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Nope, just an Aes Sedai who wanted to ally with Luthair Hawkwing and underestimated his hatred of channelers. She made the collar for him and then taught others how to make them for the invasion force before being collared herself. Given Ishamael's influence on the Hawkwing empire it's possible he seeded the idea but I don't think he was loose during the time of the Seanchan colonization.
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Jun 30, 2020 16:45
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not sure if it was due to meddling from the forsaken or just a progression from artur's stance on aes sedai in the first place e: mostly in regards to the creation of the collars and whatnot, that is. i knew that bit, but you can never rule out the idea that someone whispered to her 'hey maybe a means of control would be a great idea'
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Jun 30, 2020 16:45
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Invalid Validation posted:I don’t think the books ever say but is the reason they enslave channelers to begin with because one of the forsaken pushed them into it? I don’t think it really gives them an advantage to enslave them. An rear end Sedia made it and brought it to Luthair Paendrag as his army was slowly taking over Seanchan in the hopes to ingratiate herself to him, and as a result she was chained and became the first damane. Mat Cauthon posted:Given Ishamael's influence on the Hawkwing empire it's possible he seeded the idea but I don't think he was loose during the time of the Seanchan colonization. The Consolidation took approximately 800 years and only ended 200 years before the start of the books, I don't think he was around for any of it.
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Jun 30, 2020 16:48
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Vavrek posted:We were talking a while ago about favorite moments and I mentioned Mat with the lemon, but this one is really good: That whole scene is ace. quote:"This I Foretell and swear under the Light that I can say no clearer. From this day Andor marches toward pain and division. The Shadow has yet to darken to its blackest, and I cannot see if the Light will come after. Where the world has wept one tear, it will weep thousands. This I Foretell."
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Jun 30, 2020 17:13
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More like quote:"This, too, I Foretell. I'm going to make painfully bad and divisive decisions, and this man stands at the heart of them." But yeah it's really a great scene
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Jun 30, 2020 17:21
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My favorite Elaida moment comes from the prologue to Knife of Dreams, when Seaine (the Aes Sedai who kicked off the Black Ajah hunt) tells the group of Black Ajah hunters that Elaida actually wanted her to go after Alviarin for other reasons. It’s underplayed but it’s such a body blow. They violated all of these laws and made themselves targets without any authority or backing. I recall there’s some great, tense moments in TGS related to the hunt, maybe with Yukiri? I’m wrapping up KoD now and looking forward to the paranoia.
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Jun 30, 2020 17:40
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Yeah, I wish that particular arc had a defter ending. This is something I hope the show rectifies.
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Jun 30, 2020 17:44
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One think I like about this series is the way they warp prophecy. Rand tried to use the Prophecies of the Dragon as a step-by-step list, and it almost ruined him. Elaida almost destroyed the world by trying to force her Foretellings into happening (with the result that they were fulfilled in completely opposite ways from what she expected).
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Jun 30, 2020 17:51
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it'll genuinely be interesting to see how the show handles a lot of stuff, because for as much as people worry that they might gently caress up something there's also the chance that they'll make something tie in a lot better. because jordan handles a lot of things well, but there's definitely plenty enough that just kind of falls to the wayside.
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Jun 30, 2020 17:52
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They better not leave out Moghedien completely chumping Liandrin.
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Jun 30, 2020 18:08
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I hope the show has a punched-up visual style and flair, more The Witcher and a little less Game of Thrones in how they shoot scenes and let the camera roam.
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Jun 30, 2020 18:09
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:They better not leave out Moghedien completely chumping Liandrin. that poo poo still chills me to some degree and really drives home the kind of hosed-up things people are capable of with the power
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Jun 30, 2020 19:24
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Johnny Joestar posted:that poo poo still chills me to some degree and really drives home the kind of hosed-up things people are capable of with the power Between that sequence and Rahvin casually loving with Morgase.
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Jun 30, 2020 19:53
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Johnny Joestar posted:that poo poo still chills me to some degree and really drives home the kind of hosed-up things people are capable of with the power I liked the contrast between Lanfear’s previous activities and the end of Book 5. She spent a lot of time doing high school drama with the Mask of Mirrors but as soon as she finds out Lews Therin has been “unfaithful” she immediately separates a man from his skin like she’s pulling off a sock.
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Jun 30, 2020 19:54
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I mean, she hadn't gotten laid in thousands of years, can you blame her trying to get some?
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Jun 30, 2020 20:32
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Lanfear maybe unstable as hell but she seems like she could be fun to have on your side. Didn’t they say that one timeline her and Rand get together? Wonder what batshit crazy world she would have made.
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Jun 30, 2020 20:48
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Invalid Validation posted:Lanfear maybe unstable as hell but she seems like she could be fun to have on your side. Didn’t they say that one timeline her and Rand get together? Wonder what batshit crazy world she would have made. Oh jesus. Have you never heard the saying 'don't stick your dick in crazy?' Now take crazy and make her one of the most powerful magic wielders in history, probably with access to the Dark One's special sauce as well. If you survive, tell us how it was.
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Jun 30, 2020 20:54
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[whole empty human skin floating in the breeze] *record scratch* *freeze frame* "Yup, that's me. You're probably wondering how I ended up in this situation."
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Jun 30, 2020 21:03
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But now imagine there’s like a dozen more very powerful magic wielders trying to kill you and you have no idea who they are. I’d take the crazy myself. I mean I have a dead guys voice in my head so who am I to judge?
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Jun 30, 2020 21:39
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Invalid Validation posted:But now imagine there’s like a dozen more very powerful magic wielders trying to kill you and you have no idea who they are. I’d take the crazy myself. I mean I have a dead guys voice in my head so who am I to judge? quote:I have won again, Lews Therin.
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Jun 30, 2020 21:54
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i just wish i knew if the first episode was going to include the prologue or not. i feel like that's gonna make or break it. that poo poo in itself would hook so many viewers.
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Jun 30, 2020 21:58
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Johnny Joestar posted:i just wish i knew if the first episode was going to include the prologue or not. i feel like that's gonna make or break it. that poo poo in itself would hook so many viewers. They should just air this as an episode 0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUQE0-G_GeU
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Jun 30, 2020 22:11
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Mat Cauthon posted:Nope, just an Aes Sedai who wanted to ally with Luthair Hawkwing and underestimated his hatred of channelers. She made the collar for him and then taught others how to make them for the invasion force before being collared herself. There was some talk from the Seanchan that the Aes Sedai in that area had been acting as crueler than usual feudal lords as well. They weren't part of the White Tower and weren't bound by the oaths, and that's why she figured that sort of gift would make them allies. It is an unreliable narrator in that point though, as it was given as the Seanchan history they say publicly.
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Jun 30, 2020 22:14
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Was it Mordeth who led (or encouraged) Paendrag's hatred of Aes Sedai?
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Jun 30, 2020 23:28
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DarkHorse posted:Was it Mordeth who led (or encouraged) Paendrag's hatred of Aes Sedai? Isshamael. Mordeth was already a thousand years dead by Artur Hawkwing's time.
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Jun 30, 2020 23:40
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Old Kentucky Shark posted:Isshamael. Mordeth was already a thousand years dead by Artur Hawkwing's time. Well, not really dead but stuck in his city as his city.
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Jul 1, 2020 01:34
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Colonel Cool posted:It suddenly occurs to me that male channelers are going to be a big problem for the Seanchan in the future. They presumably don't have a means of controlling them, which means even if they stick to killing them then other nations are going to have an advantage over them when they get their poo poo sorted out and start training large numbers of men to channel. Knife of Dreams spoilers: When Semirhage impersonated Tuon, she brought 6 A'dam and 6 Domination Bands, as she had let Rand bring up to 5 channelers plus himself. This implies that the Domination Band has become a pattern that can be replicated by Damane like the A'dam is bell jar fucked around with this message at 01:57 on Jul 1, 2020 |
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Jul 1, 2020 01:54
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bell jar posted:Knife of Dreams spoilers: When Semirhage impersonated Tuon, she brought 6 A'dam and 6 Domination Bands, as she had let Rand bring up to 5 channelers plus himself. This implies that the Domination Band has become a pattern that can be replicated by Damane like the A'dam is Yeah but the domination band has a flaw that you can't keep a male channeller long term. Eventually the male channeller will also be able to reverse the control. It was only useful to try to get a hold of the high value target.
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Jul 1, 2020 02:31
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Is that in the books? I don't remember that being explored
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Jul 1, 2020 10:43
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It wasn't that male channelers could reverse it, it's that madness made things go haywire. Probably with the taint gone, they'd mostly work as designed.
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Jul 1, 2020 11:01
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bell jar posted:Is that in the books? I don't remember that being explored It was, yes. Moghedien explained those facts to Nynaeve when they found the Bands in Tanchico. silvergoose posted:It wasn't that male channelers could reverse it, it's that madness made things go haywire. Probably with the taint gone, they'd mostly work as designed. No, that's not quite correct. I've just reread that section. The Bands both made women vulnerable to the madness spreading from the men to them, as well as having the other flaw, where a male will eventually be able to reverse control if they (and you) wear the collar too long. But now I'm curious how Moghedien can know these things, considering the first a'dam was made centuries after she was imprisoned. Torrannor fucked around with this message at 14:12 on Jul 1, 2020 |
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Jul 1, 2020 12:01
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Huh. I coulda sworn the reversal was linked (heh) to the madness.
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Jul 1, 2020 12:08
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Torrannor posted:But now I'm curious how Moghedien can know these things, considering the first a'dam was made centuries after she was imprisoned. It's possible they did exist/something similar did exist during the age of legends but their true usage was perverted over the millennia like the Oath Rod, or maybe she was able to delve the properties using age of legends weaves/techniques?
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Jul 1, 2020 12:31
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Or possibly just spying on/asking (ok definitely spying, none of them would ever voluntarily ask/share information) Semirhage after she takes up her spot among the seanchan.
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Jul 1, 2020 13:11
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I’ve read all these books a couple times through but not for 20 years or so (other than the new releases). I have been listening to great hunt on audio and it’s such a different experience it’s almost like going through everything for the first time. I also speed read so being forced to go through everything slowly is a big difference as well. Listening to Nynaeves accepted test was really harrowing in a way that reading wasn’t. It’s been really fun but I cannot imagine trying to get through the Salidar / white tower plot lines again on audio. Goongrats to anyone who was able to do that.
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Jul 1, 2020 13:41
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Torrannor posted:
I thought that they had a way to get around that, which was to have two women linked to the Band at the same time. But that was also unreliable because they would either fight for control between them or one of them was essentially enslaved along with the man.
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Jul 1, 2020 14:14
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ONE YEAR LATER posted:It's possible they did exist/something similar did exist during the age of legends but their true usage was perverted over the millennia like the Oath Rod, or maybe she was able to delve the properties using age of legends weaves/techniques? Given that the Domination Band was a museum piece of unknown purpose alongside Breaking-era relics, it is entirely possible tat it was invent ed while the Forsaken were still free. That, or it was long enough ago for records to make it into one of those stasis boxes that are mentioned a few times.
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Jul 1, 2020 14:23
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The motivation for the male band was breaking mitigation and being able to have age of legend Ying and yang ability. The Adam or whatever was a forced circle, which jives with the domination and males always having control with a circle of two.
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Jul 1, 2020 14:27
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Moghedien posted:So you discovered that little gem behind you. I wonder how you did that. It does not matter. Did you come to take it away? Perhaps to destroy it? You cannot destroy it. That is not metal, but a form of cuendillar. Even balefire cannot destroy cuendillar. And if you meant to use it, it does have... drawbacks, shall we say? Put the collar on a man who channels, and a woman wearing the bracelets can make him do whatever she wishes, ture, but it will not stop him going mad, and there is a flow the other way, too. Eventually he will be able to control you, too, so you end with a struggle at every hour. Not very palatable when he is going mad. Of course, you can pass the bracelets around, so no one has too much exposure, but that does mean trusting someone else with him. Men are always so good at violence; they make wonderful weapons. Or two women can each wear one bracelet, if you have someone you trust enough; that slows the seepage considerably, I understand, but it also lessons your control, even if you work in perfect unison. Eventually, you will find yourself in a struggle for control with him, each of you needing him to remove your bracelet as surely as he needs you to remove the collar. [emphasis mine] And if I had read on, she would have answered the question I raised before Moghedien, on the very same page further down posted:Do you wonder how I know all this? The collar and bracelets were made after I was... Well, we will not talk of that. Once I was free, the first thing I did was seek information about these last days. Last years, really. There are a good many fragments her and there that make no sense to anyone who does not have some idea to begin with. The Age of Legends. Such a quaint name you have given my time. Yet even your wildest tales no more than hint at the half.I had live over two hundred years when the Bore was opened, but I was still young, for an Aes Sedai. Your 'legends' are but pale imitations of what we could do. Why...
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Jul 1, 2020 14:41
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It seems to just be built into the nature of male channeling. In the same way the warden bond can’t be used to compel male channelers, but the Black Tower’s version of the bond can be used to exert some kind of mental pressure on female channelers. The black tower would have been a hell of a wild card if we had gotten the Seanchan series.
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Jul 1, 2020 16:24
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