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Not defending cyclists hooning through crossings when the pedestrian lights are green, but cyclists absolutely should be able to go through those at a sensible pace. Maybe have a law that they should have to treat it like a stop sign or something instead - come to a complete stop at the light then go through with the pedestrians. AFAIK cyclists are currently treated exactly the same as vehicles by the road rules?
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Jun 19, 2018 03:28
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bike tory posted:AFAIK cyclists are currently treated exactly the same as vehicles by the road rules? Yep, they are required to follow all the same rules as they are vehicles on the road.
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Jun 19, 2018 03:31
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When I said "through the pedestrian crossings" I didn't mean opportunistically taking a green walk signal to cross parallel with the pedestrians - I meant turning on a red to ride perpendicular into the pedestrians crossing on a green walk.
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Jun 19, 2018 03:41
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An idiot on a bike though is only gonna get themselves killed, an idiot driving a car is going to kill someone or multiple someone elses and that is what is frustrating. Moaning about someone on a bike trying to use the awful infrastructure in a safe way distracts from the actual problem that someone else commented on earlier, tbe power imbalance. When I ride my bike I follow the road rules where they suit, and don't where they will get me killed by an rear end in a top hat in a ute who is livid that I took the lane to make a turn, or hit by someone not looking before opening their car door. The kids cross the road at the intersection near us somewhat unsafely, and I don't blame them. The nearest marked crossing is 100m away across another roundabout. It would add 5 minutes to a walk. The infrastructure is poo poo but the situation being what it is, the kid will get killed when they get hit by a car because of the speed limit, the design of the intersection and the inattention of the driver. That is the problem, a mistake or error in judgement causes death, not injury or fear. And in NZ the solution is to blame the victim.
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Jun 19, 2018 03:48
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BARONS CYBER SKULL posted:I'm unwilling to play chicken with a truck in my car, you'd think a 50kg soychild on his precious upcycled bike would be more wary of a car too. Right, but again, that does nothing to show an equivalency between the behaviour of NZs drivers, who are wholly responsible for 63% of crashes involving an injured cyclist, and partially responsible for 77% of such crashes, and cyclists.
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Jun 19, 2018 03:50
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LoudPipesSaveLives posted:When I ride my bike I follow the road rules where they suit Ok so we all just get to pick when the road rules matter, not understanding that if everyone just actually followed them properly, prediction of action is far easier meaning it's safer?
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Jun 19, 2018 03:54
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LoudPipesSaveLives posted:Moaning about someone on a bike trying to use the awful infrastructure in a safe way distracts from the actual problem that someone else commented on earlier, tbe power imbalance.
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Jun 19, 2018 03:56
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Ghostlight posted:Do you think it's okay to moan about them using the awful infrastructure in an unsafe way though. It's fine, of course, but its the way that it gets brought up in every comment thread/Hosking rant as a totally equivalent answer to people complaining about the loving insanely abusive and downright violent behaviour of NZ drivers towards cyclists that sticks in my throat.
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Jun 19, 2018 03:59
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I don't really know what you mean. Yeah I don't follow the rules all the time when I cycle because they aren't written for me, they are written for cars and stretched to fit bikes. They are written for roads which were built for all but with such a huge bias toward motor vehicles that most other forms of travel are unsafe on them. Yes, if everyone followed all the rules all the time life would be great. My point is, if I follow the rules all the time and someone else doesn't, I die. If they follow the rules and I don't, I die. That is the point I am trying to make. This discussion is loving pointless anyway, it regressed the way it always does 'people are dying on the roads, we could do something about it but one time I saw a cyclist do something unsafe so poo poo let's just stick with how things are and keep killing and dying'. Like yeah it'd be great too if women could walk home after dark without worrying about rape and murder, if everyone follow the rules of society life would be great. But people don't and you either try to change society actively and consciously while also doing what is necessary to stay alive or say gently caress it she shouldn't have dressed like that. And before anyone has a go at me I am not saying rape and death by car are the same, I'm making a comparison as sometimes you can make people think differently by doing so.
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Jun 19, 2018 04:11
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Pararoid posted:It's fine, of course, but its the way that it gets brought up in every comment thread/Hosking rant as a totally equivalent answer to people complaining about the loving insanely abusive and downright violent behaviour of NZ drivers towards cyclists that sticks in my throat. You are so much better at this than I am.
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Jun 19, 2018 04:40
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I too hate that when someone brings up cycling some joker will almost always bring up some dumb story about how they were midly inconvenienced by a cyclist bending the rules or that they saw a cyclist break a rule and it's like gently caress stop being so defensive. We are talking about bad drivers, and besides bad cyclists are never going to kill anyone. It's a false equivalency. I've had cars try and pass me on intersections and roundabouts, and I've hit them or they've narrowly avoided hitting me. I've had car actively try and run me off the road because I dared to ride in the middle of the bus/cycle lane on Kent terrace at 6:30 am with two other empty lanes. I've had drivers get out of their car ahead of me to start a fight for doing the same thing. There is nothing a cyclist can do that can equal an irate driver. loving slow down.
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Jun 19, 2018 05:13
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I totally agree cyclists get a bad rap but in countries where cycling is really common there are absolutely cyclist on pedestrian fatal crashes. Obviously it's less likely than a car, but let's not pretend a cyclist can't kill a pedestrian.
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Jun 19, 2018 05:57
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BARONS CYBER SKULL posted:I'm unwilling to play chicken with a truck in my car, you'd think a 50kg soychild on his precious upcycled bike would be more wary of a car too. Yeah, but then you also get the fuckbags who ride 3 or 4 abreast or adjacent to the cycle lane during rush hour traffic. gently caress OFF.
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Jun 19, 2018 06:00
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It is actually the cars who should gently caress off. 
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Jun 19, 2018 06:06
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Ghostlight posted:It is actually the cars who should gently caress off. We can settle this with a joust You on your bike, me in my car
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Jun 19, 2018 06:22
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Can I just beat up the both of you and claim a draw? My request for a communal punching bag got shouted down and work's been hell.
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Jun 19, 2018 07:05
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I don't have a bike so I'll meet you on the plain of battle in your choice of an AT bus or train.
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Jun 19, 2018 07:41
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I'm taking a bus into my new job in town.  Admittedly a part of the reason is parking in Tauranga (or anywhere downtown in NZ) is a nightmare, but hey!
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Jun 19, 2018 08:37
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I'm just gonna 666 hail satan etc to get through another day.
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Jun 19, 2018 09:11
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I did a u turn on a long road with a cyclist coming towards me and i miscalculated how fast he was coming and he had to swerve round me and yelled at me (fair enough), then i was following him and he kept looking round and i realised he was probably worried I'd rage out at him so i pulled over for a bit.
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Jun 19, 2018 09:17
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That's my cyclist story i guess cheers
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Jun 19, 2018 09:17
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Anticheese posted:I'm taking a bus into my new job in town. The Tauranga busses are awful. I saved myself 90 minutes a day by driving and I was able to get on at the end of my road and walk 2 minutes to work on the other side without changing busses. Cannot wait to get out of here.
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Jun 19, 2018 10:22
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Themes posted:The Tauranga busses are awful. I saved myself 90 minutes a day by driving and I was able to get on at the end of my road and walk 2 minutes to work on the other side without changing busses. Yeah there's basically nothing here in this godforsaken beautiful terrible place unless all you do all day is drink coffee. It's been a nightmare finding work and never once was there a listing locally. I got this one through sheer dumb luck. And even still it's a temporary part-time contract 
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Jun 19, 2018 10:35
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That sums it up pretty well.
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Jun 19, 2018 11:26
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Just remember in the cyclist vs driver debate, Whale Oil is on the side of the drivers. Also I rode a bike once and too many cars tried to kill me so I gave up and took the bus instead.
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Jun 19, 2018 22:35
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Somewhere in transit NZ there are probably a bunch of engineers who know how things are done in cycle friendly places like the Netherlands who are in despair as we keep on adding cycle lanes to our busiest roads with parked cars on one side and moving cars on the other.
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Jun 19, 2018 23:06
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Unfortunately the only roads in Auckland that go in a straight line for an appreciable distance *are* the main roads, everything else is twisty cul de sacs as far as the eye can see. Auckland is a very badly designed city, even accounting for the awkward geography
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Jun 19, 2018 23:20
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The cycleway they added on Nelson St is a work of art. It's got solid traffic barriers to protect cyclists, yet it's also bi-directional so if there's two cyclists passing each other it's quite tight, then at Victoria it just changes sides of the road because the rental car place wouldn't stop parking their car delivery trucks in the way so you have to cross diagonally to continue down where, finally, near the bottom of Nelson St they literally just give up and divert it onto the footpath complete with hotglued lumpy fake tiles as an outline to where you're supposed to be.
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Jun 19, 2018 23:34
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The ugly truth is that in this country anything that helps cyclists along is going to take away from motorists simply because since the 1940s the motorcar has had absolute priority and has taken up every available space. It won't happen unless things change somehow that people start seeing it as normal to say pop down to the shops or visit a friend on the bike [e:] and build a demand for more normalized cycling
Jaguars! fucked around with this message at 00:09 on Jun 20, 2018 |
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Jun 20, 2018 00:03
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Even when it doesn't though, drivers still loose their poo poo. Look at the island bay cycle way, the swapped the bike lane and the car parks position and the drivers lost nothing but a few parks and they are still talking court action years later.
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Jun 20, 2018 00:24
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My idea to fix driving in NZ in the span of one generation: At 15 you can get a motorcycle license (with size/power restrictions obviously). At 20 you can get a car license. That's it.
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Jun 20, 2018 03:01
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Slavvy posted:My idea to fix driving in NZ in the span of one generation: That certainly would thin out the driver's numbers.
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Jun 20, 2018 03:05
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Slavvy posted:My idea to fix driving in NZ in the span of one generation: Killing off half of the driving population seems a bit of an extreme measure to remove cars from the road
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Jun 20, 2018 03:33
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Why bother passing a full license for a crippled motorcycle when you can just do your learners and gently caress about on a moped.
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Jun 20, 2018 03:43
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gently caress Winston Peters, easiest moral issue of our time and he is all wishy washy about it. When National, Green and Labour are on the same page on an issue chances are there is something there. https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/poli...silent-on-issue
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Jun 20, 2018 05:05
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What the actual gently caress, they're separating kids from their parents at the border and putting them in cages? And we're calling it "inhumane?" It's loving monstrous, that's some Handmaid's Tale level poo poo
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Jun 20, 2018 07:14
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Next week everyone will have forgotten and moved onto the next thing media is telling them to be outraged about.
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Jun 20, 2018 07:30
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truther posted:Next week everyone will have forgotten and moved onto the next thing media is telling them to be outraged about. I'm alright with being outraged about this tbh
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Jun 20, 2018 07:34
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reminder that aotearoa new zealand also imprisons asylum seekers (like, in jail) while their claims are being assessed
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Jun 20, 2018 07:46
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exmarx posted:reminder that aotearoa new zealand also imprisons asylum seekers (like, in jail) while their claims are being assessed Do we tell them we are taking the kids for a bath (((shower))) then deport the parents while leaving the kids in a detention centre? Yes our immigration and asylum systems are bad. This is another level and if you aren’t angry about it you need some serious self reflection.
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Jun 20, 2018 08:22
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