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Farmer Crack-rear end posted:Think we only ever saw the spoiler-Nebula once, as the USS Phoenix in TNG The Wounded. I'm surprised the AWACS Nebula didn't show up more often in TNG and DS9. You'd think it would have been perfect for Data's sensor sweep plan in Unification or something, right? Especially because a lot of the behind the scenes folks on both shows were old Navy and Air Force people or just general military history nerds. nine-gear crow fucked around with this message at 18:57 on Dec 1, 2022 |
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Dec 1, 2022 18:55
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nine-gear crow posted:I'm surprised the AWACS Nebula didn't show up more often in TNG and DS9. You'd think it would have been perfect for Data's sensor sweep plan in Unification or something, right? Especially because a lot of the behind the scenes folks on both shows were old Navy and Air Force people or just general military history nerds. They switched to the triangle model just because they thought it looked better. But more importantly, they changed the model physically.
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Dec 1, 2022 19:48
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Yeah sadly despite making reference to the idea of different mission pods they didn't really do anything with it and neither did any games even though the Nebula class is fairly ubiquitous in TNG-era games Course some of those references also involve crazy ideas like the New Orleans class having a double-digit number of torpedo tubes including ones firing to port and starboard.
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Dec 1, 2022 19:52
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nine-gear crow posted:I'm surprised the AWACS Nebula didn't show up more often in TNG and DS9. You'd think it would have been perfect for Data's sensor sweep plan in Unification or something, right? Especially because a lot of the behind the scenes folks on both shows were old Navy and Air Force people or just general military history nerds. Ehh, they couldn't really be picky for ships in Redemption; it was a hastily-assembled task force made out of whatever starships could either get there in time or get hauled out of spacedock, to the point where the Sutherland was practically falling apart on them during the mission.
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Dec 1, 2022 20:14
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Suddenly I want to see a 
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Dec 1, 2022 20:16
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Hollismason posted:That list doesn't include the Captains Yacht that was in one of the movies. I think Insurrection. IIRC it’s the Cousteau? Great design.
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Dec 1, 2022 20:47
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I'm not gonna lie, the idea that the lowest part of the disc is literally a flying saucer for the captain to use, and not a sensor cluster for the ship, is one of the less than stellar ideas and I am glad that it was never actually used as is. The hell the captain needs that for, anyway? At least LDS wrote it away and the main hangar has one pimped-up runabout or deluxe shuttle for the missions where you need a limousine to arrive. Furthermore, is that thing below the main armor belt or part of it? If not, its a comical weak point on the bottom of the saucer section. If it is, it must be reassuring to know that captain just flew away with part of your body armor. Der Kyhe fucked around with this message at 20:53 on Dec 1, 2022 |
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Dec 1, 2022 20:49
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Aside from the "ablative armor" introduced in DS9 (which we really never saw in action), starships really don't have armor because the weapons are so incredibly overpowered. Shields and the structural integrity field are the armor. There's no physical substance that's going to really do anything against a matter/antimatter reaction. If your shields and defense screens are fully down, you are hosed.
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Dec 1, 2022 21:10
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Der Kyhe posted:The hell the captain needs that for, anyway? At least LDS wrote it away and the main hangar has one pimped-up runabout or deluxe shuttle for the missions where you need a limousine to arrive. It's the diplomatic VIP transport for when they need to bring a president of a planet aboard or something, it's just called the captain's yacht as a bit of a traditional name, like the captain's gig on a military ship. Lower Decks's captain's yacht does have a dedicated dock and that purpose is also alluded to there with the dock having a little diplomatic reception area where you disembark. Big Mean Jerk posted:IIRC it’s the Cousteau? Great design. Yeah, and the one on the D was named Calypso, which was Cousteau's ship. 
MikeJF fucked around with this message at 21:46 on Dec 1, 2022 |
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Dec 1, 2022 21:35
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wesleywillis posted:I always thought that nebula class ships were weird looking. It's one of my absolute favourites and I cannot tell you why I don't know why I love the Galaxy Hatchback so much, but I do
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Dec 1, 2022 22:04
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Nebula with that triangular platform is also one of my favorites of the ships that were criminally under-utilized.
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Dec 1, 2022 22:07
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They had to fight long and hard to get the Nebula, according to Okuda.
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Dec 1, 2022 22:17
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bull3964 posted:Aside from the "ablative armor" introduced in DS9 (which we really never saw in action), starships really don't have armor because the weapons are so incredibly overpowered. Shields and the structural integrity field are the armor. There's no physical substance that's going to really do anything against a matter/antimatter reaction. Mirandas are a kind of ablative armor.
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Dec 1, 2022 23:35
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MikeJF posted:It's the diplomatic VIP transport for when they need to bring a president of a planet aboard or something, it's just called the captain's yacht as a bit of a traditional name, like the captain's gig on a military ship. Lower Decks's captain's yacht does have a dedicated dock and that purpose is also alluded to there with the dock having a little diplomatic reception area where you disembark. I love that he's got the crew wearing some kind of safety vest over their uniform here.
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Dec 2, 2022 00:24
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Angry_Ed posted:Yeah sadly despite making reference to the idea of different mission pods they didn't really do anything with it and neither did any games even though the Nebula class is fairly ubiquitous in TNG-era games "Fire all torpedoes! Attack pattern GUMBO!
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Dec 2, 2022 01:16
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Powered Descent posted:Suddenly I want to see a I get more of a Day The Earth Stood Still vibe from that silhouette
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Dec 2, 2022 01:43
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bull3964 posted:Aside from the "ablative armor" introduced in DS9 (which we really never saw in action), starships really don't have armor because the weapons are so incredibly overpowered. Shields and the structural integrity field are the armor. There's no physical substance that's going to really do anything against a matter/antimatter reaction. I always figured the Defiant had more traditional armor because it was designed to fight the Borg, who like cutting bits off enemy ships for analysis and assimilation. So yeah, everyone else just focuses on blowing you up with weapons that can wipe out continents, regular armor doesn't do much.
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Dec 2, 2022 09:33
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Not just that but the Borg have shown themselves extremely effective at taking down shields in seconds. So the Defiant was built to compensate with high-tech armour and high maneuverability, which made it the perfect frontman against the Dominion, whose weapons were able to bypass Federation shields until A Call to Arms. Not sure what they mean about 'not seeing it in action', it's always in use and they refer to it as being critical in fights many times. There's no visible special effect though.
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Dec 2, 2022 09:50
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Ablative armor is a real thing and it should have resulted in chunks being taken out of the outer hull during battle as those layers vaporized to absorb the energy. Basically, we should have been seeing much more extensive battle scaring on the ship.
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Dec 2, 2022 14:39
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I vaguely recall that the way it worked is that the ablative layer is easily replicable and gets replaced real-time as it gets vapourised.
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Dec 2, 2022 15:07
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Tighclops posted:I love that he's got the crew wearing some kind of safety vest over their uniform here. I'm imagining the whole thing inflating and magnetizing if he falls or gravity goes out, so he just turns into an insulated ball that sticks to the hull until danger passes.
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Dec 2, 2022 15:10
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MikeJF posted:I vaguely recall that the way it worked is that the ablative layer is easily replicable and gets replaced real-time as it gets vapourised. Instead they should use the replicator to replicate a ship that's not stupid enough to get shot. 
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Dec 2, 2022 15:11
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Weaponize the poo poo out of the replicator, have ships surrounded by whirling, endlessly renewing debris fields. Hide drones and shields in the field so you're never quite sure what's defensive, offensive, or sacrificial 
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Dec 2, 2022 15:17
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Brawnfire posted:I'm imagining the whole thing inflating and magnetizing if he falls or gravity goes out, so he just turns into an insulated ball that sticks to the hull until danger passes. Inflatable safety things in space are a thing, NASA toyed with the emergency crew transfer balloon. I believe there was some concept art showing inflatable evacuation vehicles for the TOS Enterprise, actually. Or maybe it was a tech manual.
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Dec 2, 2022 15:25
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Gravitas Shortfall posted:Weaponize the poo poo out of the replicator, have ships surrounded by whirling, endlessly renewing debris fields. Hide drones and shields in the field so you're never quite sure what's defensive, offensive, or sacrificial I think that's actually the interesting thing with extrapolating Treknology into the far future: it should really just end up as swarms of poo poo. There's less and less reason for anything to remain a singular cohesive physical unit as forcefields, replicators, transporters and hard light holograms merge development.
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Dec 2, 2022 15:28
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Computer.. Bee Shield activate.
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Dec 2, 2022 15:29
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MikeJF posted:Inflatable safety things in space are a thing, NASA toyed with the emergency crew transfer balloon. I believe there was some concept art showing inflatable evacuation vehicles for the TOS Enterprise, actually. Or maybe it was a tech manual. I feel like I must have seen this and that's why it stuck in my brain. It's a hilarious image, but after watching enough space action films yeah, I'd rather be a cozy ball waiting for rescue than wrestling with straps in microgravity. Inflatables would also be fun to really lean into in a sci-fi universe. We could do a poo poo-ton with that in space. Not just a decoy Enterprise!
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Dec 2, 2022 15:31
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Brawnfire posted:I feel like I must have seen this and that's why it stuck in my brain. It's a hilarious image, but after watching enough space action films yeah, I'd rather be a cozy ball waiting for rescue than wrestling with straps in microgravity. NASA was planning an inflatable crew module for ISS called TransHab, and it was a very promising avenue, but after cost overruns Congress passed a law saying they couldn't work on inflatable space tech anymore. The research was sold to Bigelow, who planned a whole bunch of inflatable modules that would comprise an entire station. There's actually a small inflatable module made by Bigelow on ISS right now, the BEAM. They use it for storage. Of course Bigelow is dead now though so that's not going anywhere. On a crazier note, GE proposed an emergency evacuation system back in the 60s that was an entire inflatable one-man re-entry and landing system. Their studies said it would work. NASA wasn't interested. 
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Dec 2, 2022 15:37
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Brawnfire posted:I think that's actually the interesting thing with extrapolating Treknology into the far future: it should really just end up as swarms of poo poo. There's less and less reason for anything to remain a singular cohesive physical unit as forcefields, replicators, transporters and hard light holograms merge development. I think you need a central unit for power generation purposes. Replication, shields, tractor beams, warp, phasers, they all seem to be extremely energy intensive. Maybe not warp since you can fit nacelles on runabouts and shuttles, but still.
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Dec 2, 2022 15:38
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Jesus Christ what a nightmare experience that would be Gravitas Shortfall posted:I think you need a central unit for power generation purposes. Replication, shields, tractor beams, warp, phasers, they all seem to be extremely energy intensive. I was contemplating the power generation problem but I gotta figure that can be distributed as well. Isolated matter-antimatter reactions contained within forcefields, perhaps. Like a little constellation of fusion fireflies Brawnfire fucked around with this message at 15:43 on Dec 2, 2022 |
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Dec 2, 2022 15:39
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Brawnfire posted:I think that's actually the interesting thing with extrapolating Treknology into the far future: it should really just end up as swarms of poo poo. There's less and less reason for anything to remain a singular cohesive physical unit as forcefields, replicators, transporters and hard light holograms merge development. Yeah dovetailing this and the inflatable tech conversations, one of the photos from Disco 5 is an emergency spacesuit locker and it's a standard big clunky spacesuit and I remember seeing it and it bugged me because given the tech they'd established, an emergency spacesuit should just be a thing you grab and it slorps around you in a fraction of a second. Hell, they should all have a lump of p-matter on their belt all the time that can do it in an emergency. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 15:45 on Dec 2, 2022 |
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Dec 2, 2022 15:43
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I still like the cheap rear end TAS solution of wearing a force field belt so you can just step into space in your street clothes
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Dec 2, 2022 15:44
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MikeJF posted:Not just that but the Borg have shown themselves extremely effective at taking down shields in seconds. So the Defiant was built to compensate with high-tech armour and high maneuverability, which made it the perfect frontman against the Dominion, whose weapons were able to bypass Federation shields until A Call to Arms. Ablative armor was an unofficial upgrade after the initial build and trials - Captain Benteen (sp?) mentioned "someone installed ablative armor on the Defiant and neglected to inform Starfleet Operations" when the Lakota intercepted the Defiant.
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Dec 2, 2022 15:52
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They mention even from the first time we see her she's heavily armoured in a way normal ships aren't. Maybe it's not ablative yet but it's still a step above in armouring. The first mention of actual 'ablative armour' is in 3x11 Past Tense, but they're talking about new better ablative armour they've just added in 4x01 Way of the Warrior as well. That line's about neglecting to tell operations has always been weird for me, I can't imagine anyone doing a major refit and adding a whole new armour system to a capital ship without mentioning to Command! I just imagine it meant the system was classified beyond SF Operations people like Benteen. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 16:09 on Dec 2, 2022 |
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Dec 2, 2022 16:07
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MikeJF posted:That line's about neglecting to tell operations has always been weird for me, I can't imagine anyone doing a major refit and adding a whole new armour system to a capital ship without mentioning to Command! I just imagine the system was classified beyond SF Operations people like Benteen. I mean if it was put in when the ship was getting made, and the person who requested the addition is the person who designed the ship and project(?) lead, I would imagine the refit crew would just do it. With the resources of Starfleet, which was in a period of relative peace at the time, than it wouldn't really be something they would particular care about, but better to ask for forgiveness and all that. I mean you could even bury that you did it in some long technical report that you know few people are going to actually read all the way through.
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Dec 2, 2022 16:16
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Brawnfire posted:Jesus Christ what a nightmare experience that would be Only marginally smaller than the washing machine that you rode into space, if you were a mercury astronaut!
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Dec 2, 2022 17:00
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rear end to earth
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Dec 2, 2022 17:42
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Always has been
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Tiberius Christ posted:rear end to earth Don’t forget to open up the butt flap
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MikeJF posted:NASA was planning an inflatable crew module for ISS called TransHab, and it was a very promising avenue, but after cost overruns Congress passed a law saying they couldn't work on inflatable space tech anymore. The research was sold to Bigelow, who planned a whole bunch of inflatable modules that would comprise an entire station. There's actually a small inflatable module made by Bigelow on ISS right now, the BEAM. They use it for storage. Of course Bigelow is dead now though so that's not going anywhere. this is outrageously stupid. i hate the way us government funding works.
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