|
Over the last three days during isolation I finally watched the 3 new star wars films while smoking weed. I don't know poo poo about these, and i haven't followed the "hype", but I thought you might be interested to read my thoughts. Star Wars the Force Awakens: Sorry, can't really remember this one. Who actually directs these things? Oh it's JJ Abrams, the biggest hack in Hollywood. Makes sense I guess? Star Wars The Last Jedi Wow this one is actually good, and brings the franchise into the 21st century. I mean it's not perfect, but it's enjoyable, solid film making that you can watch without being embarrassed. It finally does away with the dumb monarchy poo poo too. Guess JJ has finally learned something? Star Wars The Rise of Skywalker: Goddamn yikes this is absolute trash and they did away with everything that made the last jedi good?  Now that's the JJ I know.Ok, thanks for reading everyone! edit: sorry i forgot about the thread icon
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2020 13:11
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 26, 2024 07:15 |
|
|
Last Jedi was directed by Rian Johnson, and apparently there was no direction at all for 7-9. So that's how you get JJ Abrams setting up mind numbingly dull mystery boxes, Rian Johnson disregarding that, and then Abrams diaregarding The Last Jedi.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2020 14:12
|
|
|
Just a conga line of directors throwing the immediately preceding work into the trash can, forever.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2020 14:17
|
|
|
reignofevil posted:Just a conga line of directors throwing the immediately preceding work into the trash can, forever.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2020 16:01
|
|
|
If future Star Wars movies are just alternating between Rian Johnson and JJ Abrams retconning the previous movie then thia franchise is golden.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2020 16:06
|
|
|
Roth posted:If future Star Wars movies are just alternating between Rian Johnson and JJ Abrams retconning the previous movie then thia franchise is golden. from what I have seen of these three movies I'd like this, but without JJ
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2020 16:23
|
|
|
oliwan posted:Star Wars The Last Jedi Wow this one is actually good, Nah, it just might have seemed that way to people who wanted so badly to see another good Star Wars film again. It has its share of embarrassment. A nonsensical low-speed chase in space, boring/wasted characters, "funny" green titty milk and merchandise puffins. And the whole casino planet side-quest was super dull. Let's subvert those expectations that Star Wars can be good again and make a mediocre movie instead, Rian Johnson. Even Solo was more entertaining. All in all, The Last Jedi was a huge waste of potential and JJ's efforts were like a flashy cover version of the originals but with no real heart. You have to go back to the animated series to get a decent fix these days (haven't seen The Mandalorian yet). Rogue One is kind of ok I guess. baromodo fucked around with this message at 02:17 on Apr 18, 2020 |
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 01:24
|
|
|
In my opinion The Last Jedi (if you cut out the dumbshit your momma joke and the plotline where admiral holdo pretends to have a super good plan that is gonna blow everybody's mind but in reality she steadfastly refuses to just tell the people who serve with her that what they are gonna do is known as "evacuating" aka the most basic and fundamental strategy of any losing fight with absolutely no reason whatsoever to conceal it from the crew at large who in fact could benefit from having more time to get their poo poo together and get onto the lifeboats), could have been good. The main problem with it is that it is structured like a first film in a trilogy and not like a midpoint in an already existing story. The fundamentals for the 2nd act of a three act structure were not put in place by convention and happenstance they exist because if you don't have some of those basic elements in place I'd argue you're almost destined to have a bad time once the third act rolls around, which is precisely what happened. Given that rewriting the past isn't possible what Disney needed to do was sit down and decide if Rian's vision was actually any good for what they hoped to get out of their franchise from an artistic perspective and then if the answer was yes they needed to tell everyone that they were doing a 4 movie run with two more on the way after the last jedi was released.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 01:42
|
|
|
As for JJ Abrams, take the entire script for the episode of Lost where Ben tells John Locke that a mystery box exists that can give him anything he wants in the universe and then take the script for the episode where John Locke asks Ben to show him the mystery box and Ben gives him the bug eyes and flatly responds "The box was a metaphor" and shove them both up JJ's rear end.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 01:45
|
|
|
reignofevil posted:the dumbshit your momma joke and the plotline where admiral holdo pretends to have a super good plan that is gonna blow everybody's mind but in reality she steadfastly refuses to just tell the people who serve with her that what they are gonna do is known as "evacuating" Aye, those were other embarrassing moments I had blocked out, thanks for the reminder. You're right about the structure. But the main problem I see is that there was no apparent cohesive vision for the trilogy as a whole, they took a multi-billion dollar franchise and essentially winged it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 01:49
|
|
|
reignofevil posted:the plotline where admiral holdo pretends to have a super good plan that is gonna blow everybody's mind but in reality she steadfastly refuses to just tell the people who serve with her that what they are gonna do is known as "evacuating" aka the most basic and fundamental strategy of any losing fight with absolutely no reason whatsoever to conceal it Er, you kind of have this backwards. She's pretending that she's a spiteful leader who's just winging it to Poe because he's a cocky hothead who prefers confrontation to retreat to the point of insubordination, and even her hostility toward him is just an act - she'd rather he be preoccupied in a confrontation with her than have him going off on his own doing some suicidal run against their pursuers (and probably blowing their cover in the process, too). Afterwards we see her and Leia fawning over him like, "I like him, he's so hot-blooded and passionate"  like they're thinking about tag-teaming him or something.It's still pretty dumb especially since it doesn't even work in the end, but it's just one of those plots writers come up with sometimes, "You were supposed to think I was a jerk, it was all part of the plan!" 
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 03:00
|
|
|
I've heard tons of theories on why she does what she does up to and including thinking poe is a secret spy thinking poe would definitely mutiny and now thinking poe would go suicide strike the star destroyer but really, I think the subplot just needed more time to explain her perspective better.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 03:24
|
|
|
Basically there are three alternate universes out there besides the one we live in. One where JJ Abrams made all three sequel movies and they were safe forgettable retreads of the Original Trilogy that told a cohesive yet underwhelming Mystery Box story. One where Rian Johnson made all three sequel movies and they did something innovative and bold with Star Wars but fans set themselves on fire in protest because they don’t like things that are different. And one where Colin Trevorrow was allowed to make Duel of the Fates picking up from where Johnson left off and we got a trilogy that consisted of a safe retread of A New Hope, an unsafe retread of Empire Strikes Back, and a batshit crazy pyroclastic trainwreck retread of Return of the Jedi. Unfortunately, we live in the hell world universe, the one where The Rise of Skywalker is allowed to exist.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 08:43
|
|
|
SidneyIsTheKiller posted:Er, you kind of have this backwards. She's pretending that she's a spiteful leader who's just winging it to Poe because he's a cocky hothead who prefers confrontation to retreat to the point of insubordination, and even her hostility toward him is just an act - she'd rather he be preoccupied in a confrontation with her than have him going off on his own doing some suicidal run against their pursuers (and probably blowing their cover in the process, too). Afterwards we see her and Leia fawning over him like, "I like him, he's so hot-blooded and passionate" Except Poe was right about everything and Holdo was just a big dummy. The initial sequence builds up how dangerous that big dreadnought gun is and how it can casually obliterate whatever it targets. If Poe had listened to his cowardly commanders and retreated the rest of the movie would have been about trying to hide in the shattered debris of the rebel fleet. The entire movie is about people making incoherent decisions and withholding information for no reason, but without examining any of those dumb decisions meaningfully. Its all just stuff that happens. Which I guess is a great meta-narrative for the sequel trilogy as a whole really. I mean, the entire stupid Casino Planet sequence, and the subsequent Lando-subversion double cross, was because Finn illegally parked his spaceship. But its never brought up or examined outside of a quick visual gag. The movie also wastes what little good world building JJ engaged in and flushes it down the toilet. Phasma and Finn? Who cares shes dead. Finn was far more interesting than Solo retread Poe or Luke clone Rey and his entire character got flushed into some C story.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 13:36
|
|
|
Solo is good and Rogue One is a fine Video Game adaptation. With Mandalorian it is clear the best route for Star Wars is not to make big sequels but side stories. A rich universe is too constrained on the main characters.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 16:17
|
|
|
Last Jedi took Force Awakens at face value and was punished for it because JJ doesn’t mean anything that he says.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 18:13
|
|
|
Nix Panicus posted:Except Poe was right about everything and Holdo was just a big dummy. The initial sequence builds up how dangerous that big dreadnought gun is and how it can casually obliterate whatever it targets. If Poe had listened to his cowardly commanders and retreated the rest of the movie would have been about trying to hide in the shattered debris of the rebel fleet. The entire movie is about people making incoherent decisions and withholding information for no reason, but without examining any of those dumb decisions meaningfully. Its all just stuff that happens. Which I guess is a great meta-narrative for the sequel trilogy as a whole really. I mean, the entire stupid Casino Planet sequence, and the subsequent Lando-subversion double cross, was because Finn illegally parked his spaceship. But its never brought up or examined outside of a quick visual gag. As for Phasma, there was a whole alternate take on that scene shot where both her and Finn got some great chatacter development and a definitive end to her character, but it was scrapped in favour of a more open end for her character because Johnson thought JJ was going to do something with her in Ep 9 and lol.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 18:34
|
|
|
So Johnson's excuse for gutting Finn's character and subverting expectations by pointlessly killing off Phasma was he thought Abrams was going to do something with it? Then maybe just keep her in reserve if you're not going to do anything interesting with her and maybe not kill her? And with what run time was he going to give her a good scene? The movie was already bloated. Kinda sounds like a lie to cover his rear end.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 20:23
|
|
|
Everyone has theories about why this stuff doesn't work but I am having a hard time believing there was SO little communication between the parties writing and directing these movies. Is it normal for this kind of thing to be this disorganized? Is it really actually that disorganized? Are these people not great storytellers to begin with, or are they just horribly unexcited with star wars or what?
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2020 20:38
|
|
|
Nix Panicus posted:So Johnson's excuse for gutting Finn's character and subverting expectations by pointlessly killing off Phasma was he thought Abrams was going to do something with it? He didn’t gut his character. Finn was a runner. He ran from the storm troopers. He tried to run away from Rey. So Johnson has him continue to run until he finally figures out why people stay and fight when he’s in Canto Blight. And then Phasma calls him scum and he says he’s rebel scum, finally putting his feet on the ground and believing in something. But sure. Yeah. Johnson totally ruined his character. It’s not the fault of the dude who wrote a running issue of the dude trying to say something but not and then ends a film without it ever being said.
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2020 01:21
|
|
|
Regardless of quality, I respect The Last Jedi a lot more than the Abrams movies just for at least trying to be new instead of the safest possible fanservice. It helps that I thought all the mystery box stuff Abrams set up was dull trite in the first place and The Last Jedi's subversions would have made for a more interesting trilogy if Episode 9 didn't just undo it all.
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2020 02:01
|
|
|
Roth posted:Regardless of quality, I respect The Last Jedi a lot more than the Abrams movies just for at least trying to be new instead of the safest possible fanservice. I think this is the most common reasoning from people who liked TLJ. Taken on its own TLJ is a disaster, but when compared to the creative wasteland of FA it looks good. Trevor Hale posted:He didn’t gut his character. Finn was a runner. He ran from the storm troopers. He tried to run away from Rey. So Johnson has him continue to run until he finally figures out why people stay and fight when he’s in Canto Blight. And then Phasma calls him scum and he says he’s rebel scum, finally putting his feet on the ground and believing in something. Finn stops running at the end of FA and has a lightsaber fight that establishes him as the badass normal with a complicated storm trooper past. Johnson takes that and gives him a pointless C plot that revolved entirely around Finn being a bumbling idiot while killing off his opposition. And along the way Finn learns that heroic sacrifice is bad, unless its a heroic sacrifice to teach someone else about heroic sacrifices, then its good. Or if your heroic sacrifice blows poo poo up, then its really cool actually.
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2020 04:22
|
|
|
The Last Jedi is a complete mess of a film and frankly only seems better due to how astoundingly bad Rise of the Skywalker is and how completely devoid of texture The Force Awakens is. Its like arguing over what the best dish is at a restaurant the health inspector shut down.
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2020 10:16
|
|
|
The best thing about the Last Jedi is that it managed to convince a decent chunk of the audience that a film that ends with everyone right back where they started, reaffirms that Rey's a super-special Child of Destiny, confirms that Kylo's never going to change, and wraps up Luke's story by having him decide that Jedi are Good Actually, is somehow revolutionary, and that it's JJ Abram's fault for not following up any of the innovative story-lines it offered.
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2020 13:36
|
|
|
Barudak posted:like arguing over what the best dish is at a restaurant the health inspector shut down. New title for sequeldome?
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2020 15:21
|
|
|
Ya sure why not
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2020 15:23
|
|
|
Nix Panicus posted:Except Poe was right about everything and Holdo was just a big dummy. The movie doesn't necessarily disagree. Keeping Poe in the dark just causes him to put his own plan into motion that ends up blowing their cover anyway, and it's Holdo herself that decides to do the suicidal run against their pursuers. The Poe/Holdo conflict is the movie's weird analogue for the Han/Leia dynamic in ESB. Holdo admitting "I like him" is channeling Leia's confession "I love you," Poe laying unconscious channels Han laying unconscious in carbonite, though it's Holdo that makes the sacrifice (channeling Han submitting to be frozen to spare Leia and friends).
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2020 17:38
|
|
|
Nix Panicus posted:So Johnson's excuse for gutting Finn's character and subverting expectations by pointlessly killing off Phasma was he thought Abrams was going to do something with it? How is TLJ responsible for wasting Phasma when TFA literally throws her into the trash before blowing up the planet
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2020 22:17
|
|
|
Nix Panicus posted:I think this is the most common reasoning from people who liked TLJ. Taken on its own TLJ is a disaster, but when compared to the creative wasteland of the prequels and the other sequels it looks good. ftfy
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2020 23:09
|
|
|
i mean... except at least the prequels are creative.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2020 23:09
|
|
|
and they're less of a wasteland and a glut of garbage being lobbed at the audience
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2020 23:09
|
|
|
ok, admittedly i don't know where I'm going with this analogy
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2020 23:10
|
|
|
your analogy has failed you, because the prequels, are good,
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2020 23:24
|
|
|
from my point of view the prequels are bad!
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2020 23:58
|
|
|
Scrub-Niggurath posted:How is TLJ responsible for wasting Phasma when TFA literally throws her into the trash before blowing up the planet They both wasted her. But tbh the only things she had going for her was the cool reflective suit and being a beloved/talented GOT actor. On the last point, both films wasted her talent. But TLJ could have at least redeemed that and done something with her. She had more potential as a foil to Finn than showing up for a few minutes and dying the lamest death ever.
|
|
#
?
Apr 26, 2020 23:57
|
|
|
I don't remember her being in TLJ at all and I assume all posts here about it are just pranks.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2020 00:25
|
|
|
reignofevil posted:I've heard tons of theories on why she does what she does up to and including thinking poe is a secret spy thinking poe would definitely mutiny and now thinking poe would go suicide strike the star destroyer but really, I think the subplot just needed more time to explain her perspective better. When they first realized they were being tracked through hyper spaced I assumed this was going to be the case, that Holdo was being super secretive because anyone on the couple of ships left was the person leaving a trail for the first order, but then this is never even brought up as a thing in the movie. A lot of the character's actions in the chase make more sense if they're all paranoid about that.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2020 20:13
|
|
|
Nix Panicus posted:So Johnson's excuse for gutting Finn's character and subverting expectations by pointlessly killing off Phasma was he thought Abrams was going to do something with it? The more hilarious thing was how the red dudes in Snoke's throne room aren't the Knights of Ren. Johnson's reasoning for not having these characters be that was sound. He felt that because of how they're brought up in Force Awakens and Ren's general status in Force Awakens, Ren would probably have more of an affinity for them than for Snoke or anyone in the First Order. So it would be weird or him to just ice cold cut them down or for them to try to kill him out of loyalty to Snoke. Then the actual knights pop up in Rise of Skywalker and talk about a wet fart lol, and of course they're just totally nothing goobers that Ren enjoys cutting down.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2020 20:44
|
|
|
The Star Wars sequels were meticulously and secretly plotted out by George Lucas, who hates Star Wars fans for ruining his life. All the man wanted to do was revive racist pulp action fiction and he became stuck doing one particular kind of revivalist racist pulp fiction.
|
|
#
?
May 2, 2020 20:47
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 26, 2024 07:15 |
|
|
cuntman.net posted:your analogy has failed you, because the prequels, are good, This is the weirdest take that I hear from a ton of people. All I can assume is that you were a kid when they came out and have rose tinted glasses because yikes, those are some terrible movies.
|
|
#
?
May 3, 2020 06:55
|
|
