Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us $3,400 per month for bandwidth bills alone, and since we don't believe in shoving popup ads to our registered users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
«121 »
  • Post
  • Reply
PerrineClostermann
Dec 15, 2012

by FactsAreUseless


Gobbeldygook posted:

Yes, that's how a Red Queen's Race works.

You mean enough mining power is coming online that it's forcing a 25% reduction in payout week over week?

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Gobbeldygook
May 13, 2009

Hates Native American people and tries to justify their genocides.

Put this racist on ignore immediately!


PerrineClostermann posted:

You mean enough mining power is coming online that it's forcing a 25% reduction in payout week over week?
Yes. That is exactly what is happening.

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


shrike82 posted:

Thanks for that. Based on "For the median transaction size of 226 bytes, this results in a fee of 81,360 satoshis", am I right in saying that I'd need to "tip" 2 bucks and change to get my transaction thru a < 35 minute time window.

lol

much like with the growth in size of the Ethereum DAG file, Bitcoin eventually explodes because it holds a complete transaction record of everything ever and eventually regular people can no longer store a record and cryptographic signature for every pack of chewing gum ever bought on their hard drive, or at some point no longer even just withstand the load on their connection.

there are "disagreements" being "resolved" right now (brutal wars for control) between the Bitcoin Core devs and the miners. The core devs want Bitcoin to be a reserve currency where you resolve high-level transactions between other chains (aka make them rich), but they're pushing to fix a rather dumb flaw in the initial Bitcoin implementation (Transaction Malleability) that would enable off-chain transactions to work. Most people agree it's a dumb oversight that is now becoming a crippling flaw to scaling, but it would break some ASIC that is used by a huge percentage of the miners. The miners just want to be able to turn up block size, which works in a sense, but eventually you will only be able to hold this thing on your 48 TB RAID array - or you start trusting authoritative nodes or some other network consensus, which is also a centralization of power. But everybody mines on pools anyway so decentralization is mostly theoretical.

Bitcoin is kinda super hosed in general too, because the Chinese pools own some massive share of the hash power because it's all about who can make the fastest SHA ASIC and they do private runs of their designs. It's not remotely decentralized.

Ethereum meanwhile is about to probably undergo another fork over the whole POS switchover. I mean do you think miners are just going to give up this cash cow for decline in rewards and an eventual switchover to a totally different and unproven proof-of-stake system (that earns them nothing)? Ethereum classic is rather tainted because the DAO attacker made off with a huge fraction of the money supply (~15% IIRC) so there's no going back there. But do miners want "ethereum as it exists right now, making them lots of money"?

on top of that, the memory file that Ethereum needs to work eventually becomes huge too, and at some point it limits you to streaming over the PCIe bus (i.e. 16 GB/s or less for commodity equipment, which is 1/10-1/30th of current bandwidth), on an algorithm that is basically memory bottlenecked

so basically just like digital gold, real stable in value

Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at Jun 24, 2017 around 06:57

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


oh yeah and I forgot, proof of stake is basically just paying interest to every address based on its current balance so this is intended to make bitlords into moustached rentier-class gentlemen of leisure in 50 years

this is different, it's the good kind of inflation

Computer Serf
May 14, 2005
DIDN'T FOLLOW RSF RULES BUT GOT LUCKY AND INSTEAD OF GETTING BANNED GOT THIS SHITTY CUSTOM TITLE!! LOVES TO MASTURBATE @ ZOOS

Buglord

Why are you guys contributing to some scammy mining pool full of piss?

Why don't goons have their own pool for internet points?

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


Computer Serf posted:

Why are you guys contributing to some scammy mining pool full of piss?

Why don't goons have their own pool for internet points?

lay in a course for redtext

Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at Jun 24, 2017 around 06:49

PerrineClostermann
Dec 15, 2012

by FactsAreUseless


Gobbeldygook posted:

Yes. That is exactly what is happening.



Jesus Christ

Kazinsal
Dec 13, 2011



gently caress I'm glad I posted this thread, this poo poo's about to get fun.

Fauxtool
Oct 21, 2008



can you imagine being one of those guys that spent 10k on new equipment seeing that graph? Who am i kidding they wouldnt understand it and are totally oblivious to the 100% guaranteed near future insolvency of their operation

eames
May 9, 2009



I'm hoping it'll last a bit longer so the miners will start buying up 1080Ti that they'll have to sell in 2-3 months because they won't be profitable after power costs.

Kazinsal
Dec 13, 2011



eames posted:

I'm hoping it'll last a bit longer so the miners will start buying up 1080Ti that they'll have to sell in 1-2 months.

Same. If the timing is right I'll even be able to pick one up with the profits from the magic internet money.

This is the weirdest future.

Shrimp or Shrimps
Feb 14, 2012


eames posted:

I'm hoping it'll last a bit longer so the miners will start buying up 1080Ti that they'll have to sell in 2-3 months because they won't be profitable after power costs.

Ooh now THAT would be glorious. Cheap 1080tis for all.

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

Fuck your duck dynasty

Gobbeldygook posted:

Yes. That is exactly what is happening.



I feel bad for people who actually buy video cards just for mining. Their RROI is basically hosed without some kind of "oh Eth suddenly increased in value by 1000%" event. This same thing happened in Bitcoin but with ASICs; bitlords were buying ASIC mining hardware with no actual hope of ever, ever recouping their hardware costs because a bunch of guys in China started building huge warehouses full of ASICs

Fauxtool
Oct 21, 2008



ignoring statistics and not planning for likely future outcomes deserves ridicule not pity. Even buying 580s at retail price to mine with is a poor idea when you get more profit flipping them compared to what you would get mining for a month.

Fauxtool fucked around with this message at Jun 24, 2017 around 08:03

eames
May 9, 2009



QuarkJets posted:

I feel bad for people who actually buy video cards just for mining. Their RROI is basically hosed without some kind of "oh Eth suddenly increased in value by 1000%" event. This same thing happened in Bitcoin but with ASICs; bitlords were buying ASIC mining hardware with no actual hope of ever, ever recouping their hardware costs because a bunch of guys in China started building huge warehouses full of ASICs

Try this, some chinese company offering preorders for mining devices with a bunch of RX480 MXM modules, then hiking the price on already purchased devices and ultimately falling back to RX460 chips with late July delivery dates.
People apparently bought thosands of them.
Turns out they're "testing" and "burning in" customers devices in their own mining farm and start shipping them as they become unprofitable.
'course a couple of them burned down for good measure.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sefJNg8Bv5I




it gets better:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXY2I6wJJO8

eames fucked around with this message at Jun 24, 2017 around 08:25

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


eames posted:

Try this, some chinese company offering preorders for mining devices with a bunch of RX480 MXM modules, then hiking the price on already purchased devices and ultimately falling back to RX460 chips with late July delivery dates.
People apparently bought thosands of them.
Turns out they're "testing" and "burning in" customers devices in their own mining farm and start shipping them as they become unprofitable.
'course a couple of them burned down for good measure.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sefJNg8Bv5I




it gets better:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXY2I6wJJO8

Hah remember the other day when I said "why don't they make mxm modules for rack servers"

but with buttcoin, and also not with the water cooling I conceived of when I placed my finger upon that monkey's paw

let me guess, since they use EPYC those are going to be in shortage too? drat it Maxxbot

Fauxtool
Oct 21, 2008



all the mining hardware guys do that where they "test" the customer's stuff for a month and take the bulk of the profitable mining time.

Buttcoiners are generally pieces of poo poo who will try and cheat you at every chance because cutthroat business and no chargebacks. When it inevitably happens to them the whining is amazing.

MaxxBot
Oct 6, 2003

you could have clapped

you should have clapped!!


All of the 1070s and 1060s are now wiped out on nowinstock except for one selling for $800 lol, I really hope they do go for the 1080 Ti next as being able to get those cheap sometime down the line would be neat.

eames
May 9, 2009



trunk full of 44x GTX1060 purchased at 279 (~$310) yesterday

https://www.reddit.com/r/EtherMinin...r_first_7_rigs/

Fauxtool
Oct 21, 2008



$300 profit after a year, LOLOLOL

Its not even a gamble. He will barely break even and thats not even factoring in any new GPUs being released in the next year raising the difficulty even faster.

He still went for 1060s when the profit on 1070s is so much higher, god what a poor idiot

Fauxtool fucked around with this message at Jun 24, 2017 around 09:22

shrike82
Jun 11, 2005


makes you wonder how many opportunistic sysadmins or students are mining using their corporate or university CUDA racks on the down-low

Anime Schoolgirl
Nov 28, 2002

~perfect~
battlebrother





Gobbeldygook posted:

Yes. That is exactly what is happening.




zcash is a month behind but it's gonna happen soon, at least i'll get that new PSU

divabot
Jun 17, 2015

Assisted Living Dracula of Wikipedia

DO NOT BELIEVE THIS MAN'S LIE!
Statist shill spreading FUD!

HODL!!


shrike82 posted:

Thanks for that. Based on "For the median transaction size of 226 bytes, this results in a fee of 81,360 satoshis", am I right in saying that I'd need to "tip" 2 bucks and change to get my transaction thru a < 35 minute time window.

lol

pretty much. Bitcoin filled in mid-2015, and suddenly transactions went from super-cheap and super-fast to expensive and clogged. It basically hit a brick wall.

There are basically too many transactions for capacity, so users are having to guess higher and higher fees in the hope that their transaction will get through.

There are plans to expand Bitcoin's capacity:

1. Make the blocks bigger. This will hold off the brick wall for a short while, but make the blockchain even bigger and more unwieldy.
2. Bolt an altcoin on the side and do all the real transactions there. (sidechains)
3. Bolt a new network on the side and do all the real transactions there. (the Lightning Network)
4. Use a different coin that hasn't filled yet. This is what people are actually doing.

With all the ICOs, Ethereum is filling too. The Bancor and Status ICOs clogged the network for several hours. It's only going to get worse, not better.

Risky Bisquick
Jan 18, 2008

PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.


eames posted:

trunk full of 44x GTX1060 purchased at 279€ (~$310) yesterday

https://www.reddit.com/r/EtherMinin...r_first_7_rigs/

These people believe in hype

Tamba
Apr 5, 2010



eames posted:

trunk full of 44x GTX1060 purchased at 279 (~$310) yesterday

https://www.reddit.com/r/EtherMinin...r_first_7_rigs/

quote:

Just go to the site and put in the numbers please.

Edit: I know you won't do it, so here you go. http://imgur.com/a/xqLfS $12,500 profit in 12 months

You spent almost 14k on cards and that doesn't even count all the other rig parts.

You are going to work your rear end off for the Ethereum man like a real life miner and never even pay off the cards. Don't say "but the price will increase". If the price will increase, you should just go buy coins.

Dren
Jan 5, 2001



Pillbug

quote:

You are going to work your rear end off for the Ethereum man like a real life miner and never even pay off the cards.
Except unlike a real life miner the amount of wealth generated does not scale with the amount of work done. Cryptocoins are beautiful.

nerox
May 20, 2001


Fauxtool posted:

all the mining hardware guys do that where they "test" the customer's stuff for a month and take the bulk of the profitable mining time.

Buttcoiners are generally pieces of poo poo who will try and cheat you at every chance because cutthroat business and no chargebacks. When it inevitably happens to them the whining is amazing.

A business model pioneered by Butterfly Labs back in the bitcoin days. How is Butterfly labs doing these days?

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy...ut-it-cant-pay/

Harik
Sep 9, 2001


Oh god I'm touching the poop.

My card is only 2GB so it's about to stop doing anything, and I'm not buying another.

That said - claymore_zcash starts at 160/s then after a half hour it just goes "click" and the fans start to spin down and it ends up at ~88/s instead. Thermals only get to ~72C so I don't think it's that, but maybe?

Is there a way to feed the environment variables from inside nicehash or should I just write a batch file and run it directly? I think it's not reserving enough system RAM or something.

Cygni
Nov 12, 2005

raring to post



eames posted:

trunk full of 44x GTX1060 purchased at 279 (~$310) yesterday

https://www.reddit.com/r/EtherMinin...r_first_7_rigs/

I think my favorite part is I picked up a 1060 8 months ago for $205. I'm sure buying all these video cards at a $100+ premium late into their lives will work out great...

Spatial
Nov 15, 2007



It's all happening again. Haha, I can't believe it. Bring on the milk crates and start drying out those berries!

Spatial
Nov 15, 2007



Shrimp or Shrimps posted:

Ooh now THAT would be glorious. Cheap 1080tis for all.
Cheap damaged 1080s with a severely reduced lifespan and no warranty.

Never trust an ether huffer.

Comfy Fleece Sweater
Apr 2, 2013

FOUNDER AND PRESIDENT OF THE KUATO FAN CLUB 4/2/13-PRESENT

KUATO IS MY HERO! AMA!


Yeah I don't know if I'd trust buying a used GPU, specially one used for mining

craig588
Nov 19, 2005



The 290s turned out fine. Hardware is usually made to be used. I know people who bought 200 dollar 290s in 2014 when people were panic selling them that were still using those cards very recently, until they sold them for more than they paid and updated to a 1070 basically for free.

MaxxBot
Oct 6, 2003

you could have clapped

you should have clapped!!


I wouldn't buy a used mining GPU for anywhere near MSRP but if it's 50% MSRP like the used 290s were it's worth the risk. Hardware is more resilient than people think.

NJD2005
Sep 3, 2006
...

craig588 posted:

The 290s turned out fine. Hardware is usually made to be used. I know people who bought 200 dollar 290s in 2014 when people were panic selling them that were still using those cards very recently, until they sold them for more than they paid and updated to a 1070 basically for free.

Exactly what I did, also you buy the EVGA and MSI cards first as those are under warranty through the serial number.

craig588
Nov 19, 2005



Checked in on how my machines were doing, after 2 weeks looks like it might be about time to me to bow out. Made about 100 dollars which was fun, but now my 980 is doing about 2.50 a day and my 1080 about 4 dollars a day. I'll probably drop out my 980 next week and my 1080 might get one extra week. See you next bubble!

MaxxBot
Oct 6, 2003

you could have clapped

you should have clapped!!


My profitability is still pretty good but I'm gonna sell my RX 580 because I don't think these super inflated prices on AMD cards are gonna last much longer. Their Eth mining capability is gonna start degrading pretty quickly.

1gnoirents
Jun 28, 2014

ASK ME ABOUT MY MICRO PENIS


Comfy Fleece Sweater posted:

Yeah I don't know if I'd trust buying a used GPU, specially one used for mining

I didnt either but turns out even the "cheapest" AMD crap-brands (with no greenlight program to boot) survived happily. "Burning out" or "wearing out" isn't a real thing in this scope, in fact it was joked that a buttmining card was basically proof that the GPU core was actually sound. The only thing that failed were the only moving part - the fan.

But yes, even you will buy a 1070 at $138, do not lie

LRADIKAL
Jun 10, 2001

A Very Useful Person

Fun Shoe

Attempting to flip my MSI 1070 that I bought last month for $300. They're going for 500 used on ebay right now lol. Gonna pick up a 1080 TI all the while mining currency!

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

MaxxBot
Oct 6, 2003

you could have clapped

you should have clapped!!


Yeah this is probably the best possible time to flip a 1070

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply
«121 »