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Retrowave Joe
Jul 20, 2001
Be heroes.

New year, new thread, same old song again.

Our top story: poo poo's poppin off in the Middle East. Protesters have stormed the American Embassy in Baghdad. President Trump quickly declared it the "anti-Benghazi." 82nd has sent troops. But it's all for naught. Mustang has already ETSed.

In sports, the ACFT continues to steamroll ahead in what can only be described as "a colossal shitshow." Units still don't have the equipment. The initial failure rate for female Soldiers is over 80%, thanks to the leg tuck. Barracks lawyers continue to debate the test's legality.

Hot off the runways of Virginia, a select group of 200 or so generals and CSMs have been chosen to wear the retro Pinks and Greens dress uniform. The jury is still out on just how bad berets look with the uniform, but early word is "real bad."

And finally, the weather. It's gonna continue to get hotter than hell this decade, so be safe, drink water, move north.

Back to you, Jim.

Retrowave Joe fucked around with this message at 18:43 on Jan 1, 2020

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SimonCat
Aug 12, 2016

by Nyc_Tattoo


College Slice

Why isn't the ACFT legal?

Retrowave Joe
Jul 20, 2001
Be heroes.

You got me, man. I swear in every social media post about the test someone chimes in that it hasn't passed JAG review. I haven't researched it yet, but I would tend to think that before it got the official approval and they got the equipment logistics rolling, someone would've taken care of that, whatever that might entail.

Edit: A quick google turned up a USAWTFM post on FB from March that says, "Sources tell USAWTFM that the lack of alternate events and the current form of scoring guidelines are the sticking point for the test to make it past the legal review. OTJAG views the test as potentially discriminatory towards Soldiers with injuries (both combat-related and otherwise) and those undergoing rehabilitation for injury."

They have an alternate test now for profiles, so it's probably clear.

Retrowave Joe fucked around with this message at 17:05 on Jan 1, 2020

Carnival Rider
Apr 22, 2006



Alternates are a straight 25 minutes to pass, theyíre thinking of making a grading scale for them so itís not just pass/fail. 5k row (2:30 split so pretty easy) 9.something bike or a 1000 meter swim. The pool at Huachuca is foot based so itís something dumb like 28.7 laps. Even if you have jacked legs you have to pass 3 events. Deadlift, sprint drag carry and the leg tuck if I remember right.

A Bad Poster
Sep 25, 2006
Seriously, shut the fuck up.



Gonna lol when the army just says "gently caress it" and they keep the APFT after having spent tens of millions of dollars and countless manhours on that thing.

Retrowave Joe
Jul 20, 2001
Be heroes.

Carnival Rider posted:

theyíre thinking of making a grading scale for them so itís not just pass/fail.

They're also thinking of making the ACFT go/no go when it comes to promotions, which I'm for. I don't give a poo poo if you're a PT stud, just that you can meet the standard. I'd bring back MOS tests and make those weigh heavily in promotions, but that's another discussion.

bird food bathtub
Aug 9, 2003



College Slice

Carnival Rider posted:

Alternates are a straight 25 minutes to pass, they’re thinking of making a grading scale for them so it’s not just pass/fail. 5k row (2:30 split so pretty easy) 9.something bike or a 1000 meter swim. The pool at Huachuca is foot based so it’s something dumb like 28.7 laps. Even if you have jacked legs you have to pass 3 events. Deadlift, sprint drag carry and the leg tuck if I remember right.

Are you still in that you found this stuff out or have you tasted freedom and laugh at the people telling you how dumb it is all going to be? I find this stuff out by asking the suckers I work with about it while shaving once a week and loving life.

Eulogistics
Aug 30, 2012


I wanna shitpost the space force thread tbh

McNally
Sep 12, 2007

Ask me about Proposition 305


Eulogistics posted:

I wanna shitpost the space force thread tbh

The Space Force Thread has been authorized but, like the actual Space Force, will use Air Force resources for the time being.

bulletsponge13
Apr 28, 2010


McNally posted:

The Space Force Thread has been authorized but, like the actual Space Force, will use Air Force resources for the time being.

There is no air in space, idiot.

Another example of defense mismanagement.

Icon Of Sin
Dec 26, 2008




Is the old army thread getting handed down to the marines again?

A Bad Poster
Sep 25, 2006
Seriously, shut the fuck up.



Has to go through some testing and servicing, but if it passes they should be taking receipt of the 2017 thread sometime early next fiscal year. Until then, they will have to make do with what they've got.

spacetoaster
Feb 10, 2014





A Bad Poster posted:

having spent tens of millions of dollars

Mission accomplished.

bulletsponge13
Apr 28, 2010


I remember a conversation with a Marine-
I was talking about how their standard issue kit is better than the Army's.
"Yeah, but you get M4s."
"You get hand grenades. I'll trade you."
No one in the Army trusted me with Hand Grenades. I mean, fair assessment on their part, but c'mon.

Carnival Rider
Apr 22, 2006



bird food bathtub posted:

Are you still in that you found this stuff out or have you tasted freedom and laugh at the people telling you how dumb it is all going to be? I find this stuff out by asking the suckers I work with about it while shaving once a week and loving life.

I think I'm one of the last few idiots still in nowadays.

bulletsponge13
Apr 28, 2010


Carnival Rider posted:

I think I'm one of the last few idiots still in nowadays.

A few more might be rejoining you.
If I Recall.

(Just pretend I posted a smilie of that ginger dude from CSI putting on his glasses)

Retrowave Joe
Jul 20, 2001
Be heroes.

Iím still in, but Iím a miltech so I have to be... three more months and then I can start applying for some DAC jobs

McNally
Sep 12, 2007

Ask me about Proposition 305


Those of you in the IRR, let me give you some advice:

Chips Ahoy makes a "party size" package. Eat two a day.

bulletsponge13
Apr 28, 2010


https://twitter.com/BASEDSAVAGE_/st...2219222017?s=20

3rdEyeDeuteranopia
Sep 12, 2007
Probation
Can't post for 4 days!


Regarding the ACFT, the legality will always be in question just like the APFT can be in question if leadership fucks up. I depends on who is deciding the separation for APFT failure and flags, but having a run route that is too long or has some other clear detriment to the Soldier can keep people in despite repeated failures. Really the big point is for leadership to try to do every coin flip type issue, like is there a slight incline or decline on pushups, to give the benefit to the Soldier to choose and make sure the run routes aren't too long based on the routes.

A Bad Poster
Sep 25, 2006
Seriously, shut the fuck up.



Until they come up with a test that doesn't have a human tester and judge involved, then it's all moot because at the end of the the day it's just another popularity contest or arbitrary metric. The run for example should only be judged on a level playing field. Every base has an Olympic track, use that. Oh, it's booked, or you want to test a battalion at once? Tough poo poo, learn how to schedule and manage the problem.

Retrowave Joe
Jul 20, 2001
Be heroes.

To help out the Reserve and the Guard, they should create training companies whose sole functions are to administer the ACFT and provide physical therapy/nutrition services to nearby units. Iíd like to read whatever studies they did that determined itís cheaper to contract out those services. Iím all for saving money, and at the same time we already have physical therapist and nutritionist MOSs, so why not have them actually do those jobs?

A Bad Poster
Sep 25, 2006
Seriously, shut the fuck up.



Because every soldier's real job is to shoot bad guys and drag wounded friends off a battlefield. Anything other than that is an extra specialization.

Internet Wizard
Aug 9, 2009

BANDAIDS DON'T FIX BULLET HOLES


A Bad Poster posted:

Until they come up with a test that doesn't have a human tester and judge involved, then it's all moot because at the end of the the day it's just another popularity contest or arbitrary metric. The run for example should only be judged on a level playing field. Every base has an Olympic track, use that. Oh, it's booked, or you want to test a battalion at once? Tough poo poo, learn how to schedule and manage the problem.

There was a minor scandal a couple years back when it was discovered a number of Air Force bases had tracks that were built too long somehow. I remember Goodfellow AFB was one. The Air Force was having to go back and undo a bunch of paperwork for people who had failed runs because of the extra 20 yards or so

rifles
Oct 8, 2007
is this thing working

Retrowave Joe posted:

To help out the Reserve and the Guard, they should create training companies whose sole functions are to administer the ACFT and provide physical therapy/nutrition services to nearby units. Iíd like to read whatever studies they did that determined itís cheaper to contract out those services. Iím all for saving money, and at the same time we already have physical therapist and nutritionist MOSs, so why not have them actually do those jobs?

Because it's all about funding and doing the minimum to get by. In a perfect world we would have those MOSs incentivized and on orders to make them available to units for training. One company of 15-20 certified trainers could float around to different units on their drill weekends, teach ACFT movements, put out basic training and nutrition plans, and then make themselves available to individuals to assist in further training/planning or nutrition planning. Make funding available for soldiers to be paid to go meet with them on their own schedule if they want to.

In reality what happens is we force people to go to the MFT school, they come back, and the unit dedicates all of 20 minutes for their new master fitness trainer to demonstrate a movement per drill weekend and they yell how they're available to help with putting together a PT plan for you or help you figure out your nutritional plan... and then everyone just grumbles under their breath that they're getting out anyway and they don't care.

A Bad Poster
Sep 25, 2006
Seriously, shut the fuck up.



Internet Wizard posted:

There was a minor scandal a couple years back when it was discovered a number of Air Force bases had tracks that were built too long somehow. I remember Goodfellow AFB was one. The Air Force was having to go back and undo a bunch of paperwork for people who had failed runs because of the extra 20 yards or so

Jesus, what do you even do at that point? What if someone got discharged because of a failed test?

bird food bathtub
Aug 9, 2003



College Slice


Don't forget the Army culture of abuse, "I had to show I have heart by running until I vomit and rucking until I could peel my skin off like a sock, you do too! gently caress these idiots with their 'nutrition' and 'fitness science' who think they know what makes someone strong, I'm 1SG now."

Retrowave Joe
Jul 20, 2001
Be heroes.

rifles posted:

Because it's all about funding and doing the minimum to get by. In a perfect world we would have those MOSs incentivized and on orders to make them available to units for training. One company of 15-20 certified trainers could float around to different units on their drill weekends, teach ACFT movements, put out basic training and nutrition plans, and then make themselves available to individuals to assist in further training/planning or nutrition planning. Make funding available for soldiers to be paid to go meet with them on their own schedule if they want to.

In reality what happens is we force people to go to the MFT school, they come back, and the unit dedicates all of 20 minutes for their new master fitness trainer to demonstrate a movement per drill weekend and they yell how they're available to help with putting together a PT plan for you or help you figure out your nutritional plan... and then everyone just grumbles under their breath that they're getting out anyway and they don't care.

Thatís all 100% accurate. We have 2 MFTs and theyíve done nothing related to fitness at drill in the last year.

And regarding the first part, itíd make the ACFT gear accountability and maintenance easier because it could be localized at those companies, as theyíd also administer the tests. Hell, treat it like an ID card, where a Soldier could schedule an appointment to go get one M-F. Itíd be something that the Reserve and Guard would work together on, but lol good luck with that

A Bad Poster
Sep 25, 2006
Seriously, shut the fuck up.



I think that after 15 years you should automatically be retired, but given the option to remain on payroll as an advisor or tactical consultant at the same payscale, but with no rank.

spacetoaster
Feb 10, 2014





PT tests won't matter once we all get cyborg bodies.

Flying_Crab
Apr 12, 2002



spacetoaster posted:

PT tests won't matter once we all get cyborg bodies drafted in a full national mobilization caused by Trump.

spacetoaster
Feb 10, 2014





If WWIII pops off the standards will be "Get on the loving plane"

SimonCat
Aug 12, 2016

by Nyc_Tattoo


College Slice

Upgrading to PIV Certificate for more "security," had to install Java to make it work. Still doesn't work.

Why does .mil IT suck so much?

A Bad Poster
Sep 25, 2006
Seriously, shut the fuck up.



SimonCat posted:

Upgrading to PIV Certificate for more "security," had to install Java to make it work. Still doesn't work.

Why does .mil IT suck so much?

Because it's the bottom of the worst barrel they could find?

SpaceSDoorGunner
May 4, 2018



SimonCat posted:

Upgrading to PIV Certificate for more "security," had to install Java to make it work. Still doesn't work.

Why does .mil IT suck so much?

Join the navy where we have a totally different but unavoidably necessary website for every process and sometimes even more!

bird food bathtub
Aug 9, 2003



College Slice

lovely Army IT was just downright abusive when it involved mandatory training courses. Oh the whole company needs to finish this by COB today but it can only be accessed by Army computers? Cool we got two of those total, we'll get right on that oh wait one of them doesn't have the right certificates installed and so on.

Bell_
Sep 3, 2006

Tiny Baltimore




Don't forget the multimedia training requiring a specific patch on an old version of internet explorer, drat the compatibility settings!

I'm wrapping my brains around the new centralized promotion process and wondering what it will mean for the organization over the long haul when needs change like the tide (not to mention crazy adventures)

SimonCat
Aug 12, 2016

by Nyc_Tattoo


College Slice

Y'now, the 80s Army seems pretty fun. No war, just living in Germany playing Army.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QReV0Y-yy0M#t=300s

Flying_Crab
Apr 12, 2002



Except for the whole very real prospect of getting zerg rushed by Soviet & DDR forces/nuked in the outbreak of war. Other than that it sounds like peak big army.

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SimonCat
Aug 12, 2016

by Nyc_Tattoo


College Slice

Flying_Crab posted:

Except for the whole very real prospect of getting zerg rushed by Soviet & DDR forces/nuked in the outbreak of war. Other than that it sounds like peak big army.

Eh, if it came to that everyone was a burn mark on the landscape anyway, so why worry?

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