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I had purchased Sekiro shortly after release having loved Bloodborne and (at the time) never having played any other Fromsoft game. I immediately bounced off of it in frustration at Lady Butterfly in Hirata Estates. Fast forward to having beaten Elden Ring with nearly every possible build I'd want to so I started Sekiro again and am now stuck in Hirata Estates....at Owl Father. At some point after banging my head against Genichiro, the combat just clicked and everything has gone smoothly. I seriously regret not coming back to this game sooner
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Mar 19, 2024 20:44
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I beat the bull but it's def my least favorite fight so far. I just chased it around cutting it on the rear end and then jumped off walls frantically when the camera got blocked. Nothing like the other boss fights where there are those moments when you figure out how to parry their combo. Lady Butterfly I haven't beat yet but I've come close. I think the key is be constantly attacking, because she recovers posture really quick and has way too much health. I figured out I can use the shurkein to interrupt her perilous attack, but I haven't gone back yet to really make use of it since I just unlocked the castle.
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Mar 20, 2024 04:24
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SMEGMA_MAIL posted:I think the key is be constantly attacking, because she recovers posture really quick and has way too much health. this is the case with every boss, with a small handful of exceptions (bull being one). It's not at all like other From games where you have to do sort of hit and run stuff. Sekiro you want to be constantly in their face, partying their attacks and then attacking back. The game even rewards this, because attacking and keeping the pressure on like this locks the bosses into more predictable attack patterns. And yeah when Butterfly is up on her tripwire you shuriken her. When she does her perilous attacks you want to jump, and the sweep gives you an opening to attack.
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Mar 20, 2024 04:30
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Just being psychotically aggressive and learning the fights with that as a baseline is probably the single best tip I can give after holding block down and then tapping to parry. Hesitation is defeat.
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Mar 20, 2024 04:33
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I didn't realize it at the time, but when I put it down and went to Lies of P and back to Elden Ring, it became really clear how every single thing about the combat and enemies in this game is singularly focused on one thing - facilitating aggression, and punishing overly cautious play. It was a LONG time before I stopped grumbling to myself about not having an entire health bar to burn through before I even had to start thinking about healing, and didn't have a play dead option I could use to put an enemy off their guard. It's a shame I was never actually ever able to reliably jump sweeps more than 50% of the time
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Mar 20, 2024 04:48
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I think Sekiro is the fairest of all the Fromsoft games. It has one style of play and the whole game is incredibly fine tuned around that. It means it can go deeper into what it wants to do and does not have to balance a whole world around different gems, different weapons and playstyles and so forth. It can be focused on the one blade and everything that the Wolf can do with it. It also means that when you learn the rules, you absorb them and will not be caught out. You become the Sword Saint.
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Mar 20, 2024 09:20
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VideoGames posted:I think Sekiro is the fairest of all the Fromsoft games. Absolutely. I do hope they give the same treatment to other classic DS builds -- a game based entirely on being Guts, or a spellsword.
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Mar 20, 2024 15:39
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No, more dex build spinoffs forever please
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Mar 20, 2024 15:48
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VideoGames posted:I think Sekiro is the fairest of all the Fromsoft games.  It really does give the sense of "I am the boss now" when you absorb the rules. This clicked for me when I got to the Headless Ape and, I think, three-shot that boss. All the practice against the first version had really sunk in, and I realized that when I do actually beat these bosses, it's not a fluke. And the add in boss (and the first phase of the original) has the extra fun of running away from you if you pressure hard enough. That was such as a badass feeling.
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Mar 20, 2024 17:07
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No Dignity posted:No, more dex build spinoffs forever please Ideally, both
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Mar 20, 2024 18:09
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Probably because I spent so much time sucking in the very early parts of Hirata and Outskirts, when I finally encountered Genishiro I beat him on my second try... then got owned by the secret third phase. For whatever reason about half the time I can beat the first two phases but I've only gotten close once on the lighting phase and never have successfully done the counter to the lightning attack. I managed to beat lady butterfly though I didn't feel like I mastered the "lesson" from her, of being super aggressive, but with him at least when I'm in the zone I'm sticking close with him and constantly attacking, while I still gently caress it up a lot I've managed to almost perfect parry while relentlessly attacking and sticking close to him, and posture break him in seconds in a few attempts. Apparently if you really do it right you end up being able to counterattack after the end of the ~7 or so strike sequence but I haven't quite figured that part out yet. I noticed that he responds to your actions far more than most bosses, if you try to get space from him he'll switch to the bow far more often, and you need to throw out attacks pretty often without overextending yourself to get him to attack enough to get his posture bar up fast. Anyway, I love this game. I was worried there would be some phase in the early game before the boss everyone talks about where I would get filtered but because there are not a lot of ways to cheese through everything without at least some degree of actually learning how to fight the game doesn't let you get over your head even though it feels like it until you figure out what the boss is trying to test you on, plus the particulars of their animations. Butter Activities fucked around with this message at 06:07 on Mar 22, 2024 |
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Mar 22, 2024 06:04
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The big multihit combo Genichiro does can parried by panic/reflex spamming, and dodging the big last hit. His long range bow stuff has tells but you sound like you have that down. For the final stage, the lightning counter stuff has too friendly a warning, if such a thing is possible. If you reflexivly join him in the air when you see his windup you'll end grounded when the lightning actually hits, physics kinda stops for him and he hangs midair for a while so you need to not jump until roughly the kanji symbol starts (and parry when it kanji ends). If all else fails you can noobishly run at him and just *past* him by accident, as it turns out he can't pivot to track you. And then stab him when he lands.
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Mar 22, 2024 06:47
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VideoGames posted:I think Sekiro is the fairest of all the Fromsoft games. What a roundabout way of telling people to git gud 
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Mar 22, 2024 08:43
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I believe a lot of Sekiro's difficulty mythos stems from the fact the way it's different from the souls series is fairly punishing for some of the habits from those games. So a bunch of souls veterans whined online as they kept tripping over their own muscle memory and everyone else nodded, assuming these guys must know their poo poo.
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Mar 22, 2024 12:58
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The opening of Sekiro gives you extremely few healing options and some very punishing combat encounters from like an hour in. I think it is just quite a hard game at the opening, though it definitely mellows as you get more flasks, deathblows rally and start to internalise the combat system prooperly
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Mar 22, 2024 13:09
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goblin week posted:What a roundabout way of telling people to git gud Is it? I do not think so. I did have to git gud though. Took me a 9 hour play session of being able to beat Guardian Ape (kept going elsewhere and coming back and I genuinely did not think I had the power to win). The third phase of Geni though. Oh man. My fondest memory of gaming. 
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Mar 22, 2024 13:12
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SMEGMA_MAIL posted:Probably because I spent so much time sucking in the very early parts of Hirata and Outskirts, when I finally encountered Genishiro I beat him on my second try... then got owned by the secret third phase. For whatever reason about half the time I can beat the first two phases but I've only gotten close once on the lighting phase and never have successfully done the counter to the lightning attack. I managed to beat lady butterfly though I didn't feel like I mastered the "lesson" from her, of being super aggressive, but with him at least when I'm in the zone I'm sticking close with him and constantly attacking, while I still gently caress it up a lot I've managed to almost perfect parry while relentlessly attacking and sticking close to him, and posture break him in seconds in a few attempts. Apparently if you really do it right you end up being able to counterattack after the end of the ~7 or so strike sequence but I haven't quite figured that part out yet. I noticed that he responds to your actions far more than most bosses, if you try to get space from him he'll switch to the bow far more often, and you need to throw out attacks pretty often without overextending yourself to get him to attack enough to get his posture bar up fast. The secret to Genichiro's big flurry combo is that you don't have to deflect all of it. Once you learn to recognize how it starts, it's easy to deflect the first two hits, then dodge backwards and watch him swing at the air like 5 times, then step back in and deflect the final hit which lets you counter-attack with a thrust. In phase 2 you need to be a bit careful about the dodge backwards - if you back up too far he'll change his combo to one that involves shooting his bow at you, although that combo isn't very hard to deflect so it's not a big deal, it's just not as easily punishable as the main one. In phase 3 you also do not want to counter after deflecting the normal final attack because he'll throw one more attack after it, but it's a thrust so you can mikiri it which makes it even better for you. For lightning counters, it's a lot easier than it seems - you just have to get hit in the air, then attack before you hit the ground, you don't need to deflect or even block the lightning. There is a brief stun when you get hit so you want to make sure you aren't jumping too early; the ideal is to get hit as you're still on the way up. The timing isn't super tight though so once you get the right idea of when you should be jumping it's pretty easy to hit 100% of the time. Lichtenstein posted:I believe a lot of Sekiro's difficulty mythos stems from the fact the way it's different from the souls series is fairly punishing for some of the habits from those games. This is something I've been curious about lately - whether Sekiro is actually easier to get into for people who have never played a Souls game. I feel like the process of unlearning the lessons from the Souls games makes the learning curve a lot steeper than it would be for someone who doesn't have any preconceptions about what they "should" be doing and just learning it from Sekiro itself. The Cheshire Cat fucked around with this message at 13:23 on Mar 22, 2024 |
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Mar 22, 2024 13:19
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The Cheshire Cat posted:This is something I've been curious about lately - whether Sekiro is actually easier to get into for people who have never played a Souls game. I feel like the process of unlearning the lessons from the Souls games makes the learning curve a lot steeper than it would be for someone who doesn't have any preconceptions about what they "should" be doing and just learning it from Sekiro itself. I think so. I first bounced from souls games and only went to explore the fromsoft catalogue once Sekiro clicked for me. While obviously it does have its fair share of difficulty, I remember also playing Furi at that time and feeling the two games are pretty similar in many regards, except Sekiro being far more hostile in its structure, such as the limited items bullshit. I remember feeling that what the game requires from you in terms of manual execution and reactions were fairly similar between the two games, with Sekiro "inflating" the difficulty by making the bosses two-shot you while Furi was more chill about how many mistakes you are allowed to make in each boss stage. Things definitely relax a bit when the game branches out after Genichiro fight, as - aside from getting gud - you get to outscale the parallel paths to a reasonable healthbar. One thing that doesn't help first impressions is hopping between real world and the memory hirata estate. In hindsight, when replaying the game, you do get your NPC hints about the items to pick up being fairly straightforward, but it's kind of buried under a very unclear setup. It's not that obvious you should be jumping between the two all the time and you're somehow expected to just know when a boss is excessively hard to gate you for later at a point where you're dying 12 times to one's you are indeed supposed to beat. It's a huge misstep that I think might have contributed to a lot of folks banging their heads against the wrong wall.
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Mar 22, 2024 13:42
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The Cheshire Cat posted:This is something I've been curious about lately - whether Sekiro is actually easier to get into for people who have never played a Souls game. I feel like the process of unlearning the lessons from the Souls games makes the learning curve a lot steeper than it would be for someone who doesn't have any preconceptions about what they "should" be doing and just learning it from Sekiro itself. This was exactly my experience. I'd messed around with DS1 and DS3 a little bit, but never got far because I kinda got the combat but didn't get the RPG elements at all. Sekiro having a much more focused playstyle, fewer resources to consider, and a much more railroady RPG development made it much easier to get into and learn the mechanics of. I can see how a DS veteran might get lost with the idea that you can parry absolutely everything and never have to worry about stamina, but for me it made the series much more accessible, and I've since played (almost) all the Souls games and loved all of them (except Demon's Souls which is bad).
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Mar 22, 2024 15:03
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Having never played a souls game or really any fighting game Sekiro’s learning curve felt pretty reasonable compared to what I’ve heard. Only really frustrating moment was the first couple times I fought the ogre. Or when the camera gets wonky which doesn’t happen too often thankfully. Also it never occurred to me you can parry not just arrows but bullets until I did it accidentally. Of course you can parry bullets lol E: Now my paths are blocked at the poison pool and centipede. The centipede guy is super easy until my camera gets stuck in the wall and then I get owned instantly. Anyway, as far as game design goes so far I really like how every time (which isn't much) I've spent "grinding" anything other than my actual ability to play the game I get to the next area and realize whatever resource I was short of was in abundance here and it would have been better to just get better at playing than try to unlock some particular move. Other than grinding xp for the backstab heal breath of life thing, that's a huge convenience to have now. Butter Activities fucked around with this message at 19:16 on Mar 23, 2024 |
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Mar 22, 2024 16:18
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Is the mist noble like a joke boss or something?
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Mar 24, 2024 04:17
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Kinda. It’s not supposed to be a challenge, if that’s what you mean.
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Mar 24, 2024 04:25
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I read it as a Tenchu joke. The first mission is you drop through a ceiling to face a noble, and you can cheese the whole fight into killing him with a single sword swing
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Mar 24, 2024 04:34
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mist noble is not the boss fight, the area leading up to it is the boss fight 
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Mar 24, 2024 04:37
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I missed the way in after jumping past it like a million times running around the forest forever hearing his flute, so when I finally figured out the path to the second floor and got in I expected some sort of epic battle, I meant to stealth him and dropped in wrong so I was even more amped up, and instead I was just beating this helpless guy to death.
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Mar 24, 2024 05:20
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When can you start buying items? The only thing I can buy are spirit emblems.
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Mar 24, 2024 05:47
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Street Horrrsing posted:When can you start buying items? The only thing I can buy are spirit emblems. You'll come across vendors in the world fairly early
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Mar 24, 2024 05:55
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There are 2 in the first area. They are slightly out of the way but not really
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Mar 24, 2024 05:57
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The two earliest vendors are kind of easy to miss, both are in the Ashina outskirts area. One is way up on top of a cliff that you might have already walked past - the way up to the top is around the back side so you have to turn around to see it. Likewise the other merchant is on the other side of a big door you can't open but can climb over, very easy to overlook if you just kept going forward. He won't sell you anything initially, you have to give him some sen a couple times and then he turns into a proper merchant.
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Mar 24, 2024 09:34
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Mist Noble is so funny, because you get to the last zone and realize that one noble is still a sad joke but then you let your guard down and get olded and sucked off.
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Mar 24, 2024 11:14
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Rise of Ronin is really good and tickles those Sekiro nerves https://youtu.be/jHQmlW_eipo?si=v5JfPnuGjbtwuu_Z (Im still bad at the game)
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Mar 24, 2024 11:17
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UI seems really busy. A frivolous complaint for sure, but I've started to learn to trust my gut on these sorts of small things.
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Mar 24, 2024 11:30
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You might be able to reduce some UI elements but didnt look into yet. I really like the vertical exploration, stealth and combat in this game and it works well enough in open world setting.
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Mar 24, 2024 11:45
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WaltherFeng posted:Rise of Ronin is really good and tickles those Sekiro nerves loving lmao that YouTube tags this video with "Sekiro: Sahdows Die Twice"
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Mar 24, 2024 11:47
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Street Horrrsing posted:When can you start buying items? The only thing I can buy are spirit emblems. One is really into crows on top of a hill near the first general , the other is behind a gate near the ogre. I didn’t know about the crow one until I had unlocked the sunken valley
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Mar 24, 2024 15:54
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I beat the guardian ape on my second try and like with Genichiro was wondering why I heard so much about how hard it is. Then i realized I was only halfway done.
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Mar 26, 2024 03:41
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i sure am killing a lot of primates in this
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Mar 26, 2024 08:28
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It's their own fault, they keep getting back up.
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Mar 26, 2024 09:11
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jesus could not have managed resurrecting 100 times in a day to beat that drat final boss. he would have given up. not me though
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Apr 1, 2024 02:00
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spaceblancmange posted:i sure am killing a lot of primates in this The devs really had it in for monkeys in this game for some reason lol
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Apr 1, 2024 10:07
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