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Vargs posted:It is literally not. You get to see the exact same cards that you would if you did not have Offering Token in your deck, except you have to discard one. The act of drawing Offering Token takes up one of your natural draws, canceling out the benefit of the +1 from playing the card. So all your are left with is discard 1. I swear it's some sort of Pot of Greed mental thing where Pot of Greed is so good in Yu-Gi-Oh that it was banned and it does basically the exact same thing
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Jun 3, 2020 06:18
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RazzleDazzleHour posted:I swear it's some sort of Pot of Greed mental thing where Pot of Greed is so good in Yu-Gi-Oh that it was banned and it does basically the exact same thing Pot of Greed draws 2 cards and its only cost is itself, so you're +1 card. Offering Token is +1 card drawn, -1 card discarded and costs itself, so you're -1 card.
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Jun 3, 2020 06:28
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Vargs posted:It is literally not. You get to see the exact same cards that you would if you did not have Offering Token in your deck, except you have to discard one. The act of drawing Offering Token takes up one of your natural draws, canceling out the benefit of the +1 from playing the card. So all your are left with is discard 1. Ah, but you see, when I give it holdover it's pure improvement! But for real though triggering incant for free and activating offering easily makes it a good card regardless.
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Jun 3, 2020 06:40
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Eschatos posted:Ah, but you see, when I give it holdover it's pure improvement! But for real though triggering incant for free and activating offering easily makes it a good card regardless. Holdover doesn't give you your holdover card as a bonus on the next turn. It just puts it at the top of the draw pile, meaning you are still using a draw to pull it. You're still getting the exact same disadvantages when putting it on Offering Token, except it's happening every turn instead of just for one. It's not a completely free incant either, since you are losing a card to do it. Anything else that costs 0 and doesn't force you to discard while also having a beneficial effect on its own is far, far superior for this purpose (though obviously Offering Token tends to pull ahead if you can trigger an offering card with it) Offering Token is still good though, I agree. But you need synergies to make it work. Without them it is straight up worse than Deadweight.
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Jun 3, 2020 07:18
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I actually just straight up hate Offering Token, I don't think Incant synergy is good enough to run it, and Offering cards are always so awkward to begin with because you need both the Offering card and the discarder at the same time so it doesn't go off as often as you want it to. Even with Offering cards stuck in the deck already I might just take the loss and let them sit there or plan to Vortex them later, since trying to activate an inconsistent synergy might actually make the deck worse. If I have Freeze stuff like Cuttlehex or Preserve, then it actually starts looking appealing.
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Jun 3, 2020 07:47
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The biggest issue I have is the disparity in power level between factions and heroes. I'm currently climbing up the covenant ranks playing random/random, but I could easily cruise through the last 10 or so levels by just going Melting/Umbra or Melting/Whatever. Umbra had an awful hero and desperately needed that buff, but they have possibly the best supporting card pool, especially the synergy with incant. Certain faction units could really use a redesign. The 1/1 for 1 with endless that draws a card feels pointless, but if it cost 2 and drew 2 cards, I might actually have a use for it.
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Jun 3, 2020 07:51
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Or enough card draw or a small enough deck that you can cycle through your cards and guarantee it. There's a few ways to go about it. EDIT: Marketing New Brain posted:The biggest issue I have is the disparity in power level between factions and heroes. I'm currently climbing up the covenant ranks playing random/random, but I could easily cruise through the last 10 or so levels by just going Melting/Umbra or Melting/Whatever. Umbra had an awful hero and desperately needed that buff, but they have possibly the best supporting card pool, especially the synergy with incant. That card is for harvest farming. Bring in all the money!
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Jun 3, 2020 07:51
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blizzardvizard posted:I actually just straight up hate Offering Token, I don't think Incant synergy is good enough to run it, and Offering cards are always so awkward to begin with because you need both the Offering card and the discarder at the same time so it doesn't go off as often as you want it to. Even with Offering cards stuck in the deck already I might just take the loss and let them sit there or plan to Vortex them later, since trying to activate an inconsistent synergy might actually make the deck worse. If I have Freeze stuff like Cuttlehex or Preserve, then it actually starts looking appealing. I think it's a bit tough to justify an offering build when given the choice to pick up offering/discard cards since they're dead draws until you come across something to work with them, but you get them all the time as your initial random starting cards. Makes it a lot easier to pick up a Titan's Tooth or whatever when you already have 2 Offering Tokens in your deck.
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Jun 3, 2020 07:59
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TastyLemonDrops posted:Or enough card draw or a small enough deck that you can cycle through your cards and guarantee it. There's a few ways to go about it. I mean, I understand what it is supposed to do, but spending an energy and a board space every turn to block 1 attack and get a single harvest seems . . .not good.
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Jun 3, 2020 08:07
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I mean, it's a harvest every turn. You can double up your champion with one of the other ones and still have space for the little guy. To be honest, I'd rather put endless on an imp or one of the tombs if I was planning to do that, but not having to spend gold on a unit that can do that out the gate is great. Other than the initial investment in setting up, you don't really have much mana expenditure. And if you're using mana to replace guys whose job isn't to die, then you're probably gonna lose anyway.
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Jun 3, 2020 08:17
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It does draw a card, so it's basically a 1-mana kind-of-a-Damage Shield (since it tanks 1 attack, but isn't stackable) +1 draw next turn, with Holdover. It's not the best, but I have a soft spot for Votivary because there are quite a few cute synergies that can make it do good work - The -2 unit cost artifact makes it a free damage blocker every turn (takes 1 capacity, granted), double Extinguish artifact turns it into a soft draw engine, you can spend 50 gold and for +50 health on it for a low-cost, low-capacity blocker that replaces itself. An interesting part is that it retains any stat enhancement through Endless procs too. Also on the topic of Melting, while the champ is a big part of how strong the faction is, I think another big part is how amazing Molded is. It gives your deck consistency, it's a safety net, and it gives stat scaling for your units, Burnout or otherwise. And it's a common card so you see it all the time in draft picks, it's such an auto-pick and auto-upgrade card.
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Jun 3, 2020 08:22
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Endless imps are great. Gave endless and spikes to an armour imp when I had the double summon relic.
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Jun 3, 2020 10:01
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Marketing New Brain posted:The biggest issue I have is the disparity in power level between factions and heroes. I'm currently climbing up the covenant ranks playing random/random, but I could easily cruise through the last 10 or so levels by just going Melting/Umbra or Melting/Whatever. Umbra had an awful hero and desperately needed that buff, but they have possibly the best supporting card pool, especially the synergy with incant. The entire Remnant clan needs a redesign. It's the best primary Clan, but by a long way the worst Allied Clan because so many of its cards lean hard into something no other clan has, wants or needs.
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Jun 3, 2020 10:12
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blizzardvizard posted:It's unit-centric because that's the name of the game I guess. It's a tower defense game in card form, and it's just a staple of that genre to have "buildings" and their upgrades. But while yeah in the end most factions want to "put their OP unit down" the units are still cards in a deck. This is a deckbuilding game first, and the way the decks between each faction works is definitely quite different. Awoken has draw power, Umbra has mana manipulation cards, Remnants utilize the "graveyard", and so on, and then you cross the clans and get different synergies. I don't really mind the game being unit focused, what I'm having issue with - especially in a comparison with tower defense games - is how disproportionately important 1-2 units typically end up being for your runs due to how much stronger upgraded and buffed units are than default units (even if there's big variation in the plain ones like 1/15 vs 50/50) and how strong upgrades are limited and most good buffs only targeting one unit so obviously you just stack them all on your best unit. I guess I would just personally prefer if the focus was far more on combining units on a floor in the right way so that they worked as serious force-multipliers. The game kiiiinda does this with tank units and morsel masters, but A: those are about it in terms of roles that aren't 'the uber unit' and B: they still end up just focused on one floor in my experience which feels like a waste.
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Jun 3, 2020 10:49
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Jedit posted:The entire Remnant clan needs a redesign. It's the best primary Clan, but by a long way the worst Allied Clan because so many of its cards lean hard into something no other clan has, wants or needs. It's easy to say stuff like this based off some bad runs but idk, they have plenty of cards that are just straight up good. The stealth cards (Engulfed in Smoke etc) are very strong, and Mortal Entrapment is the best Daze card vs bosses. Legion of Wax and Bounty Stalker win runs all on their own. There's good synergy with Umbra. Memento Mori / Memories of the Melted / etc. work very well since morsels die constantly. Same with the Harvest cards. Resin Removal lets you strip the Emberdrain effect from cards like Furnace tap. The worst thing about them as a secondary class is that you have all those dregs clogging up your deck
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Jun 3, 2020 15:11
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Dregs are fine as a starting clan card though - they cost 0 and effectively have consume so it's easy to thin out your deck the first time through. They don't necessarily do all that much, but no starting clan cards are exactly great.
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Jun 3, 2020 15:57
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Yeah Dregs are by far the "best" clan starting cards cause they consume themselves, not to mention costing 0 mana. If anything they "clog" the deck the least since you can just throw them on top floor, let them burn out, and forget about them.
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Jun 3, 2020 16:21
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I mean, I think I’ve won a run where I copied 5 Offering Tokens and had insane draw (I think from Awoken hero but not 100% sure) and then spammed the Tokens to get my incant units to stupidly strong stats. Also, Imp decks are hilarious and fun. Non-consume Imp in a Box combined with Transendimp and stuff like Impolate and Implosion is stupidly strong and fun. Also, fun mechanics thing I learned. Stacking Rage on a unit and then using the rare Awoken card that swaps Hp and Attack swaps your attain stack when you’re enraged, leading to having like 200+ attack and health because your new attack gets buffed by the stacking rage. Managed to win a run with pre-buff Hellhorned Brawler by abusing this alongside the artifact that gives demons multistrike. This game is addictively fun.
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Jun 3, 2020 16:56
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Can you spot the things that are ridiculous in this picture, lol. EDIT: Part 2 
TastyLemonDrops fucked around with this message at 18:30 on Jun 3, 2020 |
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Jun 3, 2020 18:24
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as far as remnant as an ally goes with burnout/reform, the best version of reform is from remnant cards, not the hero, since you can target them and use holdover if need be (reducing hand size but you can also just run a thin deck and not do holdover, though I'm only at c5/c6)
Tempora Mutantur fucked around with this message at 18:27 on Jun 3, 2020 |
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Jun 3, 2020 18:25
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blizzardvizard posted:
how on earth e: is that 24 stacks of spell weakness
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Jun 3, 2020 18:38
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 So here is the imp run that I managed to win with. Rector Flicker Burnout 3 is so stupidly strong that if I have any starter card that extends Burnout, I immediately take it. Eternalstone + Mana cost reduction Imp-in-a-Box means infinite imps that I can spam on other rows to build up to my Transcendimp and having Wicklash on Holdover meant my champion and Lady never burnt out. This is my second highest scoring run, with my highest scoring run being another Melting Remnant + Hellhorned run with Sneko Gauge (Volatile Gauge) alongside two Consumer of Crowns (10 cost units that reduce by Imps) and an Eternal Stone Umbra Stone (Melting Remnant Consumable that gives Trample) and Doublestack Eternal Stone Onehorn's Tome (Hellhorned Consumable that gives multistrike). With a Vovitary and Imps, I was able to implement the Harvest Fliker, but the MVP's were the Consumers who had their costs significantly reduced so I could pump them to ridiculous levels.  In other words, Imps are OP as gently caress and I love the little devils.
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Jun 3, 2020 18:47
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ThermosAquaticus posted:Dregs are fine as a starting clan card though - they cost 0 and effectively have consume so it's easy to thin out your deck the first time through. They don't necessarily do all that much, but no starting clan cards are exactly great. True. I guess the issue I run into is that I sometimes max out board slots with good units, which makes the Dregs total dead draws The other thing is you can make a spell like Torch or Restore semi-useful with a spare +damage upgrade, which is cheaper than removing it. I don't think that's really true with Dregs
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Jun 3, 2020 19:05
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 monstertrain://runresult/a3d95768-ddad-458b-a9c2-a0c648f11ee2 Yup rector flicker is bonkers on the burn bright path. On top of that this run threw infinite money at me so I also rolled up on Seraph with railgun plants. Took 9 damage on the second fight and never again
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Jun 3, 2020 19:10
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Vargs posted:Holdover doesn't give you your holdover card as a bonus on the next turn. It just puts it at the top of the draw pile, meaning you are still using a draw to pull it. You're still getting the exact same disadvantages when putting it on Offering Token, except it's happening every turn instead of just for one. 
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Jun 3, 2020 19:20
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President Ark posted:how on earth That doesn't seem so absurd. My personal record for damage with one spell is 5400, but I've managed 400 without Spell Weakness before so 10,000 is possible in the right deck. I just got my new fastest win, in just over 33 minutes, on the back of the artifact that summons four units on the middle floor and duping a Quick Multistriking Consumer of Crowns.
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Jun 3, 2020 19:47
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Burnout Flicker no-sells a lot of the challenges too, it's amazing. Spikes 4? Who cares! Armor 10? He overkills anyway. Mark of Invasion? He can only attack one at a time, but he makes for an excellent meatshield for Dregs to finish the rest secret volcano lair posted:True. I guess the issue I run into is that I sometimes max out board slots with good units, which makes the Dregs total dead draws Sometimes I throw a spare +25 hp upgrade on a Dreg to turn them into a cheap blocker  I've been doing this more and more with Imps as well9/28 for 0 mana (who's dying in front anyway burnout or no) isn't bad at all, and I've been finding myself needing blockers more because enemies just hit so hard, especially if I want to take on challenges
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Jun 3, 2020 19:59
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Burnout Flicker significantly reduces the difficulty of any run by virtue of how strong and tanky the unit is. Melting is the only faction where I have managed to win with every single other faction as secondary. The main issue he faces is dealing with his burnout but once you can manage that, he smashes faces.
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Jun 3, 2020 20:45
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I decided to go for the 10 card achievement and got it pretty handily with Umbra/Melting. I went Gorge, then Trample with Penumbra, targeted a good second lane unit (ended up being an Alloyed Construct that I gave Quick and Largestone to), and got two Morsel Masters. The deck ended up being those 4, 2 Shadesplitters, Crucible Extension, Retch, Perils of Production, and Immortal Trade.
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Jun 4, 2020 00:35
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Just had an amazing run where I got to dupe a Hoarfrost Effigy with holdover and -cost, so I got to spend 2 embers every turn to get quadruple frostbite stacks. Super strong combo - I was even able to outpace the boss who halves debuffs and kill him before he entered.
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Jun 4, 2020 00:39
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Just did a run where I got the Lightstone Casing for my first artifact. As Awoken. I created a 0 mana holdover spreading spores at the second magic tent. Then hellvented it in the same moment. On the final boss I got to 98 stacks of spikes and 60 something of regen when she finally killed herself. I also had the totem guy who makes spikes deal double damage, AND the artifact for that, so she was taking 3x my spikes stacks as damage. It probably wasn't the most optimal build, but I literally was just purging things because I didn't need anything besides my champion, my spreading spores, and my double spike damage guy. Unfortunately didn't manage to get under 10 cards.
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Jun 4, 2020 00:54
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Finally got my first victory - Awoken/Hellborne combo where upgraded a couple Husks and went the Explosive route. Oh and I got the Volatile Gauge in a chest at the very start. It was complete overkill, though the final boss came down to being finished off by my Pyre. Short story, game rules.
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Jun 4, 2020 01:36
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Slapped a run through by taking all the good damage spells I saw and duping them at every opportunity. Tethys reduced them all to 0 cost in her lane and was being guarded by a shark that gained 10 armor every spellcast. Bosses spent so long killing the shark that a spell amp unit in the back would get them to 15 stacks and they'd blow up the next turn.
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Jun 4, 2020 02:04
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Has anyone found ways to go infinite at all?
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Jun 4, 2020 02:11
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Gyshall posted:Has anyone found ways to go infinite at all? Its a hell of a lot harder to do than StS that's for sure.
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Jun 4, 2020 02:14
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I bet you could do it with an imp deck. Excavated embers, imp scholar, transcendimp with endless...
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Jun 4, 2020 02:16
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dyzzy posted:I bet you could do it with an imp deck. Excavated embers, imp scholar, transcendimp with endless... Offering Monument and some consistent way to heal would do it.
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Jun 4, 2020 02:25
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what does this mean, go infinite? english is not my first language
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Jun 4, 2020 03:14
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a fatguy baldspot posted:what does this mean, go infinite? english is not my first language Have a combo you can play forever until you win the fight/get bored. It requires, at minimum, some way to generate energy and draw enough cards to loop entirely through your deck. In Slay the Spire you usually accomplished this by exhausting a lot of cards in combat and having very small decks. An easy one to set up in that game involved two copies of the card 'dropkick' which, when played, drew a card and generated one energy. If that's the only card in your discard pile/deck you can just keep playing them until the enemy is dead
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Jun 4, 2020 03:18
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I don't think there is any unlimited source of draw. Most sources of +draw are for the next turn only, or only apply once per turn like winged steel. So there is a hard limit in terms of the number of cards you can play a turn. I'm not going to try and calculate what this limit is because cards like "preserved thorns" generate cards and inflate that number. Edit: It may be possible with offering monument and a triple cost reduced cycle of life. Offering monument is tricky as it doesn't damage itself, it reduces its max hp so you can't just heal it. Cycle of life is the only card I know of that does a 5+ health increase. Smiling Demon fucked around with this message at 04:52 on Jun 4, 2020 |
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Jun 4, 2020 04:45
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