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Cavalry are always a pain but besides Bretonnia and maybe Demigryphs, Black Knights as VC is my go-to cavalry option. You can go full skelespam I guess but cavalry has two huge advantages: you get to run down fleeing units which means lord kills are easier and you can weaken the opponent a lot more in situations where you have to fight them twice and bother are tough fights; and you make early-game sieges a lot easier by stacking every unit on one side of the battlefield then breaking down the gate on the other side and getting cavalry in. Dire Wolves can do the first but they literally fall over to archers or any opposition (same for bats) and they can't do the latter effectively at all. Since VC has no range, can't cast their good killing spells on walls and won't have flying mounts for the lords early on, you're basically forced to either break in with a mobile army and run rampant on the AI or else just throw everything at the walls and hope you don't take too many casualties. My most recent Mannfred campaign I've had 4x Black Knights in his army and they've been MVP for sure. Gotta phase them out though, you can use Blood Knights later on but they're not as good since A: they're tougher than Black Knights but not as much as the enemy troops are tougher than swordmen and orc boys and the like and B: low model count is so painful.
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Aug 8, 2020 21:22
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WTF is a cost effective counter to blood knights for Norsca? I've tried all three flavors of skin wolves, the were kin hero, spearmen, Javs, I dunno what to do. Maybe great weapon Fimir?
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Aug 8, 2020 22:15
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Cpt_Obvious posted:WTF is a cost effective counter to blood knights for Norsca? I've tried all three flavors of skin wolves, the were kin hero, spearmen, Javs, I dunno what to do. Maybe great weapon Fimir? Mammoths, probably.
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Aug 8, 2020 22:23
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Aug 8, 2020 22:26
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I mean I dunno if mammoths are cost effective but I recommend one in every army as Norsca. They’re drat useful for sieges and dealing with otherwise tricky units Norsca has no answer to.
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Aug 8, 2020 22:28
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Cpt_Obvious posted:WTF is a cost effective counter to blood knights for Norsca? I've tried all three flavors of skin wolves, the were kin hero, spearmen, Javs, I dunno what to do. Maybe great weapon Fimir? Probably more skinwolves, ideally with fimir mixed in, but they're still going to take a lot of damage from blood knights and their bonus v. large. Blood knights are in the running for top tier cavalry for a reason. E: a thin screen of spearmen to eat the charge and some javelins first should help a lot if you're looking for cost-effectiveness.
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Aug 8, 2020 22:43
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The internet told me to spam war mammoths as norsca.
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Aug 8, 2020 23:09
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Blood Knights are a best-in-class unit thanks to great stats and the Lore of Vampires. You can pressure them a little with armor piercing skirmishers like axe throwers or javelins. But you will need to kill the character presumably spamming Invocation of Nehek on them, probably with Wulfrik and a skinchanger. Then it’s just a matter of blocking the charge and getting something else to grind them down.
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Aug 8, 2020 23:31
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SHISHKABOB posted:The internet told me to spam war mammoths as norsca. It will solve any problem you encounter. I don't make all my armies mammoth armies, but once Chaos is gone and you get -75% upkeep I always have a bunch I use to easily win every siege.
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Aug 9, 2020 00:04
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An all-mammoth army is the Norsca cheesestack.
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Aug 9, 2020 00:05
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DOCTOR ZIMBARDO posted:Blood Knights are a best-in-class unit thanks to great stats and the Lore of Vampires. You can pressure them a little with armor piercing skirmishers like axe throwers or javelins. But you will need to kill the character presumably spamming Invocation of Nehek on them, probably with Wulfrik and a skinchanger. Then it’s just a matter of blocking the charge and getting something else to grind them down. They have pretty poor armor piercing overall so blocking them up with armored infantry like Marauder Champions and then blocking them in with Fimir or Armored Skinwolves leaves them pretty anemic.
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Aug 9, 2020 00:14
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Blood Knights are one of those units that are so good you need multiple units or purpose-built heroes. Other similar units: carnosaurs, mammoths. Skinwolves, champions, and javelins are great. You could also have 2 skinwolves and champions wear them down.
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Aug 9, 2020 00:43
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Great weapon fimir are perfect for killin blood knights. The RoR gets stalk too so they can't as easily avoid them. fe: the AP ranged are okay too but I never enjoy plinking down things that will get neheked. This is probably not a big deal in campaign though.
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Aug 9, 2020 01:01
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jokes posted:Blood Knights are one of those units that are so good you need multiple units or purpose-built heroes. Other similar units: carnosaurs, mammoths. Though as mentioned, a huge part of of why Blood Dragons can feel so good is that they're guaranteed to be in an army with someone who can cast Nehek, which is also a loving amazing spell.
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Aug 9, 2020 02:21
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Tfw the Nehekarans don't have the invocation of Nehek :thinking:
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Aug 9, 2020 02:36
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SHISHKABOB posted:Tfw the Nehekarans don't have the invocation of Nehek :thinking: it is weird they don't. i know it's just a tabletop thing and that the factions are balanced around vampires having easy healing and tomb kings not, but it is weird. arkhan can use lore of vampires in the uh, lore, but can't use it on the tabletop or in total war warhammer. he's the second best necromancer after nagash, but has no actual necromancy spells in-game.
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Aug 10, 2020 05:40
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The modern tomb kings explicitly don’t use that kind of necromancy though, so they really shouldn’t have it. Well kind of, I remember stories being pretty inconsistent about whether or not liche priests can easily rez people, but the idea is that they’re binding actual souls back to the bodies instead of just driving skeletons around like so many drones. That’s ultimately a tabletop conceit but like, so is all the lore. Why is a skeleton scarier than a chaos knight? I think the name is a legacy from “Undead” days because Invocation of Whoever is the standard TK spell name yeah Edgar Allen Ho fucked around with this message at 09:15 on Aug 10, 2020 |
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Aug 10, 2020 09:13
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Tomb King magic was quite different back in their 6e army book, and did include a heal, so Invocation of Nehek makes a bit more sense in that context.
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Aug 10, 2020 09:25
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In my Clan Mors game I'm rolling up on Karaz-a-Karak and trying to do a fuckload of damage to them so I can get Peace which will let me focus on one of the other Ordertide asswipes harrassing me. Fortunately, I seem to be getting the hang of Weapons Team-heavy armies and using them to obliterate a couple of full stacks of bearded twats on ambush each turn. It's a pain, though. I've pushed up as far as the Silver Road, but while I was doing that they confederated Greybeard's Prospectors and are now using those settlements to churn full stacks out of the desert's anus every turn.
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Aug 10, 2020 11:42
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kingturnip posted:It's a pain, though. I've pushed up as far as the Silver Road, but while I was doing that they confederated Greybeard's Prospectors and are now using those settlements to churn full stacks out of the desert's anus every turn. Its the worst once they've confederated Angrund and have the Ghost Dwarf agents running around forever being annoying as gently caress.
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Aug 10, 2020 12:31
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Seems odd they're doing an update for just Wood Elves and whoever the core 2 race that's getting another Legendary Lord. Kinda makes me wonder if development for 3 has been delayed enough that the "2 more packs" statement from before the Grom dlc is no longer the plan and they might be doing a bit more dlc for 2. They did say they wanted all the factions to be in a somewhat good place before 3 comes out and after the WE pack that'd be the Beastmen and Chaos left right? They're doing that slightly odd physical release of 1 that has Chaos and Beastmen in it which is a bit odd since they are currently the least impressive DLC. I really did expect a Wood Elf/Beastman pack tbh so curious what's gonna be in the Wood Elf pack that'll make me want to buy it.
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Aug 10, 2020 13:05
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thebardyspoon posted:Seems odd they're doing an update for just Wood Elves and whoever the core 2 race that's getting another Legendary Lord
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Aug 10, 2020 13:15
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thebardyspoon posted:Seems odd they're doing an update for just Wood Elves and whoever the core 2 race that's getting another Legendary Lord. Kinda makes me wonder if development for 3 has been delayed enough that the "2 more packs" statement from before the Grom dlc is no longer the plan and they might be doing a bit more dlc for 2. That's the part that has me most excited for the Wood elf DLC to be honest. I'm not thrilled by WH2's endgame of "ranged doomstacks" and WElves are obviously good at that already, but in general the DLCs have been excellent and imaginative and since there's nothing obvious to add, they're either going to add shitall (which is out of character for them so far) or something unexpected and great.
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Aug 10, 2020 13:15
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AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:Why? This is how pretty much every single DLC has worked. Well if you read the rest of my post I expand on that one sentence. Since they said that there were only going to be 2 more lord packs AND that they want every faction to be in a good place it seems odd to make one just for Wood Elves as potentially the last piece of DLC. Also, pretty much none of the DLC has worked like this one??? It's all been either a full new faction DLC pack or a dual lord pack that adds lords and units/RORs for two factions at the same time? This one is solely Wood Elves DLC for an already DLC faction with the free lord being for one of the 2 races (that part is usual yeah) and then there's some sort of bonus if you own all of the DLC for the game as well. They even acknowledged that it was a very unusual DLC offering in their announcement page. Ravenfood posted:That's the part that has me most excited for the Wood elf DLC to be honest. I'm not thrilled by WH2's endgame of "ranged doomstacks" and WElves are obviously good at that already, but in general the DLCs have been excellent and imaginative and since there's nothing obvious to add, they're either going to add shitall (which is out of character for them so far) or something unexpected and great. Yeah I'm excited for it as well. Odd doesn't mean bad, just odd. Just was hoping the Beastmen would get some love as well really. thebardyspoon fucked around with this message at 13:25 on Aug 10, 2020 |
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Aug 10, 2020 13:22
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thebardyspoon posted:Well if you read the rest of my post I expand on that one sentence. Since they said that there were only going to be 2 more lord packs AND that they want every faction to be in a good place it seems odd to make one just for Wood Elves as potentially the last piece of DLC. Its not DLC-for-DLC because, just like the addition of Markus Wulfhart, you can play this DLC without owning any other content - you do not need to own anything relating to Total Warhammer 1 in order to be able to use this DLC in game 2. However, they are tying the FLC LL to owning WH1 content, which is the only difference worth mentioning to me
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Aug 10, 2020 13:42
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Oh poo poo, I looked back at the blog and I had got it wrong. I totally thought the free lord was the core Warhammer 2 race revisit and the actual paid part was purely Wood Elves stuff. Sorry for the snark there.
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Aug 10, 2020 13:56
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thebardyspoon posted:Oh poo poo, I looked back at the blog and I had got it wrong. I totally thought the free lord was the core Warhammer 2 race revisit and the actual paid part was purely Wood Elves stuff. Sorry for the snark there. 
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Aug 10, 2020 14:02
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thebardyspoon posted:Oh poo poo, I looked back at the blog and I had got it wrong. I totally thought the free lord was the core Warhammer 2 race revisit and the actual paid part was purely Wood Elves stuff. Sorry for the snark there. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that the Wood Elf part of the DLC comes with a Vortex start for Wood Elves and an associated LL, and another paid DLC lord for an as-yet-unnamed race (though my guess is its for the same one getting a revisit) that's their antagonist faction. My guess is Throt the Unclean leading Moulder with Skaven getting the rework, since they're on the same continent as the Bowmen of Oreon in Vortex and while they don't really need a rework they fit best for WE antagonist factions and are notably missing both on Vortex and ME. I suppose Throt could still come in as a DLC faction while another faction gets the rework treatment, but in both previous Lord packs featuring WH1 races, one of the headline Lords' races got the rework. And their dev blog post explicitly says that the WH2 core race revisit is different from the WH1-style WE revisit. In either case, if the Skaven don't get it, I think the Lizardmen do. As far as I know, the DLC is a new Vortex/ME Wood Elf LL with new mechanics and an LL for an unknown faction. There's also a free race revisit for an unknown WH2 race that could be (probably is) the same race as the unknown LL faction, a free ME Wood Elf rework in addition to the new Vortex Wood Elf faction, and a FreeLC LL for the Athel Loren-style Wood Elves if you own the WH1 Wood Elves DLC. Everyone also gets a FreeLC hero of unknown race. It feels very much in line with both the Hunter/Beast and Grim/Paunch DLCs except the FreeLC is tied to owning WH1+first WE DLC. e: I see you already have thoroughly discussed this. Chaos/Beastmen not getting reworks when they're pretty much in the worst state of any of the factions (WE aside) kind of sucks but maybe they'll include those in WH3 first thing. Ravenfood fucked around with this message at 14:35 on Aug 10, 2020 |
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Aug 10, 2020 14:33
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SHISHKABOB posted:Tfw the Nehekarans don't have the invocation of Nehek :thinking: Any weirdness with that sort of magic can be easily blamed on Nagash being a terrible terrible rear end in a top hat. The kind who would waste world changing magic to petty spite people because they angered him one time, much less say resisted his reign of terror or anything like that.
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Aug 10, 2020 14:51
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The vampires probably gave it that name to be a dick to the nehekarans.
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Aug 10, 2020 14:53
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https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2191557420&searchtext= Kislev
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Aug 10, 2020 16:54
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Wow it actually looks... great!? Wonder if it'll get variants for SFO and poo poo?
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Aug 10, 2020 17:08
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Kaiju Cage Match posted:https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2191557420&searchtext= Is this the mod that was shown off in a PartyElite (I think) YouTube clip earlier?
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Aug 10, 2020 18:03
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Probably, the first two videos on that steam page are YouTube videos from the usual bunch trying it out. Looks like the one, I’ve seen a bunch of times.
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Aug 10, 2020 19:14
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Ravenfood posted:Yeah, I'm pretty sure that the Wood Elf part of the DLC comes with a Vortex start for Wood Elves and an associated LL, and another paid DLC lord for an as-yet-unnamed race (though my guess is its for the same one getting a revisit) that's their antagonist faction. My guess is Throt the Unclean leading Moulder with Skaven getting the rework, since they're on the same continent as the Bowmen of Oreon in Vortex and while they don't really need a rework they fit best for WE antagonist factions and are notably missing both on Vortex and ME. I suppose Throt could still come in as a DLC faction while another faction gets the rework treatment, but in both previous Lord packs featuring WH1 races, one of the headline Lords' races got the rework. And their dev blog post explicitly says that the WH2 core race revisit is different from the WH1-style WE revisit. In either case, if the Skaven don't get it, I think the Lizardmen do. i am very excite for the thread title to change to "Total War: Warhammer 2 - Orion Crushes The Asur Scum Between His Massive Thighs" or the new WE lord, hopefully they will also have massive bare thighs with bulging green veins
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Aug 10, 2020 19:32
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I'm pretty sure Tomb Kings magic back in 6th was almost entirely "cast spell on unit to hit again/shoot again" or "cast spell to walk again", and because I knew nothing of Tomb Kings since buying in at that time, I was confused when that *wasn't* their entire spell list. That and Settra being able to have Liche Priests in his army at all, since he couldn't back in the day. You know what, I'm surprised the Hieratic Hierarchy didn't also make it in, in some weird form or another, speaking of weird rules.
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Aug 10, 2020 22:30
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AtomikKrab posted:Any weirdness with that sort of magic can be easily blamed on Nagash being a terrible terrible rear end in a top hat. The kind who would waste world changing magic to petty spite people because they angered him one time, much less say resisted his reign of terror or anything like that. He got godlike power, and then he started to abuse it. Just like in real world mythology where the gods mostly use their powers to be spiteful, petty assholes. "Your a better weaver then me? Bam, now your a spider." And Athena was one of the nicer gods.
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Aug 11, 2020 01:25
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If I'm playing Grimgor, have an army with empty slots, finished a waagh! a few turns ago, and I'm in a province I control, is there any reason why I would not be able to recruit regiments of renoun? All it says is that they are not available.
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Aug 11, 2020 01:56
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Man does Thorgrim have it rough ever since the greenskin buff. 
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Aug 11, 2020 02:47
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Kaiju Cage Match posted:Man does Thorgrim have it rough ever since the greenskin buff.
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Aug 11, 2020 02:59
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