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I'm getting close to halfway through the fires of heaven and it feels like pretty much every chapter so far has been either Elayne or Nynaeve and I'm starting to pull my hair out. I
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Jul 6, 2020 21:56
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CainsDescendant posted:I'm getting close to halfway through the fires of heaven and it feels like pretty much every chapter so far has been either Elayne or Nynaeve and I'm starting to pull my hair out. I Stop tugging your braid so hard.
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Jul 6, 2020 22:15
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aparmenideanmonad posted:Stop tugging your braid so hard.
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Jul 6, 2020 22:24
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UltraRed posted:Perrin going DBZ and magically jumping around TAN Is one of my least favorite parts of the series. This mostly bugged me cuz I always wanted to see Perrin bump into Egwene in T'A'R and have her start teaching him. Or even have her direct him to the Wise Ones who have to figure out how to fit a man who can dreamwalk into their teaching hierarchy. That could have been real fun. Especially with the books having a bit of a "what if matriarchy instead of patriarchy?" theme. Having the first woman in a traditionally male dominated profession is a common enough story archetype, it would have been neat flip that and would have worked well in WoT I think. Instead he does nothing of relevance or interest for 5 or so books then becomes the worlds best dreamwalker in what feels like an afternoon. Which was doubly annoying because the stuff we see him and Slayer doing makes their interactions from the Two Rivers story arch seem really inconsistent in retrospect. Slayer should have utterly destroyed Perrin back then based on what we see him able to do. I'd admit "it's only a weave" was really good though.
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Jul 6, 2020 22:40
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Spek posted:
Whatever the TAR version of training with weighted clothing is, I just assume Slayer was doing that after he got his rear end kicked by Perrin the first time. It makes the anime ending work better at least.
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Jul 6, 2020 23:29
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I finished AMoL yesterday and am still processing a lot of what happened. One thing I wanted to post about is related to all the wonky time stuff happening: As each book in the series progresses, the elapsed time seems to come to a crawl related to Jordan going into lots of details on things that are sometimes important or sometimes forgotten. Time dilation happens when Rand is battling Moridin and then the Dark One. So question: is the time slowdown all intentional throughout the series as the Dark One’s grip tightens or am I being generous to Jordan’s planning of the series? Also so many people died. Sometimes it was sad and then others felt like throwaways. I was left wondering if some of the deaths would have been more momentous had they died leading up to AMoL or at least prior to the Last Battle.
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Jul 6, 2020 23:29
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Prairie Bus posted:I think Jordan was going for something on the danger of small-c conservative thinking and ossified orthodoxy. Healing is a great (and historically appropriate) example - the Aes Sedai are locked into their lovely battlefield Healing through a fear of the one power, the legitimate danger, and the force of tradition. Then Nynaeve (and eventually Sumiko) comes from outside the orthodoxy like a bolt of lightning to dramatically change how healing is done entirely. In the real world, western medicine orthodoxy was stuck on Galen’s / Ibn Sina’s theory of the humors for centuries. I think that may have been the reason for "the Dark One was not the enemy, amd never had been." I think he intention was that Shai'tan is not the embodiment of evil, he is the embodiment of destruction to mirror the Creator. Killing the Dark Ome removed conflict frpm the world, and thus eliminated the chance for what you call "creative destruction".
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Jul 7, 2020 00:57
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Gnoman posted:I think that may have been the reason for "the Dark One was not the enemy, amd never had been." Yeah, I think that's a pretty good read. I'm excited to get to that point of my re-read. I just got to the part with Lord Ramshalan in TGS and it really shows where Sanderson excels. Rand's plan makes a lot of sense (even if it's a little evil) and uses the rules of the system in a creative way. A good bit of plotting.
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Jul 7, 2020 02:58
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More than a little, I'd say! Plus, it didn't work, he was too clever.
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Jul 7, 2020 03:05
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I like how that shows just how sharp Graendal actually is. The instant she gets wind of all that Power she bails. No matter what Rand might have been doing, it wouldn't have been good for her.
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Jul 7, 2020 03:08
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what exactly causes the big famine in the dragon reborn? I thought it was just the dark ones influence making the crops go bad but a few people have alluded to it being Rands fault?
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Jul 7, 2020 03:16
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CharlesThunder posted:what exactly causes the big famine in the dragon reborn? I thought it was just the dark ones influence making the crops go bad but a few people have alluded to it being Rands fault? He was responsible for burning down the Cairhien grain houses in TGH, right? E: vvv it’s been a couple months. I’d guess it was a result of the power vacuum - no one was at the top organizing food for the poor, lower nobility was squabbling, and the civil war was preventing any serious trade. Prairie Bus fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Jul 7, 2020 |
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Jul 7, 2020 03:21
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Prairie Bus posted:He was responsible for burning down the Cairhien grain houses in TGH, right? I thought I just read near the end of TDR somewhere that cairhien couldn't buy any grain and the grain sat in the silos.
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Jul 7, 2020 03:27
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there's probably some weird poo poo going on to mess things up overall, honestly. in CoT there's the part where perrin and co. go visit that weird town where they're seeing ghosts everywhere and everyone is basically sickly-looking, and when they go to the warehouse to check the grain they want to buy it turns out like half the total mass is made up of weevils basically.
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Jul 7, 2020 03:36
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Johnny Joestar posted:there's probably some weird poo poo going on to mess things up overall, honestly. in CoT there's the part where perrin and co. go visit that weird town where they're seeing ghosts everywhere and everyone is basically sickly-looking, and when they go to the warehouse to check the grain they want to buy it turns out like half the total mass is made up of weevils basically. My read was that was the Dark One’s second serious attempt at starving out the world after the year without a winter failed. Same reason there were more rats everywhere and Keepings and wards on the Tower started failing - the prison was weakening and he could exert himself on the world to a greater degree. E: yup, I was wrong. Tied to the land. I’m a couple hours out from the end of TGS, looking forward to that. Prairie Bus fucked around with this message at 04:03 on Jul 7, 2020 |
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Jul 7, 2020 03:42
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Well they say that a lot over the last few books. I like the moment he becomes Jesus and is walking by some dieing orchard and the trees start producing. They just stare at him like alright my dude we’re gonna follow you. That’s how the dragon reborn should come across as.
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Jul 7, 2020 03:51
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All the food rots because Rand is losing the plot and the land reflects him. Then all the food turns out to be fine after Veins of Gold? I don't really remember that well.
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Jul 7, 2020 03:52
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there are to events that stop the famine. the first is the bowl of the winds. the second is the land mirrors rands mental health. the land springs back before the last battle
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Jul 7, 2020 03:57
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I really liked the moment in TGS where Rand is wandering into Bandar Eban and a balcony collapses and he thinks to himself well, there's always balance to that and BAM second balcony collapses It's a really great 'poo poo is fuuuuuuuuuuuuuucked' moment
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Jul 7, 2020 03:57
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In-universe, the Prophecies of the Dragon say "There can be no health in us, nor any good thing grow, for the land is one with the Dragon Reborn, and he is one with the land." Out-of-universe, it's a riff on the Fisher King, an Arthurian character whose incurable wound was reflected in the sorry state of his land. It depends on the version, but the Fisher King is usually healed through the forgiveness of Jesus. Although Rand has incurable wounds on his side, the relevant wound here is his PTSD, which he heals by forgiving himself on Dragonmount (because Rand is Jesus).
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Jul 7, 2020 08:32
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CharlesThunder posted:what exactly causes the big famine in the dragon reborn? I thought it was just the dark ones influence making the crops go bad but a few people have alluded to it being Rands fault? I think the famine in TDR is because of the war in Ghealdan
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Jul 7, 2020 12:53
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The famine in Carhien is because all of the farmers abandoned their farms along the dragonwall after the Aiel war and the entire nation has been on the verge of famine for twenty years, saved only by expensive royal grain barges: a system that break down entirely when the King dies. Illian, Murandy, Ghealdan, and Altara have food shortages caused by local political instability; Logain's uprising, the Seanchean invasion, and dragonsworn bandits, so it is at least partly Rand's fault. In other news, my re-read is now up to Path of Daggers, and I had forgotten that this book is 40% Elayne, 40% Faile, and 0% Mat. Send whiskey and pray for my soul.
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Jul 7, 2020 16:24
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Spek posted:Agreed I don't know how much Egwene could have really taught Perrin though. His understand of TAR is very instinctual and combat-focused, and he is pretty much the most powerful combat dreamer as early as Shadow Rising(other than Slayer). Egwene could never have done "it's only a weave" because she views things from the perspective of a channeler so to her balefire is the ultimate weapon. The Wise Ones could own him but that's because they wouldn't fight fair. What Egwene could have helped him with is the TAR-adjacent stuff like interpreting dreams and visions, but none of that is ever that important to Perrin. Also I agree that Slayer should have easily wrecked Perrin in Shadow Rising but that can be attributed to Sanderson doing his thing in the later books.
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Jul 7, 2020 16:26
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Plus the whole series starts with that terrible neverending winter
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Jul 7, 2020 16:27
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It's whiplash from long winter->(period that is mostly glossed over because Rand and Company spend 6 of the 9 non winter months stuck in a portal stone alternate timeline fugue)->normal winter->long forever summer drought pushed by the Dark One->Bowl of the winds induced turbo winter->spring where nothing blossoms because Rand is a shellshocked mindfuck victim->revelation time and brief recovery. Prairie Bus posted:He was responsible for burning down the Cairhien grain houses in TGH, right? Rand doesn't torch Cairhein himself, but after going to the party at Barthanes' place and snubbing the king, the king has thugs follow Thom to beat information out of him and kill his girlfriend/apprentice. Thom then (offscreen) assassinates the king and tosses Cairhein in to the civil war that wrecks it.
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Jul 7, 2020 19:18
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Thom 
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Jul 7, 2020 20:12
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The description of him with this awful grin on his face as he goes off to kill the king...
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Jul 7, 2020 20:24
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One of the best bits about Mat's run from Ebou Dar with Tuon is the chapters you get from the Seanchan perspective where they conclude that obviously Thom is the brains behind everything that's happened to them, and that he's the White Tower's master spy/assassin/fixer. Right down to the scene when they finally meet up with Mat after he's re-united with the Band, and the Deathwatch guards are all getting those funny responses of "Wait, you want to see *Thom?* Uh, sure, ok, I guess, here he is."
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Jul 7, 2020 20:32
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God that bit is so good The thing is in any other company at all, they'd be dead right and Thom would be the man to watch
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Jul 7, 2020 20:42
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"General Merrilin, you have fought a brilliant campaign..."
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Jul 7, 2020 20:51
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Thom’s continued weariness as taverens taveren him is my favorite part of the character. Just imagining the offscreen Loony tunes style hijinx as he tried unsuccessfully to get away and then coincidentally found himself back in the thick of it is great. Similar to the battle where mat tried to find a way out to safety and being taveren meant it just wouldn’t work.
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Jul 8, 2020 02:45
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the grain was fine all along, they were merely opening the wrong sacks!
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Jul 8, 2020 04:31
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Brolander posted:the grain was fine all along, they were merely opening the wrong sacks! Came here to post this. That was one of my favorite bits for being so subtle. It was a great way to explain miracles and statistics.
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Jul 8, 2020 04:52
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I liked every once in a while Mat would realize he was taverening and would try to get away. Then immediately taverens himself back, realizes it, and slinks off like Charlie Brown to accept his fate.
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Jul 8, 2020 06:33
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Invalid Validation posted:I liked every once in a while Mat would realize he was taverening and would try to get away. Then immediately taverens himself back, realizes it, and slinks off like Charlie Brown to accept his fate. Its the daughter of the nine moons, Charlie Brown
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Jul 8, 2020 11:57
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The Grinwell parents have been cast along with some new character called Dana, so at least some of the Caemlyn road sequence is happening. The casting call for Else is gonna be fun - I bet they just have them stare at a shirtless guy and react. https://www.cbr.com/wheel-of-time-casts-three-more-characters/amp/
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Jul 9, 2020 16:45
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The best part is that she shows up again in book 3 for like, one scene.
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Jul 9, 2020 16:52
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i forget which book it is, maybe like winter's heart or the book before it, but iirc else is relevant again because one of the forsaken imitates her to drop off a message in the white tower or something? which sets off alarm bells in the target's head because else supposedly left a while back or something. i dunno, the details are a bit hazy.
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Jul 9, 2020 17:01
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Johnny Joestar posted:i forget which book it is, maybe like winter's heart or the book before it, but iirc else is relevant again because one of the forsaken imitates her to drop off a message in the white tower or something? which sets off alarm bells in the target's head because else supposedly left a while back or something. i dunno, the details are a bit hazy. It's book three. Else shows up on the farm in book 1, then appears as a Novice in the White Tower briefly in book 2, then Lanfear uses her as a disguise when delivering a message to Egwene and Nynaeve in book 3, not realizing (or not caring) that Else had been sent packing back home as a ditz several weeks earlier.
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Jul 9, 2020 17:10
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Gawyn in Towers of Midnight is giving out serious "gently caress up ex-boyfriend from high school" energy.
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Jul 10, 2020 02:58
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