|
 A huge number of people these days are engrossed in the quaint hobby of "prepping": the idea that by stockpiling ammunition and canned food, they can avoid the gritty reality of the complete collapse of civilization and somehow emerge victorious. So many, in fact, that the Climate Change thread attracts them like bees to a jar of honey. We needed to split off the discussion of the coming end times. This concept of has been around since the cold war, potentially sparked by government prepardness programs and later taken to wild extremes by some folk, but the 2008 economic collapse really kicked it into high gear for a new generation. The phenomenon has since appeared as dedicated television shows, spawned numerous blogspam fortunes, and at this point even those ultra-rich silicon valley Ayn Rand fans are happy to admit that they've dropped vast sums on personal bunkers fully stocked to ride out the end of the world. I guess looking at the arctic right now will do that to even the richest? Pretty hosed up mentality really, since once those supplies run out it's back to fighting your neighbors with clubs and roasting children over a campfire amidst the ashes of all which man hath wrought.   For the purposes of this thread we'll also include the sibling hobby of "bushcrafting", where hipsters and wealthy rednecks spend inordinate amounts of money on fancy axes and milsurp gear to go build a lovely lean-to in the forest and pretend they are totally a modern day Dick Proenneke. Are you a prepper / bushcrafter? Do you hold delusions that you can simply "live off the land" in the event of utter catastrophe? What are your plans for the coming end of civilization as we know it? Let us discuss. Rime fucked around with this message at 04:36 on Feb 23, 2017 |
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 04:32
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 27, 2024 02:18 |
|
|
[Saved for something.]
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 04:34
|
|
|
i and some friends are going to raid preppers for their supplies. good luck defending your canned beans from 20 heavily armed and well-trained raiders, dorks
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 04:36
|
|
|
I'm going to feast on long pork.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 04:40
|
|
|
I'm reading a book by a sociologist who spent time with survivalists. I'm only up to like the fifth page, but an interesting point he's made is that preppers/survivalists tread a fine line between optimism and despair. On the one hand, they firmly believe that society won't hold out and will collapse catastrophically. On the other hand, it will collapse in such a way that those who are prepared will ride it out victoriously. He's fairly sympathetic (or perhaps he's just even-handed and it reads as sympathetic to a right-hater like me), it's worth checking out his book if it's at your library: Dancing At Armageddon: Survivalism and Chaos in Modern Times by Richard G Mitchell Jr
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 04:42
|
|
|
My neighbor has a solar array so I guess I'd have to commandeer that. Not sure if it could power a fully fledged gaming rig but it could probably do a regular laptop. I figure I just stick with old games like Civ 1 and SimCity 2000 that don't require too much power. Solar panels last 20+ years - I'll be good.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 04:46
|
|
|
I read another book on prepping - forget the title now, will let you know when I get home - that tells you how to do things like purify water simply, make your own soap, blah-blah-blah... None of which was as interesting as the introduction which pointed out that there's really only one scenario in which society will collapse and you'll need to know/use this info. That scenario is a 'Captain Trips' scenario where plague wipes out everyone except a few immune people. Anything else - comet/nuclear war/eco-collapse... Sorry, we're all dead. While the subject of the government overstepping their bounds was outside the remit of the book, I think it's been convincingly argued that if the government of a country like America wants you dead, you're dead, and no bunker with 500 gal drums of mayonnaise is going to change that. So it's notable that preppers are basically preparing for a very narrow, specific scenario, unless you want to include Biblical Armageddon which leaves them on Earth for some reason. Who knows, maybe they do include that.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 04:49
|
|
|
i have spent the past two years in a rural area learning basic animal husbandry and breeding up a stock of chickens, quail, guinea fowl, sheep and goats to prepare myself for a life as a nomadic herder-gatherer
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 04:49
|
|
|
the motive for prepping is really about control, yeah. and i will delight in taking that facade of control away as i raid their shoddy little compounds
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 04:52
|
|
|
I live not too far away from the Federal Reserve bunker-turned-Library of Congress film preservation archive built into Mount Pony outside of Culpeper, Virginia. The facility includes vaults for the storage of volatile film and generators to last for ages, so I plan to set up shop there and form an order of peaceful monks worshiping a dogma based on a twisted misunderstanding of twentieth century American popular culture and subsisting off tithes given by warlords in exchange for cryptic advice from the Oracle, which is in fact a highly-degraded showing of several classic films spliced together in a room full of incense.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 04:54
|
|
|
expecting to remain stationary in the aftermath of a global crisis is the worst mistake anyone could make. creating a bunker will only protect you against nuclear fallout - planning your resources for maximum mobility will protect you against other people, which is what is going to get you in the end unless you live within a few miles of a major military target
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 04:55
|
|
|
i am the last and greatest prophet of the israelites. ask me anything
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 04:56
|
|
|
Who was the goon who put his life savings into prepping because Y2K was coming and then Y2K didn't happen so he became the resident forums expert on declaring bankruptcy?
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:03
|
|
|
Avshalom posted:i am the last and greatest prophet of the israelites. ask me anything How many guinea hens can I have before I have to get a cock?
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:04
|
|
|
each mormon household is expected to stock at least a year's worth of food. what do mormons know that we don't? makes u think
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:06
|
|
|
Starshark posted:How many guinea hens can I have before I have to get a cock?
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:22
|
|
|
I'm going to declare my hatred of all things that aren't vests, grab a shotgun, and go chill in a hospital with a twelve-fingered woman and a token minority.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:29
|
|
|
I've been reading books about nuclear war recently, various field manuals and government pamphlets put out in the 60s, 70s, and 80s. Basically the nuclear explosions aren't going to be nearly as devastating as the nuclear winter that follows for several years afterwards. The vast majority of deaths from nuclear war will be from starvation the next year as food runs out and massive crop failures occur. On the plus side: canned goods stay good for decades (not the pop-top ones, the regular cans) and perhaps even a century. They managed to yank some canned food out of a river barge that sunk in the Civil War and although the food inside was sludge and tasted like vinegar, it was still edible.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:31
|
|
|
Dehydrated food can last even longer than canned, as others have pointed out the real problem isn't stockpiling food, it's either remaining mobile or defending your hoard from raiders.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:36
|
|
|
Another thing that will kill a whole fuckton of people are communicable diseases. Everyone's going to have weakened immune systems from stress, lack of food, minor radiation poisoning, etc. They'll be stuck indoors in cramped living quarters and those are conditions ripe for bacteria and viruses to kill the poo poo out of you. It would greatly benefit any prepper to have a hearty stockpile of medical supplies like painkillers, antibiotics, alcohol (for trade, consumption, or sterilization), or even something as simple as Immodium or Loperamide because a lot of diseases kill you via diarrhea. Medicine would be worth its weight in gold. I'm assuming that most industrial production would be shut down due to electricity not being available.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:40
|
|
|
Rastor posted:Dehydrated food can last even longer than canned, as others have pointed out the real problem isn't stockpiling food, it's either remaining mobile or defending your hoard from raiders. Historically, when society has broken down, people band together to form ad-hoc militias that control and maintain order in a certain geographic area.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:44
|
|
|
nuclear winter isn't going to be as bad as it was predicted to be in the 80s and it won't be anything near the conditions in "the road" (which is the aftermath of a meteor strike, not a nuclear war - for a big meteor or even a supervolcano eruption the book is a lot more accurate). large-scale agriculture will definitely fail and yes that will result in massive food shortages and famines, but industrial food production will struggle on for the few decades it would take for the climate to recover and subsistence farming will still be possible. in fact war over the remaining food stores is going to claim more lives than if people just devoted that energy to maximising what production avenues they still have available. given that we're currently unable to devote any energy at all to coming up with a production system that doesn't wreck the biosphere and make the planet unliveable, i see no reason to think after a war would be any different - anyone who maintains any power will send militias in to grab other people's stored food instead of focusing on making their own. if you're going to die from a nuclear war or meteor strike or pandemic or anything like that, you'll either die from the source event within 24 hours or, if you survive, other humans will be your #1 threat. disease will be a very, very distant #2.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:44
|
|
|
quote:or even something as simple as Immodium or Loperamide because a lot of diseases kill you via diarrhea Please don't use Imodium for bacteria-related diarrhea without also using an antibiotic in parallel. Oh god, please don't do this. This hot new prepper tip brought to you by the maker of Imodium(R).
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:45
|
|
|
yeah, i and my extensive martial art/firearm training am your #1 threat by a huge margin
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:47
|
|
|
My idea is not dying immediately in whatever situation could occur. I believe people to be very clever and level headed when their rear end is on the line. So, the people that manage to survive the initial suicides, panic, and homicidal outbursts will inherit the wealth of materials to carry on. The prevailing thoughts on self-sufficiency doesn't make sense to me since the western world has a surplus of goods to be scavenged far easier than recreating medieval society. The major issue is how apocalypse will occur and how to survive the initial shock. Afterwards, the people with the will and character to survive probably will.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:51
|
|
|
i hear a lot of preppers loudmouthing about how much research they've done but how many of you have actually walked the barren plains with a flock of goats, living off the land and killing all in your path? not many i bet. but i have, and that is why i can never return to the city
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:53
|
|
|
temple posted:My idea is not dying immediately in whatever situation could occur. I believe people to be very clever and level headed when their rear end is on the line. So, the people that manage to survive the initial suicides, panic, and homicidal outbursts will inherit the wealth of materials to carry on.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:54
|
|
|
you've never even delivered twin lambs. you'd start crying at the sight of the afterbirth. "oh mother, that ghastly thing," you'd say "oh mother it's a meat fungus" but the only meat fungus here is you, weakblood
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 05:56
|
|
|
All I want out of survivalism is to survive a few months so I can learn what happened. I do not have enough wherewithal to keep on keeping on if I can't get bree cheese from the super market
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 06:00
|
|
|
I believe there will be a war like WWII in scale sometime in the next 20 years, and so I'm collecting food to help my neighbors/friends/family etc if there is a shortage.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 06:01
|
|
|
Everyone in this thread will be dead within twenty years.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 06:06
|
|
|
1. own gun at the end times 2. use gun to kill self most likely, anyway. survival instinct is tough to overcome, so i might stick it out til i'm starving/have been robbed/get murdered for my gun or something edit: my personal theory is that climate change is going to gently caress us, not nuclear war or a WW2 esque conflict. but maybe it'll lead to that. idk, i kinda think that fuel scarcity will play a huge role and ideally people would just go back to living in small dispersed farming communities, but hopefully not lovely ones with no sort of knowledge base on how to kill germs and whatnot Admiral Bosch fucked around with this message at 06:09 on Feb 23, 2017 |
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 06:06
|
|
|
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 06:29
|
|
|
I once discussed with a friend how removed from the context of your own life you could be before living was unbearable. So, we agreed that if we were transported back in time and forced to be a medieval peasant, life wouldn't really be worth living- even if your circumstances were physically bearable, being intellectually shipwrecked like that would make living impossible. The same would be true going forward in time- say if you were transplanted from our reality into one in which the present time is very similar, but the history of how everything got the way it is was different- that would be misery. Your self-esteem, your place in the causal chain of history, the sense of meaning you derive from human society- are gone. Surely a major historical discontinuity like nuclear war would have just as great an effect as these hypothetical examples. So thinking about it now, I don't know how "preppers" could carry with them all they know and have experienced into the apocalypse and expect to have the motivation to keep living. In science-fiction, the journey of space exploring pioneers is given meaning by the continued existence of the place they set out from. A prisoner of Bergen-Belsen can find meaning in their daily sufferings because there are things inside them that still correspond to a world outside the camp. If you are a prepper, there is nothing "outside" the discontinuity- you are just a soon-to-be mutant that is surviving until it's next meal. You would find my corpse about 10 minutes after I double check it is the apocalypse and not an April fools joke, is what I'm saying basically.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 06:33
|
|
|
We won't go back to the middle ages as a civilization. Probably late victorian ish.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 06:37
|
|
|
There's no reason to stop doing agriculture on an industrial scale unless so many people have died that you can no longer sustain any kind of industrial production. Like if we can't even produce a 1950s era tractor anymore. If that happens we're back to hunter gathering I guess but that's also an amazingly effective disaster to accomplish that.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 06:43
|
|
|
This is all you will ever need
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 06:50
|
|
|
Dilkington posted:Surely a major historical discontinuity like nuclear war would have just as great an effect as these hypothetical examples. Why would it? There would still be historical continuity; there was a nuclear war and now it is after the nuclear war. Survivors could easily find meaning rebuilding and the shared experiences they have with their fellow survivors of living through a nuclear war. It's not like the universe along with time itself would become fundamentally different just because nukes blew things up.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 06:55
|
|
|
Dilkington posted:I once discussed with a friend how removed from the context of your own life you could be before living was unbearable. So, we agreed that if we were transported back in time and forced to be a medieval peasant, life wouldn't really be worth living- even if your circumstances were physically bearable, being intellectually shipwrecked like that would make living impossible. This is a good point, but indeed that discontinuity may be the very thing most survivalists are seeking. As the synopsis from the book Starshark mentions: quote:Survivalists, Mitchell shows us, are seeking resistance, not struggling against it; they are looking for ways to define themselves and test their talents in a society that is becoming devitalized and formless. Is, thus, the rising popularity of such pursuits a natural reaction to a society in which scarcity has become largely unknown and the daily struggle to survive is removed for all except the most cripplingly poor? Is this seeking of discontinuity from the norm something which could be sustained post-collapse, then, or would most of these individuals break under the horror of their quaint power fantasy suddenly becoming reality? For my own part I have a firm belief that we're nearly three decades into a widespread systemic collapse of our global civilization at the fundamental levels, one which (when coupled with accelerating climate change) will result in widespread and prolonged socioeconomic distress across most of the west. I also think anyone going full prepper in the face of that is idiotic, as we're looking at something closer to what the former USSR experienced throughout the 1990's or which nations such as Venezuela are currently suffering. Having a basement full of ammunition isn't going to be of much help there, having a deep social network which you can rely on and a very strong mental library of tactics for self-sufficiency in the face of scarcity will be of considerably greater value. Especially since if nothing happens and civilization keeps trucking along just fine, you've sacrificed nothing financially, gained valuable life skills, and don't come across as a nutter. Bushcrafters annoy me. Possibly more than vampire LARPers, and that's saying something. 
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 06:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 27, 2024 02:18 |
|
|
when the end comes all you can rely on is your own body. without the system to buoy you up and plug your holes, can you stand naked in the company of your peers and proudly proclaim that, yes, you are a human? you're all psychologically dependent on cheap cotton garters. you can't even rig up your own drat balls to stop them swinging. you shave your pits. you hide your noble nipples. you disgust me
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2017 07:13
|
|