (Im (obviously) not a programmer)

For Steam you need to

1. Create a store page. For this you're required to have a trailer, capsule images, screenshots, some icons, and some other basic info. Then valve has to approve the page, then it has to be visible for 2 weeks before you can release.
2. Upload and submit a build for valve to review. Aside from remembering how to use the command prompt, this part isn't very hard, but if you're going to use microtransactions, that requires some additional api work that can take somewhere between a few hours and a few weeks depending on which framework/libraries you're using.

It's not terribly difficult, but it's a lot more involved than something like Kongregate where you can upload a build, an icon and some screenshots then slam the publish button.

shs
Feb 14, 2012
I haven't posted about efu:rtw for a little bit now (because 95% of changes I make are minor adjustments and "moved some text to the left" doesn't make for an interesting post), but it's going to launch into Kongregate's beta program this Thursday, then the web version will likely be released somewhere between 1 week and 2 weeks afterwards.

shs
Feb 14, 2012
the enemy's face when he sees your stat chain


By the way, the "official" web version of efu:rtw will happen tomorrow (the 21st) at about 7:15 PM EST. The 4th region will be in, and the 5th will appear in the next week or two. Of course everyone's progress will be reset so you'll have to grind your way there.

shs
Feb 14, 2012
hmm woops

shs fucked around with this message at 16:38 on Feb 25, 2019

shs
Feb 14, 2012
I feel this tweet is relates to the conversation at hand

https://twitter.com/DesignUXUI/status/576432203560685568

shs
Feb 14, 2012
The game was unpopular and had a poor rating and would very likely not ever make enough money to justify how much it would've cost to finish, so I asked Kongregate staff to refund the money people spent on it and stopped developing the web version.

I was going to stop working on it altogether, but I still enjoy playing the game, so I decided to clean up the UI a bit, improve balance a bit, finish a few features that I had already started on, finish the 6th region map, and continue with the Steam version that I said I was going to build back when I first posted about the game. Even if the game continues to be unpopular and I don't add anything new to it, in its current form it still provides an easy 50 to 500 hours of amusement, depending on how much you like the mechanics. The Steam version can also be played at 1920 x 1080 instead of that gently caress rear end 1050 x 590 garbage I had to use for the web version.

shs
Feb 14, 2012
The cursed game appears again, except it's on Steam and in 1080p now.

Compared to the previous version, there's a few more card portraits, an extra region, balance is a bit better, and there's some minor UI improvements. There's also a new feature where you can make cards like this:



Some Steam keys:

8WA3L-8Y5XY-92JVL
NWMTG-54E7X-Y07J2
ZAN6E-H5GIX-M5NG8
YA7DE-AA3YN-N83AV
254CY-P6KHI-9Q3WB


Edit:

There's also a starter guide that might make the game slightly less overwhelming

shs fucked around with this message at 00:42 on Mar 29, 2019

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

shs
Feb 14, 2012

KazigluBey posted:

Oh, is there uhhh, no way to export saves from the Kong version, shs?

Unfortunately no. The web version saves your data in your browser's local storage, and the data is encrypted, while the Steam version saves things in a file in your user folder. There's no practical way to to access the local storage from the standalone build, and I'm not sure if the saves would actually be compatible with each other.

If it's any consolation, pretty much every stat and upgrade received a small to moderate buff for the Steam release, so you can probably get back to where you were relatively fast ("fast" in an idle game sense).

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply