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SpaceAceJase
Nov 8, 2008

and you
have proved
to be...

a real shitty poster,
and a real james
Got a heap of Origin games packed in with my Sound Blaster and CD-ROM drive.

Ultima 8, Wing Commander, hell yeah :cool:

The beheading in the first 2 minutes of Ultima was the first time videogame violence made me feel uncomfortable

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qhat
Jul 6, 2015


Mr. Nice!
Oct 13, 2005

c-spam cannot afford



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrENmPeHUbc

echinopsis
Apr 13, 2004

by Fluffdaddy
game spy

echinopsis
Apr 13, 2004

by Fluffdaddy
and lol download managers

fart simpson
Jul 2, 2005

DEATH TO AMERICA
:xickos:

i showed a classmate how to access files on other computers on the network and got in trouble for “hacking” because he ended up deleting grades off a math teachers computer lol

qhat
Jul 6, 2015


fart simpson posted:

i showed a classmate how to access files on other computers on the network and got in trouble for “hacking” because he ended up deleting grades off a math teachers computer lol

All the permissions on my school network were public so I set everyone's home folders, including all the teachers, to private and owned by a classmate. He got in trouble for that lol

Poopernickel
Oct 28, 2005

electricity bad
Fun Shoe
your command?
your orders?
yes, sire?
yes?
my lord?
yes?
stop touching me
stop touching me
make up your mind
are you still touching me?
don't you have a kingdom to run?
I do have work to do
'join the army,' they said
'see the world', they said

fart simpson
Jul 2, 2005

DEATH TO AMERICA
:xickos:

qhat posted:

All the permissions on my school network were public so I set everyone's home folders, including all the teachers, to private and owned by a classmate. He got in trouble for that lol

:yosnice:

ADINSX
Sep 9, 2003

Wanna run with my crew huh? Rule cyberspace and crunch numbers like I do?


Mplayer.com

Stick Insect
Oct 24, 2010

My enemies are many.

My equals are none.

echinopsis posted:

and lol download managers

GetRight with its cute little tray icon progress bars.

Download Accelerator Plus which secretly continued downloading while paused, making it seem fast when you un-paused it.

Resume support was nice on dialup. Download a zip of a few megs over the course of a week. But only if the host server supported it.

3D Megadoodoo
Nov 25, 2010

pram posted:

C:\CON\CON

COPY CON C:\CON\CON

when you can't be arsed to fire up the old edlin

3D Megadoodoo
Nov 25, 2010

commodore computer
atari computer
hey guys what's the difference between an ibm and a pc??!?!? computer user

Fart.Bleed.Repeat.
Sep 29, 2001


had one of these come through our shop around 2001? It was the silvered out Barbie one instead of hot wheels, but same thing. it was DOA so eventually it got the plastic sides pulled off it and became the home of a mini-ITX system. It never did get proper sides other than the sheet metal it was made of

they really did exist

echinopsis
Apr 13, 2004

by Fluffdaddy

Jerry Cotton posted:

commodore computer
atari computer
hey guys what's the difference between an ibm and a pc??!?!? computer user

my amiga had decent graphics etc compared to pc of the time but god i got shat on for how often it crashes and also dis(c/k) swapping

echinopsis
Apr 13, 2004

by Fluffdaddy
and god commodore hosed up by making the floppy drive the low density version so almost any floppy a pc owner handed to me fail to work because i couldn’t read high density 3.5” like i swear that was the reason we aren’t all in amiga land today

also lol “cross dos” i used it to emulate a pc and play blues brothers game and it was frame per minute slow

The_Franz
Aug 8, 2003


beta 5 was the best because it was the last one where you moved fast

akadajet
Sep 14, 2003

irfanview

akadajet
Sep 14, 2003

aol bots made in vb5 that advertised being able to impersonate the ceo (steve case)

Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

this is me posting irl

echinopsis posted:

got shat on for ... di(c/k) swapping

echinopsis
Apr 13, 2004

by Fluffdaddy

akadajet posted:

irfanview

:worship:

echinopsis
Apr 13, 2004

by Fluffdaddy

echinopsis
Apr 13, 2004

by Fluffdaddy
can someone help me learn : prince of persia on amiga had some extreme kind of copy protection where the disk had to be copied using the most hardcore mode which was mega slow

why? and what was that?

is it something to do with perhaps it didn’t just use the normal accessible sectors but did something different with the error checking bits that wasn’t standard?

like, a disk chunk might say it holds 8kb for example but the reality is that there are like 9kb actual bits per chunk, but if you say write to the disk bits directly (as was possible on my amiga, used it to change the messages in the cracktros) you only have access to the 8kb of data, because the extra bits are hardware controlled error checking bits.. (as far as end user is concerned they don’t even exist) but theoretically you could access them if bypassing the driver and accessing the hardware directly? hmm 🤷‍♂️



what was kinda cool about amiga and relates to people with their autoexec scripts was that often games weren’t formatted to amigados and from my understanding it was that the game basically disowned the operating system the moment it could and just ran itself in a mostly os-free environment. the ROM was always there I guess but i believe as a programmer you were basically free to release core parts of the OS out of memory

was stuff like old playstation etc like this too?



perhaps this comes from my understanding from how modern operating systems work, do modern operating systems hand over to a program or does every program give say a single instruction to the OS and the OS determines if it’s a safe and appropriate instruction and then only executes it on its terms?


and why isn’t task manager in windows operating at highest priority

echinopsis fucked around with this message at 19:06 on Mar 6, 2019

Zlodo
Nov 25, 2006

echinopsis posted:

can someone help me learn : prince of persia on amiga had some extreme kind of copy protection where the disk had to be copied using the most hardcore mode which was mega slow

why? and what was that?

is it something to do with perhaps it didn’t just use the normal accessible sectors but did something different with the error checking bits that wasn’t standard?

like, a disk chunk might say it holds 8kb for example but the reality is that there are like 9kb actual bits per chunk, but if you say write to the disk bits directly (as was possible on my amiga, used it to change the messages in the cracktros) you only have access to the 8kb of data, because the extra bits are hardware controlled error checking bits.. (as far as end user is concerned they don’t even exist) but theoretically you could access them if bypassing the driver and accessing the hardware directly? hmm 🤷‍♂️



what was kinda cool about amiga and relates to people with their autoexec scripts was that often games weren’t formatted to amigados and from my understanding it was that the game basically disowned the operating system the moment it could and just ran itself in a mostly os-free environment. the ROM was always there I guess but i believe as a programmer you were basically free to release core parts of the OS out of memory

most amiga copy protections were based on slowing down the disk rotation to write a little more data that a regular drive was able to.
Regular drives would still be able to read it because the bits are encoded with a format (mfm) that inserted synchronization bits to compensate for rotation speed discrepancies. But if you tried to write the data with a normal drive, it wouldn't fit and the end of the track would end up overwriting the start

if there was only one protection checking track written like this it was usually easy to crack the game by neutralizing that check with a well placed NOP or RTS instruction (or making a branch non conditional)

if all the tracks used a higher density with this trick (like psygnosis games often did for instance) it meant that the game could not fit on disks written normally, so crackers had to go to great lengths to extract all the data from the game and repack them on more disks or remove the games intro sequence to make some room

It was a pain in the rear end because usually these games used their own homebrew simplistic file system and you had to basically rewrite and patch all their data loading code to read off a normal disk format

and yeah most games didn't use the os and they wouldn't even "free" it, they'd just disable all interruptions and then unceremoniously overwrite all the memory with their own code, and do everything (including disk accesses) by programming the hardware directly

I had a trick to make those games coexist with Amiga os: I had disassembled a large chunk of exec's initialization code, starting with an hooking address known as "cold capture" up to the memory allocator initialization, and modified the later so it would leave the first 512k of chip ram untouched and allocator things after that, then it would resume normal ROM execution by jumping directly at the right address

It allowed me to use devpac ii's debugger to run games step by step even if they used custom track loaders

echinopsis
Apr 13, 2004

by Fluffdaddy
gently caress that’s cool and interesting. a little bit above my head but it’s fuckin’ cool, and such different “issues” compared to modern games. thanks for that

controlling the hardware directly is so badass.

how much efficiency could modern games get if they could do that? (disregarding the whole every hardware is different thing)

Zlodo
Nov 25, 2006

echinopsis posted:

gently caress that’s cool and interesting. a little bit above my head but it’s fuckin’ cool, and such different “issues” compared to modern games. thanks for that

controlling the hardware directly is so badass.

how much efficiency could modern games get if they could do that? (disregarding the whole every hardware is different thing)

in themselves, the extra software layers between the game and the hardware aren't adding that much overhead

what can add a lot of overhead is when the api that interfaces the driver with the game works too differently from the actual hardware. for instance before dx12 / vulkan, 3d drivers had to do a lot of magic behind the scenes because the way the api works is too divorced from the way the hardware works

if it was possible to program the hardware directly then it would imply that we know exactly what hardware we'd be running on, and that's really the real reason why it could be more efficient (not avoiding the extra software layers like driver and os, but rather knowing in which type of graphic card memory to put which resource and when, how the caches work, that kind of things). but in most games there is probably a lot more to be gained by doing more work on optimizing the game itself anyway (and that is rarely pushed to the limits because of production / time to market constraints)

in the amiga days the hardware was still small enough that there was really a clear advantage in getting rid of the cpu and memory overhead of the os (when you had only 512kb of memory and no mmu to remap memory pages around, it made sense to avoid using a general purpose memory allocator where fragmentation would waste a lot of memory), and the hardware was simple enough to program that people could do it themselves

r u ready to WALK
Sep 29, 2001

I'd like to see a PC graphics card that has a dedicated CPU onboard so you could offload the entire game to it and get predictable, consistent performance no matter how the rest of the system looked

sort of like

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nb_-hPkvkAk

echinopsis
Apr 13, 2004

by Fluffdaddy

Zlodo posted:

in themselves, the extra software layers between the game and the hardware aren't adding that much overhead

what can add a lot of overhead is when the api that interfaces the driver with the game works too differently from the actual hardware. for instance before dx12 / vulkan, 3d drivers had to do a lot of magic behind the scenes because the way the api works is too divorced from the way the hardware works

if it was possible to program the hardware directly then it would imply that we know exactly what hardware we'd be running on, and that's really the real reason why it could be more efficient (not avoiding the extra software layers like driver and os, but rather knowing in which type of graphic card memory to put which resource and when, how the caches work, that kind of things). but in most games there is probably a lot more to be gained by doing more work on optimizing the game itself anyway (and that is rarely pushed to the limits because of production / time to market constraints)

in the amiga days the hardware was still small enough that there was really a clear advantage in getting rid of the cpu and memory overhead of the os (when you had only 512kb of memory and no mmu to remap memory pages around, it made sense to avoid using a general purpose memory allocator where fragmentation would waste a lot of memory), and the hardware was simple enough to program that people could do it themselves

awesome

i remember i had a program from one of those public domain things that would just fragment memory until the system was unusable lmao

one of my first programs I wrote that accessed the file system was basically this

code:
START:
makedir “folder”
cd folder
goto START
LMAO fill up the whole disk


what a revelation it was when i got a hard drive lmao


what was the difference between chip and fast ram again? my a500 had 512 chip and 512 fast, my a1200 had 2mb chip :smugmrgw:


i love computers

Zlodo
Nov 25, 2006

echinopsis posted:

what was the difference between chip and fast ram again? my a500 had 512 chip and 512 fast, my a1200 had 2mb chip :smugmrgw:
chip ram is accessible both by the cpu and the dma controller which in turns feeds data to the sound chip, the various graphics systems (playfields aka most of the stuff displayed, sprites, copper lists which were small programs that allowed to reprogram the hardware registers based on which scanline was reached by the crt to make gradients and all kind of cheap funky effects, blitter), the floppy drive etc

fast ram is accessible only by the cpu, so it's faster

echinopsis
Apr 13, 2004

by Fluffdaddy
thankyou!! the blitter stuff was cool. reminds me of “unpacking”

pram
Jun 10, 2001

r u ready to WALK posted:

I'd like to see a PC graphics card that has a dedicated CPU onboard so you could offload the entire game to it and get predictable, consistent performance no matter how the rest of the system looked

sort of like

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nb_-hPkvkAk

it will only take up 4 pcie slots

TheCoach
Mar 11, 2014
SET BLASTER=A220 I5 D1 T3 P330 H6

graph
Nov 22, 2006

aaag peanuts
this macamp update will let me play an mp3 and a game at the same time

Agile Vector
May 21, 2007

scrum bored



echinopsis posted:

and lol download managers

the first movie i downloaded was with one and after a week i played it only to realize it was the matrix in german

Agile Vector
May 21, 2007

scrum bored



running ircd on your faster dialup so everyone can have a private chat network

Best Bi Geek Squid
Mar 25, 2016
dad getting frustrated because rebel assault runs at like 2 fps and the goddamn computer is only like two years old

3D Megadoodoo
Nov 25, 2010

laplink (for trasferring 16-colour porns from a machine with a non-floppy drive to the machine with a floppy drive)

echinopsis
Apr 13, 2004

by Fluffdaddy
lol

3D Megadoodoo
Nov 25, 2010

hb2a.gif

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Bored Online
May 25, 2009

We don't need Rome telling us what to do.
being a yahooligan

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