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Loel
Jun 4, 2012

"For the Emperor."

There was a terrible noise.
There was a terrible silence.



Mmk, let's kick something off with something light: ratifying some old treaties we have lying around.

    UN Convention on the Rights of the Child
    UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities
    UN Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women
    UN Convention on the Law of the Sea
    UN International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights
    Convention on Cluster Munitions
    Ottawa Treaty (landmines)
    The Rome Statute (international criminal court)

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DivineCoffeeBinge
Mar 3, 2011

Spider-Man's Amazing Construction Company
More OOC Talk: Having said that, I fully expect all of us are going to have to make some adjustments to fit our own values; Indiana can be part of Libertopia all they want but Mike Pence ain't gonna love my platform, you know? I mean, it's still gotta be fun. :D

IC Talk:

Loel posted:

Mmk, let's kick something off with something light: ratifying some old treaties we have lying around.

Pretty sure treaty ratification is still going to be the Legislature's job once we decide what the Legislature will actually look like. We're drawing up a Constitution, not actually governing.

Some points for my fellow delegates to consider:
  • The present Constitution discusses precisely one crime, namely Treason. We may want to keep our new Constitution similarly light on criminal and legal code; the Legislature can draw those up. When it comes to matters of law, I suggest we do as the founders did and keep our focus as broad as possible so that the Legislature can concern itself with the specifics.
  • We have the option to rewrite or discard any portion of the present Constitution - or to refrain from doing so. It may be worthwhile to go through the present Constitution and find areas that we think are good as it stands (I would place our present Preamble in this category, personally, I think it works just fine).
  • What we enshrine in the Constitution can be as broad as "guiding principles" or as specific as "specific procedures." Note that each time we choose the latter we necessarily hamstring our future government's ability to adapt to changing times - for an example, see the present Constitution's insistence that we have a Postal Service which, today, it seems like no one uses. I suggest that when making proposals we consider not just what effect these proposals might have today but what effect they might have fifty years from now.
  • Keep in mind also the degree to which ambiguity in the present Constitution has led to ambiguity in our own laws; being too broad can be as bad or worse as being too narrow.

Therefore I suggest that, before we begin arguing specifics and issues, we should take advantage of the time allotted to us to introduce ourselves and establish our goals to spell out, in the broadest of all possible terms, what issues we want to see addressed before this convention (OOC: that is, to do the "so a week to decide the 10 things to be debated (send a list of your area's top five issues, then I'll create the docket)" bit suggested in the OP). I further suggest that we do so publicly, and I will be doing so herein, though of course this suggestion bears only moral rather than legal weight.

To wit, the broad issues with which the people of Libertopia are most concerned and wish to see debated and acted upon at this convention are as follows:
  • Racial Inequality and Civil Rights (GLBTQ rights included here; a "Second Bill Of Rights" should definitely be considered)
  • Economic Inequality and Consumer Protection (including a "No, Corporations Are Not People In A Legal Sense Until We're Allowed To Draft Them" Amendment)
  • Free Trade And How To Get It To Stop loving The American Worker (aka "what, if any, limitations should be set on international treaties")
  • Redesigning the Legislature and - potentially - shifting to a more Parliamentary system (with an added dose of "should we ditch first-past-the-post voting)
  • Recognizing that America was Founded on Judeo-Christian Values and Finding Ways To Enshrine Those Values In Our Constitution Because Indiana Demanded It

Loel
Jun 4, 2012

"For the Emperor."

There was a terrible noise.
There was a terrible silence.



Its a constitutional convention, we can sign things if we want to :D

edit:

"Appendix I to the 2nd American Constitution. The following treaties are signed into with force of law, and are not considered a part of the Constitution.

A, B C."

Loel fucked around with this message at 07:03 on Sep 4, 2016

DivineCoffeeBinge
Mar 3, 2011

Spider-Man's Amazing Construction Company

Loel posted:

Its a constitutional convention, we can sign things if we want to :D

edit:

"Appendix I to the 2nd American Constitution. The following treaties are signed into with force of law, and are not considered a part of the Constitution.

A, B C."

Fair cop, and I'd forgotten about that bit! Still, the Speaker (OP) has said they'd like to put individual issues on the docket, ten in total; I'd say "treaties and international obligations" just became one of the five issues of importance you want to bring up to the convention, hmm?

Loel
Jun 4, 2012

"For the Emperor."

There was a terrible noise.
There was a terrible silence.



DivineCoffeeBinge posted:

Fair cop, and I'd forgotten about that bit! Still, the Speaker (OP) has said they'd like to put individual issues on the docket, ten in total; I'd say "treaties and international obligations" just became one of the five issues of importance you want to bring up to the convention, hmm?

This is more to pass the time until we get the issue of the week :D

RandomPauI
Nov 24, 2006


Grimey Drawer

Pragmatic Populist's soundbite posted:

I look forward to working with my colleagues to 1) reunify an american people divided by the culture war, 2) correct the under-representation of real, honest, working Americans in governance, 3) increase the freedoms of the states to innovate without an overbearing federal government, 4) rebuild America to it's former greatness, and 5) address the consequences of an unnatural number of natural disasters which are befalling my constituents.

Pragmatic Populist's notes to himself posted:


Civil rights and culture war stuff is going to have a big political cost no matter what. The culture war is a bigger issue with other states with their own plans, so why not let them do the proposals and duke it out? The culture war's masked the economic problems at least. So do I back stuff that I know will fail to win brownie points, or not back anything in the name of states rights, or do I vote my conscious and suffer electorally? In the grand scheme of things it actually won't matter.

Constituents still need better paying jobs which is popularly linked to the idea of increasing domestic consumption and exports while reducing imports and having less immigrants doing work but more people joining the workforce. Also less regulations for business while having all the benefits of more regulations for business. It will be impossible for anyone to propose something to resolve the underlying problems in a way that isn't antagonistic and which doesn't reveal the inherent contradictions. I don't see anyone having an actual economic fix, but I could still back less popular amendments if we can tie it back to economic growth.

Then there's the contradiction of voters feeling like there are too many other representatives in Washington and not enough reps for their concerns. Someone'll definitely propose something about overturning citizens united, public financing, STV, eliminating the electoral college, etc., so I can piggyback on those. But my constituents will be disappointed when those ideas are implemented and that's not enough.

So I'll push for something big. A bold and major reform that'll probably fail that'll leave people thinking "what if?". A new chamber of govt that more closely resembles the people. Proportional representation, review laws before they can be voted on, given discretionary funds to send back to their states and districts. This'll require major rewrites. So I'll propose it and argue for it and it'll die and then I'll be able to tell my constituents "See, the elites want to keep their stranglehold on congress".

In addition, constituents want more federal financial help for struggling families and municipalities but want the feds to butt out of local affairs. For practical purposes this requires legislative fixes, not constitutional ones. But we're here anyway. So, how do you increase states rights if you're also making states more dependent on the federal government? If I can't get the legislature changes approved I'll settle for piggybacking on something else. And maybe proposing something as a consolation prize like codifying social security and having it funded by income and capital gains taxes.

Natural disasters are worse and we need to be better prepared. Climate change is more accepted but it'll still be a controversial headache. And Infrastructure and municipalities are falling apart, I'm told just get it fixed. So I'll invoke ways to fix the damage while other people battle about the long-term structural causes. I can probably get support for an infrastructure/rebuilding bank, and creating a national guard equivalent for natural disasters (and infrastructure repair during the off seasons).

This is just a crazy thought, but if I could bring one more thing to the table it'd be citizenship and voting representation for the native territories and the territories of the US

OOC breakdown:

1) Tri-cameral legislature (My future will live or die based on how this does)
2) Social Security
3) Infrastructure bank
4) FEMA on steroids
5) Citizenship

RandomPauI
Nov 24, 2006


Grimey Drawer

Facebook message reply to loel posted:

Got the list and letting you know how I feel. We can talk about any disagreements over ratification later.

Convention on the Rights of the Child :love:
Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities :love:
Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women :love:
International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights :love:
Law of the Sea Convention :)
Convention on Cluster Munitions :crossarms:
Ottawa Treaty :crossarms:
The Rome Statute (international criminal court) :nono:

Olothreutes
Mar 31, 2007

RandomPauI posted:

Advisory council 1 elected rep per 100000k people minimum 1. 2 year term

You realize that two year terms are garbage right? Unless you intend to drastically alter the manner in which elections are run so that you don't spend 75% of your time raising funds for re-election instead of actually legislating.

RandomPauI
Nov 24, 2006


Grimey Drawer

Olothreutes posted:

You realize that two year terms are garbage right? Unless you intend to drastically alter the manner in which elections are run so that you don't spend 75% of your time raising funds for re-election instead of actually legislating.

It is contingent on other electoral reforms going through.

HiHo ChiRho
Oct 23, 2010

RagnarokAngel posted:

but it's literally IN new england! This will not stand, New England delegation's first order of business is to fix this outrage.

CT Demand: Split the state like Solomon and the baby! Litchfield and Fairfield counties to NYC, the rest can be for New England.

QuoProQuid
Jan 12, 2012

Tr*ckin' and F*ckin' all the way to tha
T O P

As a community leader in Cleveland, I would remind the delegations to remember the federal nature of our government. As it was in 1787, all agreements must be ratified by the 50 states. Any attempts to legislate controversial issues will likely result in state rejection. I ask that the delegates exercise restraint and caution throughout this process. I also ask that each delegation keep their colleagues interests in mind, so that this discussion can avoid red lines and unnecessary battles.

As a proud Ohioan, I would ask the Libertopian delegation fight for the following:
  • Saving Our Cities: The last few decades have been tough for Libertopia. Cities like Buffalo, Cleveland, Detroit, and Gary have suffered greatly due to the loss of manufacturing and trade. Millions have lost opportunities and many more have left their states for other regions. Something must be done to staunch this bleeding before the region becomes a shell of its former self;

  • Saving Our Businesses: As a small business owner, I know how tough it is to compete against groups like Wal-Mart. When the federal government helps these big businesses, either through inaction or malfeasance, it is disheartening. Our new system of government must recognize that corporations are not entitled to the same constitutional rights as people.

  • Saving Our Water: Natural resources are important for any state. Few, though, are more important than water. While we are sympathetic to the concerns of states like California, the Great Lakes are a regional treasure and a source of security for our people. We would oppose any other region's attempt to infringe upon our sovereign rights. No authority should be able to extract another region's resources without its consent;

  • Saving Our Status: Libertopia is one of the most diverse regions in the country. It is a place where people of different ideologies come and work together. It makes sense why states like Ohio and Pennsylvania enjoy such influence in election years. While other regions have become polarized, Libertopia remains a beacon of bipartisan solutions. As such, we would strongly oppose any attempts to reduce our region's status in the political system. We especially oppose any attempt to remove the Electoral College without very strong concessions;

  • Saving Our Free Speech: Today, more than ever, our ability to communicate is under assault. We would oppose any attempts to limit the breadth or depth of free speech. The ability of private citizens to "speak their mind" must not be infringed upon, nor can the ability of journalists be undermined. We also consider prohibitions against political speech in churches to be wrong. We would encourage the government to recognize the importance of each of these actors in fostering political dialogue;

  • Saving Our Soldiers: We are deeply concerned by the growing power of the president, especially in matters of foreign policy. The Imperial Presidency has dragged us into wars without congressional authorization or public debate. Our soldiers fight at the whim of the Executive. As such, we ask the Electoral College to rein in the excesses of the presidency and return the Congress to its position in matters of war and peace;

  • Saving Our Values: It's no secret that the United States of America is a country founded on Judeo-Christian values. Yet, our traditions are under attack by so-called elites who believe that we cling to our "guns and religion." If this country is to succeed another 240 years, it needs to enshrine our beliefs and values into the Constitution.

If an alternate is needed, I would be happy to participate. Until that time, I will comment on the proceedings and provide an outlet for the people's concerns.

also, puerto rico should totes be allowed to participate

Loel
Jun 4, 2012

"For the Emperor."

There was a terrible noise.
There was a terrible silence.



Thats a good point.

OP, can we assume whatever we come up with becomes the law of the land?

QuoProQuid
Jan 12, 2012

Tr*ckin' and F*ckin' all the way to tha
T O P

Oh, and I would encourage the delegates to work out broad principles before focusing on minutia. As you all know, it is often easier to build consensus on a general philosophy of government than it is to build a philosophy out of several dozen inconsistent policy ideas. If I were to organize debate, I would go in the following order.
  • The Power and Authority of the National Government, the Several States, and the People;
  • The Role of the Legislature;
  • The Role of the Executive and Judiciary;
  • The Bill of Rights and the Doctrine of Incorporation; and
  • Economic Rights and American Capitalism;

Once you have have determined the relationship between the people, states, and federal government, you can go about developing a system to enshrine that relationship. Once that system of governance is developed, you can reaffirm or create particular civil rights. Once those civil rights are developed, you can see if you can form any consensus on economic issues.

That's just my suggestion. I would hate to see the body get bogged down on an issue like, say, the National Bird when it hasn't yet figured out who should be represented in Congress.

Dr. Angela Ziegler posted:

Obviously. Also I see you sneakdooring "churches can engage in political speech" up there :argh:

I have nothing but the best intentions for this country and all its citizens.

QuoProQuid fucked around with this message at 16:27 on Sep 4, 2016

Shrecknet
Jan 2, 2005


Loel posted:

Thats a good point.

OP, can we assume whatever we come up with becomes the law of the land?

Obviously. Also I see you sneakdooring "churches can engage in political speech" up there :argh:

seiferguy
Jun 9, 2005

FLAWED
INTUITION



Toilet Rascal
Here's some of the top issues facing Cascadia today:

Equal Housing: As many people find refuge in the west coast, the ability to find an affordable house has greatly diminished. This is causing serious gentrification in cities like Seattle, Portland and San Francisco. This forcing people to move out of the city. There needs to be a plan that's fair to all that allows people to live within the cities but not also create a massive housing shortage. That leads to the next point...

Comprehensive infrastructure: Los Angeles, San Francisco and Seattle are ranked 1, 2, and 4 in the worst traffic in America respectively. Part of this is due to a lack of alternative options besides roads roads and more roads. While alternative options exist, it's nowhere near acceptable, and plans to build up rail won't be ready anytime soon. In addition, our current highways are already failing.

LGBTQ* Rights: Cascadia is gay. Like, super gay. San Fran is the LGBTQ capital of the world, and we have a right as Americans to ensure that they maintain strong rights beyond marriage (equal employment / housing opportunities, banning of gay conversion therapy, etc etc.).

Free trade: Cascadia is on the coast, and port operations are a strong driver of economic activity. This is driven by trading with outside nations, and free trade is important to that. Also, activities like the Ex-Im bank help allow foreign countries to purchase our products.

Laws to support the tech sector: We have Silicon Valley, and require strong IP / patent laws to ensure our creations are made fairly and not stolen with ease.

Tribal Rights: Cascadia is home to many native tribes that struggle to maintain footing against the oppression of Americans. We need to ensure they maintain strong tribal sovereignty and access to government help to keep them afloat.

And last but not least...

Legalize weed: I don't give a hot g*y gently caress what congress says.

Luigi Thirty
Apr 30, 2006

Emergency confection port.

As a resident of the fine city of Tampa, I hope that my CSA delegate to the Constitutional Convention doesn't forget that Hispanics are, in fact, people too. Thank you.

Elmnt80
Dec 30, 2012


The representative of the csa is of course aware of this fact and would like to suggest that we recognize that all people currently living in the us at the time this constitution is ratified be recognized as US citizens, provided they are not considered a citizen of another nation. Furthermore, we would suggest any child born to a us citizen is also a us citizen, regardless of where they are born.

However, we would like to suggest we firmly establish border security as a responsibility of the federal government, with the armed forces being the main force used to police them.

OCC: I guess florida conservative that knows he can't alienate his states latino population and ever be re-elected to anything is how I'm going. Idk, gotta figure out how to dogwhistle in the constitution. :v:

Chwoka
Jan 27, 2008

I'm Abed, and I never watch TV.

seiferguy posted:

Here's some of the top issues facing Cascadia today:

Equal Housing: As many people find refuge in the west coast, the ability to find an affordable house has greatly diminished. This is causing serious gentrification in cities like Seattle, Portland and San Francisco. This forcing people to move out of the city. There needs to be a plan that's fair to all that allows people to live within the cities but not also create a massive housing shortage. That leads to the next point...

Comprehensive infrastructure: Los Angeles, San Francisco and Seattle are ranked 1, 2, and 4 in the worst traffic in America respectively. Part of this is due to a lack of alternative options besides roads roads and more roads. While alternative options exist, it's nowhere near acceptable, and plans to build up rail won't be ready anytime soon. In addition, our current highways are already failing.

LGBTQ* Rights: Cascadia is gay. Like, super gay. San Fran is the LGBTQ capital of the world, and we have a right as Americans to ensure that they maintain strong rights beyond marriage (equal employment / housing opportunities, banning of gay conversion therapy, etc etc.).

Free trade: Cascadia is on the coast, and port operations are a strong driver of economic activity. This is driven by trading with outside nations, and free trade is important to that. Also, activities like the Ex-Im bank help allow foreign countries to purchase our products.

Laws to support the tech sector: We have Silicon Valley, and require strong IP / patent laws to ensure our creations are made fairly and not stolen with ease.

Tribal Rights: Cascadia is home to many native tribes that struggle to maintain footing against the oppression of Americans. We need to ensure they maintain strong tribal sovereignty and access to government help to keep them afloat.

And last but not least...

Legalize weed: I don't give a hot g*y gently caress what congress says.

As an Oregon Onion, I don't see how some of these are structural constitutional issues and not for the legislature... LGBTQ rights, IP reform*, tribal rights, even flying weed legalization over the head of the legislature sound great to me, but equal housing, comprehensive infrastructure, and especially free trade definitely belong under the more flexible jurisdiction and judgement of the legislature instead of enshrined as the way to do things for hundreds of years in the constitution. Can you imagine if, like, the Monroe Doctrine snuck its way into an amendment or some poo poo?

* Although IP needs reformed in the opposite direction, drastically, for creative works. poo poo's a loving mess. (I just want sampling back in hip-hop honestly.)

Also, I'll echo what I've seen said here already: The judicial branch is the most well-functioning branch of the entire US government, especially when you include the Bill of Rights, which makes sense because the constitution was written by a bunch of lawyers. It doesn't need much, if any, changing. (Prison for profit needs to die though.)

Peztopiary
Mar 16, 2009

by exmarx
OOC -- It's actually going to be really hard to roleplay this, because an actual Constitutional Convention would result in the red states' wet dreams being passed over the strong but completely irrelevant objections of the blue states.The NCR up there wouldn't recognize LGBT people (no marriage, no protections, etc.) and they'd get the War on Drugs into the Constitution etc. Nevermind what they'd do to Cascadia in terms of water use rights (hint: they wouldn't exist anymore, federally) no matter how stupid it would be for them to have to take on that at the regional/state level. They'd gut the Supreme Court's authority to rule on almost anything as well.

Solkanar512
Dec 28, 2006

by the sex ghost

Chwoka posted:

As an Oregon Onion, I don't see how some of these are structural constitutional issues and not for the legislature... LGBTQ rights, IP reform*, tribal rights, even flying weed legalization over the head of the legislature sound great to me, but equal housing, comprehensive infrastructure, and especially free trade definitely belong under the more flexible jurisdiction and judgement of the legislature instead of enshrined as the way to do things for hundreds of years in the constitution. Can you imagine if, like, the Monroe Doctrine snuck its way into an amendment or some poo poo?

* Although IP needs reformed in the opposite direction, drastically, for creative works. poo poo's a loving mess. (I just want sampling back in hip-hop honestly.)

Also, I'll echo what I've seen said here already: The judicial branch is the most well-functioning branch of the entire US government, especially when you include the Bill of Rights, which makes sense because the constitution was written by a bunch of lawyers. It doesn't need much, if any, changing. (Prison for profit needs to die though.)

I would sum up the LGBQ* issue as an "Expanded Equal Rights Amendment".

Loel
Jun 4, 2012

"For the Emperor."

There was a terrible noise.
There was a terrible silence.



Peztopiary posted:

OOC -- It's actually going to be really hard to roleplay this, because an actual Constitutional Convention would result in the red states' wet dreams being passed over the strong but completely irrelevant objections of the blue states.The NCR up there wouldn't recognize LGBT people (no marriage, no protections, etc.) and they'd get the War on Drugs into the Constitution etc. Nevermind what they'd do to Cascadia in terms of water use rights (hint: they wouldn't exist anymore, federally) no matter how stupid it would be for them to have to take on that at the regional/state level. They'd gut the Supreme Court's authority to rule on almost anything as well.

Yeah, I presume that's why the Founders (tm) made it so we need 5/10+1 of each region, as opposed to 2/3 of all states, for that reason.

boy are my arms tired
May 10, 2012

Ham Wrangler
I understand Hawaii got swallowed up (by the east coast of all things) but if Texas can have its own thing, I'd like to represent Hawaii. Hell, give me all of the Pacific territories while we're at it.

Aloha, motherfuckers.

Loel
Jun 4, 2012

"For the Emperor."

There was a terrible noise.
There was a terrible silence.



I will admit having 11 regions would make votes easier.

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

seiferguy posted:

Comprehensive infrastructure: Los Angeles, San Francisco and Seattle are ranked 1, 2, and 4 in the worst traffic in America respectively. Part of this is due to a lack of alternative options besides roads roads and more roads. While alternative options exist, it's nowhere near acceptable, and plans to build up rail won't be ready anytime soon. In addition, our current highways are already failing.

As a resident of the jewel of the CSA, Atlanta, this is issue number one for me

Loel
Jun 4, 2012

"For the Emperor."

There was a terrible noise.
There was a terrible silence.



Looks like that would be a 3.6 trillion dollar project http://www.wired.com/2015/01/time-fix-americas-infrastructure-heres-start/

Edit: Thats using 2010 dollars http://www.infrastructurereportcard.org/a/#p/grade-sheet/americas-infrastructure-investment-needs , so it would cost more like 4T

Loel fucked around with this message at 00:01 on Sep 5, 2016

Shrecknet
Jan 2, 2005


Rafza posted:

I understand Hawaii got swallowed up (by the east coast of all things) but if Texas can have its own thing, I'd like to represent Hawaii. Hell, give me all of the Pacific territories while we're at it.

Aloha, motherfuckers.

Well then, lightning round time. Delegates have until 12:00am Tuesday morning (Pacific) to vote on this issue! I'm sending a form via PM, please don't break it.

OOC: Does anyone have an idea for how to effectively do polls and share them with the 10(11 soon?) posters? The PM system for SA is bunk because I have to send 10 messages, can't use commas in the recipients line. I guess GMail would work, but I don't have everyone's email yet.

Loel
Jun 4, 2012

"For the Emperor."

There was a terrible noise.
There was a terrible silence.



The Mafia games have one, let me check how they do it.

edit: So far Ive found

quote:

-To format your vote please type "##vote targetname" in bold ( [ b ] to bold, without the spaces, [ /b ] to close tags). ##unvote if you wish to remove your vote from someone but not put it on someone else yet.
but not where the vote goes...

edit 2: It looks like there is a bot that posts votes? https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3787500&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=8 Scroll down to 'votefinder'

edit 3: instructions here https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3729528#post447371443 but the person I asked said its down at the moment.

Loel fucked around with this message at 01:30 on Sep 5, 2016

Quorum
Sep 24, 2014

REMIND ME AGAIN HOW THE LITTLE HORSE-SHAPED ONES MOVE?
Tidewater is in strong support of this resolution. I'll be making an introductory post with a 101 guide to the states of Tidewater, our priorities as a region (for which I, again, encourage residents to get on the horn and pester me about), and other such cruft, probably tomorrow.

In the meantime, while an Islands and Territories bloc wouldn't be as populous as the others, all Americans should be represented at a Constitutional Convention of this sort. They can also represent the expat community if you like.

HiHo ChiRho
Oct 23, 2010

Aside from the status of where CT lies, My important issue as a resident of NYC/NE is this:

Mandatory service upon reaching the age of 18, but allow for service to be done through non military government institutions (Teach for America, Peace Corps, bring back the TVA, etc)

And fix the loving Tappan Zee already!! :argh:

Shrecknet
Jan 2, 2005


HiHo ChiRho posted:

Aside from the status of where CT lies, My important issue as a resident of NYC/NE is this:

Mandatory service upon reaching the age of 18, but allow for service to be done through non military government institutions (Teach for America, Peace Corps, bring back the TVA, etc)
Would you go so far as to say Service Guarantees Citizenship?

Loel
Jun 4, 2012

"For the Emperor."

There was a terrible noise.
There was a terrible silence.



Dr. Angela Ziegler posted:

Would you go so far as to say Service Guarantees Citizenship?

I would like to know more.

Loel
Jun 4, 2012

"For the Emperor."

There was a terrible noise.
There was a terrible silence.



Since a few people have mentioned it...

quote:

Appendix I to the 2nd American Constitution.

The following treaties are signed into with force of law, and are not considered a part of the Constitution.

1/6 Votes (RandomPaul)
UN Convention on the Rights of the Child
UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities
UN Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women
UN Convention on the Law of the Sea
UN International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights

0/6 Votes
Convention on Cluster Munitions
Ottawa Treaty
The Rome Statute

quote:

Appendix II to the 2nd American Constitution.

The Federal Government shall ensure infrastructure is maintained. In the year of 2016, the Federal Government shall follow the recommendations of the 2010 paper produced by the American Society of Civil Engineers, at an estimated cost of four trillion dollars.

0/6 votes random paul, seiferguy, xiahou dun, cat_herder?

Loel fucked around with this message at 02:30 on Sep 5, 2016

Xiahou Dun
Jul 16, 2009

We shall dive down through black abysses... and in that lair of the Deep Ones we shall dwell amidst wonder and glory forever.



HiHo ChiRho posted:

Aside from the status of where CT lies, My important issue as a resident of NYC/NE is this:

Mandatory service upon reaching the age of 18, but allow for service to be done through non military government institutions (Teach for America, Peace Corps, bring back the TVA, etc)

And fix the loving Tappan Zee already!! :argh:

They're actually halfway through building a brand new bridge right next to it. I pass it whenever I take Metro-North/am hideously and probably eventually fatally distracted by it whenever I drive across.

Also my current things to lobby for are (in no order and just to let my constituents know where I'm at) : infrastructure, universal rights, police reform, gun control, a real loving railway system god drat, education reform (especially at the college level ; your fault for letting an adjunct lecturer hold office), and some other poo poo that isn't springing to mind.

Full write-up on Tuesday when I'm in my office and not on a phone. Feel free to remind me of something I'm missing. Maybe selling Jersey to France????

O do we want to cross link to LAN threads, or will that just end in us all getting drowned in requests?

HiHo ChiRho
Oct 23, 2010

Xiahou Dun posted:

a real loving railway system god drat

Metro Fuckin North posted:

The Catenary Replacement Project
Replacement of century-old catenary wires continues with two tracks out-of-service between Southport and Bridgeport stations for the next few years and one track out of service between Stamford and South Norwalk, Track 4, the last of four tracks in the section to be replaced. That work will be completed this spring.
At the moment, about half of the New Haven Line in Connecticut is either out of service for repairs or operating under 100-year-old wire.
Catenary and bridge replacement projects will continue for years to come because the work must be phased to limit impacts on train service on the line, the busiest rail line in North America.

Never mind that the branch lines in CT are one track only for the most part, or that they have no electrical lines and rely on the archaic diesel trains. And when inclement weather comes along and those lines go down, the branch lines get bus service via NYC metro buses along windy hilly CT roads not meant for them and the main line gets the ol' reliable diesel trains that is why I drink and take the Harlem line now.

Also gently caress, no more bar cars.

RandomPauI
Nov 24, 2006


Grimey Drawer

backdoor communication to loel posted:

You know I support this, but my voters are knee-jerk against this. Publicly we'll both have to sell this hard and somehow bullshit an explanation about how this won't raise taxes and here are the safeguards we'll put in place to make sure that the locals spend the money as they see fit but also that there's complete transparency so no waste and so on. But I'll still take a hit and if I'm taking a hit I'll want something back.

The ASCE paper does not fully address the mitigation of the the consequences of natural disasters and my region has suffered greatly from them. I don't care if you figure out a way to include a disaster mitigation aspect in the appendix or if you support my move to create a quasi-military disaster response force or if you back me up in subsequent legislation so that following the recommendations somehow includes land mitigation and poo poo, but I gotta get something for this vote.

Loel
Jun 4, 2012

"For the Emperor."

There was a terrible noise.
There was a terrible silence.



Also, for people who want trains, the Amtrak Northeast corridor upgrade would cost 150B. https://www.amtrak.com/ccurl/453/325/Amtrak-Vision-for-the-Northeast-Corridor.pdf

QuoProQuid
Jan 12, 2012

Tr*ckin' and F*ckin' all the way to tha
T O P

As much as I love trains, transportation networks seem like a matter for an eventual legislature. It would set a dangerous precedent to enshrine pork-barrel projects into the national constitution.

Loel
Jun 4, 2012

"For the Emperor."

There was a terrible noise.
There was a terrible silence.



Thats why I have sections for 'this only counts as a law' or 'the govt will do x, with a 2016 budget of y' :D

cat_herder
Mar 17, 2010

BE GAY
DO CRIME


I'm ok with the military having a hand in disaster response. I'm already for nationalizing the police and ending the war on drugs in favor of legalization/evidence-based harm reduction.

Expanding public transportation, and rail in particular, is also a huge deal. Yes, it'll be expensive, but look at all the jobs it'll create.

the NCR is going to be a land-use and natural resources mess, so give me some time to read various state land management websites. I also encourage my constituents to talk about how land use affects them.

also also: Native American rights, and can we just give the tribes as much land as they want and then work around them?

(I'm trying to speed-read the treaties and will add my votes to those in a bit)

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HiHo ChiRho
Oct 23, 2010

QuoProQuid posted:

As much as I love trains, transportation networks seem like a matter for an eventual legislature. It would set a dangerous precedent to enshrine pork-barrel projects into the national constitution.

You would think this, and then we get into situations like now where legislature sits with a thumb under their rear end since transportation is always a boondoggle.

I, as a citizen of NYC am giving specific reasoning for why comprehensive transportation reform is important. I don't expect this congress to get everything written to a T about MTA and Metro North's problems, but I do expect that infrastructure be embedded into the constitution to ensure that future legislatures know that by neglecting them is unconstitutional.

Which they are now, and have been

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